can a feeblemind victim use manufactured weapons?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


I would doubt if it makes them have 1 int (as smart as a not very bright animal)


The spell tells you how it limits you, and it doesn't prohibit using manufactured weapons.


I have to disagree. Feeblemind gives you an int of 1 which is equivalent to animal intelligence. An animal is proficient with its natural attack only.


That was my reasoning as well. There ARE a few animals that use tools but they are all apes as far as I know which have 2 int

Silver Crusade

Feeblemind doesn't prohibt you from using your feats, so shouldn't interfere with using weapons.


Feeblemind is powerful enough without trying to add more to what the spell already explicitly states.


Zombies are dumber than feeblemind and can use weapons. The spell is plenty potent with just the listed effects, no need to punish martials more.


Val'bryn2 wrote:
Feeblemind doesn't prohibt you from using your feats, so shouldn't interfere with using weapons.

True, RAW doesn't prohibt you from using feats, however, your character basically does not longer KNOW how to use the feats. Therefore, I'd say any character hit by a feeblemind (and failed its save) becomes useless (i.e. no weapons and no magic) until recoverd from the stat damage. But while feeblemind is in effect, the character is unable to figure out how to use manufactured weapons, will discard those weapons, and will use slam and bite attacks (like Speaker of the Dead stated).

Once the stat damage has been cured, the feats can be used again and any magic can also be used again.


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Danny Stardust wrote:
Once the stat damage has been cured, the feats can be used again and any magic can also be used again.

Feeblemind:
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Target creature’s Intelligence and Charisma scores each drop to 1. The affected creature is unable to use Intelligence– or Charisma-based skills, cast spells, understand language, or communicate coherently. Still, it knows who its friends are and can follow them and even protect them. The subject remains in this state until a heal, limited wish, miracle, or wish spell is used to cancel the effect of the feeblemind.
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There is no 'stat damage', there is no feat blocking or restriction. Even in the case of casting (which this thread is not about), if you somehow made the target's Intelligence higher (or 'healed the damage' if it existed), such as wearing a headband of vast intelligence or fox's cunning, you still couldn't do any of those things until the spell was actually removed.

Yqatuba wrote:
I would doubt if it makes them have 1 int (as smart as a not very bright animal)
Speaker for the Dead wrote:
Feeblemind gives you an int of 1 which is equivalent to animal intelligence. An animal is proficient with its natural attack only.

Going on the assumption that we're talking about creatures that use manufactured weapons (like humanoids), not creatures that already don't:

It doesn't make you an animal, even if you're as dumb as one. A person whose Intelligence is damaged or drained to 1 (or lower somehow) doesn't lose proficiencies. An animal becoming as smart as a humanoid doesn't gain the humanoid proficiencies, HD, save bonuses, etc.

Even if we went with that logic, a stupid humanoid is still a humanoid.

Humanoid wrote:
  • Proficient with all simple weapons, or by character class.
  • Proficient with whatever type of armor (light, medium, or heavy) it is described as wearing, or by character class.
  • Feeblemind does not remove or suppress character class, nor does it remove proficiencies (or change creature type). It doesn't make you forget anything, like how to use weapons, (you might not use them Intelligently).

    Feeblemind does enough, and it's not confusing. Let's not make it so.

    You might be thinking of Amnesia, which does make you lose class abilities (which could make you lose Martial Weapon or Heavy Armor proficiencies.
    (And is so poorly thought-out and implemented it makes me sick. Seriously? An oracle forgets that they're blind, so they're not blind. "Curse? I don't remember a curse, and since that's obviously a key element to being cursed... I'm not."
    Oh yeah, and Great Fortitude or Racial Heritage... Because everyone knows it only matters that you remember, and know specifically, that you're more hardy than a normal person and that there's elf blood in your veins.)
    At least the hit points from Toughness are probably protected by the hit point keeping statement, depending on your GM.


    The spell explitly forbids only 2 attribute bases for skills, meaning the other attributes' skills are still usable, and it specifically say the feebleminded individual is still able to protect friends, meaning their combat abilities are not impaired. ergo, a feebleminded martial looses little if any of his combat prowess... even if a mage is relegated to relying on his quarterstaff or dagger (I assume that the low intelligence and prohibition to cast spells make using magic items other than use activated ones an impossibility), similarly, a rogue would still be able to pick locks and disarm traps, and to detect such (perception is Wis based IIRC)

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