Handyman Corner: Home Edition

One thing that your explanation confused me about, Justin, is that in your closing statements you say this:

Earning capital costs half as much as purchasing it, but takes time and some creative thinking on how our character will work to earn it. Let's say our character can reliably earn 1 point of capital per day, and can do so for each type of capital. This means our character would spend 62 days gathering resources and labor building their house for an overall price of 645 gp. The time investment can change however, as some characters are suited to earning certain types of capital quicker, and the town's size limits how fast construction can go.

Most rooms in Ultimate Campaign have a time cost associated with them. Is that time cost referring the time it takes to perform the labor required to build the room?

Basically, are you saying the following:

I'm Valeros the Fighter, and I have 2,000 gp in my pocket. I'm looking to get a house in Sandpoint and settle down. I don't feel like doing the work myself, so I decide to spend my hard-earned gold on my new digs. According to the House entry in Ultimate Combat, a standard house costs 1,290 gp and Valeros doesn't want anything fancy (yet) so this is good enough for him. I spend my gold and the house is built for me, taking 62 days of construction (the total time investment of all component rooms). Two months later and with 710 gp in his pocket, Valeros's house is completed!

I'm Sajan the Monk, and I have 2,000 gp in my pocket. I'm looking to get a house in Sandpoint and settle down. I value hard work and my money, so I decide to build this house myself. Each day I make Downtime checks, slowly gaining capital until I have the requisite amount (31 Goods, 1 Influence, and 31 Labor). When I have earned all of the labor I need, I spend all of my captain and my house is immediately ready for use before my time investment is spent on earning the labor I need to actually construct my home.

Your post seems to imply the following, that because you're performing / overseeing the labor yourself, when you're done, the building you are constructing is done.

I absolutely love the downtime rules, but if Ultimate Campaign has a weakness, I truly think it is in the explanations for how capital is earned and spent on buildings. All of the information that you want and need are scattered about the Chapter and squirreled away in large blocks of text instead explained quickly and concisely. I appreciate your effort in trying to explain the system, however.

I interpreted the rules to mean that you have to spend the capital before the 62 days of construction starts. This allows you to buy it outright and be able to move in in 62 days, or you can spend half the gold but take more time because it takes 62 days or less to acquire the capital and another 62 days for the construction.

Now that I have read your post, I see both possibilities. Now I am really confused.

Another thing my players are confused about is this:

If you are paying for Cost of Living (which they are) and it includes a place to live, what are the benefits of building a house? Also when they build a house and do not run a business out of it, what is the upkeep cost to maintain the building.

I find the Downtime rules very intriguing but they are a bit confusing.

-- Urlord The Wonderful --

I interpreted the rules to mean that you have to spend the capital before the 62 days of construction starts. This allows you to buy it outright and be able to move in in 62 days, or you can spend half the gold but take more time because it takes 62 days or less to acquire the capital and another 62 days for the construction.

Now that I have read your post, I see both possibilities. Now I am really confused.

Another thing my players are confused about is this:

If you are paying for Cost of Living (which they are) and it includes a place to live, what are the benefits of building a house? Also when they build a house and do not run a business out of it, what is the upkeep cost to maintain the building.

I find the Downtime rules very intriguing but they are a bit confusing.

-- Urlord The Wonderful --

Same.

However, the rules are pretty clear that there are no costs to maintain buildings outside of any capital that you have to spent to resolve downtime events regarding the building.

And remember if the ladies dont find you hansom they should at least find you handy

Alexander Augunas, is that also true for teams? I couldn't find any information regarding upkeep costs for hired guards/soldiers/etc that aren't being used for a commercial purpose.

Teams also do not have upkeep costs.

In the Downtime section: Has anyone seen stats for a water supply like wells, river/lakeside stats etc?

I've seen the "pit" stats, I've seen the "aqueduct" stats for the kingdom builder section. Not so much info regarding water for your buildings, gardens and farmlands...

The "sewer access" lets you have "indoor plumbing" however I see this as "outgoing" instead of ingoing.

If not any suggestions for stats?

Here's an interesting scenario I had come up in my homebrew using Downtime:

Some refugees came to the PCs hometown and the players felt bad for them so helped them build some shacks on the outskirts of town. W/all the capital they were able to bring to bear (4 level 5 PCs) they were able to get all the rooms done in a day. However one PC wasn't content w/these poor folks spending a winter in shacks.

She came to me separately and asked if she could use more capital and make 3 custom homes. Each would have bunk space and kitchens enough to house roughly about 10 folks, covering the 30 refugees in these buildings. Her PC has in her backstory an enormous extended family mostly living in town or the next village over, so she asked if she could assemble Teams of skilled and unskilled labor from these.

Through a flurry of emails what emerged was a MASSIVE undertaking of charity. This PC, along w/2 others donated their time and resources, stored capital, gold and such to the gathering of teams and materials. They also went to their respective churches of Erastil and Saranrae and used Diplomacy to generate Capital, translating into these PCs begging boons of the clergy and sympathetic parishioners.

Over the course of a couple weeks they gathered and spent all the capital needed to:

1. Assemble 8 teams; 3 of skilled crafters and 5 of unskilled labor
2. Amass copious amounts of Goods, enough to cover the whole project
3. Spend some of their own Labor into the bargain to kickstart the work

So... after all that my question is: did I have it right that, with teams recruited and all the capital spent up front that they can now go off adventuring while the Fantasy Makeover: Home Edition project progresses without them?

You see, after a couple weeks of Downtime my players were like "Ok... now we can go explore that evil bog outside town again right?" So I said they could leave the one NPC cousin of the female PC in charge while they went off. I said since they spent massive capital amounts up front then the buildings would take roughly another 30 days but that the characters didn't have to stick around for it all.

The PCs didn't buy the buildings outright but rather gathered capital for them. Did I do that right?

Haven't had a chance to use the rules yet Mark, but kudos to you and your players.

... The PCs didn't buy the buildings outright but rather gathered capital for them. Did I do that right?

In my mind, the Rule of Awesome says you all did this exactly right.

In the Downtime section: Has anyone seen stats for a water supply like wells, river/lakeside stats etc?

I've seen the "pit" stats, I've seen the "aqueduct" stats for the kingdom builder section. Not so much info regarding water for your buildings, gardens and farmlands...

The "sewer access" lets you have "indoor plumbing" however I see this as "outgoing" instead of ingoing.

If not any suggestions for stats?

Well, technically speaking aqueducts were used for both in-going and outgoing water. You could do the same thing with a water tower, in which you fill up the water down and gravity pulls it down piles and into drains. But realistically speaking, if your kingdom took the time to build a trial of aqueducts (which are pretty expensive as-is) then your buildings should be able to gain indoor plumbing. I would personally include it as a furnishing to a room (+300 gp).

As for water itself? Wells are sort of chancy in terms of where they go. You can't just dig a hole and expect water to be there, so it makes sense that you can't just "buy" a well. Likewise, most irrigation tracks were built off of rivers, which would simply mean that your lot would need to have a water boarder for irrigation.

This is all going off of "Rule of Common Sense" rather than anything in the book itself, though.

Thanks Mr. Augunas.

I get irrigation. Saw many a PBS, NatGeo and Discover documentaries. Wells needing to be "strategically" placed I understand that too. I guess what I should have asked is how to get water to your home/hideout/hangout via the Downtime plugin.

I was thinking about the "Furnishing a Room" option too. I'm thinking this would also include Barrels at a Downspout, a fountain in a courtyard room and any other rain collecting device.

I know aqueducts are HUGE projects. Thus I too don't think it is appropriate for the Downtime Room building method.

I guess folks will have to create irrigation channels from a good water source. Still I'd like any other suggestions and stats for a "water supply" option.

It's funny they mention Lavatories and Baths, but not how water gets to the rooms.

Rom001

I guess folks will have to create irrigation channels from a good water source. Still I'd like any other suggestions and stats for a "water supply" option.

You would probably have to build a bunch of pits or something to create an artificial lake or reservoir. I *think* that might have been beyond the technology scope of the medieval era, but certainly not for a magically-enhanced era. Its a very good question that isn't easy to replicate using the Downtime Rules. Personally, I might look up the cost of filling a lot with water (from the Kingdom Building rules) and try to translate that from BP to GP, and then from the size of a lot to a smaller size.

It's funny they mention Lavatories and Baths, but not how water gets to the rooms.

I think they want to leave it up to your imagination. I've always liked the Greek-and-Roman baths, personally, were they route water from the aqueducts into the bath, then use fires and stuff to heat it for you.

Water in general gets very fuzzy once you get a magic item crafter to create a few decanters of endless water for you, as shown by the Everspring Fountain lot upgrade. ;-)