Really liking the look of this game so far! Figured I'd create this thread for folks to post potential suggestions to Paizo for as the full game is being developed, similar to the errata threads we have for Pathfinder.
I'll start with mentioning a confusing bit of formatting in the archetype descriptions. In the "Relations to Other Characters" section of each of these, the formatting of the other archetypes' names looks the same as the previous few sections' titles, when really they're sub-sections of the "Relations to Other Characters" section. I'd recommend adjusting the formatting (perhaps putting those archetype names in italics, rather than bold, or putting them in a bulleted list) to make it clear that the later parts of the description are parts of that section rather than entirely separate sections of their own.
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The AI-generated alt-text on the images in this document is frequently incorrect. [...]
Good find! It looks like Pathfinder Impossible Magic by contrast doesn't seem to have alt text for any of its images (at least not the ones I checked), which tbh I'd likely consider to the better option vs. AI slop alt text that's predictably full of inaccuracies and even says "AI generated" at the end of each alt text that it generated.
If AI's going to be used to generate alt text (which imo, it shouldn't be, taking a piece of art and adapting it to a different medium is absolutely creative work) then it definitely at least needs human review to make sure it's accurate.
What was the delivery method for the pdf?
I paid the $5, but I haven't seen any follow-up for actual pdf download.
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What was the delivery method for the pdf?
I paid the $5, but I haven't seen any follow-up for actual pdf download.
I received an email with a download link, but it took several hours after submitting my payment for me to receive it.
Creative Director
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AI is not meant to be used ever to generate Alt Text. In fact, several of us at Paizo (myself included) spent hundreds of hours overall over the past few years hand-writing alt text for a lot of images that were going up online for the new store becuase the software was auto-generating it. As we stride boldly forth into the future, that sort of "help" is only going to get worse and sneaky as far as how it sneaks into products, as it happened here, apparently.
I'll look into it and make sure that we fix it going forward. I'd rather have NO alt text at all than even one AI generated one... but with some places moving toward legal requirements to have alt text before you can put a product on sale, it's gonna be tricky. It's not a simple task to add alt text to everything, and Paizo's resources for employee time is not infinite..
Anyway, thanks for bringing this up! I'll share it with the team.
EDIT: Can confirm this is something the software did on its own. There's a toggle to turn it off, but every time the software updates, it turns that toggle back to on so we have to go in and turn it off again. Great help from the future, thanks, I hate it.
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Creative Director
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Really liking the look of this game so far! Figured I'd create this thread for folks to post potential suggestions to Paizo for as the full game is being developed, similar to the errata threads we have for Pathfinder.
I'll start with mentioning a confusing bit of formatting in the archetype descriptions. In the "Relations to Other Characters" section of each of these, the formatting of the other archetypes' names looks the same as the previous few sections' titles, when really they're sub-sections of the "Relations to Other Characters" section. I'd recommend adjusting the formatting (perhaps putting those archetype names in italics, rather than bold, or putting them in a bulleted list) to make it clear that the later parts of the description are parts of that section rather than entirely separate sections of their own.
This is great feedback! I'm working on new 13 Omens stuff already and have made some changes along these lines to upcoming stuff for the same reasons. It's not the right time or place to say more but yeah, we're still dialing in things like this for the final product.
So, please keep feedback like this coming! Super helpful!!!
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EDIT: Can confirm this is something the software did on its own. There's a toggle to turn it off, but every time the software updates, it turns that toggle back to on so we have to go in and turn it off again. Great help from the future, thanks, I hate it.
I am so, so tired of AI "features" turning themselves on.
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Creative Director
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Thanks for the response, and I appreciate the commitment to your firm anti-AI stance.
It's only gonna get tougher to spot them, alas, as time marches onward, but we'll keep the fight up as long as we can. (One of the things that the program generated AI alt text for was nothing more than a line under a piece of header text, for example...).
We at Paizo also appreciate folks pointing these out to us in a helpful and non-accusatory way too. We are 100% against generative text/art, and it has no place in our products, but as this stuff gets better at stealing from creators and artists, their styles are increasingly things that other folks assume are AI generated and get accusatory on. When what's really happening is that their style's have been stolen by the image generators and spammed so much across the internet that it turns into a toxic case of the chicken and the egg.
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EDIT: Can confirm this is something the software did on its own. There's a toggle to turn it off, but every time the software updates, it turns that toggle back to on so we have to go in and turn it off again. Great help from the future, thanks, I hate it.I am so, so tired of AI "features" turning themselves on.
Agreed.
I got an email this morning from Google that they ever so kindly out of the goodness of their hearts (and without ever asking for my consent) enabled promotional access to AI tools in Drive, Docs, and Sheets.
Gee, thanks. So now I have to watch and make sure they don't try to automatically roll that over into a paid subscription? And what, exactly, are these AI tools going to be doing to my existing files that I already have working exactly how I want them to?
I remember a time where things like this were considered ransomware.
Thanks for the response, and I appreciate the commitment to your firm anti-AI stance.It's only gonna get tougher to spot them, alas, as time marches onward, but we'll keep the fight up as long as we can. (One of the things that the program generated AI alt text for was nothing more than a line under a piece of header text, for example...).
We at Paizo also appreciate folks pointing these out to us in a helpful and non-accusatory way too. We are 100% against generative text/art, and it has no place in our products, but as this stuff gets better at stealing from creators and artists, their styles are increasingly things that other folks assume are AI generated and get accusatory on. When what's really happening is that their style's have been stolen by the image generators and spammed so much across the internet that it turns into a toxic case of the chicken and the egg.
I just got an email with corrected PDFs where the 'AI' content has been removed, that's a really fantastic (and fast) response that ya'll pulled together in the middle of a convention weekend. Kudos to whoever on the team took care of that so quickly.
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Creative Director
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Yup; getting that garbage scrubbed out of the game was super important. The silver lining I guess is the momentary bout of amusment I had about the so-called "intelligence" describing a spilled bag of bloody teeth as "a hat with a red dot on it." Go home, Robot. You're drunk.
More seriously though, thanks for pointing this out so we could get it fixed in the first place, and we'll be keeping an eye on said robots even more going forward!
EDIT: Can confirm this is something the software did on its own. There's a toggle to turn it off, but every time the software updates, it turns that toggle back to on so we have to go in and turn it off again. Great help from the future, thanks, I hate it.I am so, so tired of AI "features" turning themselves on.Agreed.
I got an email this morning from Google that they ever so kindly out of the goodness of their hearts (and without ever asking for my consent) enabled promotional access to AI tools in Drive, Docs, and Sheets.
Gee, thanks. So now I have to watch and make sure they don't try to automatically roll that over into a paid subscription? And what, exactly, are these AI tools going to be doing to my existing files that I already have working exactly how I want them to?
I remember a time where things like this were considered ransomware.
I hope there's some kind of firefox addon I can install that removes those at least.
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I really want to break out my copy of Betrayal at House on the Hill Legacy, and build archetypes for those characters and use the tiles to build out the map when I get around to running the game.
If anyone wants inspiration for 13 Omens adventures, just pull any scenario from Betrayal, every one is almost a perfect adventure seed.
I received an email with a download link, but it took several hours after submitting my payment for me to receive it.What was the delivery method for the pdf?
I paid the $5, but I haven't seen any follow-up for actual pdf download.
Lesson learned: when they say *immediate* access, they mean immediate, and there's no way to go back to the link except by paying again that I've discovered.
Hey, paid my $5 but still no PDF download link. It has been almost 24 hours.
Thanks
Jeff
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Feedback on the game! We tried it last night. 4 players, one Host. Intro scenario. The Players picked the Face, Gopher, Tech Specialist, and Fan. True Believer as the NPC. I printed off character sheets and the map (chopped into sections) in order to make it easier/faster for their play.
General feedback was that the game was fun! There was tension exploring the Inn, and the story moved along at a good pace. We played for about 2.5 hours all total with setup. The stat distribution was easy to understand and setup, as well as the perks. The players did cooperate on that a bit "I'm going to be good at Evade!" and similar to balance the party.
Gameplay was a little klunky initially, honestly. That was somewhat in my ability to balance vivid descriptions intermixed with the "right times" to ask for an Aspect check. It was somewhat hit/miss on the Aspect checks for the players - whoever was talking the most got more checks, so Host had to find ways to pull the quieter folks in.
Other feedback was that the "scenario specific" aspects seemed to get shorted when it came to the storyline. I found very few suggestions in the scenario for checks that related to the story specific Aspects. An occult check here or there. "Tech" "Ghost Lore" and others weren't even mentioned in the scenario, which means the players and I had to wing that a bit. "When was I supposed to make a Tech check?" Etc. A bit too much falling back to standard "Evade/Fight/Luck" to get out of jams, etc.
Overall, folks enjoyed it, and want to play some more for sure. Will try to find a night to run the other scenario and see how that goes.
