Can you create a light kinetic blade while holding a heavy (two handed sized) item, or a two handed weapon while holding a light object?
I've looked around for answers to this question & it's been asked before by others(can provide links), but i've not seen a conclusive answer.
It looks like it should, since nothing in the text implies you can't & it makes no real mechanical difference(outside making Aether kinetic blades equal to those of every other element), but i see there being room for some objections based on aesthetic(personally infuriating but i get the reasoning)
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If it does absolutely NEED to be aesthetically size-appropriate, is there anything stopping the fluff description from being(for a light weapon - large object) ripping a weapon shaped shard out of it with aetheric strands(basic tk)/snapping off a length telekinetically, or (for the inverse) using your net(also basic tk) to gather rubble & detritus around your object in the shape of a weapon?
(i'm imagining a pebble, trash & sawdust warhammer around a chair leg and cracking a rough, jagged dirk out of a breastplate and it's awesome)
could you provide the links? also if it's been asked before with no answer it's unlikely you're gonna get an answer this time as it's likely any particular gm would have to decide themselves and rule on it
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There's nothing that says it wouldn't work, but it would be purely aesthetic because the held weapon provides no mechanical change to the blast.
Texas Snyper wrote: There's nothing that says it wouldn't work, but it would be purely aesthetic because the held weapon provides no mechanical change to the blast. Pretty much this. But also beware that the rules are quiet on whether or not your object still takes damage when using kinetic blade. So, if you are using an actual weapon as your object, it may get wrecked pretty quickly.
dharkus wrote: could you provide the links? also if it's been asked before with no answer it's unlikely you're gonna get an answer this time as it's likely any particular gm would have to decide themselves and rule on it Here's the first i can remember, the other might be from on reddit and i'll have to fish around my bookmarks & get back to you.
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2sq1e?Does-weapon-Finesse-work-with-a-kineticis ts#36
Also, this is true, but i figure if the rules say anything explicit I've missed i can either know ahead of time to drop it or be confident it won't be super likely to upset anyone & get canned.
Texas Snyper wrote: There's nothing that says it wouldn't work, but it would be purely aesthetic because the held weapon provides no mechanical change to the blast. Exactly, and that is what i was going for, but i've run into some people with "not in my game" mentalities about fluff and aesthetics and i was worried this might set them off if it was at all shaky legally, so i wanted to get another set of eyes on it and see where i stand before writing any further into the build in case i was wasting my time on something that wouldn't be accepted anywhere.
Melkiador wrote: Texas Snyper wrote: There's nothing that says it wouldn't work, but it would be purely aesthetic because the held weapon provides no mechanical change to the blast. Pretty much this. But also beware that the rules are quiet on whether or not your object still takes damage when using kinetic blade. So, if you are using an actual weapon as your object, it may get wrecked pretty quickly. That is perfect, i was half hoping they would take damage, the idea was specifically for a "pick up whatever weapon or hefty object is lying around and swing it at the enemy until one of those two things breaks, then grab something else" type of character.
Never actually thought about that, ever since I started wondering if the object you're wielding takes damage or not, and I strongly believe the answer is no, since it would make Kinetic Fist mostly useless for aether kineticists, (and there is also the known issue of Half-Orc kineticists swinging sorcerers after a fighter level dip)
So, I'd love to get this issue solved first and then worry about if you can make a light kinetic blade while wielding a large object.
For now, and to avoid any problem, I suggest you stick to ammunition so you can freely draw as many as needed to full attack, don't need to worry about damage, and can also decide to make them a light or one handed weapon of any kind.
Hmm.İt looks like foe throw clearly states how telekinetic blast works at range.I think it doesnt damage the item since there is no explosion.if it did you wouldnt be able to use your blade with ittaretives since at high levels it does enough damage to easly break your dagger at your first ittaretive atack.
Still unsure, I'm reading the text for the basic blast and the kinetic bladde infusion over and over, and I still can't figure it out.
I guess not many object can take 10d6+10+something multiple times per round and survive.
As for the light/one-handed question, the infusion charges an object in hand with the blast, is it possible you don't get to choose and use whatever is in your hand (ignoring proficiencies like the basic telekinetic blast) ?
I'd really like to know too. And if the object does take damage, does the kinetic blade end (say in the middle of a full attack...) or can you pull another object? I really wish it was just a blade of telekinetic force. :)
I was thinking about buying a few adamantine sling stones just in case. They've got hardness 20 and ~40 HP, should be able to handle a couple of empowered swings.
If the object takes damage and gets destroyed (not just broken, that would not hinder you at all) nothing tells us what happens to the kinetic blade, we only know it lasts for the entire turn.
Since you can use the infusion once as part of an attack, charge or full attack action (key word "once") you should not be able to use it again on another object during the same round.
If you want to use only Bludgeoning type of damage, you can always use a piece of rope as your "focus" it's not harmed by B damage.
Miniature Stone walls and doors seem to be good for piercing damage.
I'm still looking for something to use to deal slashing damage.
Oh, and "a fistful of sand" is a nice object to use, you're definitely allowed to pick it up with your basic telekinesis, and I would love to see someone say you can "damage" it with weapons :p
A broken object is still an object. Short of a disintegrate, you should be able to keep using whatever it was to attack your foes. It will just look terrible.
My table just tends to handwaved the damage to your melee object away. It is a stupid and needlessly complicated problem that only plagues aether KBlade.
Plus if you really wanted to get pedantic then telekinetic blast says the "thrown object" takes damage and since you're not throwing your KBlade weapon then it is excluded front that bit.
There are a lot of things about the telekineticist that you need to just talk to the person running the game to agree on how things work and barring a bunch of extra rules text, I don't think there's any changing this.
The big bugaboo is "what defines an unattended object" (e.g. "can you levitate a thing you're standing on, if you don't pay attention to it enough?") but the aforementioned KBlade issues crop up too.
My take: the part about the telekineticist using nearby objects to charge with energy in order to more effectively bash/hurl at other people is supposed to be cool and thematic, it's not supposed to prevent the telekineticist from working as well as other kineticists.
I mean, what's cooler: "using a barstool as a whip" or "you can't use a barstool as a whip"?
It's better to whip them with a barstool
And if a kineticist considered an item grabbed with telekinesis as attended, he wouldn't be able to target anything.
Alderic wrote: If the object takes damage and gets destroyed (not just broken, that would not hinder you at all) nothing tells us what happens to the kinetic blade, we only know it lasts for the entire turn.
Since you can use the infusion once as part of an attack, charge or full attack action (key word "once") you should not be able to use it again on another object during the same round.
If you want to use only Bludgeoning type of damage, you can always use a piece of rope as your "focus" it's not harmed by B damage.
Miniature Stone walls and doors seem to be good for piercing damage.
I'm still looking for something to use to deal slashing damage.
Oh, and "a fistful of sand" is a nice object to use, you're definitely allowed to pick it up with your basic telekinesis, and I would love to see someone say you can "damage" it with weapons :p
That is freakin' brilliant. I've thought about snapping off weapon sized pieces of solids or gathering rocks & sand in a weapon shape, but i never considered hardening malleable substances like a rope or water.
So much awesome stuff can be made from this.
Alderic wrote: Never actually thought about that, ever since I started wondering if the object you're wielding takes damage or not, and I strongly believe the answer is no, since it would make Kinetic Fist mostly useless for aether kineticists, (and there is also the known issue of Half-Orc kineticists swinging sorcerers after a fighter level dip)
So, I'd love to get this issue solved first and then worry about if you can make a light kinetic blade while wielding a large object.
For now, and to avoid any problem, I suggest you stick to ammunition so you can freely draw as many as needed to full attack, don't need to worry about damage, and can also decide to make them a light or one handed weapon of any kind.
Good point, but I'm pretty sure whatever object you coat in aether explicitly does take damage. It says so in the description of the blast that the blade is a form infusion of.
Telekinetic Blast wrote: If the attack hits, the target and the thrown object each take the blast’s damage.
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Alternatively, you can loosen the strands of aether in order to deal damage to both the object and the target as though you had thrown the object yourself
So, regardless of whether it's a full blast dice or thrown damage, your weapon and whatever you're hitting should take the same number of dice(not sure if you have to roll them seperately, i probably wouldn't bother personally, but it would add to verisimilitude that your weapon could break before or after it does X damage rather than having rull parity, which in turn is fairer, if less realistic)
Also, OP actually wanted the blade to take damage, so while your advice is good, it only helps those of us who don't.
And while this most likely(wouldn't know, never read it a second time) extends to telekinetic fist(which i personally believe is entirely useless for everyone, not just aether) and make it worse, i kind of like it that way. There aren't too many ways in this game to break all your fingers by punching someone too hard. Which isn't an unlikely thing to happen in a fistfight to the death.
Kind of like when you see super strength exceed super durability(in the Inheritance cycle for example.)
So, sure it's terrible, but i may actually take it now to display power surpassing discipline or an accidental rage boost to a normal punch by leaking telekinesis, instead of avoiding it like the g$$$+&n plague it is.
*Edit- Oh wow, i did not expect something that tame to get censored. Apparently we can't talk about things being damned by gods in a forum for a game where that is a thing that literally happens. OK.
(To be honest a sorcerer being used as a bat by a fighter-kineticist SHOULD be getting hurt just as bad as the person being used as a ball. That's why you never use YOUR sorcerer)
PossibleCabbage wrote: There are a lot of things about the telekineticist that you need to just talk to the person running the game to agree on how things work and barring a bunch of extra rules text, I don't think there's any changing this.
The big bugaboo is "what defines an unattended object" (e.g. "can you levitate a thing you're standing on, if you don't pay attention to it enough?") but the aforementioned KBlade issues crop up too.
My take: the part about the telekineticist using nearby objects to charge with energy in order to more effectively bash/hurl at other people is supposed to be cool and thematic, it's not supposed to prevent the telekineticist from working as well as other kineticists.
I mean, what's cooler: "using a barstool as a whip" or "you can't use a barstool as a whip"?
I agree and had a really long discussion about that exact thing on reddit. Whether rooms are attended, if you attend by standing on stuff
how many hundred pairs of gloves before you aren't attending your weapon(i'd drop it at 3), whether bacteria exist and can attend things, all kinds of silly stuff.
It was... unhelpful.
I've had a similar discussion, and it seems there was an issue even with dungeon doors and throwing them inside a room instead of opening them... trap, lock and all.
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