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Early on a lot of parties may not have area effect magic, environment effecting tricks, etc to properly deal with swarms. Especially diminutive or tiny ones. Such was the case with my last session.
According to the rules the PCs had no way to deal proper damage to a swarm because diminutive swarms are immune to weapon damage.
The party monk opened his whiskey over one and the Sorcerer ignited it, failing a save the swarm perished from the fire. The cavalier on the other hand had another problem. All he had were his weapons. His idea was to use his shield to scoop and smoosh the critters dispersing the swarm. I allowed it, but RAW I'm confused as to how to handle this kinda stuff.
Any advice?
Swarms -suck- at any level... but yeah, at low levels they're almost unbeatable considering even AoE magic apparently only deals half damage to them.
I used a Hydrolic Push spell on a rat swarm once and the DM ruled that it dispersed the swarm for 1D4 rounds. That at least bought us some time.
Alchemist fire, Acid flasks, and torches.
Torches deal energy damage, while the alchemical items kill the swarms.
A party without some energy damage, and a few alchemical items to fall back on are asking for death by swarm.
It might not be as fancy as that breastplate, but like rope, grappling hooks, pitons, a hammer, rations and waterskins some alchemical items are mandatory at lower levels (and still smart at higher ones).
Alchemist fire, Acid flasks, and torches.
Torches deal energy damage, while the alchemical items kill the swarms.
A party without some energy damage, and a few alchemical items to fall back on are asking for death by swarm.
It might not be as fancy as that breastplate, but like rope, grappling hooks, pitons, a hammer, rations and waterskins some alchemical items are mandatory at lower levels (and still smart at higher ones).
Is energy damage still halved? If so, 1D6/2 isn't all that great. It helps, sure... but it'd be nicer if it weren't halved.
throw a lantern at em then lob oil
Swarms -suck- at any level... but yeah, at low levels they're almost unbeatable considering even AoE magic apparently only deals half damage to them.
I used a Hydrolic Push spell on a rat swarm once and the DM ruled that it dispersed the swarm for 1D4 rounds. That at least bought us some time.
A swarm takes half again as much damage (+50%) from spells of effects that affect an area, such as splash weapons and many evocation spells.
I try to pick up at least 1 alchemist's fire for every starting character if I anticipate swarms being present as enemies. My group has gone before unprepared for such an encounter, fled, then came back later to a nearby place and encountered the swarm ready to go. Really, though, at all levels it's the fight you generally have to improvise if you're not ready to face them.
Is energy damage still halved? If so, 1D6/2 isn't all that great. It helps, sure... but it'd be nicer if it weren't halved.Alchemist fire, Acid flasks, and torches.
Torches deal energy damage, while the alchemical items kill the swarms.
A party without some energy damage, and a few alchemical items to fall back on are asking for death by swarm.
It might not be as fancy as that breastplate, but like rope, grappling hooks, pitons, a hammer, rations and waterskins some alchemical items are mandatory at lower levels (and still smart at higher ones).
I don't see anything that says energy damage is halved... In fact I haven't ever saw anything stating that.
Swarms are not objects.
>.<
Dang. So my Burning Hands should have been very effective vs that swarm, not 3 damage effective.
you might have noticed there is a bee keeper type outfit in the APG which gives you DR10 vs swarm damage
also would a battle poi deal damage to a swarm ?
its 2 fuel soaked balls lit on fire and swung around on chains deals 1d4 fire dmg.
which also leads me to think that most groups could create makeshift swarm weapons by carry around oil/fuel to coat weapons and shield to light them on fire.
you could even do fire breathing whith a flask of ignitable fluid and a torch or the spark cantrip.
Yeah, AoEs are they only way to effectively handle a swarm. If you have none of those, sucks to be you.
heh here's a thought if you play a Tiefling pour oil over yourself if facing a swarm and then set yourself on fire , since you have resist 5 fire you'll take no damage from ongoing fire burn however any swarm you come into contact with is gonna burn and I'd argue wouldn't be able to cause damage becuase they need to touch you to attack and in doing so the individual creatures would burn to death before they got close enough to bite/sting etc
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>.<
Dang. So my Burning Hands should have been very effective vs that swarm, not 3 damage effective.
Indeed. Dropping a burning hands through your bonded item is the backup swarm killer. It's more fun when the swarm is on another PC because they can't try and reflex save otherwise it will reduce the damage dealt to the swarm too ;-)
Indeed. Dropping a burning hands through your bonded item is the backup swarm killer. It's more fun when the swarm is on another PC because they can't try and reflex save otherwise it will reduce the damage dealt to the swarm too ;-)>.<
Dang. So my Burning Hands should have been very effective vs that swarm, not 3 damage effective.
Um... I'm pretty sure that isn't the case. You still get a reflex save, and if you succeed the swarm doesn't get to take half damage unless it made its save.
Can also carry a flask of Keros Oil 10 uses to breathe fire in a 5 foot AOE
Torches really are the weapon of choice for anyone dealing with swarms at low level. It is even common in movies (such as The Mummy). Almost all characters should have torches in their gear at very low level. Those that do not are either spellcasters with light or darkvision folks.
If they do not have torches I would allow them to make home made ones with torn cloth on the tip of a sword/spear/stick. This is something that any character should be able to do.
Other then that you can try and use the environment as a barrier. Run behind a closed door. Jump over a stream. Climb up a tree and jump limb to limb. These are all examples of what fictional characters have done in movies and should be something that could come to a players mind when presented with this type of challenge.
Would let the players use torches or campfires. Would even let torch do double damage vs swarms ( but thats just me ). Would let campfires provide a 3 foot safe spot for character to stand in that swarm could not enter ( but then again thats just me ).
Why = because that is what i say on Indeana Jones :)
Would let the players use torches or campfires. Would even let torch do double damage vs swarms ( but thats just me ). Would let campfires provide a 3 foot safe spot for character to stand in that swarm could not enter ( but then again thats just me ).
Why = because that is what i say on Indeana Jones :)
heh tielfing stand in the fire just to be extra safe from the swarm ;)
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Vermin Repellent is also a cheap alchemical remedy to keep them off you.
Additionally, if there is a druid in the party, they can convert any first level spell to Summon Natures Ally I and summon a mite. Mites have Vermin Empathy and since most swarms are vermin, lets them control the swarm. Just make sure the druid speaks undercommon before he summons the mite since that is the only language they speak.
Here's an interesting question... Would a tanglefoot bag thrown to target the center of the swarm cause the myriad little buggers (pun!) to be stuck still? And if so, does a lit torch easily wipe out the swarm? :)
A tanglefoot bag targets a single target and is not a splash weapon. It is ineffective against swarms. An alchemist tanglefoot bomb, on the other hand, does affect a swarm.
Does 5 year old post necromancy do anything to swarms?
I have a huntress who got abandoned by the party to a leech swarm. As a desperate act she casted flaming sphere on herself to kill the leeches attacking her and made her reflex save to avoid damage. The leeches weren't so lucky. When the enemy magus made her unconscious with a flaming sphere of her own, the Party left her unconscious despite being the only divine caster and healer in the party. They healed the injured but conscious barbarian instead, even though My Hunter's Griffon did more damage than he did. Some party. Also said Magus flaming sphere? The party was about to leave my Huntress in it and perma die until I argued with them. Experiences like this make me play more adventure paths with my friends while slow to accept any pathfinder society once or twice a month.
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I have a huntress who got abandoned by the party to a leech swarm.... Some party. Also said Magus flaming sphere? The party was about to leave my Huntress in it and perma die until I argued with them. Experiences like this make me play more adventure paths with my friends while slow to accept any pathfinder society once or twice a month.
Pathfinder Society is all about who you find there, true.
It is strangely the closest you get to a real life makeshift party experience. The GM should have alignment smacked any good PCs leaving your PC. Since watching Critical Role and starting recently in PS, I do a lot of the talking even though I keep looking around the table for someone else to say anything. Even though my PC is a slugger with no INt or CHA.So I roll with it and play it as a PC who thinks everyone trusts his leadership, even though number jockeys shouldn't let me talk. Everyone loves to see the trouble I get into and I fight way more than I should. Half the conversations we have involve post knocking everyone out intimidation conversations.
Roll with the situation is how this should go.
I would make your character more gunshy around society players and maybe have her trust the one player who saved her. Or have her take her alignment to neutral and make her plot her revenge indirectly. You now are the definition of chaotic. The story threw you a curve ball. Just keep trudging through like you would in real life. It is why playing with living people is interesting.