Some Questions


Advice


In no particular order.

1) If I ride a (non-flying) mount off a cliff and cast feather fall on the mount, is that sufficient or do I also need feather fall on the rider?

2) Celestial bloodline eventually sorc gets wings for a limited amount of fly time each day. Does he have to take a standard action to activate the wings then start flying as a move action or can he just start flying as his move action and still have his standard action left?

3) If flying with wings or the fly spell, can you quadruple move run?

4) If you are flying can you burning hands straight down to hit a 15’ diameter circle?

5) Raging song gives a morale bonus to will saves. The superstition rage power gives a morale bonus to all saves. Do those stack? Or just the higher one?

6) Can you charge if you don’t melee attack someone at the end of the movement (example: charge to get within spell range of a target)?

7) Narrow corridor. Front rank A is fighting in melee and getting beat up. Second rank B is fighting same opponent with a reach weapon. Third rank C has a wand of CLW. Can C squeeze into B’s position to use the wand to heal A?

8) Which book(s) have the list of which types of bonuses stack?

9) Which book(s) have the durable ammunition?

10) Constrictor snake with greater magic fang attacking an incorporeal opponent. The greater magic fang allows it to hit for half damage. Can it still grab/constrict?


1. Should work. If you cast Featherfall on yourself, it applies to your backpack (a heavy thing on your back that you are carrying), so casting Featherfall on a mount should apply to heavy things it is carrying on its back. *
2. Using a (Su) ability is always a Standard action unless the description of that ability says otherwise. This ability does not, so it must be a Standard action.
3. Yes. If you have a movement rate of any kind, you can run (normal encumbrance rules still apply too).
4. Yes. Combat is always in 3 dimensions though we usually don't care - when it does matter, just envision a 3-D grid of 5' cubes (or if it's applicable, just imagine a vertical 2-D grid of squares since that's much easier to envision).
5. Only DODGE bonuses stack. All other typed bonuses don't stack - just take the higher.
6. That's not a charge, it's just movement. The ONLY reason to charge is to be able to move (farther than one normal move) AND attack, so if you just want to move, then just move.
7. No. Normally he cannot end his turn in B's space. There is no normal way to move into that square, use the wand, then move out of that square. Some exceptions might be if C is 3 sizes smaller than B, in which case it's allowed, or if C has a magical item to give him an extra move action this round, or using feats to swap places with B who can then swap places on his own turn and still attack. But without specific exceptions, it cannot be done.
8. Core rulebook. But the list of bonus types that stack is easy: Dodge. That's it. A very short list.
9. Elves of Golarion. I don't remember if it got reprinted in Ultimate Equipment or not.
10. No. Universal monster rules on Incorporeal: " Incorporeal creatures cannot make trip or grapple attacks, nor can they be tripped or grappled."

*This one is very much up to the GM. I'll post more below.


1) feather fall effects gear and carried objects but not carried people. By RAW you would need to target both (if spells could effect riders, animal growth would be way too powerful), but if I were DMing, I would house rule the opposite for feather fall and only feather fall.

2) Not certain. Draconic bloodline specifies standard action, but doesn't have a duration. Therefore for balancing purposes I would say swift or free action to grow celestial wings since they are far more limited.

3) Burrow calls out that you can't run or charge, while swim specifically calls out that you can run. This makes flying's lack of call out under movement types very confusing. The spell fly (and overland flight which works just like fly) states that you can charge but can't run. With wings, my assumption is that you can run or charge while flying, because otherwise a hawk would be just as fast as a running human.

4)Translating from 2D to 3D is always hard, but assuming you are using 5ft cubes instead of squares, yes. Yes you can.

5)I think no, but seeing as how I am not sure, I will skip it.

6) No, charging is a special action that requires a full round action. You could not double move and then cast a spell in the same round (unless it was quickened). For the same action economy cost there is nothing besides attacking that charging can let you do while double move actions would not. Source

7)You can move through a square a friendly character occupies without trouble but you can not end your turn in that square. As such if you have a way to move before and after using the wand, take 2 5ft steps a round, a freerunner's shirt (extra move action), or if you are tiny or smaller, then yeah, you are golden

8)not sure

9)Elves of Golarion

10)Incorporeal creatures cannot make trip or grapple attacks, nor can they be tripped or grappled

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

What most people don't realise is that featherfall is NOT A SINGLE TARGET SPELL.

Targets: one Medium or smaller freefalling object or creature/level, no two of which may be more than 20 ft. apart


Regarding Feather Fall.

1. You can hit multiple targets (ninja'd by LazarX" so one spell can hit your mount and you.
2. Your mount is probably larger than Medium (unless you're smaller than medium) so it takes more target "slots" of the Feather Fall (targeting a horse counts as much as targeting two humans).
3. Feather Fall really only affects objects (as Headbutt! pointed out) so casting it on a horse doesn't mean it applies to its rider. But it does apply to the horse and its saddle and if the rider can hang onto either the horse or the saddle, there is no reason the rider should plummet to the ground when the horse does not.


Well sure Lazar, but what if this was at 2nd level (large creatures count as 2 medium) or if other people were also falling and you had to conserve targets?


8. Core Rulebook. But DM Blake, you forgot a few. Take a look.

Core Rulebook, page 208 wrote:
The important aspect of bonus types is that two bonuses of the same type don't generally stack. With the exception of dodge bonuses, most circumstance bonuses, and racial bonuses, only the better bonus of a given type works (see Combining Magical Effects).


Avoron wrote:

8. Core Rulebook. But DM Blake, you forgot a few. Take a look.

Core Rulebook, page 208 wrote:
The important aspect of bonus types is that two bonuses of the same type don't generally stack. With the exception of dodge bonuses, most circumstance bonuses, and racial bonuses, only the better bonus of a given type works (see Combining Magical Effects).

Fair enough, I did forget them.

I've never seen two stacking racial bonuses. An anyone cite an example?

Circumstance bonuses are a good catch though.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Use Headbutt!! wrote:
Well sure Lazar, but what if this was at 2nd level (large creatures count as 2 medium) or if other people were also falling and you had to conserve targets?

Life is tough. But seriously at 2nd level,... are you really preparing Featherfall, or taking it as a known spell? If you're going to argue by moving goalposts, consider me done with this thread.


LazarX wrote:
Use Headbutt!! wrote:
Well sure Lazar, but what if this was at 2nd level (large creatures count as 2 medium) or if other people were also falling and you had to conserve targets?
Life is tough. But seriously at 2nd level,... are you really preparing Featherfall, or taking it as a known spell? If you're going to argue by moving goalposts, consider me done with this thread.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to move the goalpost, I was just saying that there is the very real possibility that despite featherfall having multiple targets there are instances where it may not be enough. He originally asked if he also "need[ed] feather fall on the rider" which doesn't have to mean a 2nd casting, but could mean just as a second target for the spell. You are right, a lot of people do completely forget that featherfall is multi-targeted and reminding them of that helps a great number of the people reading this thread, so I should have first acknowledged that input before asking your answer to the question he asked.

Oh and for the record, heck yeah I could see the party fighting a 2nd level nomadic wizard out in a mountainous region who prepared featherfall as a means of escape. That sounds pretty epic for a low level party fight. Or heck, a squad of halfling cavaliers and a 3rd level wizard? 1 feather to save 3 mounts and their riders or do you need to cast it twice?


Examples of Stacking Racial Bonuses:

If you get a racial bonus to Climb or Swim checks from your race, it stacks with the racial bonus from having a Climb or Swim speed.

If you get a racial bonus to a certain type of save from your race, it stacks with the racial bonus from the Spirit Talker trait.

The Desert Hunter elf alternate racial trait stacks with the Savanna Hunter trait.

The Eternal Hope gnome alternate racial trait stacks with the Illusion Resistance racial trait, the Magical Linguist alternate racial trait, or the Expanded Resistance feat, for spells against which both bonuses apply.

The Child of the See and Water Child half-elf alternate racial traits stack to give a +8 racial bonus on swim checks.

The Bestial and Scavenger half-orc alternate racial traits stack.

The Forest Walker and Rock Climber half-orc alternate racial traits stack.

Half-orcs with the Cliffside Charger alternate racial trait and the Racial Heritage (Catfolk) and Catfolk Exemplar feats gain a +20 ft racial bonus to speed on a charge.

The Fearless and Halfling Luck halfling racial traits stack. This one is explicitly called out in the text.

For humans with the Mixed Heritage alternate racial trait, Heart of the Mountains and Heart of the Snows stack. Also, Heart of the Slums and Heart of the Wilderness stack. Alternatively, Heart of the Fields and Heart of the Sea stack for Profession (sailor) checks.

Variant aasimar heritages and variant aasimar abilities both give racial bonuses to certain skills. Because of this, it is easy for aasimars to double up on racial bonuses to certain skills: Acrobatics, Diplomacy, Handle Animal, Heal, Intimidate, Knowledge (planes), Perception, Perform, and Sense Motive. In the case of Diplomacy, they can get a third stacking racial bonus through the Revered Guidance feat.

Variant tiefling heritages and variant tiefling abilities both give racial bonuses to certain skills. Because of this, it is easy for tieflings to double up on racial bonuses to certain skills: Diplomacy, Disguise, Escape Artist, Knowledge (local), Knowledge (religion), Perception, and Sleight of Hand. They can also get a stacking racial bonus to Intimidate through the Monstrous Mask feat.

For Scion of Humanity aasimars with Racial Heritage (halfling) and the Halfling Slinger feat, the bonus from that feat stacks with variant aasimar heritages numbers 13 and 61.


There were several of us trying to figure an escape plan. I had enough slots for all of us, but not my riding dog and me. GM decided to allow it to work, but wasn't real certain.

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