Incredible Investiture [Opinions]


Advice


So, what do you think about this feat?

Is it worth, even just at some point ( knowing that magic items are costy ), to aim for it?

I still have no clue whether 10 ( 8 not considering armor and weapon ) invested ( invested trait ) magic items would be enough or not.


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Depends on how many magic items you have. I've never had enough to need it.

Scarab Sages

In my Age of Ashes game, my party as a lot of gold, so I took it, and it was a feat well spent.

In my Extinction Curse game, we're short on gold so it doesn't really make sense for my PC.


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It seems like one of those feats that you would retrain into if you find that you need it. Not something that I would plan for from level 1.


breithauptclan wrote:
It seems like one of those feats that you would retrain into if you find that you need it. Not something that I would plan for from level 1.

Well, since it's tied to a high charisma score, it is definitely something somebody would like to plan in advance.

I feel more like Deriven, though the more the books, the more the possibilities ( and because so it becomes way more interesting the more the "time" passes ).

@NG: In AoA we are currently starving for golds ( If I were to create a brand new character following the rules, it would result into one having the items of the whole party ).

We didn't make a good use of downtime activities, I guess.


By the time you get to your 11th or 12th item, we're mostly talking about either extra uses of an item you have (by buying a copy) or item bonuses to a tertiary skill.

Is that worth a feat? Often, I'd think, but one should be able to figure that out relatively early (and possibly think of different solutions, like via wands) at least for oneself. The party as a whole might be able to cover that, as might alchemy w/ its item bonuses if only needed infrequently (or you have an Alchemist).

Is that worth stat points in Charisma? No. Those points could go to another stat that perhaps gives a similar bonus to what you're looking for (net) or gives a more important bonus to a saving throw or even Bulk (et al) Unless a build already uses Charisma (assuming one doesn't have spare stat points!) the feat isn't reason enough to invest in Charisma.


It helped that weapons, wands, scrolls, and most consumable or minor magic items don't require investment. It's a rather small number of items that require investment.

A staff I think? Maybe staves only need preparation.

Worn skill enhancing items.

Something like an energy resistant ring.

Not too many items you absolutely have to have require investment. That makes this feat not too necessary.


Gonna echo the others and say it really depends on the character. I'm intending to take it on my summoner because they've already got loads of Cha anyway, and I like the extra actions and things that having lots of items gives me. Also, I'm slightly unclear on who spends the investiture when your eidolon wears items; is it me, or does the eidolon get two "free" investiture that it can spend on, well, right now the only two items it can wear?


In my opinion, it really depends on players. Some like to have tons of items (and rings of Energy Resistance is a good example of an item you can have 5 times) when others dislike tracking tons of items and only focus on a few important ones.
Overall, it's a very strong feat, even if it just gives you a resistance of 5/10 against 2 energies, it's way above what most general feats can give. There are very few useful general feats (Toughness, Fleet, Ancestral Paragon, Canny Acumen and Incredible Initiative) so once you have them all Incredible Investiture becomes a staple.


I think that weapons have to be invested, unless you take weapons with just potency runes

Quote:

Certain magic items convey their magical benefits only when worn and invested using the Invest an Item activity, tying them to your inner potential. These items have the invested trait. Many invested items have constant abilities that function all the time or that always trigger when you use the item—but only when they're invested. If you don't have an item invested, these abilities don't work. If an invested item can be activated, you must have invested the item to activate it.

You can benefit from no more than 10 invested magic items each day. Because this limit is fairly high, and because it matters only for worn items, you probably won't need to worry about reaching the limit until higher levels, when you've acquired many useful magic items to wear.

You can still gain the mundane benefits of an item if you don't invest it. A suit of +1 resilient armor still gives you its item bonus to AC when not invested, but it doesn't give its magical bonus to saving throws, and winged boots still protect your feet even though you can't activate them to fly. Entirely non-magical items don't need to be invested

So, you have a armor? You don't need to invest it.

It has resilient or property runes? You need to invest it ( the item, not each single rune, obviously )

Same goes for weapons ( Item bonus = potency runes. Anything else = Requires the weapon to be invested to benefit from em ).

As for any other item, you won't need to invest them unless they have the specific "invested" trait.

The exception would obviously be a staff enhanced with "striking runes", resulting into something meant to be "invested", if the character wants to benefit from the striking runes.

Shadow Lodge

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HumbleGamer wrote:

I think that weapons have to be invested, unless you take weapons with just potency runes

Quote:

Certain magic items convey their magical benefits only when worn and invested using the Invest an Item activity, tying them to your inner potential. These items have the invested trait. Many invested items have constant abilities that function all the time or that always trigger when you use the item—but only when they're invested. If you don't have an item invested, these abilities don't work. If an invested item can be activated, you must have invested the item to activate it.

You can benefit from no more than 10 invested magic items each day. Because this limit is fairly high, and because it matters only for worn items, you probably won't need to worry about reaching the limit until higher levels, when you've acquired many useful magic items to wear.

You can still gain the mundane benefits of an item if you don't invest it. A suit of +1 resilient armor still gives you its item bonus to AC when not invested, but it doesn't give its magical bonus to saving throws, and winged boots still protect your feet even though you can't activate them to fly. Entirely non-magical items don't need to be invested

So, you have a armor? You don't need to invest it.

It has resilient or property runes? You need to invest it ( the item, not each single rune, obviously )

Same goes for weapons ( Item bonus = potency runes. Anything else = Requires the weapon to be invested to benefit from em ).

As for any other item, you won't need to invest them unless they have the specific "invested" trait.

The exception would obviously be a staff enhanced with "striking runes", resulting into something meant to be "invested", if the character wants to benefit from the striking runes.

Weapons don't need to be invested: The general rule-of-thumb is 'if you wear it, you need to invest it, but if you are just holding it in your hand, you do not...'

Of course, there are one or two worn items without the invested trait, but there has been no clarification (that I am aware of, at least) on if this is a typo or not...

While armor entries do not show the Invested Trait, there is a specific rule for this:

Chapter 11: Crafting & Treasure / Runes / Investiture wrote:

Source Core Rulebook pg. 580 2.0

If a suit of armor has any runes, it has the invested trait, requiring you to invest it to get its magical benefits.

Weapons do not have this rule.


Oh that's great.

Thanks for the clarification Taja, I made a so wrong assumption back there.

I also noticed one of the items you are talking about, and either since no errata until now... I don't know, I still think they might really be a typo.


My highest level character in PFS is a level 10 Champion. In my last set of buying things, I noticed that I was approaching 10 invested items. Admittedly a lot of them are low level skill boosters and other misc. items.

I didn't ever think I'd hit 10 invested items, so was surprised to see I was as close as I was. Luckily, I already have the Charisma so I might take it. In the meantime I will probably need to start trading up or just making decisions.

I guess my point to all of this is, it's not necessarily hard to suddenly find yourself with a lot of items. It's probably also not hard to pick the most valuable ones and sell off older ones. But the feat certainly exists and I'm glad it does. It has value for certain kinds of players at some points in the game. I probably wouldn't plan for it, but you might hit a point where you want it.


PFS tends toward the generous side on wealth AND you get near total agency on your item selection. So there, yeah, that skill would be handy.
That's two extra items each of which (if you have the gold) would give you the equivalent of a good feat. So yeah, one feat for that is good, again if the Charisma's there since stats are more valuable (usually).


Taja the Barbarian wrote:
HumbleGamer wrote:

I think that weapons have to be invested, unless you take weapons with just potency runes

Quote:

Certain magic items convey their magical benefits only when worn and invested using the Invest an Item activity, tying them to your inner potential. These items have the invested trait. Many invested items have constant abilities that function all the time or that always trigger when you use the item—but only when they're invested. If you don't have an item invested, these abilities don't work. If an invested item can be activated, you must have invested the item to activate it.

You can benefit from no more than 10 invested magic items each day. Because this limit is fairly high, and because it matters only for worn items, you probably won't need to worry about reaching the limit until higher levels, when you've acquired many useful magic items to wear.

You can still gain the mundane benefits of an item if you don't invest it. A suit of +1 resilient armor still gives you its item bonus to AC when not invested, but it doesn't give its magical bonus to saving throws, and winged boots still protect your feet even though you can't activate them to fly. Entirely non-magical items don't need to be invested

So, you have a armor? You don't need to invest it.

It has resilient or property runes? You need to invest it ( the item, not each single rune, obviously )

Same goes for weapons ( Item bonus = potency runes. Anything else = Requires the weapon to be invested to benefit from em ).

As for any other item, you won't need to invest them unless they have the specific "invested" trait.

The exception would obviously be a staff enhanced with "striking runes", resulting into something meant to be "invested", if the character wants to benefit from the striking runes.

Weapons don't need to be invested: The general rule-of-thumb is 'if you wear it, you need to invest it, but if you are just holding it in your hand, you do not...'

Of course, there are one or two...

Thanks for pointing out the armor rule. I generally look for the invested trait. If I don't see it, I would not think the item needed to be invested.


SuperBidi wrote:

In my opinion, it really depends on players. Some like to have tons of items (and rings of Energy Resistance is a good example of an item you can have 5 times) when others dislike tracking tons of items and only focus on a few important ones.

Overall, it's a very strong feat, even if it just gives you a resistance of 5/10 against 2 energies, it's way above what most general feats can give. There are very few useful general feats (Toughness, Fleet, Ancestral Paragon, Canny Acumen and Incredible Initiative) so once you have them all Incredible Investiture becomes a staple.

Or you blow all your general feat picks on skill feats, instead, which wouldn't be a bad way to go either, once you've picked up the general feats you want.


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Perpdepog wrote:
Or you blow all your general feat picks on skill feats, instead, which wouldn't be a bad way to go either, once you've picked up the general feats you want.

Clearly. But Incredible Investiture is part of the general feats you want if you have at least a tiny bit of access to low level items and if you're fine with tracking them. 2 extra magic items is largely better than one skill feat.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

After the "standard"/"high value" general feats of Canny Acumen (at 15th or 19th on your PC's lowest save to go from expert to master), Fleet, Incredible Initiative, and probably Toughness, the only one that really stands out IMO is True Perception (which is only available investigators, rangers, rogues, or other characters that can get legendary perception). The 1-2 remaining general feat selections will probably be dependent on what you want out of the PC.

For some characters Incredible Investiture could be useful; for others, no so much.


Campaign structure also matters. In an adventure where you get a ton of magic items it will matter more, especially if you don't have opportunity to sell the old ones or it is just more efficient to do hand me down items.

Shadow Lodge

Personally, my halfling thief did bump-up against the 10 item cap towards the end of Age of Ashes, but not in a serious way:

I had six "core" items:
1) Magic Armor (+3 Major Resilient) for the AC / Saves
2) Anklets of Alacrity for the Dexterity / Acrobatics bonus
3) Goggles of Night (Major) for the perception bonus (and darkvision, of course)
4) Dragonscale Amulet for the resistances.
5) Cloak of Elvenkind (Greater) for the sneakiness.
6) Doubling Rings (Greater) so I only had to rune one weapon to cover all the special material weaknesses.

Then, I had a pair of 'really nice to have' items:
7) Boots of Bounding (Greater) for the speed buff
8) Sleeves of Storage (Greater) to keep my encumbrance low

Finally, I had a couple of 'might be useful but probably not' items:
9) Cordelia's Construct Key (Greater) for fighting constructs (This uncommon item was a late addition to my character, so I don't think it ever came into play).
10) Diplomat's Badge just in case we needed to talk our way out of something (our party 'face' had to leave the campaign about halfway through, so we were a little short on social skills for the back half).

So, 10 items was fine for this character (which is good, as he didn't have the charisma for the feat) but your mileage will vary: My rings/sleeves were good for me, but possibly irrelevant to other builds, while my amulet covered all the resistances with a single item...

Honestly, I don't know what I would have equipped if I actually had extra investment slots...

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