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so i want to make my 1st character part 1

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this are the classes im thinking about
wizred
fighter
roughe
monk
gunslinger
swashbuckler
bard
im open to archetypes
any advise
i like minmaxing and story telling
please help
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step one find out what your dm allows(classes, books,ect), step 2 find out what you actually want to get out of the character, step 3 find all classes that would allow you to do said thing you are looking to do. after all that is done more advice can be given as without that knowledge we cant help much
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Since it's your first character, I'm also assuming that you're very new to the game.
The Wizard is a very complex class, I would advice you to not start there.

The Rogue and Monk are considered to be two of the weakest classes in the game. However, if you have access to the Unchained variants of these classes, you could consider them.

The gunslinger is very context sensetive, as not all gaming groups want guns in their game.

The Fighter and Swashbuckler (and the Unchained Monk) are all very potent damage-dealers, though they offer little versatility.

The Bard is very versatile and I don't think it's too heavy for a first time player. Just remember: you are the party's support, not the star.

And if you want to play a Rogue, play an Unchained Rogue. It won't be as strong as a Fighter or as versatile as a Bard. It's somewhere in the middle.
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Rub-etas little summary is sound, like lady-j I'd like to know which books are allowed.

http://paizo.com/campaigns/GMMainersCryptOfTheEverflame/recruiting#29
this is what im shooting for i dont have unchained so yah but i will check it out i know a place online that shows all the classes im going with ether a unchained monk a swashbuckler a fighter a bard or a gunslinger help me pick from these guy
"Ameraaaaaa wrote:


i like minmaxing and story telling
please help

Good thing the storm-wind fallacy isn't here

Grand Lodge

For a new player I would go for the slayer, it's a good hit dice, good bab class with lots of skills and an easy built in buff.

I know it isn't on the list but I have always felt that the Ranger is an awesome first class. Basic spell casting. Easy to make whatever type of combat you want to have work. Decent skills. It is great.

1st whats a storm wind fallacy
nah slayer relies on sneak attack and i dont like how any monster with immunity crits are going to make me suck but is it common i dont know
isnt the ranger the weekst class maybe im wrong but tell me

ops didnt know i can reply
magispitt wrote:
"Ameraaaaaa wrote:


i like minmaxing and story telling
please help
Good thing the storm-wind fallacy isn't here

whats that

Balancer wrote:
For a new player I would go for the slayer, it's a good hit dice, good bab class with lots of skills and an easy built in buff.

how common is crit imunity

J4RH34D wrote:
I know it isn't on the list but I have always felt that the Ranger is an awesome first class. Basic spell casting. Easy to make whatever type of combat you want to have work. Decent skills. It is great.

isnt it the weekist class in the game but maybe im wrong

Ameraaaaaa wrote:
Balancer wrote:
For a new player I would go for the slayer, it's a good hit dice, good bab class with lots of skills and an easy built in buff.
how common is crit imunity

oozes, elementals and some aberrations have it but mostly its uncommon in pathfinder unlike in 3.5 were crit immunity was rampant and pretty much every were

Ranger is not the weakest class in the game.

Core rogue or Core monk deserves that title.
Lady-J wrote:
Ameraaaaaa wrote:
Balancer wrote:
For a new player I would go for the slayer, it's a good hit dice, good bab class with lots of skills and an easy built in buff.
how common is crit imunity
oozes, elementals and some aberrations have it but mostly its uncommon in pathfinder unlike in 3.5 were crit immunity was rampant and pretty much every were

then i not playing a slayer

Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:

Ranger is not the weakest class in the game.

Core rogue or Core monk deserves that title.

then im adding them to the list

not the core rogue or core monk i meant the ranger
and i just read the unchained monk and i like so that or swashbuckler or gunslinger or bard or fighter

ops posted 2 times my misstake
Grand Lodge
Ameraaaaaa wrote:

1st whats a storm wind fallacy

nah slayer relies on sneak attack and i dont like how any monster with immunity crits are going to make me suck but is it common i dont know
isnt the ranger the weekst class maybe im wrong but tell me

Okay let me correct some misconceptions. Immunity to critical doesn't make you immune to sneak attack, often they overlap but not all the time.

Immunity to critical hits is an uncommon ability, so uncommon it's not even worth considering unless you are specifically trying to make a build the focuses explicitly on them like two weapon kukri fighting. In your everyday situation critical are the gravy on the meat of build, nice to have but not game breaking if you can't get it.

Slayer does not rely on sneak attack damage, it has reduced progression that can be corrected with a feat but the damage is only their secondary means. They are full BAB 10 HD killing machines that have an inbuilt scaling bonus to damage.

You gain sneak attack when the target is denied it's dexterity bonus or flanked by you, this should be easy for you to establish with some teamwork from the rest of the party since you want to be on the front lines.

You even to take a ranger combat style, and with the combat trick rouge talent and weapon training talent you get a tonne of bonus feats for free, not as much as a fighter but that's comparing lake Victoria to the pacific ocean, both are still large bodies of water.

The take away here is that you are not going to suck if you can't crit, pick a greatsword, take power attack and go to town. You have a very good selection of skill and 6+int to spend on them, trust me you that is a very good thing to have.

Slayer is the best of both sneaky rouge work and raw killing power of a ranger, essentially you are a stronger sneaky rouge without the weakness of a rouge because once you've got the drop on the bad guys or if you can't get a flank it doesn't matter because you're still going to be able to hit your opponent.
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Ameraaaaaa wrote:
magispitt wrote:


Good thing the storm-wind fallacy isn't here
whats that

this explains it quite well

Ok add slayer to the list now make some arguments that compares the classes on the list Which are slayer gunslinger swashbuckler fighter bard and unchained monk ranger

Forget unchained monk and replace it with unchained rogue
magispitt wrote:
Ameraaaaaa wrote:
magispitt wrote:


Good thing the storm-wind fallacy isn't here
whats that
this explains it quite well

well i was completely wrong with what i thought it was XD

now i narrowed it down to
gunslinger musket master
fighter 2 handed fighter or mobile fighter or archer
bard plan or court fool
swashbuckler plan
slayer plan or cutthroat
most are humen but slayer plan or cutthroat might be catfolk

also the 2 handed fighter might be a dwarve

im going gunslinger musket master

so how to make him
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I'd start with getting a character sheet and a pencil, but that's just me

well 20 point buy
str 10 dex 16 con 10 int 10 wis 18 cha 10
hes humen
hes name is fred finkill
hes home town is frank town
hes a gunslinger
part 1 now 2 traits i need help with this
and feets help please

oh and skills how many skill points i have please
Ameraaaaaa wrote:

well 20 point buy

str 10 dex 16 con 10 int 10 wis 18 cha 10
hes humen
hes name is fred finkill
hes home town is frank town
hes a gunslinger
part 1 now 2 traits i need help with this
and feets help please

First, your abilities are not well-balanced. Dex for to-hit is more important than Wisdom for grit. Leaving Con at 10 is risky. You have a low chance to stabilize once you're at negative hit points, and you have a relatively high chance to bleed out (that is, dying from losing 1 hp/round after going negative). Intelligence helps with Crafting, and a gunslinger needs Craft Alchemy to make ammunition. Str and Cha are less important, although you have to watch out for encumbrance if you dump strength.

Consider a stat line of Str 10 Dex 15 (+2 human for 17) Con 14 Int 13 Wis 14 Cha 10. You could dump Cha down to 8 to get Int up to 14 or Str to 12 without weakening the character much.

Your first two feats are probably going to be Point-Blank Shot and Precise Shot. That will allow you to shoot an opponent in melee without taking a -4 to hit (although they may still have cover for a different -4).

You'll have 4 skill points/level for being a Gunslinger, one point for being human, and more for Int modifiers (if any).

As for traits, you might want to get one that adds to your Will save, but beyond that the options are pretty wide open.
The Exchange
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Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:

Ranger is not the weakest class in the game.

Core rogue or Core monk deserves that title.

The stereotyping runs rampant. Certainly Core rogue is nowhere near as good as unchained rogue, but good core rogues CAN be built.

As for Core Monks, I don't even feel the unchained is clearly better than core, they are simply different. Very powerful monks can be built and can out DPR (Damage Per Round for the newer people that may be reading this) most other classes and their AC, Immunities, abilities generally scale far better than those classes that do over power it.

Just because it is common for people to go down the wrong rabbit hole when creating a Monk (or any class) does not mean that class is weak, only that they don't always work well with any build.
Glorf Fei-Hung wrote:
Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:

Ranger is not the weakest class in the game.

Core rogue or Core monk deserves that title.

The stereotyping runs rampant. Certainly Core rogue is nowhere near as good as unchained rogue, but good core rogues CAN be built.

As for Core Monks, I don't even feel the unchained is clearly better than core, they are simply different. Very powerful monks can be built and can out DPR (Damage Per Round for the newer people that may be reading this) most other classes and their AC, Immunities, abilities generally scale far better than those classes that do over power it.

Just because it is common for people to go down the wrong rabbit hole when creating a Monk (or any class) does not mean that class is weak, only that they don't always work well with any build.

its usually only worth going core monk if the archetype you want isn't compatible with unchained monk and the dm doesn't want to home brew compatibility

Rub-Eta wrote:

Since it's your first character, I'm also assuming that you're very new to the game.

The Wizard is a very complex class, I would advice you to not start there.

I know most people disagree with me, but I actually think Wizards are the 2nd easiest classes to play, and Clerics are the easiest.

I think Fighters are the hardest class to play.

My caveat to this is if the OP is making his own character and hopes to play with this character indefinitely, maybe even level 20.

My reasoning is that the backbone of both the Wizard and Cleric classes are lists of spells that they can change their minds about every day, whereas Fighters depend upon Feats, a small number of special abilities that you can barely change your mind about at all, and then only at significant expense.

If the OP were playing someone else's character, like a pregen, then Fighter is the easiest, but to navigate a character build from levels 1-20, Wizard or Cleric, maybe both: Mystic Theurge.
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Glorf Fei-Hung wrote:
Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:

Ranger is not the weakest class in the game.

Core rogue or Core monk deserves that title.

The stereotyping runs rampant. Certainly Core rogue is nowhere near as good as unchained rogue, but good core rogues CAN be built.

As for Core Monks, I don't even feel the unchained is clearly better than core, they are simply different. Very powerful monks can be built and can out DPR (Damage Per Round for the newer people that may be reading this) most other classes and their AC, Immunities, abilities generally scale far better than those classes that do over power it.

Just because it is common for people to go down the wrong rabbit hole when creating a Monk (or any class) does not mean that class is weak, only that they don't always work well with any build.

I'm not stereotyping anything I'm simply saying those are currently the weakest classes in the game that doesn't mean you can make them work if you work at it did I ever say that? I dont think I did, did I?

Most of the ways people make core monk work is simply playing archetypes that are much better at what they do that the core monk is at doing anything. The unchained monk is simply a much more user friendly class that doesnt need archetypes or system mastery to reach a reasonable level of power. They get nice things like pseudo pounce and full BAB.

Two suggestions,

1) If you can, talk with your GM about what you want to make. She/he can help guide you to specifics within the world and group. If not, don't worry. I've had good experiences as both a new player and a GM of new players when we could talk before the first session.

2) If you're considering a monk and a gunslinger, try a Zen Archer. Its a (regular/chained) monk archetype that is very straightforward, but still has room for customization. It's a little slow at first, but is very good in combat, and has good roleplay flavor.

Here's a helpful link
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2nix8?Zen-and-the-Art-of-Monk-Maintenance-A-Gui de

Good luck, have fun!

never mind he was not picked
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