3.5 Bard Music Feats to Pathfinder


Conversions


Because the Pathfinder bard music is rounds/per day vs. music uses/per day, how does one convert feats from splatbooks like lyric song, snowflake wardance, enchanting song, etc...that use a certain number of uses of bard music?

Is there a suggested number of rounds used instead (maybe 4 rounds = 1 song use)?

Because a Pathfinder bard can only have one performance in effect at a given time, what would happen if a bard uses a feat that uses bard music to power it? For example a bard is maintaining song of courage and casts charm person using the Enchanting song feat, would inspire courage immediately end or keep going?


Personally, I convert them by changing the bard back to uses/day. It's a much easier conversion that way. Otherwise it's pretty much impossible to come up with a unified method of conversion.


while he gains 4 points at level 1 and 2 points per level after that, myself I would go with 4 rounds per feat. that pretty much keeps it as the same number in 3.5 more or less.
cha 14 bard
1=6 1 use
2=8 2 uses
3=10
4=12 3 uses
5=14
6=16 4 uses
7=18
8=20 5 uses
9=22
10=24 6 uses

And so on. now keep in mind most bard will raise cha higher but 4 per use is a good rule


However, that completely destroys the entire point behind changing from uses/day to rounds/day. If you're going to give performances different rounds/day costs than the number of rounds they give an effect for, then you might as well just go back to uses/day.


not really, a few of the feats grant ability are more powerful then the norm, so paying more for that is not really an issue. Unless you wish to just add it to your list of known powers. Many of the ones I know of from eberron you could not even take before 5th level, so really it is a non issue

As always this is a case by case thing

Grand Lodge

I would actually go with 2 rounds = 1 use considering every level (other than 1st) gives you 2 rounds. In 3.5 it was 1 use per level, in PF it is basically 2 rounds /level.


The way I handle it, is you pay 1 round to activate it, and another round every 3 units of time the feat lasts.

Chant of the Long road enhances a group/unit/small army's ability to travel without fatiguing over hours, so, 1 round to activate it, and 1 round after every 3rd hour if you want to maintain it.

Snowflake Wardance lasts a number of rounds equal to perform dance ranks. This one can go one of two ways (I haven't decided yet because my bard player hasn't expressed an interest in melee)

A: Use the same method as others, 1 round and one more after every 3rd round to maintain it, but this destroys the benefit of perform dance ranks

B: Use 1 round to activate it as a free action, and it lasts a number of rounds equal to your perform dance virtual ranks (Ranks+class skill bonus+any applicable feats) divided by 3. Then you refresh it every time that duration runs out. (For example, a bard with snowflake wardance, 6 ranks in perform dance, +3 because it's a class skill, and skill focus (+3) would pay once, it would last 4 rounds, and then he could trigger it again.)

I know this is a side point, but my bard player is using the bow from the magic item compendium that burns a bardic music use to add cha to attack and damage for the round. I've decided to just change it to sucking a round of bardic music out of her per shot fired.(This also frees up her swift action to do other things, maybe a quickened spell or a swift action one)


ithuriel wrote:
I would actually go with 2 rounds = 1 use considering every level (other than 1st) gives you 2 rounds. In 3.5 it was 1 use per level, in PF it is basically 2 rounds /level.

Or you can do that, simple and clean. Good idea Ithuriel.


ithuriel wrote:
I would actually go with 2 rounds = 1 use considering every level (other than 1st) gives you 2 rounds. In 3.5 it was 1 use per level, in PF it is basically 2 rounds /level.

I thought of that but some will be too good for that maybe, it is cleaner however

Scarab Sages

Reigor wrote:
Because the Pathfinder bard music is rounds/per day vs. music uses/per day, how does one convert feats from splatbooks like lyric song, snowflake wardance, enchanting song, etc...that use a certain number of uses of bard music?

It depends on lots of stuff, I've decided. As I am playing a bard, I've put quite a bit of thought into this one. Note that a single feat/performance will likely be modified by more than one of these.

Duration: If the duration is measured in rounds, the new duration is 1 round ("until the start of your next turn"). If the duration is measured in minutes or greater, it remains unchanged. If the duration is "until the start/end of your next turn" it is unchanged. (The only exception so far is Sound of Silence, which retains the 3 round duration.)

Action: If the action required is standard, move, or swift, it changes to a standard action*, as normal for a bardic performance. All other activation actions are unchanged.

Immediate Action Peformances: If the feat uses an immediate action, it requires 1 round of bardic performance. In addition, it interrupts any performances currently being maintained.**

Multiple Uses: If a bardic music feat requires multiple daily uses, it now requires 1 round of bardic performance. In addition, the bard cannot maintain a bardic performance for a number of rounds equal to the number of daily uses the feat requires.***

*:
This might, at first, seem nerfing, but if you look at the feat, when the bard can get it, and the action it requires, the PFRPG change to starting a performance (that it gets easier as the bard gains levels) almost perfectly matches - usually only off by one level. Thus we remove the action specified in the feat to take advantage of the bard's reduced starting peformance time.

**:
I am currently testing allowing the bard to resume a previous performance by expending the appropriate action on the following turn, without expending a round of bardic music.

***:
I am currently testing allowing the bard to maintain a performance during this time at increased difficulty - as a standard action. Example: I use Lyric Spell to cast glitterdust; it costs me only 1 round of bardic performance, but for the next two rounds I can only maintain a performance by using a standard action. Incidentally, I *may* end up just converting uses to rounds for Lyric Spell only, as the bard gains a ton of spellcasting power this way.


Thanks all for your replies :)

Scarab Sages

Just and update: the following are the rules my group has finalized for converting 3.5 bardic music. (It's pretty much the same as my previous post, but including - or not - the things we were testing.)

To convert a bardic music feat to PFRPG, examine all of the following aspects of the feat and change each aspect accordingly.

Duration: If the duration is measured in rounds, the new duration is 1 round ("until the start of your next turn"). If the duration is measured in minutes or greater, it remains unchanged. If the duration is "until the start/end of your next turn" it is unchanged. (The only exception is Sound of Silence, which retains the 3 round duration.)

Action: If the action required is standard, move, or swift, it changes to the normal action for starting a bardic performance (which is dependent on the bard's level). All other activation actions are unchanged.

Immediate Action Peformances: If the feat uses an immediate action, it requires at least 1 round of bardic performance and interrupts (ends) any performances the bard was maintaining.

Multiple Uses: If a bardic music feat requires multiple daily uses, it now requires 1 round of bardic performance. In addition, the bard can only start or maintain a bardic performance as a standard action for a number of rounds equal to the number of daily uses the feat required.


Are there any feats that function like Practiced Spellcaster for Bardic Music/Perfomance? 3.5 or PFRPG?

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