
Tarrant1012 |
Hey All, I’m looking for some tips to help build an animal instinct, ape, barbarian. I’m currently thinking human but can be flexible.
How do animal instinct barbarians stack up compared to other barbarians? I like the idea of Ape quite a bit just because of the flavor of it so I’d like to focus on that specific animal instinct.
Thank you in advance!

Joyd |
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Animal Instinct is the defensive barbarian option, with arguably the most general-purpose resistances and the potential for the highest Armor Class. The primary cost it pays is in raw damage, with a lower damage bonus to rage than some of the alternatives. They can also use a shield without giving up much offensive ability as long as they're raging. It's difficult to precisely weigh the value of added defense vs. the lost damage, but you'll still be a high-damage character - just not at the same level as a Giant or Dragon instinct barbarian.
Ape Barbarians and others with Grapple weapons can reach nearly unmatchable levels of Grappling ability. This synergizes somewhat well with the more defensive nature of the class, as one of the risks of grappling some enemies is that, with no other good options available, they use all of their actions attacking you.
Human is a fine choice for an Animal Barbarian. To the best of my knowledge, there aren't any ancestries with exceptional synergy that make them a must-take.

tivadar27 |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I honestly think Animal Instinct is the best overall. It might do slightly less damage than Giant Instinct, but I'm not even convinced of that in actual play for a few reasons:
1. They basically get a 0-handed d12 weapon for free, the Giant Instinct barbarian needs 2 hands for that.
2. Their class abilities are amazing, though you do have to invest into Dexterity. Predator's Pounce is basically the best thing you'll find for action economy in the game (Rage, Move, and Attack for 1 action at level 11). Animal Skin basically cancels the AC penalty for rage, so they're effectively starting at a +2 to AC relative to the clumsy Giant Instinct.
3. They do +12 vs +18 damage, *but*, that's an unarmed strike, and a quick multiclass into Monk and suddenly you're flurrying with your d12 bite attack...
So yeah, there are other reasons as well, beyond just thinking that Giant Instinct's abilities are generally garbage (Size Increases without actually gaining any advantage beyond reach is okay, but not particularly stellar). Beyond this, they can use a *shield*. Suddenly with Animal Skin and a Shield, they're at a +4 AC vs their Giant Instinct counterparts, and survivability *really* does matter. You can't build straight off of DPS any more now that battles last more than 1.5 rounds.
Note that I do think that they are situationally bad when you run across something that hurts when you bite it... because pretty sure that's still a thing and the other archetypes have more options there, but overall, still really solid.

Tarrant1012 |
Thank you all for the responses! A grappling Ape Instinct Barbarian sounds brilliant and very fun.
What would a reasonable starting stat line up look like? I’m pondering:
18 StR
14 Dex
12Con
10 Int
14 Wis
10 Cha
That would make Animal skin at 6 have capped Dex. Lack of skills is a tad sad and I’m not sure how to round out his out of combat stuff.

Arachnofiend |

Boosting wisdom doesn't completely screw you on skills now - Medicine and Nature are both quite good things to have that key off of Wisdom. The problem with it is that for it to be any good it has to be constantly upgraded to keep pace, but on the other hand if you do that it's the best skill in the game. Even if you have a Cleric or other in-combat healer already in the party having someone else capable of handling out of combat patching up can be a huge boon to that character's daily resources.
So for this character the five skills I'd personally pick are Athletics, Medicine, Acrobatics, Nature, Survival, with priority given to Athletics and Medicine for all skill upgrades. I'd recommend picking a background that gives Battle Medicine as a bonus feat (there's only one in the CRB but a few more in the Lost Omens World Guide).

shroudb |
Ape/Shark/Snake Barbarians are the only characters in the game that can get an item bonus to grapple checks right now. This is very good, especially since Barbarians get some great feat support for grappling in their talents.
Tbf, anyone can get an item bonus to their maneuvers, it just requires a separate item.
What you basically gain is a "magic item of your choice" instead of being shoehorned into "lifting belt/other +athletics items"

shroudb |
The Lifting Belt only goes up to +1; it's good certainly, but having the property on your weapon and getting a stronger bonus essentially for free (you were going to upgrade your weapon anyways) is far better.
There are other +2/+3 item bonus to athletics items that you can get at equivalent levels as your +2/+3 weapon. Armbands of Athleticism +2 are 1 level before the +2 weapon, and the +3 Armbands are 1 level after the +3 weapon, but more importantly at that level the Apex item for strength (that you would want anyways) is also a +3 to athletics.
It's good in the sense you don't need to buy said items (well, you'd still be buying the Apex item and that's a +3), but it's not like you wouldn't have an item bonus on your Athletics if you were building for maneuvers, despite your choice of weapon.

tivadar27 |
Thank you all for the responses! A grappling Ape Instinct Barbarian sounds brilliant and very fun.
What would a reasonable starting stat line up look like? I’m pondering:
18 StR
14 Dex
12Con
10 Int
14 Wis
10 ChaThat would make Animal skin at 6 have capped Dex. Lack of skills is a tad sad and I’m not sure how to round out his out of combat stuff.
That seems like a pretty solid stat line. Barbarians can afford to have a bit lower Con, as they get the HP from their class, have temp HP when they rage, and good Con saves to begin with... You'll want to keep boosting it though, as I believe the DR you get keys off of it later.

Atalius |

I honestly think Animal Instinct is the best overall. It might do slightly less damage than Giant Instinct, but I'm not even convinced of that in actual play for a few reasons:
1. They basically get a 0-handed d12 weapon for free, the Giant Instinct barbarian needs 2 hands for that.
2. Their class abilities are amazing, though you do have to invest into Dexterity. Predator's Pounce is basically the best thing you'll find for action economy in the game (Rage, Move, and Attack for 1 action at level 11). Animal Skin basically cancels the AC penalty for rage, so they're effectively starting at a +2 to AC relative to the clumsy Giant Instinct.
3. They do +12 vs +18 damage, *but*, that's an unarmed strike, and a quick multiclass into Monk and suddenly you're flurrying with your d12 bite attack...So yeah, there are other reasons as well, beyond just thinking that Giant Instinct's abilities are generally garbage (Size Increases without actually gaining any advantage beyond reach is okay, but not particularly stellar). Beyond this, they can use a *shield*. Suddenly with Animal Skin and a Shield, they're at a +4 AC vs their Giant Instinct counterparts, and survivability *really* does matter. You can't build straight off of DPS any more now that battles last more than 1.5 rounds.
Note that I do think that they are situationally bad when you run across something that hurts when you bite it... because pretty sure that's still a thing and the other archetypes have more options there, but overall, still really solid.
"Rage, Move, and Attack for 1 action at level 11". I don't believe this is entirely true. Predators Pounce comes online at level 12 and the ability itself does not allow you to Rage as a free action, you must be Raging before you use this feat from what I can see anyways.

Atalius |

Mighty Rage allows him to Rage & Predator's Pounce for 1 action.
It's a strong opening, allowing one to prebuff w/ either a spell or drinking a consumable, and still Rage/Move/Strike.
Sweet deal, I like it. I like it a lot! Interesting prebuff idea, if he casted Haste would he gain the benefit of haste the same round or does the extra movement/strike take effect in subsequent rounds? Oh and would a Multiclass into Bard be a thing?