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With the latest Errata, the Level 1 Mutagenist feature does almost nothing. Here are its 3 mechanical benefits:
1. You start with the formulas for two 1st-level mutagens in your formula book, in addition to your other formulas.
2. You can gain the benefit of any mutagen, even if it wasn’t specifically brewed for you.
3. Whenever your proficiency rank for simple weapons increases, your proficiency rank for unarmed attacks increases to the same rank unless it’s already better.
Number 1 is worth what, 2 gold?
Number 2 doesn't seem to do anything, because the consensus I've gotten from the community is that mutagens no longer key off of a particular target (and I hope we keep it this way, because the idea of trying to pre-brew each mutagen at the start of the day seems awful, not to mention it means finding mutagens as loot would do nothing unless you had a mutagenist).
Number 3 literally does nothing, with the latest errata that Unarmed Attacks count as Simple Weapons for Proficiency.
I have a new player who's playing a Mutagenist in my PF Game. Should I tell them to stop playing the class and play something else? I don't want my new player to feel bad for play a character with a blank class feature.
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Yeah, they need to FAQ/Errata in something for 1st level Mutagenists to get.
I suggested either Medium Armor ala Ruffian Rogues or an increased mutagen bonus in the other thread, but however you look at it they need something.
Alchemists in general also have some inconsistencies with Bulk (the PFS version of Fumbus is listed at 4.7, but comes to 6.6 and encumbered when the math is done), but that's hopefully just a typo of some sort.
The Mutagenist thing is a real mechanical problem in need of a solution, though.
Yeah, they need to FAQ/Errata in something for 1st level Mutagenists to get.
I suggested either Medium Armor ala Ruffian Rogues or an increased mutagen bonus in the other thread, but however you look at it they need something.
Alchemists in general also have some inconsistencies with Bulk (the PFS version of Fumbus is listed at 4.7, but comes to 6.6 and encumbered when the math is done), but that's hopefully just a typo of some sort.
The Mutagenist thing is a real mechanical problem in need of a solution, though.
Would a thief style dex to damage on unarmed attacks gained via mutagens be too broken you think?
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Well for 2, I'm pretty sure that Mutagens do still key to an individual. Unless they changed that from the PT?
Literally the only mention of it in the final book is under mutagenist.
And yes, there are high level reasons to go mutagenist, but there are high level reasons to go bomber, too. Mutagenists should get some meaningful mechanical bonus at the same levels the other paths do.
Would a thief style dex to damage on unarmed attacks gained via mutagens be too broken you think?Neither of the attacks given by Bestial Mutagen are finesse, so this just wouldn't work.
Huh, that's a good point. Not sure why but got it in my head that natural attacks were finesse.
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Number 1 is worth what, 2 gold?Number 2 doesn't seem to do anything, because the consensus I've gotten from the community is that mutagens no longer key off of a particular target (and I hope we keep it this way, because the idea of trying to pre-brew each mutagen at the start of the day seems awful, not to mention it means finding mutagens as loot would do nothing unless you had a mutagenist).
Number 3 literally does nothing, with the latest errata that Unarmed Attacks count as Simple Weapons for Proficiency.
These are all good points. The errata to #3 in particular completely invalidates the benefit as it already applies to every character. Likewise, #2 seems to already apply to every character, or at least I haven't notice a restriction on mutagens yet.
Hope to see some errata from Paizo on this issue soon.
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Overall I really like 2E, but they really screwed the pooch with the Alchemist class. It's the worst class in the game by a huge margin. They really needed to just pull it out of the core book, work on improving it, then release it in a supplement later on. As is, it's basically just a potion crafting class that does nothing else well.
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Overall I really like 2E, but they really screwed the pooch with the Alchemist class. It's the worst class in the game by a huge margin. They really needed to just pull it out of the core book, work on improving it, then release it in a supplement later on. As is, it's basically just a potion crafting class that does nothing else well.
My biggest irk is how butchered it feels compared to other classes revamp. Like, a rogue in PF1 was interesting, but now it's samey-but even more options. Alchemist on the other hand moved away from all the unique and strange discoveries towards crafting. And while I love the free pots and such, none of the paths seem very impactful.
Need to have Jekyll/Hyde At level one
Some kind of transformation ability
Need to have Jekyll/Hyde At level one
Some kind of transformation ability
I've been wanting a lv 1 "Master Chymist" option since the first Advanced Player's guide. Here's hoping PF2 finally delivers it.
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I think it would be neat to have an innate transformation ability as if you had taken a mutagen as like a focus power or something. Some kind of transformation from taking so many mutagens like how Ant-Man in the comics has pym particles just imbued into his being after using them so much.
I've been wanting a lv 1 "Master Chymist" option since the first Advanced Player's guide. Here's hoping PF2 finally delivers it.Need to have Jekyll/Hyde At level one
Some kind of transformation abilityAlchemist MC Barbarian
or
Barbarian MC Alchemist
?
That can get some of the feel of the Master Chymist, but that's still an Alchemist with rage, not a mutagen specialist. It also doesn't really capture the alter-ego of the Master Chymist very well. The prestige class goes so far as to give you a secondary alignment, rage can be flavored as an alternate personality, sure, but it can't back that up with any mechanics.
But my desire to get the Master Chymist in PF2 is secondary to addressing the real problem with the mutagenist, and that's the fact that there's not much reason for the alchemist to drink a mutagen themself. The Bomber can do things with their bombs a non-alchemist can't, but the mutagenist has to wait until Feral Mutagen is available before a bestial mutagen is any better in their hands than in the hands of the party's fighter.