Sebecloki's Shattered Star AP Super Spectacular Paizo Anniversary Celebration Campaign (Inactive)

Game Master Sebecloki

Ok so, the character I am working on is from Tian Xia. Basics of his backstory are, he is a half-dragon which he acquired from an evil imperial underworld dragon that used it's blood to create it's own unquestioningly loyal servants/supersoldiers to advance it's kingdom. The dragon was defeated and killed by its enemies, freeing my character from it's control. He fled, fearing retribution for the evil he had done while under the dragon's control. He even cut off his own wings and wore thick clothing to help himself hide. He learned of Sarenrae and was drawn to her message of redeption and dedicated himself to her and making a new life. It was revealed to him that he was an Aasimar (scion of humanity) before his draconic corruption and he was blessed by Sarenrae with a restoration and strengthening of his celestial heritage to become a half-celestial. His cut off wings sprouted supernatural wings of heavenly light and he was renewed.

Mechanically an aasimar half-dragon half-celestial paladin cleric of Sarenrae. Backstory will hopefully justify everything. Just got to figure out a reason for having 880k gp. If you decide multiple templates are not allowed I'll just go with half-celestial.

Question: how much can crafting feats affect our starting wealth? With magic items being crafted for half price and crafting feats and skill focus and such so easy to get, will we be allowed to effectively start with more wealth?

Quick question, what your take on feats that can be taken multiple times during our creation, are you limiting how many times we can take them like one per level or unrestricted?

Quick question, what your take on feats that can be taken multiple times during our creation, are you limiting how many times we can take them like one per level or unrestricted?

Unrestricted

Ok so, the character I am working on is from Tian Xia. Basics of his backstory are, he is a half-dragon which he acquired from an evil imperial underworld dragon that used it's blood to create it's own unquestioningly loyal servants/supersoldiers to advance it's kingdom. The dragon was defeated and killed by its enemies, freeing my character from it's control. He fled, fearing retribution for the evil he had done while under the dragon's control. He even cut off his own wings and wore thick clothing to help himself hide. He learned of Sarenrae and was drawn to her message of redeption and dedicated himself to her and making a new life. It was revealed to him that he was an Aasimar (scion of humanity) before his draconic corruption and he was blessed by Sarenrae with a restoration and strengthening of his celestial heritage to become a half-celestial. His cut off wings sprouted supernatural wings of heavenly light and he was renewed.

Mechanically an aasimar half-dragon half-celestial paladin cleric of Sarenrae. Backstory will hopefully justify everything. Just got to figure out a reason for having 880k gp. If you decide multiple templates are not allowed I'll just go with half-celestial.

Question: how much can crafting feats affect our starting wealth? With magic items being crafted for half price and crafting feats and skill focus and such so easy to get, will we be allowed to effectively start with more wealth?

Great character concept. You can effectively start higher.

I'm gonna be submitting a Wizard/kineticist(Dark Elementalist and Blood Kineticist).

Also do we get traits? Not that it's needed considering we get 45 feats, just curious?

Traits are fine

Also, I'm open to adding in mythic later -- I need to sort of 'take the temperature' for a while, design a few encounters, and see how these characters handle before adding that on top of what I've already proposed, but the potential is there for those who are curious.

I'll throw my hat into the ring here. I've got a couple character concepts and I'll need to boil them down. One is a tristalt from a multitable game so I'd have to drop one. I'll see what I can do.

Btw we are starting at level 5 now?

Yes -- I posted a revised build rules post, follow that.

Some questions:
1. Do we still have a single level of an NPC class in addition to the 5th level gestalt?
2. Aside from the fighter bonus feats, does each side of the gestalt receive 1 feat per level, the standard 1 every odd level, or something else?
3. Is combat stamina an option (taking the feat)?
4. Are skill unlocks an option (taking the feat)?
Assumptions on animal companions: Double maximum HP, 45 feats at first level, fighter progression with HD for more feats, and a feat every HD if PCs get that (see above question #2). Race, wealth, and class do not apply, I think.
6. Can we use point buy to improve/replace the animal companions scores? Seems like a no, especially if they get a template, which leads to:
7. Do animal companions get background skills and a template (given enough story to back it up)?
8. The Intimidate Trick says the animal companion automatically uses aid another when it's master uses Intimidate; this is usually a standard action for combat (Attack or AC), but I cannot find an action usage for skill aid another; when the animal companion uses this trick, would it be an immediate action?
9. I would like my animal companion to take the Noxious Bite feat, which is definitely Paizo. However, Archives of Nethys lists it as 3.5 material, even though it is from Pathfinder Chronicles. Is that feat on the table?

I'm really liking this idea, especially the fact that many feats I would never be willing to take, or that I wanted to but lost out to Power Attack or Iron Will, are now on the list.

My mind is boggled by the options! I still plan on playing a human noble, but with the simple advanced template. He will be some type of wizard. I got to focus on making sure whatever I submits fits into the city of Magnimar.

3.5 from Dragon and Dungeon under Paizo and Pathfinder is fine -- it's the company, not the system.

That also gave me another idea -- I'm going to slightly alter Golarion -- Paizo Greyhawk is going to be on the other side of Avistan, and Paizo Dark Sun is going to be in the middle of Sarusan.

Can somehow tell me how editable animal companions are in HeroLab -- can you give them higher stats and more feats and skills?

Holy balls, man, you're insane! I love it!

River of Sticks -- I'm going to get to the rest of your questions, I'm waiting to hear what can be done about animal companions in HeroLab.

I hate that you can't edit posts after an hour -- I'd like to be able to update the initial OP every time I tweak the build rules, so annoying.

I was originally adding the NPC levels before I realized you could do gestalt in HeroLab. Instead, I'm now thinking about adding on a Prestige Class level instead. Could everyone find 1 level of a prestige class they want?

I can't think of a PRC I'd want just one level of, forever, but I can think of several I'd love to mix into various character builds if they kept progression. Especially if casting PRCs could boost our CL above our HD like that.

Yeah, you could advance it, but then you have the trade-off between another gestalt level or another prestige level, so that might be an issue. I'm just thinking out loud here -- I'd like to make design space for prestige classes because there are tons of Paizo prestige classes that don't get much use. I think we'd have to have everyone have one if we were going to do it unless people were okay with the trade off I'm positing as an issue above.

EDIT: How do people feel about a build of 10/10 gestalt with 10 levels of prestige class?

You hear that sound on the edge of your hearing? The one that sounds like a cat choking on a canary?

That's me trying to restrain my cackling because I'm at work. Scavenger Investigator 10 / Fighter 10 / Pathfinder Delver 10 Advanced Human sounds fun. I don't want to just be a Pathfinder. I wanna be the Pathfinder.

I'm having another thought -- what if you started at 5th level gestalt, and in the course of the first adventure you'd get your first prestige class level -- there would be a side trek/in-game encounter that would explain how you got started on it.

Plenty of fun. Not as silly, but probably more fun for that, honestly.

That sounds all good and fun, but starting at 5 might be enough.
After all is also cool to reach something ingame ;)
For me starting at level 1 would be quite fine as well.

River of sticks has a lot of valid questions.

Are we stacking templates now though? I thought we only get 1?

Yeah, more than one template is fine -- I want to hear someone with HeroLab address the animal question before I finish responding.

Is everyone okay with planning a 10/10 gestalt, 10 prestige class build. If we do that, I'm going to require everyone to do that progression, since we can't level up and have some people getting two gestalt levels and some getting a prestige class level, that will be a mess.

I was thinking that my human noble would take the Noble Scion prestige class, but not if everybody is forced to take a prestige class.

I wouldn't want to have to take a prestige class over paladin/cleric levels.

I'm hoping monster feats are ok to use too?

Can't help with the herolab question as i don't use it. I calculate everything on my own.

I think you can do all that to animal companions too, yes.
Except the gestalt level as far as i know, because they don't really have a class. Might be possible as well though, don't have herolab here right now.

10 levels gestalt + 10 levels PRC is fine, but i would prefer to start lower and then play up that way, leveling as the books progress. Espeically when playing Shattered Star.

Of course nobody will qualify for the PRC at level 5, since kinda all of them are only accessible after level 5/6+.

Ok yeah.......880,000 gold........THAT the thing I am having problems getting my head around XD

Buy a noble townhouse so you have some stakes in the city!

Nah, already got that part needed out, my character will not be a noble, but something a bit more unique, a assassin of great renown, who has a anger problem :P
Just working out the kinks in his story.

I'd suggest staying with gestalt L5, without extra prestige class levels, as per your last big build rules post. If we really do an AP, we'll want to have plenty room to grow, and we can take prestige classes as we do, if we choose, as part of the gestalt.

Per your comment on editing the OP when you change build rules, can I suggest putting the build rules in the campaign tab, and posting a big bold post in Recruitment that says to look there for the latest build rules summary? Then you can update it as needed, and potential players don't have to read through pages to try to figure it the latest.

I'd suggest staying with gestalt L5, without extra prestige class levels, as per your last big build rules post. If we really do an AP, we'll want to have plenty room to grow, and we can take prestige classes as we do, if we choose, as part of the gestalt.

Per your comment on editing the OP when you change build rules, can I suggest putting the build rules in the campaign tab, and posting a big bold post in Recruitment that says to look there for the latest build rules summary? Then you can update it as needed, and potential players don't have to read through pages to try to figure it the latest.

That's a pretty good idea!

Some questions:

1. Do we still have a single level of an NPC class in addition to the 5th level gestalt?
2. Aside from the fighter bonus feats, does each side of the gestalt receive 1 feat per level, the standard 1 every odd level, or something else?
3. Is combat stamina an option (taking the feat)?
4. Are skill unlocks an option (taking the feat)?
Assumptions on animal companions: Double maximum HP, 45 feats at first level, fighter progression with HD for more feats, and a feat every HD if PCs get that (see above question #2). Race, wealth, and class do not apply, I think.
6. Can we use point buy to improve/replace the animal companions scores? Seems like a no, especially if they get a template, which leads to:
7. Do animal companions get background skills and a template (given enough story to back it up)?
8. The Intimidate Trick says the animal companion automatically uses aid another when it's master uses Intimidate; this is usually a standard action for combat (Attack or AC), but I cannot find an action usage for skill aid another; when the animal companion uses this trick, would it be an immediate action?
9. I would like my animal companion to take the Noxious Bite feat, which is definitely Paizo. However, Archives of Nethys lists it as 3.5 material, even though it is from Pathfinder Chronicles. Is that feat on the table?

I'm really liking this idea, especially the fact that many feats I would never be willing to take, or that I wanted to but lost out to Power Attack or Iron Will, are now on the list.

1. After some consideration, we'll stick with 5th level gestalt and no NPC class.

I wouldn't want to have to take a prestige class over paladin/cleric levels.

I'm hoping monster feats are ok to use too?

Can't help with the herolab question as i don't use it. I calculate everything on my own.

Monster feats are fine. As long as its Paizo, everything is allowed.

OK, I'M CREATING THE CAMPAIGN PAGE PER THE SUGGESTION ABOVE TO STORE BUILD RULES WE CAN EDIT. FOR ALL READERS, PLEASE CONSULT THE CAMPAIGN INFO PAGE FOR CONTINUOUSLY UPDATED BUILD RULES.

I second starting at 5 and getting the first prestige level in game. My preference would be for having the option of taking multiple prestige classes with that progression, but that’s mostly because I’ve only seen a few I like all ten levels of. I can certainly work with just getting one progression though!

Stacking templates does get crazier, even with the requirement for an in story explanation. Not that anyone should be complaining about power level, but it also introduces more power disparity. We will have to wait till the characters are all built to see if that’s a problem.

Right now my idea is for my character (half orc bloodrager) and animal companion to have both been the subject of an evil wizards experiment. Wizard attempted to summon a greater power from the beyond and was killed; in the chaos, the character and companion find each other, survive the insane experiments, and use the resources of the keep to figure out who they are and plan their return to the rest of the world. My character devoted himself to that greater power (inquisitor) and has a vendetta against evil spellcasters and slavery.

Ok, I updated the build rules in the campaign info -- someone check for me if that all works in HeroLab. Does HeroLab let you do 2/3//2/3 gestalt -- like Fighter 2/Mage 3//Cleric 3/Ranger 2? That would solve the prestige class issue, since then you can just take it on one side of the gestalt if you want to.

I also outlined my vision of PaizoWorld as the setting for this experiment.

Mh no.
In herolab gestalt you have gestalt levels, which means you pick the class "gestalt" for a level and can then pick 2 other classes, which make up the gestalt.
Of course you can multiclass though, but i would describe that as Fighter2/mage3/cleric3/ranger2, which would then be a level 5 character.
The PRC would have to be added otherwise or replace one of those classes.

If you look at my avatar for the Runelords game it might become clearer.
First spoiler contains the herolab gestalt, second spoiler the addition from having a third class over that HO feat.

That sounds like you can do it if you do 3/3 as a gestalt and then multi class another 2/2 gestalt, is that correct?

Ehhhhh...

Herolab parses your levels of other classes as class features of your gestalt class. From a software standpoint, you're a Gestalt 5 with 3 levels of Cleric, 3 of Wizard, 2 of Fighter, and 2 of ranger as your selected class features. It's all one progression, you just kinda... change your selection when you want.

OK it sounds like that's possible then -- that should also make it possible to be a 3 Cleric/2 PrC//3 Fighter/2 PrC or whatever.

You can mix and mach what classes constitute the gestalt levels in Hero Lab.

I tend to stick to two classes, but you could have 10 class levels of different things in the 5th level start if you so chose.

Okay, then that resolves that question -- in that case, I think the build rules are updated to everything we've discussed so far.

I've bypassed other high level recruitments you've run before, just because they've included a lot of 3PP material I don't know well, but since we're sticking just Paizo, I'll throw my hat into the ring for this. Now, what to build.

EDIT: For buying stats above 18, should we continue the progression of the table (e.g. it costs 4 points to go from 18 to 19, 5 points from 19 to 20, etc)?

@Phntm888
Yes, we're continuing the cost progression as you stated.

@Sebecloki, thanks for moving build rules to the campaigns tab!

My character so far:
I'm working on a gnomish trickster. He once tried to steal a magic sundial from Shyka the Many (one of the Eldest, a chronomancer). The Many tried to blast him back to the time before time, but he managed to dodge the worst of it and is instead merely...poorly anchored in time.

Mechanics:
- Definitely Bard (Prankster) on one side of the gestalt. Still mulling options for the other side.
- Templates: Timebreaker, Fey Creature

Gyrfalcon, Timebreaker is Rite Publishing, not Paizo. Just an FYI.

With so many feats, the party should definitely go for some teamwork feats early on.

Dirty Fighting, Outflank, menacing weapon :)

Make other suggestions!

Also easy to spend the feats leveling up for a VMC class (or 2 if you really wanted).

I'm hoping these build rules will encourage people to dig into some of the more obscure Paizo collection like archetypes and feats for volcanic/fire races, etc., of which there are at least tens of similar examples.

I'm also hoping some of the many, many prestige classes get some love. Since HeroLab can handle PrCs on one side of the gestalt, I won't require them to even out leveling concerns, but I still really like the idea of incorporating joining one, since most of them are organizationally-linked, into a side-trek/campaign action.

Gyrfalcon, Timebreaker is Rite Publishing, not Paizo. Just an FYI.

Doh! Oh no. d20pfsrd.com's templates page calls out "[3pp]" after most of the 3p templates so I thought I was safe...but it seems they forgot to list it with that one. I see (as you say) it's attributed to Rite Publishing on the bottom of the page. Bummer.

I just got the bundle and I'm looking at the AP modules -- it seems to be a series of dungeon crawls if anyone is thinking about favored terrain etc.

Teamwork feats: Shake it Off is also good. Call a team huddle to survive the fireball!

Edit: it is very difficult to find interesting prestige classes that don’t have a specific deity requirement.