Weapon Surge question

[Atalius]

The spell states "On your next turn, increase the item bonus of your weapon by 1 (minimum +1 and maximum +5). This adds an additional die of damage as is normal for magic weapons."

Does it become a +2 item bonus at level 5, a +3 at level 10, a +4 at level 15, a +5 at level 20? As for the additional damage dice would it keep adding an extra die for each +1 bonus?

[Joey Cote]

No, it just adds +1 to the potency of the weapon.

Also, you misquoted. The power actually says " On your next attack with that weapon before the start of your next turn".

So if you cast it and don't make any attack before the start of your next turn, you loose the effect. You also loose the effect if you miss that next attack.

The way you misquoted the spell it wouldn't do anything until your next turn plus it would apply to all your attacks in that turn.

[Atalius]

ah yes, my bad. It must add more than just +1, what about +2-5 like it says in the description? how does that work?

I can get the exact same effect, actually better, from casting Magic Weapon at level 1. So what is the good thing about this power? Does it stack with +3 or +4 magic weapons for example?

[Blave]

Yes it stacks. It turns a non magical weapon into a +1, a +1 weapon into a +2, a +2 weapon into a +3, a +3 weapon into a +4 and a +4 weapon into a +5.

The Magic Weapon spell on te other hand only works on non-magical weapons, turning them into +1 weapons. It has no effect at all on a weapon that's already magical.

[Atalius]

You mean it can turn a magical +1 weapon into a +2 temporarily right?

[Joey Cote]

Atalius wrote:

You mean it can turn a magical +1 weapon into a +2 temporarily right?

Exactly. It increase the potentency any weapon has by +1. So a weapon without a potency rune effectively is a +1 potency weapon, a +2 becomes +3, etc except that you cannot increase the potency to more then +5 (which is why they give that +1 - +5 range).

[Atalius]

Thanks Joey, not a bad power! Nice work Paizo.

[Atalius]

So if I had a Magical Greatsword +2 let's say, and I casted Weapon Surge, would it then do +3 to attack/damage and deal 3D12 damage?

[citricking]

A +3 great sword gets a +3 item bonus to attack (not damage) and does 4d12 damage.

[Atalius]

Oh, with Weapon Surge on it then it would do +4 to attack and 5D12 damage?

[citricking]

If you have a Magical Greatsword +2 then no, after weapon surge it would have +3 item bonus to attack (not damage) and does 4d12 damage.

[Atalius]

I meant +4 to attack and 5D12 damage if its a +3 Greatsword with Weapon Surge on it. Thanks citricking.

[Crexis]

Question about weapon surge and an expert weapon.

With my expert weapon I get a +1 to attack roll only.

If I get weapon surge casted on my weapon, I believe it gives me 1 extra damage die, but what about attack roll. Does it increase my 'expert weapon' from +1 attack roll to +2? Or does the attack roll stay at +1 like an upgrade from expert weapon to a +1 weapon?

[Draco18s]

I was about to say "it doesn't stack, obviously" but looking at Weapon Surge again:

Quote:

increase the item bonus of your weapon by 1 (minimum +1

and maximum +5). This adds an additional die of damage as is
normal for magic weapons.

Expert quality weapons already HAVE an item bonus, but this power states that it increases by 1!

So that leads me to believe that this would be a +2 on the attack and do 2dN worth of damage.

[Crexis]

On page 190 it lists Expert, w/ item bonus +1 weapon costs 350 sp.

Does anyone know how much an expert (w/o +1, so basically just +1 to attack roll) weapon would cost?

I can't find it anywhere, just what is listed on page 190, maybe that's the cost?

[Edge93]

Crexis wrote:

On page 190 it lists Expert, w/ item bonus +1 weapon costs 350 sp.

Does anyone know how much an expert (w/o +1, so basically just +1 to attack roll) weapon would cost?

I can't find it anywhere, just what is listed on page 190, maybe that's the cost?

The 350 sp expert weapon IS an expert weapon that provides +1 to attack rolls, no extra dice. The "+1 item bonus" referenced on page 190 is stating that an expert weapon gives you a 1 item bonus to attack rolls.

The extra dice weapon is an Expert weapon with a +1 Potency rune (the expert weapon is 350 SP, the +1 rune is 650 SP, total for a +1 weapon is 1,000 SP or 100 GP)

[Joey Cote]

Weapon surge increase the potency of the weapon by +1. So an expert weapon that has had weapon surge cast on it has a +1 item bonus to hit (from expert) and a +1 item bonus to hit (from potency). Since we know that bonuses of the same type don't stack, it should be still be a +1 to hit.

[Draco18s]

Joey Cote wrote:

Weapon surge increase the potency of the weapon by +1.

Uh. It does not say that:

Quote:

increase the item bonus of your weapon by 1 (minimum +1

and maximum +5). This adds an additional die of damage as is
normal for magic weapons.

[Atalius]

So do we know which one it is? Does Weapon Surge give an additional +1 item bonus on an Expert Weapon? So effectively you would have a +2 item bonus with a single additional die of damage on the weapon?

[Atalius]

Anybody?

[Blave]

Atalius wrote:

So do we know which one it is? Does Weapon Surge give an additional +1 item bonus on an Expert Weapon? So effectively you would have a +2 item bonus with a single additional die of damage on the weapon?

RAW? Yes.

RAI? Most likely no. I'm pretty sure Weapon Surge is meant to increase the weapon's potency rune by 1 (or setting it to 1 if it doesn't have any) and the rune's item bonus doesn't stack with the expert item bonus.

So it's most likely just poor wording.

[Joey Cote]

Draco18s wrote:

Joey Cote wrote:

Weapon surge increase the potency of the weapon by +1.

Uh. It does not say that:

Quote:

increase the item bonus of your weapon by 1 (minimum +1

and maximum +5). This adds an additional die of damage as is
normal for magic weapons.

Correct, it doesn't actually say increases potency by one, but it does say

"increase the item bonus of your weapon by 1 (minimum +1 and maximum +5). This adds an additional die of damage as is normal for magic weapons."

I admit, that is a bit different from increasing potency by 1, which would not allow the +1 from expert to stack.

[Darksol the Painbringer]

Atalius wrote:

So do we know which one it is? Does Weapon Surge give an additional +1 item bonus on an Expert Weapon? So effectively you would have a +2 item bonus with a single additional die of damage on the weapon?

Per the written rules, yes it does, as it has to give a call out to magic weapons instead of saying it functions as a magic weapon if it is non-magical.

However, I'm sure it's not meant to stack up bonuses unevenly like that. It's also fairly corner case.

I'd be more worried about Channeling Smite working with both this and Magical Striker. Cleric swinging around a +2 weapon now dealing as a +4 weapon is crazy-scary.