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So I was tinkering with some hypothetical builds the other day, as many gamer's do, and I noticed something peculiar. There are no Paizo prestige classes or class-archetypes that specialize in dealing with Giants. I find this so odd because two AP's focus around Giants.
I've found ways to specialize in fighting aberrations, dragons, undead, outsiders of various types, and even genies. Why not Giants?
Now I know there are races that have features against giants (lookin at you dwarf and gnome) and Rangers can always select Favored Enemy, but that's not what I'm getting at here.
I'm also aware of builds that benefit from fighting Giants. The "Titan" builds for both the Barbarian and Fighter benefit from Large weapon drops. Goliath Druids and Mammoth Rider benefit from Giant sized dungeons. But these examples benefit from fighting Giants, but don't specialize in fighting them.
Am I just missing something here? Am I looking in the wrong place? I am involved in a few groups playing Rise of the Runelords, so it could help them. We also regularly talk about starting the Giant Slayer AP. Thoughts everyone?
There's feat chains available if you're so inclined; goblin cleaver/orc hewer/giant killer, dwarven hatred style, some of the teamwork feats. Not everything is a class feature.
Edit: and giants tend to have poor Reflex saves and touch AC, and so-so Will saves, and the humanoid type, which makes them vulnerable to many kinds of magic! A blaster or enchanter can have a field day against them.
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Yeah I understand building to beat Giants. Dwarves are an obvious choice with their racial features, available traits, and feats. Smaller races also have good feat lines for combating races/creatures larger than themselves.
I just feel as though there must be something I missed. With so many build options for every other type of creature you fight available I thought that there must be something for Giants. I mean, Paizo does have two AP's centered around using them as the primary villains.
That being said, if what I'm looking for doesn't exist, what do people think are the idealized builds for fighting giants? Lets start a conversation about that.
Enchanters (like avr said) and archers are quite powerful against giants, usually they should make a joke out of them.
It's more interesting to go into melee vs. giants, since they hit hard and from reach. Beside the feats avr mentioned, there is also Steadfast Slayer (especially for gnomes), Big Game Hunter (if allowed by GM) and Giant-Killer Stance. Further (not that amazing) feats are Mountain-Splitting Strike, Arcing Lob, Death or Glory (nice with Vital Strike), Chokehold, Scuttle, Ground-Grabber, Deadly Grappler, Porcupine Defense and the Twin Thunders line (gnome or dwarf only). Halflings get Large Target, Risky Striker and Improved Low Blow. Goblins may take Tangle Feet. For small races in general there are also Underfoot and Passing Trick.
The beast wrestler brawler gains Humanoid (Giant) as a favored enemy (a +2 CMB/CMD vs. giants).
An Order of the Paw cavalier gains the Giant Slayer ability, improving challenge bonuses vs. opponents at least two sizes larger, at 15th level.
An inquisitor can select the Favored Judgement feat with Humanoid (Giant).
Not everything has to have a prestige class or an archetype dedicated to it. Giants are a pretty broad group that other than being larger than normal doesn’t really have a lot in common. Undead, dragons, and outsiders tend to have similar abilities that often need to be overcome to handle them. Other than rock throwing giants really don’t have any common abilities other than size.
There are plenty of ways to build a character focused on fighting giants in the game already. Many of the things that will work against giants will also work against a lot of other creatures, but that makes them no less effective against giants. Most martial classes don’t really need much more than power attack and a two handed weapon. Also mounted combat works extremely well vs. giants. Since giants are already large creatures anywhere you find them will also probably accommodate a large mount.
Since giants have no common attack form, or defense there really is not a great need for a prestige class to deal with them. A ranger with maxed out favored enemy with a mount is going to be about the strongest class against a giant, anything they could possibly create would actually be less effective. When a core class with no archetype is the best choice for dealing with a creature creating a prestige class is pretty silly. They could create archetypes for other classes, but really about the only thing they could do would be to give the rangers favored class bonus. While they have created archetypes that rendered the rogue useless, I don’t think they want to do the same with the ranger.
There is an entire publication on giant hunting:
http://paizo.com/products/btpy99s4/discuss?Pathfinder-Player-Companion-Gian t-Hunters-Handbook
I'm currently playing in ROTR, and my character took the Giant Vendetta story feat ( our GM gives us a bonus story feat each).
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Thanks for the feed back so far! I was looking to be corrected and the Order of the Paw in particular did just that.
I don't own the Giant Hunters Handbook but I do imagine that mixing it with the Players Guides for Rise of the Runelords and Giant Slayer you could come up with some effective ideas.
I bet there as many good Traits as there are Feats that you guys mentioned, so there certainly is a lot of material out there. This post was mostly just about something I found to be an oddity rather than an outreach to min-max. But I find it interesting.
Goliath Druid is a fun giant-oriented druid archetype that gives you bonuses against giant magic!
Ranger serves as a catch-all "I hunt X" class, and as such is a good specialist for giant killing. In Giant Hunters Handbook there is Goliath Druid for infiltrating and destroying Giant settlements and bases. There is also Vexing Dodger, a skilled rogue who darts up the backs of large foes to claw at their throats, eyes, and necks. And Titan Fighter, a fighter designed to poach Giant weapons and use them to kill Giants.
You want the Sun Seeker prestige class to kill giants. An extra 4d6 per hit with the right weapon at 10th level. It's also good for goblins and orcs too.
The main issue is...what would a "giant killing" PrC look like?
Giants are pretty much just tall humans. Sure, some have unique SLAs, and there are some oddballs, but few and far between.
You kill them like you kill anything else with Reach.
Archetype for you: Mouser Swashbuckler. It just also happens to work against other opponents larger than you (even Medium opponents if you are Small).