Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Is there a viable way to do a throwing knife build? +1 item bonus comes in at level 3, but can one put that on throwing knives?
Verzen wrote: Is there a viable way to do a throwing knife build? +1 item bonus comes in at level 3, but can one put that on throwing knives? Yes, as throwing knives are simple weapons.
Remember that throwing knives have the twin trait
Quote: These weapons are used as a pair, complementing each other. When you attack with a twin weapon, you add a circumstance bonus to the damage roll equal to the weapon’s number of damage dice if you have previously attacked with a different weapon of the same type this turn. The weapons must be of the same type to benefit from this trait, but they don’t need to have the same runes. So you will be using 2 of them.
By lvl 5 you might be able to get the ring to share potency/striking runes, and eventually get a returning rune on your main knife.
Probably the best would be, given the twin trait, to have that specific rune on either knives ( you will be investing a lot of money in the earlier levels ) in order to properly perform.
I suppose that by lvl 7/8 you will be able to set up the template you want.
Finally, remember that renouncing to a rune ( in order to add returing ) might mean to renounce to 1 elemental damage.
But I guess you will be forced to take 2x returning rune if you want to do a throwing Knife Build.
There is indeed. You can put +1 runes on any weapon you like and the Returning Rune on a throwing knife removes the need to have them on more than one knife starting only very shortly after they're available at all.
There are a few builds that work with this, though I think the Swashbuckler build using the Flying Blade Feat is probably the best at the moment. That foregoes taking advantage of the Twin trait, but I think it's probably still better.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
There is a necklace of knife throwing at like.. level 2 I think... If I just 'carried" a +1 throwing knife on me but never throw it does the twin trait come into play?
Verzen wrote: There is a necklace of knife throwing at like.. level 2 I think... If I just 'carried" a +1 throwing knife on me but never throw it does the twin trait come into play? No. Twin doesn't even kick in until the second attack, and only if it's with a second weapon.
Verzen wrote: There is a necklace of knife throwing at like.. level 2 I think... If I just 'carried" a +1 throwing knife on me but never throw it does the twin trait come into play? The trait says
Quote: These weapons are used as a pair, complementing each other. When you attack with a twin weapon, you add a circumstance bonus to the damage roll equal to the weapon’s number of damage dice if you have previously attacked with a different weapon of the same type this turn. The weapons must be of the same type to benefit from this trait, but they don’t need to have the same runes. It explicitely sais these weapons are used as a pair, complementing each other.
By what "complementing each other" means, I can guess 2 possible outcomes:
1) A character is required to wield both of them to use properly even only one of the ( it feels weird though ).
2) In order to benefit from the twin trait, you have to have 2 weapon of the same type ( I lean toward this one... ) and attack with the other one.
doubling rings specifically don't work for thrown attacks:
Quote: The replication functions only if you wear both rings, and it ends as soon as you cease wielding a melee weapon in one of your hands. Consequently, the benefit doesn’t apply to thrown attacks or if you’re holding a weapon but not wielding it (such as holding in one hand a weapon that requires two hands to wield).
shroudb wrote:
doubling rings specifically don't work for thrown attacks:
Quote: The replication functions only if you wear both rings, and it ends as soon as you cease wielding a melee weapon in one of your hands. Consequently, the benefit doesn’t apply to thrown attacks or if you’re holding a weapon but not wielding it (such as holding in one hand a weapon that requires two hands to wield).
This sounds pretty expensive.
A Throwing Knife are fine thrown weapon for a Swashbuckler even sans the Twin property, which I agree is a bit impractical to actually make use of.
So, to reiterate, I'd do that.
Deadmanwalking wrote: A Throwing Knife are fine thrown weapon for a Swashbuckler even sans the Twin property, which I agree is a bit impractical to actually make use of.
So, to reiterate, I'd do that.
Yeah me too.
Regardless the fact I don't feel to comfortable with a swashbuckler, I have to admit that Flying blades is too cool.
HumbleGamer wrote: shroudb wrote:
doubling rings specifically don't work for thrown attacks:
Quote: The replication functions only if you wear both rings, and it ends as soon as you cease wielding a melee weapon in one of your hands. Consequently, the benefit doesn’t apply to thrown attacks or if you’re holding a weapon but not wielding it (such as holding in one hand a weapon that requires two hands to wield).
This sounds pretty expensive. If you want to take advantage of Twin, yes.
If not, they aren't different from other throwing builds you can keep throwing the same "+1 returning throwing kinfe" over and over again.
Deadmanwalking wrote: A Throwing Knife are fine thrown weapon for a Swashbuckler even sans the Twin property, which I agree is a bit impractical to actually make use of.
So, to reiterate, I'd do that.
One cool thing that throwing Swashbuckler can do is use dual finisher to attack 2 targets with 20ft range using throwing knife if you have the Flying Blade.
shroudb wrote: HumbleGamer wrote: shroudb wrote:
doubling rings specifically don't work for thrown attacks:
Quote: The replication functions only if you wear both rings, and it ends as soon as you cease wielding a melee weapon in one of your hands. Consequently, the benefit doesn’t apply to thrown attacks or if you’re holding a weapon but not wielding it (such as holding in one hand a weapon that requires two hands to wield).
This sounds pretty expensive. If you want to take advantage of Twin, yes.
If not, they aren't different from other throwing builds you can keep throwing the same "+1 returning throwing kinfe" over and over again.
Yeah more or less.
To be honest i was considering a simple dual wield combatant with a throwing weapon and a non throwing weapon.
Let's say longsword and dagger.
If everytime he throws its dagger he needs to have the runes or it ( because they won't work with the doubling rings ) this means he will require to invest a moderate ( because one of the rune would be returning which is cheap ) amount of golds.
I wonder if there's a real reason for this in terms of balance.
Given the 3 runes per weapon ( apart maybe the paladin weapon with the spirit, which gets an extra weapon ), isn't any thrown weapon already underpowered if we consider it will have ( it's not necessarily I know, but let's suppose we talk about a thrown build ) a rune less for each weapon ( considering a twin scenario )?
Or there's a specific build which might exploit it?
Or maybe, the "range" is enough to justify it?
HumbleGamer wrote: shroudb wrote: HumbleGamer wrote: shroudb wrote:
doubling rings specifically don't work for thrown attacks:
Quote: The replication functions only if you wear both rings, and it ends as soon as you cease wielding a melee weapon in one of your hands. Consequently, the benefit doesn’t apply to thrown attacks or if you’re holding a weapon but not wielding it (such as holding in one hand a weapon that requires two hands to wield).
This sounds pretty expensive. If you want to take advantage of Twin, yes.
If not, they aren't different from other throwing builds you can keep throwing the same "+1 returning throwing kinfe" over and over again.
Yeah more or less.
To be honest i was considering a simple dual wield combatant with a throwing weapon and a non throwing weapon.
Let's say longsword and dagger.
If everytime he throws its dagger he needs to have the runes or it ( because they won't work with the doubling rings ) this means he will require to invest a moderate ( because one of the rune would be returning which is cheap ) amount of golds.
I wonder if there's a real reason for this in terms of balance.
Given the 3 runes per weapon ( apart maybe the paladin weapon with the spirit, which gets an extra weapon ), isn't any thrown weapon already underpowered if we consider it will have ( it's not necessarily I know, but let's suppose we talk about a thrown build ) a rune less for each weapon ( considering a twin scenario )?
Or there's a specific build which might exploit it?
Or maybe, the "range" is enough to justify it?
It would make "returning" redundant and it would allow to exploit material weaknesses extremely easy i guess.
Have a regular +x main weapon, and only throw with your ofhand whatever throwing weapon you want with whatever material.
No need for returning since you just use plain daggers for throwing them and gaining your bastard sword's magical bonus on them, keeping equal bonuses for melee and ranged simultaneously open (bastardsword close, throwin ranged), use plain silver/adamantine/cold iron daggers to exploit weaknesses.
Good catch with the materials ( I totally forgot about them ).
You definitely convinced me.
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You actually can effectively dual wield a throwing weapon and a non-throwing weapon with Doubling Rings, though you'll need Returning.
You just have all the magic (including Returning) on the throwing weapon. You can then take advantage of the Doubling Ring to apply its magic to your non-magical melee weapon while in melee (it would not apply to the melee weapon while you were actively throwing the thrown weapon, but that's a very niche circumstance).
You can even exploit special materials this way, though only in melee.
I'm not really sure how much of an exploit swapping out special materials would be, since you would still have to pay for them separately. Besides, bows already do that, and for a cheaper price with special material arrows, at least in the short term.
What about Fighters level 6 feat Riccochet stance. Frees up a rune slot. Rebounding Toss also seems good. Sadly fighter doesnt have quick draw to bridge the time until you get a returning weapon.
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