Is Merciful Spelled Hellfire Ray still [Evil]?

[deuxhero]

Merciful Spell
Hellfire Ray

The Metamagic frees it of the whole "creatures killed by this go to Hell" because it can't kill (barring using it on an already KOed foe). Obviously, by RAW, it still is [Evil] as nothing about Merciful Spell changes that (that's why I'm not putting this in Rules Questions). I want to know what you'd rule it as.

[Rysky]

Hmm, I'd say yes since you're still using the flames of Hell.

[Weables]

I'd rule personally that you couldnt make it merciful in the first place, as the point of the spell just isnt meant to work non lethally, but thats a complete houserule. That, however, seems to be what you're asking for.

[Volkard Abendroth]

Merciful does not remove other tags.

The spell is still [evil].

[Rajnish Umbra, Shadow Caller]

Weables wrote:

I'd rule personally that you couldnt make it merciful in the first place, as the point of the spell just isnt meant to work non lethally, but thats a complete houserule. That, however, seems to be what you're asking for.

I'd say the fire damage turns nonlethal, but that the unholy ignores-all-resistances part stays lethal.

(Which would be even more houseruley, but eh.)

[cetra02]

Rajnish Umbra, Shadow Caller wrote:

Weables wrote:

I'd rule personally that you couldnt make it merciful in the first place, as the point of the spell just isnt meant to work non lethally, but thats a complete houserule. That, however, seems to be what you're asking for.

I'd say the fire damage turns nonlethal, but that the unholy ignores-all-resistances part stays lethal.

(Which would be even more houseruley, but eh.)

I like this. The unholy power is the "Hell" bit in Hellfire in this case, and honestly Hellfire does not play nice. Also, if I were GMing, no the [Evil] tag stays. You are drawing on the innate nature of an Evil plane using this spell.

[blahpers]

Yes, it is still [evil]. Note that such a spell can still kill given sufficient damage, and that will trigger the, er, "no escape" clause.

"Save or eternal damnation" seems a bit much for a 6th-level spell.

[OmniMage]

Maybe the spell will cause you to experience hell while you are unconscious?

[Cevah]

Instead of being roasted in a fire pit, you are parboiled in a sauna.

/cevah

[DaLucaray]

I would rule yes, and that the spell does not just have the”evil” tag because its an evil thing to do, but because you’re specifically calling energy from Hell, the same way summoning an evil creature with Summon Monster N is evil.

Also, I would rule that learning an evil spell just so you can add metamagic to it (making it much more inefficient) and say “oh its okay, its not evil!” is, in fact, an evil action.

[zza ni]

hell HAS been known for tormenting people.
why wouldn't they let you HURT people while keeping them alive for more pain?
and yes. it's evil. sometimes killing is more merciful ;)

[avr]

Suppose you fire a merciful hellfire ray at an annoying wizard at the start of his career. He takes 11d6 ⇒ (5, 6, 2, 2, 1, 1, 2, 4, 4, 3, 1) = 31 nonlethal damage. Only the first 8 HP are nonlethal. The next 23 are lethal damage, and his HP + Con = 22. He dies and is condemned to Hell. In what way was this not an [Evil] spell?

[Adjoint]

zza ni wrote:

hell HAS been known for tormenting people.

why wouldn't they let you HURT people while keeping them alive for more pain?
and yes. it's evil. sometimes killing is more merciful ;)

That's exactly what they do to the petitioners in Hell. The damned petitioners are immune to fire... but not to the pain caused by fire. That way they can be easily tormented for a long time.