Top 10 Class Choices You Would Like To See Next


Prerelease Discussion

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Contributor

Hm.
1. Investigator
2. Bloodrager
3. Oracle
4. Witch
5. Kineticist
6. Hunter
7. Inquisitor
8. Shifter
9. Spiritualist
10. Summoner

Bonus Round, Classes That I Hope We Don't See

1. Vigilante. Fits WAY better as an archetype if archetypes aren't class-bound. The entire class was basically, "slap other classes flavor on me, please."

2. Skald. If bard is done well, this doesn't need to exist. Everything skalds have could just be a bard archetype.

3. Cavalier / Samurai. We don't need both of these classes. One well-built mount class will suffice.

4. Ninja. This could honestly be built back into the rogue.

5. Gunslinger / Swashbuckler. Both of these classes were too powerful in some aspect. (Gunslinger in its offense, Swashbuckler in its defense.) For all the "coolness" of the class, the way deeds worked meant that every gunslinger was the same, and every swashbuckler was the same.


Magus
Inquisitor
Investigator
Swashbuckler
Brawler

(Still mad about 2.0...)


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A shapeshifter. Not a PF1 shifter which is another bsf whose weapon is being a bear. Not a PF1 Druid which is a somewhere between the above and a mage whose mage armor is being a bear. I'd like to see a class that can shapeshift into new forms while still attacking, and can take forms to gain special attacks from round to round.

A defenses oriented martial debuffs/control class that can draw enemy fire away from others, block attacks for allies, and make hits that are strong enough to get through defenses give the enemies penalties as they are using too much effort. This is something that might be a subclass of fighter or paladin, but I'd like to see it as its own class. It is what I picture when I think of a melee tank.

Not sure I'd like to speculate about PF classes transitioning to PF2 until I see how well the characters of those classes can be made without their own unique class. But these are things I don't think PF1 was as well equipped to ever provide to my taste, and suspect the new action economy might lend itself to better.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

1) Oracle
2) Kineticist
3) Gunslinger
4) Mesmerist
5) Brawler (would accept as monk archetype)


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More than anything I want a martial class focused on leadership, comradery, and tactical acumen. A Cavalier without a mounted focus or a 4E Warlord type of class. The person you follow into the breach.

After that I would say Kineticist, Witch, Oracle, Magus, Bloodrager, Inquistor, Investigator, Summoner and a base class Dragon Disciple.

Silver Crusade

Alexander Augunas wrote:

Hm.

1. Investigator
2. Bloodrager
3. Oracle
4. Witch
5. Kineticist
6. Hunter
7. Inquisitor
8. Shifter
9. Spiritualist
10. Summoner

Bonus Round, Classes That I Hope We Don't See

1. Vigilante. Fits WAY better as an archetype if archetypes aren't class-bound. The entire class was basically, "slap other classes flavor on me, please."

2. Skald. If bard is done well, this doesn't need to exist. Everything skalds have could just be a bard archetype.

3. Cavalier / Samurai. We don't need both of these classes. One well-built mount class will suffice.

4. Ninja. This could honestly be built back into the rogue.

5. Gunslinger / Swashbuckler. Both of these classes were too powerful in some aspect. (Gunslinger in its offense, Swashbuckler in its defense.) For all the "coolness" of the class, the way deeds worked meant that every gunslinger was the same, and every swashbuckler was the same.

This seems like a mostly solid list to me; class division imo should be for mechanically district divisions. Perhaps giving the fighter a resolve point system to power a new set of abilities would move it into a space similar enough to the Gunslinger and Swashbuckler that the three could be integrated to one class and then we use archetypes? Similarly cavalier/samurai become fighter variants.

WRT the main list there, I’m of the camp that supports the Shifter being more shiftery and at least the equal of the Druid on choice of forms; I appreciate the attempt was to make it simplified shapeshifting and not require a ton of reference books, but the result was I kinda feel restricted when I should feel fluid of form.

We know from the Vigilante experiment, which was a wild success imo, that major changes from archetypes still work, so why not make base Druid shapeshifting more focused on a few forms and archetype Shifter as a spell-less, martial variant with expanded shapeshifting powers?

Vigilante, much as I love them, and I DO, might make sense as a class lens that you can fit onto multiple classes and onto archetypes; if a Gunslinger is a Fighter and a Ninja is a rogue, we want to still be able to do Gunmaster and Teisatsu.

Summoner could use careful consideration, particularly in 2 areas; the 12 tentacles, 14 butts problem and the Synthesist stat-dump problem. Archetyping might make some sense here, or even class lending so I could play a warrior who summons demons and binds them directly to his own skin as armor, but I recognize that the class itself has an identity and there are so many cool variations that I guess it needs to stay separate.

Silver Crusade

Paradozen wrote:

A shapeshifter. Not a PF1 shifter which is another bsf whose weapon is being a bear. Not a PF1 Druid which is a somewhere between the above and a mage whose mage armor is being a bear. I'd like to see a class that can shapeshift into new forms while still attacking, and can take forms to gain special attacks from round to round.

A defenses oriented martial debuffs/control class that can draw enemy fire away from others, block attacks for allies, and make hits that are strong enough to get through defenses give the enemies penalties as they are using too much effort. This is something that might be a subclass of fighter or paladin, but I'd like to see it as its own class. It is what I picture when I think of a melee tank.

Not sure I'd like to speculate about PF classes transitioning to PF2 until I see how well the characters of those classes can be made without their own unique class. But these are things I don't think PF1 was as well equipped to ever provide to my taste, and suspect the new action economy might lend itself to better.

Without wanting to go too far into MMO territory, a taunt mechanic would be kinda cool, and a lot of the people I’ve talked to in Europe would like something like the Come and Get Me rage power without a 12 level barb dip. But it should be expensive to use, either in action economy or spendable resources.

Silver Crusade

Brawler is great but could be done as either a fighter or monk archetype.

In fact it was kinda done although suboptimally as both. Martial flexibility is bae though.


Assuming that I'm reading right that the initial classes are (and first need to address these before additional ones):

  • Alchemist -- nice already, but expand so that Investigator can be a set of archetypes of this
    Barbarian -- okay, although I would have rather seen Fighter become flexible enough to encompass this as an archetype
  • Bard -- make Skald an archetype of this (which they sort of started to do in the Advanced Player's Guide, but then apparently forgot about); also make a 4/9 (5/10?) version, including a Battle Herald Base Class archetype
  • Cleric -- needs a rebuild to make it more interesting; remix with Warpriest and Inquisitor, and cover Shaman with archetypes
  • Druid -- needs a remix with Hunter, and should have 9/9, 6/9, 4/9, and 0/9 versions (actually 10/10, 7/10, 5/10, and 0/10? -- the last one would be the new Shifter, of which the Oozemorph archetype should instead be a race/ancestry)
  • Fighter -- should be made flexible enough to include Barbarian, Brawler, Cavalier/Samurai, Gunslinger, Ranger, and Swashbuckler and include good Unarmed archetypes for an easy transition into Monk prestige class
  • Monk -- should really be a prestige class, including prestige class archetypes
  • Paladin -- should really be a prestige class, including prestige class archetypes
  • Ranger -- should really be a Fighter archetype
  • Rogue -- make it shine this time, and include the Ninja and some of the types of Vigilante (other Vigilante types would be archetypes of some other things)
  • Sorcerer -- the idea in Pathfinder 1.0 was really good -- it's just that the Bloodline organization became really messy, and the Bloodline quality became really uneven; also include spontaneous Psychic and Summoner as archetypes
  • Wizard -- rebuild to make it more interesting, and include prepared Psychic, prepared Summoner, and Witch as a set of archetypes
Most wanted classes not yet listed as included (and not listed above as archetype/remix wishes):
  • Arcane Trickster Base Class
  • Arcanist -- really cool in Pathfinder 1st Edition
  • Bloodrager -- see Sorcerer above for Bloodline cleanup notes, and also make a 6/9 (7/10?) version
  • Divine equivalent of Arcanist
  • Kineticist -- but the current Burn mechanic is really inelegant, so I'd like to see this rebuilt
  • Magus -- but fix some things like Knowledge Pool so that they aren't brokenly overpowered; also make a 4/9 (5/10?) version
  • Medium done right -- include a Harrowed Medium archetype -- if not in the Advanced Player's Guide 2nd Edition, at least in the Harrow Handbook 2nd Edition
  • Occultist, if it can't be made into archetypes of something else
  • Oracle -- but also have 6/9 and 4/9 (actually 7/10 and 5/10?) versions to work as Rage Prophet base classes (Raging Prophet and Prophetic Rager?)
  • Spiritualist, if it can't be made into archetypes of something else
Also, would like to see class talents and specializations(*) cover as many as possible of the archetypes (including as many of those listed above as possible).

(*)Think of Vigilante Specialization if it hadn't suffered arrested development after 2 choices.

Classes that I want moved to prestige classes (partly for thematic reasons):

  • Inquisitor
  • Monk
  • Paladin/Antipaladin/etc.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

My top 10-
1. Bloodrager- It's neither Barbarian nor sorcerer- of all of the hybrid classes,it's the one uniting the most disparate skillset and concepts.
2. Magus- Maybe new multiclassing will make it irrelevant, maybe not... until I see, I've had too many cool magi to want to see this class go.
3. Kineticist- It does things that no other single class does.
4. Vigilante- It's pretty niche, but I like it.
5. Shifter- Mostly 'cause we barely go to know this one.
6. Witch- Mostly for thematic reasons.
7. Oracle- They're cool and I love them... and if wizards and sorcerers are both still Core, then the spontaneous divine caster has a role to play.
8. Shaman- Ideally less of "witch meets oracle," and more of a retooling to truly be its own thing.
9. Gunslinger- Might require some firearm edits... and until we get firearm rules ironed out, I'm not holding my breath.
10. Inquisitor- ideally with less spellcasting this time.

Classes I love, but which might not be required in PF2:

Slayer- As a kitbash of Rogue and Ranger, a lot of what it does could be performed by a decent archetype or retool of one of the other two. I love slayers because I hate spellcasting rangers, but... yeah.

Brawler- Feels like it could work as a twist on the fighter chassis.

Skald- With the right tweaks, this could simply become a Bardic archetype.

Hunter- Halfway between Ranger and Druid- two classes with plenty in common.

Classes I don't particularly like which I could easily see getting the boot:

Summoner- A wizard with a limited spell list and a seriously upgunned familiar. Done.

Cavalier- In Pathfinder, has always felt like the weird love-child of Fighters and Paladins, with a Bard somewhere in the family woodpile. Ditto for Samurai.

Occultist- The focus (ironically, given the current class features) is all over the friggin' place.

Swashbuckler- Hasn't been that great at replicating the feel it was going for... a fighty rogue or a roguey fighter often feels more like I'm getting my Errol Flynn on. Maybe a revamp would make me love it- hard to say.

Ninja- A suitably upgunned rogue should tackle this just fine.

Arcanist.

Dark Archive

Summoner is my number 1. I don't think summoner functions great as an archetype because it would gut a major part of the class.

Summoners come in a few variants.
1. The build your own animal companion
2. The spam the field with little monsters to control the field.
3. Summon your own big monster and buff it.

Now it kind of matters how the game is when it comes out. If the animal companions are all trash because of how the game system works, then that ruins my hopes for eidolons.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Hmm. At the moment, I can only see a handful of non-core 11 classes that really need to be actual classes. They are: the Alchemist (which was bumped up to Core), the Gunslinger, the Kineticist, the Medium, the Summoner, the Vigilante, and possibly the Occultist (if the item-dependent shtick makes it distinct from the Wizard) and the Shaman (which is derived from two potential archetypes). The rest could possibly work just as well as class archetypes. 5E created a non-multiclassed Ftr/Wiz and a Rog/Wiz, as well as a spontaneous divine caster with a Sor kit, so there's no reason P2E couldn't do the same.


Wow a lot of new posts. I always do enjoy wish lists.

Dark Archive

I can see many classes being simply converted as a base class with different archetypes or feats chosen, such as a Cleric taking more skill feats and taking some Rogue stuff to emulate an Inquisitor. With that in mind my suggestions are for classes that can't be approximated easily, and also aren't psychic casters (as Paizo has already expressed a desire to leave that design space open for 3pp for now).

1. Vigilante - The class is already built in a similar way to the new feat system, so it's easier to convert, but while it does emulate other classes it also has its own distinct identity (pun intended).

2. Kineticist - Technically not a psychic caster! The Act system would make Gather Power easier to understand, it again shares the modular class feat structure that Vigilante and 2e classes have thus making it easier to convert, and it's a pretty cool class overall. Just find a way to simplify Burn so I don't have to listen to people whine about it all the time.

3. Hunter - Although this is listed as a hybrid of Ranger and Druid it actually has a completely different niche, as I've posted before. The Hunter treats its companion as an equally-valuable partner rather than a bodyguard or a pet like the other classes do. Admittedly this could be done by adding teamwork-inspired class feats to Druid or Ranger.

4. Oracle - The Oracle is far more than a spontaneous Cleric - the Curse, Mystery, and Revelation features make them an iconic class to round out the divine casters.

5. Witch - As stated already in interviews, the Witch is already one of the most popular classes and is likely coming soon anyway. Even so, they're unique amongst the spellcasters for their focus on debuffs and their unique Hex mechanic. Just balance hexes a little better this time? We don't need 1e Sleep Hex again.

6-10 are all either non-existent or 3pp classes the likes of Spheres of Might's Scholar or 4e's Warlord. There's a lot of unbroken ground here for new classes that I'd really rather see - I can do conversions on old classes if I have to, but designing new stuff from the ground-up is tough.


Personally I would like them to rework the Hunter as a non-caster martial with animal companion(other creature types like magical beast with archetypes). If needs to heal it;s companion give it a lay on hands like mechanic that works only on animals and whatever it's companion is if not an animal.

So LuniasM, they mentioned the witch as more then likely on the next batch of classes, did they mention any other classes?

Dark Archive

Dragon78 wrote:

Personally I would like them to rework the Hunter as a non-caster martial with animal companion(other creature types like magical beast with archetypes). If needs to heal it;s companion give it a lay on hands like mechanic that works only on animals and whatever it's companion is if not an animal.

So LuniasM, they mentioned the witch as more then likely on the next batch of classes, did they mention any other classes?

I didn't hear anything about other classes - all that was said was that the Witch was nearly the 12th Core class but Alchemist won out, and that there likely wouldn't be a long wait before it was brought to 2e somehow.


1)Kineticist
2)Mesmerist
3)Investigator
4)Slayer
5)Witch
6) Inquisitor
7)Spiritualist
8)Shifter


1. Shifter
2. Psychic
3. Witch
4. Gunslinger
5. Spiritualist
6. Investigator
7. Slayer
8. Kineticist
9. Magus
10. Summoner


gunny the toad wrote:

wooooah

PF2????
OH MY GOD, i missed the news, well i'm glad i randomly logged in today, this news has made my day

Your reaction is great. Love it!


Everything in Occult Adventures (Harrowed version of the Medium if you can get it).

I like overcomplicatedness.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

Off the top of my head...

1) Cavalier
2) Investigator
3) Ninja
4) Samurai
5) Magus
6) Bloodrager
7) Arcanist
8) WarPriest
9) Oracle
10) Hunter


My choices:

  • Magus
  • Summoner
  • Oracle
  • Witch
  • Warpriest
  • Swashbuckler

Archetypes I want to see:

  • Bladebound
  • Kensai
  • Synthesist
  • Bolt Ace
  • Pact Wizard


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Which pact wizard?


In no particular order

Kineticist
Vigilante
Occultist
Spiritualist
Magus
Bloodrager

That's all I can think of for now.


I'd like to see a batch all at once of classes that do not rely on being a mix of 2 other classes. Even though they're some of my favorites, we may not need an Arcanist if wizards work that way, or Warpriests if Clerics are far more melee capable now. Then, once we see how those work , see what combinations of the new classes make sense/work, and go from there. But give us all the base classes at once, like a Class Codex

Scarab Sages

Magus
Occultist (Haunt Collector was my favorite archetype for these)
Kineticist
Oracle
Hunter
Bloodrager
Shaman

It's not 10 but these 7 are some of my favorite things.


1) Magus (to fill the half arcane caster half melee role)
2) Bloodrager (to fill the full melee minor arcane role)
3) Inquisitor (to fill the half melee half divine caster) -this could be warpriest
4) Hunter (the half melee half nature caster roll)
5) Arcane Archer (full ranged attacker with minor arcane)
6) Kineticist (for another option for a ranged elementalist)
7) (something that is ~75% of an arcane caster and 75% divine caster)
8) Shifter (but, you know, good)
9) summoner (needs a redesign though)
10) swashbuckler (fills no role, but fills a fun theme)


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Assuming these cannot be done with Archetypes and such:

Summoner
Magus
Oracle
Witch
Investigator
Occultist
Psychic
Medium
Shifter

If Prestige Classes can be turned into base classes:
Mystic Theurge

Yes, I like spellcasters, why do you ask?

The Exchange

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

My first hope would be that Paizo wait a bit for adding new classes to 2E, as I'd like to play Core only at least for a time.

And second, I'd rather have them surprise me with new classes instead of just rehashing everything they already had in PF1

This said: Kineticist :)

Shadow Lodge

1. Magus
2. Oracle
3. Witch
4. Inquisitor
5. Arcanist
6. Summoner
7. Bloodrager
8. Slayer
9. Gunslinger
10. Swashbuckler


In order of me thinking of them rather than necessarily preferential order.

1) Kineticist - For a viable blaster now that spells don't scale... and also just because it was always one of my favorite classes anyways. It kinda uses the same system that new classes use anyways so conversion shouldn't be *too* hard... though keeping the split between Utility and Infusion could be interesting.

2) Vigilante - Honestly I would be okay with this being done through General Feats... on the condition I can still get Transformation Sequence. The Call of the Magical Girl is too stronk, I can't resist it. Of course, it also makes a good class with the defined split in "Adventuring" (Vig) and "Social" abilities... if you can find a way to work that into the new set-up... basically the same issue as Kineticist in that it fits well but also could have issues at the same time.

3) Psychic - We need our fifth casting type (Arcane, Divine, Nature, Alchemical, and Psychic) back.

4) Magus - While there's talk that Gishing will be do-able in Core, the Magus's claim to fame has been two fold: Action economy advantages with casting and attacking AND the whole delivering touch attacks through your weapon thing. Also it opens up the path to eventually get Mind-Blade and I love me some Mind-Blade.

5) Warpriest - Especially if Team LG of the Paladin threads wins, we'll need a Holy Warrior. And I don't mean a 9 10-level caster who picked up a sword, I mean a Divinely-empowered Warrior who just happens to have some level of casting acumen.

6) Oracle - Because Spont Casting >>>> Prepped Casting IMO, also the Curse and Mystery interaction is fun and makes for some cool characters.

7) Spiritualist and/or Summoner - Both are filling the same slot because both kinda fill the same niche: A less animal, more supernatural Pet Class. Ideally we'll get the build-a-monster APG Summoner back, but if given the choice between the Chai- I mean "Un"chained Summoner or Spiritualist I would favor the Spiritualist.

8) Shifter - We all know Paizo screwed up on the UW Shifter... so let's try Round 2, and see if it works out well this time.

9) Bloodrager - I'll admit I'm a bit particularly biased in favor of Bloodragers (Air Elemental Bloodline is the most Anime character I've been able to make so far and I love me some Anime) but just in general this fills a fun area, as a magically empowered Warrior with all the uncontrolled inherent power of the Sorcerer.

10) Gunslinger - Because it's an iconic, and very particular, class. Bonus points if we get the Bolt Ace too though.


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Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Witch
Summoner

That's it. The rest can come later


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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Considering how much the iconics are a part of the game and how much love they get I don't see them removing classes down the line. They are a selling point for Paizo with the miniatures, the comics, and everything else so i dont see the removal of most classes. The 10 i would like to see first though are

1. Oracle (People love spontaneous casting and the divine version of that will need to come out asap)
2. Inquisitor (My favorite class in the game)
3. Cavalier (Mounted combat specialist, though with the new feat system can also build as a marshal like character would be sweet)
4. Medium
5. Occultist (This and the above are my preferred psychic classes so hope they get some love asap)
6. Investigator (Considering how much is being done to chance how alchemical items will work adding another class to use those mechanics will be a smart move)
7. Magus
8. Hunter
9. Kineticist
10. Witch


1. Warlord
2. Warder
3. Stalker
4. Psion
5. Summoner


1 Cavalier: Or some way to get that bonded mount but I really like what they did with Cavalier orders.
2 Summoner: One of the most controversial classes back in the day but also one of the most interesting flavor wise. Much like cavalier its really hard to do a summoner without being an actual summoner
3 Psychic: Again its all about the flavor and I LOVE psychic stuff. Ever since I read the 2nd edition book about psionics Ive loved the flavor of psychic characters, monsters, and societies and I want more
4 Shifter: I actually havnt read PE1's shifter yet but a character that is all about shapechanging is something that sounds awesome. I played a shifter back in the 3.0 days and he was endless comedy and fun. So lets get more of that going
5 Witch: IMO an iconic class that I feel should have been core but at the same time should be seperated just a bit more from sorcerer/wizard
6 Magus: Ok you can kind of do this with a decent fighter/wizard build but the magus blows that thing out of the water while adding really good flavor to someone who walks both roles simultaneously
7 Bloodrager: One of the most interesting "strange bedfellows" mix of classes but at its core it offers interesting RP situations which is always a bonus
8 Slayer: Sometimes you just want to play that specialist whos really good at hunting/killing a certain thing out there and the slayers it. I mean come on, we've all wanted to play the dragonslayer or demonslayer, theyre just good fun
9 Brawler: The class that made unarmed fighters cool again!
10 Oracle: I just love the dichotomy of gaining power in exchange for some kind of curse. Oracles (like all my other picks) are just full of flavor for someone who wants to play a character thats interesting from an RP and mechanics point of view

Dark Archive

I'd personally like seeing, in no particular order, Magus, Witch, Oracle, Gunslinger, Ninja(Yeah I know, I'm probably only fan of the class considering amount of support it got), Summoner, ALL Occult Classes, revised version of Shifter and revised version of Vigilante.


No real order here:
Magus: A melee caster is a classic niche. Might be doable with archetypes, and the action economy also changes them a bit. Also they totally should get the Create Pit line of spells, being able to make a pit and then push someone into it with a bull-rush really should be an option.

Kineticist: Has great potential, but the current implementation is problematic. They should probably have more utility powers and get them earlier as well as get more flexibility for their blasts earlier. Basically all the flexibility is locked until fairly late. Also burn needs to be re-balanced so the HP cost doesn't scale up faster than you get hit points.

Inquisitor: Fun class that has a different feel to the other divine casters. Kind of like a Divine Bard equivalent.

Summoner: Great class. Summoning monsters for minutes per level finally lets you do the trope of the magician who summons minions to do tasks around the lab instead of just for half a minute to fight someone. Before you basically could only do that at high levels. And the Create Your Own Creature aspect is great. Might need a bit of balancing. Also the Synthesist archetype needs a bit of tuning, but at least in my group is rather popular, 3 of the 4 PC summoners were Synthesists.

Witch: with a better spell list,I remember there being classically witchy spells they don't get, but sadly I don't recall what those were off the top of my head. But I do like the mix of arcane and divine spells, the otherworldly patron and special familiar are both neat, and hexes are cool.

Oracle: Has some of the otherworldly flavor of witches and gives divine casters a spontaneous option.

Cavalier: Having the option to be a knight is such an iconic role, and the paladin only really gets part of it. The caviler is just a knight as heavy cavalryman without getting divine magic and morality involved. There is the problem with them not being suited to dungeons unless perhaps they're a small sized one.

Beyond that I'm not so sure. Probably Psychic and perhaps some of the other Occult classes, it's just most of them seem to be kind of looking for a niche to fill. The Hybrid classes for the most part seem more like something that can be handled with archetypes (although I did love my Swashbuckler, he was a bit over powered, murdering the crap out of anything that crossed his socio-path).

Gunslingers are both kind of niche with guns being very divisive theme-wise, and mechanically overpowered. Especially with a two-pistol build. Once they get free-action reloads or a pepperbox they can spam ranged attacks with dex bonus to damage, and can hit most of the time despite dual-weapon penalties because of the touch-AC thing. So they need to be re-balanced along with guns. The only other dual-wielding ranged characters I cna think of are maybe some kind of thrown weapon specialist and the kasatha Bow Nomad which is also pretty overpowered, but at least doesn't hit against touch AC.


Warlock
Avenger
Warden
Wu Jen
Archivist
Artificer
Beguiler
Assassin
Psion
Binder


Paradozen wrote:
A defenses oriented martial debuffs/control class that can draw enemy fire away from others, block attacks for allies, and make hits that are strong enough to get through defenses give the enemies penalties as they are using too much effort. This is something that might be a subclass of fighter or paladin, but I'd like to see it as its own class. It is what I picture when I think of a melee tank.

I could get behind this. A lot of folk use "tank" from video games, but it doesn't translate well in PF currently. Taunting and kiting stupid enemies etc...


Witch
Antipaladin (if not part of paladin)
Gunslinger
Psychic


Windcaler wrote:
8 Slayer: Sometimes you just want to play that specialist whos really good at hunting/killing a certain thing out there and the slayers it. I mean come on, we've all wanted to play the dragonslayer or demonslayer, theyre just good fun

While I don't disagree with bringing back the Slayer... I think the class you want (at least the PF1e equivalent) is the Ranger. Slayers in PF1e were less picky about who they slew, being able to make someone their Favored Enemy with a Move Action (or an Immediate when they successfully Sneak Attack.)

Doktor Weasel wrote:
Also burn needs to be re-balanced so the HP cost doesn't scale up faster than you get hit points.

Very much not disagreeing with Kineticist, they're one of my fav classes... but unless you're incredibly unlucky with HP die rolls Burn shouldn't outscale HP growth. Average HP for a d8 is 4.5+Con, and Burn caps at 3+Con, so on average even if you've used every point of Burn you can willingly accept you should still have a bit more than 1.5xLevel HP left. Not a lot, but that's also worst-case scenario, given how easy it is to play a Kineticist while taking little if any burn during the day.

Paizo Employee Organized Play Developer

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Given that Mark has stated that you can basically pull off spell combat naturally due to the action economy and structure of the new system, I'd actually like it if some of my favorite current edition classes weren't brought over or even necessary, like the Hunter, Investigator, Skald, and Vigilante. A lot of those seem like they should be something that could just be an archetype or path of the core classes under the new paradigms that have been discussed. What I'd really like to see is classes that are both mechanically and thematically distinct from the core line-up so that the new edition has the broadest array of tropes available as quickly as possible, avoiding concepts that the base system can already accommodate. So my list would probably be-
1) Kineticist
2) Occultist (though with resonance I don't how distinct this would really be)
3) Medium (hopefully looking a bit more like the playtest version than the final one)
4) Summoner/Spiritualist

And that's actually it for current Paizo classes. I think most of the other Paizo classes could easily be covered by archetypes or multiclassing, especially with the system being revisited from the ground up. If I were to go a little farther afield and look at 3pp classes that could be cool adopted into core...

5) Luchador, or more precisely, a grappling/close combat based class that doesn't have the alignment and eastern mysticism aspects of the monk (maybe the monk will cover this in the new system though, which I would be good with)
6) Battle Lord/Commander/Envoy/Warlord/Marshal, really just a martial leader who can support and buff a party without magic
7) An Incarnum/Akashic/Solarion type class that gets to manifest different kinds of weapons, armor, and/or items and play with resonance (assuming that gets kept) in different ways. This might have some overlap with the occultist, but I'm picturing something more focused on actually creating a finite number of weapons/armor/items each day. Soulknife could also fit under this general concept.
8) Warlock/Dragonfire Adept. Honestly the kineticist could dropped under this heading as well. A class that gets a big, scaling, at-will offensive option they can customize based on different themes and concepts, with some supporting but narrow magical abilities that reinforce the theme.
9) Artificer. It doesn't have to have that name, but a genuine 1pp class that gets to craft magical devices and golems and all sorts of arcane gadgetry.
10) Binder. This could potentially be done under a summoner or medium type chassis as well where you wear your pet instead of conjuring it (preferably without the various issues inherent to the synthesist summoner), but a class that specializes in communing with scary creatures from beyond and then letting said scary creatures ride around in the conjurer's body and actually changing their physical characteristics and abilities.

Dark Archive

1> Bloodrager as a Barbarian Archetype.
2> Slayer
3> A Grit/Panache class. Not necessarily tied together with gun use, but definitely better than pf1 Swashbuckler.
4> Warpriest
5-10> new hybrid classes different from the pf1 hybrid classes.


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We've been told that prestige classes have evolved into something else, most likely archetypes? Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster being plausible with base classes seems like a better alternative than needing a bunch of different classes.

Aiming for the desire for multiclassing to be corrected in a way that lets one essentially create their own hybrid classes, so I wouldn't want any of those.

Some of the base classes exist for the sole purpose of 'answering' certain desires, the cavalier coming from a desire for an alignment free paladin, the samurai a derivative of that, the ninja of the rogue, etc. I want none of these, I want these concepts to be fulfilled with options within the core base classes.

So we need different classes with different mechanics. They mentioned psychic magic might have some form in the core book in passing in the 2 hour interview with Erik and Logan. This means to me that I shouldn't ask for any of the psychic classes that more or less are "the psychic equivalent of x spellcaster" but there's still a lot to gain from the book. Kineticists need some cleaning up. Summoners and spiritualists may function off the same chassis.

Given my personal desires for the edition, I would want (not necessarily in desired order):
1) Witch (arcane equivalent to the wizard as the druid is to the cleric)
2) Oracle (spontaneous equivalent to the cleric as the sorcerer is to the wizard)
3) Spontaneous druid (could be covered by an oracle that switches spell lists)
4) Spontaneous witch (could be covered by a sorcerer that switches spell lists)
5) Kineticist/ Continuous blaster like class (Warlock?)
6) Summoner/binder/buddy class
7) Gunslinger that doesn't break the game so easily
8) Artificer/Occultist/ guy who has a relationship with crafting/items (ironman class?)
9) Shifter that doesn't require immediate errata
10) expand the niche of bard-like classes, archaeologists/dandy rangers/full casting bards/ etc. so it is parallel with other spellcasters. This might overlap with witch.

I expect a lot of these spell lists will be written out as full 10 level lists, with partial casters like paladins, rangers, and eldritch knights all receiving similar chassis to acquire spellcasting coupled with other mechanics. I like this concept as to reduce the total number of spell lists so new classes can use the same lists without the need to errata them into older releases.


1. Witch.
2. Vigilante.
3. Hunter.
4. Shaman.
5. Occultist, (to see how it changes).
6. Antipaladin.
7. Bloodrager.
8. Summoner.
9. Magus.
10. Shifter, (specifically a re-do).


I've been hearing that Pathfinder 2nd Edition hit points will be like Starfinder hit points, in that if you get knocked out by non-lethal damage, you can die of a paper cut.

This is going to really hurt the Kineticist without a major design change.


If I had any faith in this new system at all, I'd say Kineticist, but I don't trust them to not screw it up.
I guess Shifter is what I'd like to see. Not much they can do to make it even MORE mediocre.


All from the Advanced Class guide.


Generally looking at stuff that fills in holes in Core set while not overall changing assumptions of play, or specializing for sake of specializing.

Cavalier - Nonmagical companion martial with minor CHA angle
Oracle - Spontaneous Not-Cleric / Divine not-Sorceror
Shaman - Alt-Druid unique casting/power abilities but not really disruptive
Investigator - Rogue/Ranger/Bard using Alchemy lite
Swashbuckler - alt-Fighter/Rogue, not my thing personally but deserves it
Occultist - seemingly exemplary of P2E approach, psychic magic that doesn't over specialize (IMHO Psychic & Mesmerist are too specialized/not otherwise distinct from Sorceror/Bard)
Medium - other 'balanced' psychic magic that seems suited to new system and actually innovative (not just alt-Sorc/Bard).

Excluding:
Magus: Fighter-Mage handled fine if arcane armor options allowed as indicated. NEXT if/when more classes done.
Inquisitor: Fighter-Cleric handles fine. NEXT if/when more classes done.
Arcanist - Alt-Wizard with kinda more break the rules power - No need.
Bloodrager - NotBarb NotMagus NotNeeded
Brawler - NotMonk NotNeeded
Gunslinger - NotInMyFantasy
Hunter - TooSpecialized TooEarly, Try DruidFighterBarbRangerCavalier
Kineticist - Too assumption changing, not enough filling holes in Core
Mesmerist - Too much specialization, and different for different sake, try Bard
Psychic - Too much specialization, and different for different sake, try Sorc
Ninja - Too much specialization, try RogueSorc
Slayer- Too much specialization, try RogueRangerFighter
Skald - Too much specialization, try BardBarb
Shifter - Too much specialization, try DruidBarb
Spiritualist - Too much specialization, Core assumption violation, try Undead focus Cleric/Wiz/Sorc
Summoner - Too much specialization, try WizSorc
Vigilante - Too much specialization, try Whatev
Warpriest - Try FighterCleric already
Witch - Try WizSorcDruid (or Shaman if included) like everybody did before this class was released


1) Oracle
2) Witch
3) Vigilante
4) Magus
5) Mesmerist
6) Shifter
7) Bloodrager
8) Swashbuckler
9) Cavalier
10) Investigator

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