The Way of the Monstrous (Inactive)

Game Master Stalwart


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Doomed Hero wrote:
chillblame wrote:
DM Stalwart wrote:

@Ravencourt: I took the liberty of reading your backstory. I like it, though you're right it strays away from the major theme. If you wanted, you could say the curse manifested at puberty, or when he was taking his vows, or even he activated a cursed item from his parents' spoils from their adventuring days. I'm not saying you have to go those routes if it's too outside your concept, but it might be something to consider.

@Chillblame: Nice! One thing about the construct, though, it doesn't grow and improve like a living being would. How would you want to address that? I can think of a few ways, but I'd like to hear what you would want.

Hmmm

I recall that in 3.5 there was a construct that could level, used two rapiers damned if I can remember the name. But any way, if I was to build like an angel eidolen that would work I think. Make it a consruct type, but gian the fixed abilities listed in ultimate magic for an eidolen angel form.
What do you think.

You're thinking of the Nimblewright. I don't remember it being able to gain class levels though.

There was an Awaken Golem spell though.

Thanks for the name. It had an intelligence score around 11, and had skills and feats. Never saw a reason it couldn't get level. I gm'd a game where a high level mage had two of them with four levels of fighter as bodyguards. :D. Still each game is different.


Seiomi Telanaa wrote:
@ Capt Wombat great, a Bureaucrat; What every team needs, the evil lawyer~

You will be thinking her when it comes to dealing with government types and bartering, and as long as you don't sign your PC's soul away you will be fine.

maniacal laugh, maniacal laugh, maniacal laugh.

but remember she's more brains over borne! she likes to give others what they wish for just not in the way they wish


GM Capt Wombat wrote:
Seiomi Telanaa wrote:
@ Capt Wombat great, a Bureaucrat; What every team needs, the evil lawyer~

You will be thinking her when it comes to dealing with government types and bartering, and as long as you don't sign your PC's soul away you will be fine.

maniacal laugh, maniacal laugh, maniacal laugh.

but remember she's more brains over borne! she likes to give others what they wish for just not in the way they wish

Bad bureaucrats go to heaven, good go to hell. Cause an LE organization is just their cup of tea. :D

Rememder the big bad in golarians hell is the god of lawyers

Grand Lodge

Damn you Fake Wishcrafter Ifirit!


It occurs to me that some of the applicants are for a not-good bent, and my submission is for a Paladin. That creates a conflict.

GM, would you allow a second submission from me? Paladins only really work in games where everyone is pretty much good.


Ainti-Paladin, go on you know you want to.

Grand Lodge

But my character isn't evil. While she would be viewed as evil by people who see harpies as man eating monsters she would be Chaotic neutral, going against her impulses to commit evil acts while going against everything harpies stand for, or try to at the very least.

Also wow all these spell casters; if need be I have no issue reworking the character to be more melee driven, even going as far as completely changing it if need be. Because that's how I roll~


Cap Wombat here
Well I made a small test Alt
to keep track of some ideas

She can be LN just as LE, no real biggy.

Still like the idea of a cursed Dragon.


Nice avatar Cpt. Wombat. I'm using the same avatar for a Human Slayer at the moment. ;)

The Green Wave and the Ire Blossom:
If only she hadn't said what she hadn't meant him to ever hear, or if only he hadn't merely walked away with no anger. Whcih had made her angrier still. Her turmoil, her hatred of him were only a haze of green in her eyes when she became frustrated. It was becoming harder to think straight. The sun was so captivating...

More later, got to go to sleep...


HumanInDisguise wrote:
Still possible to get in on this?

Yep! Still taking submissions!

Also, I'd like to respectfully request that the chatter be kept to a minimum so others checking on this thread don't get the wrong idea.


Think you could explain how the stats will work a bit more in-depth for those of us who are curious to start pondering that part of their character?


Another question, sorry for the double post: Is this set on Golarion, or another setting?


GM Capt Wombat wrote:
Ainti-Paladin, go on you know you want to.

Actually, I really do. That class doesn't get nearly enough play.

If the GM goes with an evil party I could easily adapt a version of Kane that had his alignment reversed by the curse or something.

Another thought I had was to play a fairly normal person (a non-caster even) who managed to become a Lich.

I thought it would be fun to play a guy who had started treating himself like he was disposable because he kept coming back when he died, and who craved human contact because now everytime he touched someone he paralyzed them forever. A funny/tragic character who could fit into any party makeup.

GM? What do you think of Kane being a Lich instead of a Gargoyle? Maybe he interrupted a powerful caster during a liching ritual and ended up being the recipient himself? During the process he was Level Drained like crazy and nearly killed, but because he was a Lich he didn't die.

A Lich Paladin sounds like a concept that hasn't seen much play. Alternatively, since Pharasma is so anti-undead, Kane could start as a paladin who'd already lost his paladin-hood, and would have to go Fighter the rest of the way (or something like that). A suicidal former-paladin who can't die sounds like a really fun character to me.

Grand Lodge

@ Sir Kane Ravencourt.
As the GM stated in the opening post, No undead.


@Ravencourt: Sorry, I'm not allowing undead. Seiomi is correct. You are certainly allowed to submit an additional idea if you want. And don't get worried about this campaign turning evil yet. I may go with two, if I get more submissions.

@Cydrius: Second question first: I'm undecided. Golarion will either be the setting or a homebrew world with a lot of Golarion influence.
It'll be on a case-by case basis, depending on the desired monster. Creatures with high CRs will likely be on the eidolon build, while lower CR monsters will probably be character classes with racial abilities, augmented with bonus feats and the like.


dot

Grand Lodge

You know, if We have the campaign split off, I'd also submit a submission for a evil fighter cursed to be a Dweomercat.


I see. Sounds tricky to balance. Hm... well, powerful fey like Queen Swandove and her kin would have pretty high CRs, so I think I'd rather follow the eidolon model, myself.


If you were going to run two campaigns, I would like to offer Lady Setra, a paladin that was cursed into the form of a minotaur. The curse was caused by an unintended destruction of a gods holy site during its defense (the operation was a success: the patient is however dead).
She must seek atonement for her action.


DM Stalwart wrote:
@Ravencourt: Sorry, I'm not allowing undead. Seiomi is correct. You are certainly allowed to submit an additional idea if you want. And don't get worried about this campaign turning evil yet. I may go with two, if I get more submissions.

Ok, no problem. I'll stick with my original concept. I like it, I was just concerned about making a "wedge" character that would necessitate a certain group dynamic and make it so that either people making evil-er characters couldn't play, or that I couldn't.


chillblame wrote:

If you were going to run two campaigns, I would like to offer Lady Setra, a paladin that was cursed into the form of a minotaur. The curse was caused by an unintended destruction of a gods holy site during its defense (the operation was a success: the patient is however dead).

She must seek atonement for her action.

This could also be a cleric, oracle or inquisitor. The idea is geminating a bit.


I knew things would start to crystalize once I actually put this campaign up for submissions, and it appears that the "evil/good campaign" thing is something that needs to be addressed and clarified. No one's fault but my own, I suppose.

One of the reasons for the campaign twist was to preserve the whole good/evil axis which comes from a very humano-centric perspective. No big surprise there; the folks at TSR/Wizards/Paizo who designed the alignment wheel were all human. At least, I'm pretty sure they were. I'm going to assume they were.

Inject the traditional alignment wheel in a monstrous campaign, it opens up the argument that, "It says here in the bestiary that they eat sentient flesh! That's normal to this creature, so I'm at least Neutral, if not Good!" And off we go into places I hope we don't want to go. Alignment arguments rarely end well. We're all here to have fun.

So the Human-turned-monster will have the good/evil axis defined from a place where we can all relate. Eating people is bad. Consigning souls to Hell is bad. Taking over dwarven strongholds and stealing their treasure is bad. And so on.

Every character selected for this campaign will ultimately have a choice: Do I become the monster whose form I wear?

I expected players who will want their characters to say yes. I expected players who will want their characters to say no. I expected players who won't know which way their characters go until the campaign's in full swing, some straddling the fence over the course of months, or years.

And I've got them! Which is very cool, and I thank each of you for your submissions. It's one of the reasons why I'm open to running two campaigns, one for those who will probably fall to their new natures, and one for those willing to fight. And I'm vastly interested in and thankful for those who haven't decided. I'm not forgetting about you.

I think there is a misconception about the Evil Campaign. What I realize now is that I should have characterized the Evil Campaign as the "Tragic Campaign." A Tragedy in the classic literary sense. "Evil" often translates to "the easy path that ends up doing more harm in the long run." Succumbing to your monstrous nature when confronted by scared, ignorant humans who can't see you're more scared and confused than they are. Taking out your rage and frustration and pain and loss upon those who don't deserve it. And so on. It's tragic. And makes for great drama.

I'm intrigued by that kind of story just as much as the story of the Beast who maintains (or re-discovers) his humanity through selfless acts, despite the fear, mistrust and misguided fools who would slay first, and think later.

I hope this brings more into focus the kinds of stories I'm hoping to develop with this (these) campaign(s), and doesn't chase anybody off. But I'm seeing even some of the neutral folks feeling they need to choose "good" or "evil" at the outset. That's not necessary, especially if you're more interested in the journey.

Man, do I hope I'm making sense. Hit me with your questions if I'm not!


I would personally rather be part of a more hopeful campaign.

Peacock currently has little faith in his humanity, seeing his transformation as a second chance at life. However, he has seen only a distrustful and limited side of mankind. I'm not sure yet whether he'll pick to remain a fey or try to regain a humanity that may or may not be rightfully be his, but I would rather he be in a campaign where other party members, and the occasional NPC, will at least try to make a case for the human side of things.

[url=http://paizo.com/people/Peacock]Profile here[/url, but I'm avoiding posting with it until I'm picked so as to be able to remove it if I'm not. (Avoiding alias clutter.)


Please find my submission here. I think it fits with your vision and is an idea I've had for a while.

I explain the crunch in the attachment and will work out background, etc if you are interested in it. I can come up with ways to make all of them human at one time or another, so that is not a concern for me.

Thank you for your consideration.


I'm going to drop the devil, it only works if your a true devil finding your way to a new place like hope and good. Starting from human going to the bad and back again seems to contrived.

I think the problem is monsters have a set alignment locked into a back ground
Not saying the players will need to start with that but others will see them that way v world interaction

Dragon girl
So I think I'll go with the human who thought they where human but finds out slowly they are dragon who was made human! and starting to move back again it has a better feel for this game. Most of all the idea of a split life and memory's fighting to rain over one soul. Coming to turns with that and what was done to her, would be fascinating to play out.

As for how it was done to her,
There are some powers spells that do that.
GM would you allow Pisonics, classes / monsters ?

.


Forming Ideas, and Looking at some old 3.5 content for ideas.
Races of the Dragon, Planar handbook, Savage Species


Capt Wombat, I'm not sure why you're assuming that transformed humans have to take on the alignment of the monster they have turned into. Just because you've got the body of something doesn't mean you have to take the full mindset from it.


Sorry was not clear, Edited my post

It's your comment on "we eat others" that had me thinking down that line, of monsters set aliment V back ground
If they have evil powers [Su] [Ex] v game mechanics,
going to be hard to hide that or maybe suppress it.
.
yep I can see how human -> monster may have any Aliment
Awakening one day to say, "Hay I'm not bad I just look/act that way"

Playing a Devil or Demon is going is going to be real hard when it comes to interacting with others [Normals] in any kind of setting, but a City/Culture of monsters.

It why I liked PlaneScape so much, Sigil The City of Doors, The Cage etc was a great setting for this kind of thing.

A neutral place where Monster live with all kinds of races, of all aliments.

With the idea of a kind of Jeckyll and Hide, you can have a number of fun places to start and go to.

Human good/bad
or
monster good/bad

very interesting.


I am very interested in this, but a question arises:

It seems like the overall concepts, both from what the GM put forth initially, and a fair amount of the players appear to be of various normally evil or at least unpleasant monsters, who may or may not hate what they've become. They might try to retain their humanity, or perhaps embrace what's now their true nature.

Would an angelic, celestial type, who considers himself blessed by the gods, thus be woefully out of place?


I like the idea, myself.

Perhaps, considering the transformation, the blessing could be counterbalanced by feelings that one is not worthy of the gift he's received, and feels the burden of a very hefty debt to be repaid for it.

That would give the character some inner conflict.

(Just a suggestion from one player to another, of course.)


DM Stalwart wrote:
Taking over dwarven strongholds and stealing their treasure is bad.

Says Who?


Azure_Zero wrote:

Forming Ideas, and Looking at some old 3.5 content for ideas.

Races of the Dragon, Planar handbook, Savage Species

There is also a Savage Species PF conversion thread HERE. I think the link to the latest version of the PDF is on the second last page...


Well my character isn't quite evil, despite her similarity to a medusa (though she isn't one of those fully either, no snakes for hair for instance). Her hunger for power actually comes from her human side, though it's more the recognition she craves than the actual power.

That said, she'd be more devoted to her god/goddess than anything else and that deity should be neutral or good. Which brings up a thing for me, as when it comes to deities there I no standard Golarion one that really fits her unless I pull the 'Vudra' card, which I personally don't mind. Only downside is that I think Vudrani are more likely to actually accept a monstrous human who is blessed/cursed by a god than anyone else and that takes away an element from the game.


Cap Wombat here

I've dropped Evil Devil submission, as someone of faith just getting a bad vibe from it, I like much more the idea of a cursed Dragon GM.

This is the same Alt just new name, using it to old basic info, so as not to use my GM alt.


Dotting for interest.

*Waves to Captain Wombat* (^_^)


*Waves to back* (^_^)


Thinking on it, Gretal is not so much evil as traumatised and hurt. She is also very angry at the man who did this to her, her old god who let it happened and the world that persecutes her. What happens next would depend on who influences her. Does a devil turn up to offer vengeance for a small trifle, a wise cleric talks her round promising justice, not revenge, if she is attacked by a panicked farmer or even an encounter with an innocent. Think about Frankenstein's monster encountering the young girl, in the novel. It could have ended differently, not in the bad way it did.Heck her god coming down for a chat about it (I joke...I hope).

Back to how to run this character, I think basing it on a android (Golarian bestiary I think), and adding eidolan abilities or targeted feats. Perhaps healing doesn't work on her, so she needs mending spells or the like. But if you have other idea in mind I am all ears, with mind open.

The actual beastie is a CR5 monster, with a light breath wpn, DR/ adamantium and the ability to shield others from ranged attacks with its wings. And it flies. Lots of natural armor.


Okay...the weird/random thought that comes to mind is basically a 'Octo-poid' type of critter.

Starting as Medium and working their way up to really monstrous 'Scilla' type thing. Basically, classic Greek 'The gods have cursed you!' type thing.

Thoughts? Feedback?


Monkeygod wrote:

I am very interested in this, but a question arises:

It seems like the overall concepts, both from what the GM put forth initially, and a fair amount of the players appear to be of various normally evil or at least unpleasant monsters, who may or may not hate what they've become. They might try to retain their humanity, or perhaps embrace what's now their true nature.

Would an angelic, celestial type, who considers himself blessed by the gods, thus be woefully out of place?

Monkeygod: Not at all. A lot of the good outsiders are pretty monstrous -- look at the lillend, for example.

A note on becoming outsiders in general, especially those of a specific alignment: I will probably assume some sort of "cosmic error" in which a human becomes an outsider without the proper steps (dying, being judged, going to your respective plane, and so on). Thus, the character will still have free will and player agency and all that.

@,: that's pretty wild, going really big. Interesting!

@Campbell: Nice work. I'll consider all submissions, though it seems your monster is one that possesses other bodies. Is that right?


Thinking of making an Agathion, based on either a panther or wolf, that are tasked with hunting down rogue celestials and escaped fiends and bad guys.

Thinking they are probably the most active on the material plane. This would play into my origin.

Just curious, will this be in Golarion, some other established setting or your very own creation?


The more I think about this the more I'm liking the idea shes a CN Gold Dragon. She had it all stripped and way and was made Human, She has a feeling it was something to do with a lost love, but she just can't remember.

But here and now she's changing taking on a new form and has to work at getting back to human.

The Why its all so confusing for her, its all mixed up in her head, is it real or... why dos he not know.

The idea is the why and how comes out in game GM, it could be that she really is human and is becoming a gold Dragon for some reason she knows nothing about. Or that in her past something so dark, so bad broke her mind and made her wait to be some other thing that her race. Finding that out may send her back again, OR it could be some as yet to be found out path.

Idea being she has NO idea what this is happening to her.
She knows she is old and has not changed so others say.
been in the same place the Inn for as far as she can remember.

"Every one who sees me like that tells me I'm good kind and wise, but I'm non of those. I'm just me. They keep looking at me like I'm going to save them but I have no idea how, what can I do? for them, I just don't know what to do"

The idea is that other have expectations of her and she has no idea what to do.


Oceanshieldwolf wrote:
Azure_Zero wrote:

Forming Ideas, and Looking at some old 3.5 content for ideas.

Races of the Dragon, Planar handbook, Savage Species
There is also a Savage Species PF conversion thread HERE. I think the link to the latest version of the PDF is on the second last page...

Nice...

Though would the GM allow it?

Link to latest Savage Species Post


Just posting in this thread because I haven't in awhile - still interested in my lycanthropic ex-druid character if it fits the party. :)


Any idea when you're planning to make a selection, Stalwart?


DM Stalwart wrote:
@Campbell: Nice work. I'll consider all submissions, though it seems your monster is one that possesses other bodies. Is that right?

Doppelganger copies other bodies

Intellect Devourer possesses other bodies, killing them and stealing it
Brain in a Jar dominates other bodies, leaving them alive, but under its control

Three different mechanisms for one concept.

1. Doppelganger - Use Beast-, Dragon-, Giant Form spells for stats just like Wild Shape
2. Intellect Devourer - Upgrade bodies based on what we find/kill
3. Brain in a Jar - An animated Magic Jar spell

Is there a problem with the switching bodies concept? I thought it was a clever way to level a monster. If it's not what you're interested in, let me know why so I can either submit another monster or move on and look for another game.


@Azure: I'm a big fan of the old Savage Species myself, so I'd be happy with looking into third party monster class progressions. I know there's several floating out there.

I'll probably make my decision sometime over the weekend. I'll make an official announcement to give those who've dotted for interest a chance to get their submissions finalized before the deadline to keep things fair.

@Campbell: To be honest, I'm not sure how a body-hopper/shapechanger will fit with my theme, but a strong background or character can get me behind it. Go for it, or if you want to submit something more conservative, do that too.


Question what is the point buy?

What about templates from Bestiaries or other sources?

Have a few ideas floating using Savage Species,

Same setup of how, just what;

  • Succubus (w/o Half-Dragon),
  • Frost Giant (w/o Half-Dragon)
  • Nymph (w/o Half-Dragon)
  • Titan(Elysian)


  • Also with more thought.

    Drider?
    Still toying with the 'Evolving/growing' Scila.

    I must admit to not having a clear idea/handle on how to actually create a character for the game....

    Much cheers to all.


    , wrote:
    I must admit to not having a clear idea/handle on how to actually create a character for the game....

    I'm right there with ya.

    That's why I came up with a concept and pitched it. I figured the postings that have been made talking about adding monstrous abilities as we level means that I don't have to worry about it too much.

    When we get character creation rules, I figure I will start by making my young man, and then will apply the "extensions" I'm told to.

    I can worry about the person, and about how he reacts to the changes happening to him, and only worry about the mechanics of the monster when told that I need to.

    This should be a far more story driven campaign than many others on the forums. I'm liking the possibilities.


    I think that because character creation is going to be more complicated, the DM is waiting until he has selected the players before delving into the actual crunch.

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