[Core] Best Melee Dragon Disciple Build?

Hey everyone,

I'm trying work out what the best build is for a PFS [Core] melee based Dragon Disciple. Currently I'm thinking Paladin 2 / Sorcerer 3 for prereqs but Bard & Barbarian both seem equally valid options.

For Stat Arrays I originally worked up
Str 18 (incl +2 Race), Dex 12, Con 14, Int 7, Wis 10, Cha 15

but then I remembered the you need to know Draconic as a language and Paladin / Sorcerer are so hard up for skill points (to use Linguistics to learn) I reworked into a new plan...

Str 18 (incl +2 Race), Dex 10, Con 12, Int 12, Wis 9, Cha 15

In both cases the stat point at Level 4 will go to Charisma.
3 skill points per level would go into Diplomacy, Perception & Knowledge (Arcana). Possibly the FCB into skills as well (the more I play the more I want to contribute outside of combat)

Current thinking on traits is Magical Knack & Indomitable Faith.
First feat would be Power Attack.

Race - Im thinking Half Elf at this point for Multitalented & having Skill Focus in Perception (since I don't get it as a class skill until 6th level).

My concern with my build above is AC. How can I make it any good? Is the Arcane Armour training tree very useful? With Mithril & both feats you can reduce the % failure by 30%.

AC can be sorted by purely taking defensive spells e.g. shield, protection from evil, etc to the exclusion of offensive/utility ones (am I right in remembering draconic gets mage armour @ level 3?)

You don't need 12 Int, 10 will do and put the 12 on dex, improves your reflex save too. Human may be better than half-elf, e.g. Focussed Study (= up to 3 skill focus feats, +1 skill point a level and if you only take one level of sorcerer then you only lose one level of favoured class bonus). I'd also go Paladin over fighter/bararian/ranger and Sorcerer has way better spells for what you want that the bard.

Bard 7 (for the move action courage) / DD 5+ is good, and you could dump int again for dex if you like. If you have 13+ dex and 14+ str, I'd say reach and combat reflexes is better than power attack.

I've a Barb 1 Bard 4 DD entry in PFS Core and she's plenty fun. Bard spells for nice utility (Featherfall to never worry about pit traps, Expeditious Retreat for speedy charges/getaways, Heroism for everything it does...), Bard music to buff self and party, rage and fast movement to hit stuff harder with that greatsword she totes about.

The other big question is how long you intend to stick with DD. 4 levels grants you the important offensive abilities of the prc besides the wings (which you won't get in standard pfs play anyway) and only costs you one drop to BAB and casting progression. You could then drop back into Bard for another point of Inspire Courage, more music per day, lore master 1/day, another point of bardic knowledge, and your second versatile performance at the cost of a point of BAB. Or you could pop into Eldritch Knight for full BAB and a bonus feat at the cost of a level of casting (ouch!)

Choices, choices...

It depends on how you define "best."

For melee damage, barbarian 2 (Moment of Clarity rage power)/bard 3/dragon disciple 4/bard +1/eldritch knight 2 gains +10 BAB and spell progression as an 8th level bard (3rd-level spells at 12th character level), plus can cast spells in light armor (mithral breastplate) without spell failure.

For a bit less damage (against non-evil foes), but stronger defenses/support, paladin 3 (for Aura of Courage, Divine Health, and a Mercy)/bard 2/dragon disciple 4/bard +3 gains +9 BAB and spell progression as an 8th level bard (3th-level spells); can also cast spells in light armor without spell failure.

For better spells, barbarian 2/sorcerer 3 (take Arcane Armor Training)/dragon disciple 4/eldritch knight 3 gains +9 BAB and spell progression as an 8th level sorcerer (4th-level spells); can cast in a mithral chain shirt.

Alternately, paladin 3/sorcerer 3/dragon disciple 4/sorcerer +2 gains +8 BAB and spell progression as an 8th level sorcerer; can also cast in a mithral chain shirt with Arcane Armor Training.

If you want the widest selection of spells, barbarian 2/bard 1/wizard 2/dragon disciple 4 (advance wizard spellcasting, not bard)/eldritch knight 3 gains +9 BAB and spell progression as a 7th level wizard (4th-level spells, that can be switched out as needed)/1st level bard (gain some extra cantrips and 1st-level spells); can cast wizard spells in a mithral chain shirt with Arcane Armor Training.

My taking is a bit different...
Pure sorceror 5 cross blooded and 1 eldrich heritage feat.
Human dual talent for top str, cha, con.
Draconic has to be one main, the other 2 (crossblood, heritage) can be :
1) abyssal for 4-5 str
2) fey for a companion
3) infernal (pit) for 4-6 con
4) elemental for some more elemental trade
5) umbral for hide in plain sight

Use spells like altered elemental dazing scorching ray while fight with claw-claw-bite.
Why take barbarian and loae 2 more casting level?

Magical Knack will prevent the loss of up to 2 CL which is pretty critical for builds like this.

I think I want to stick to Sorcerer as my spontaneous arcane prereq. I just don't like the flavour / feel of the bard. Yes I realise that makes my BAB & other more useful combat abilities worse.

Please note that this is for Core so alternative FCB & racial abilities's (Focused Study / Dual Talent etc) are not legal. Neither is Crossblooded or the Eldritch Heritage feats.

People seem to prefer Barbarian over Paladin - is that still the case if I will take Sorcerer levels instead of Bard. What about Paladin 2 / Barbarian 2 / Sorcerer 1 into DD?

Paladin 2 Barb 2 has the alignment issue.

My core dragon disciple is on track to being paladin 2/sorcerer 3/dragon disciple 4/eldritch knight x.

I think his starting stats were

Str 18
Dex 10
Con 15
Int 10
Wis 7
Cha 15

To throw another option into the mix, Bard 1/Ranger 4. If you know that you'll be facing one race a significant amount this can leap far ahead of the other classes (i.e.; the Skull & Shackles AP where you fight humans an incredible amount of the time). Also, if you're wearing Medium armour and get it mithril then you can cast without any arcane spell failure chance at all, since mithril allows the armour to count as one class lower for all limitations (Medium > Light) and Bards can cast in Light armour.

Note: Traits aren't part of the Core rules, are they?

@AC - The Arcane Armour training feat tree is quite nice, but it synergies best with the Celestial armours which are not core either. But as a dragon disciple you are unlikely to use Quickened Spell (or any other Swift Action spell, they are not core) for quite some time so I think I would recommend this path.

Breastplate + Shield spell is a base AC of 10 which should be well enough, especially considering all the natural armour bonuses you pick up.

Note: Traits aren't part of the Core rules, are they?

@AC - The Arcane Armour training feat tree is quite nice, but it synergies best with the Celestial armours which are not core either.

Celestial Armor actually is in the Core Rulebook.

Arcane armor training and mastery are great combined with a mithral full plate, only using the core book of course. That makes it a 5% asf as opposed to the 35 or 25 from armor being mithral. You wont have to many uses for swift actions aside from arcane strike which is also core. You won't be using arcane strike really if you're casting spells in a round.

If you can start at lvl 5, you might as well just go Bloodrager.

Note: Traits aren't part of the Core rules, are they?

They are part of the web enhancement, which is considered part of the core rules. In PFS CORE, traits from the Guide to Organized Play and the Web Enhancement are legal.

Paladin 2 Barb 2 has the alignment issue.

Eh, you lose the ability to rage if you start barbarian and become a paladin, but you keep fast movement, uncanny dodge, and that big 12 HP from first level. It's not the worst thing in the world.

Celestial Armor actually is in the Core Rulebook.

Ah. I was thinking of the Plate version. Which is really nice : )

They are part of the web enhancement, which is considered part of the core rules. In PFS CORE, traits from the Guide to Organized Play and the Web Enhancement are legal.

M'kay, did not know that : )