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Setting aside that Limited Wish is only going to enter the picture at Seeker levels, it would then become a GM's call as to whether it works or not. Since the spell being duplicated effectively doesn't exist for that character, it doesn't fall under the automatic clause of Limited Wish that says it can duplicate a spell. Instead, you'd be describing the effect you want, and the GM would decide if it works.
Thinking about it another way, if a spell was made illegal because it was considered confusing or overpowered instead of because of racial access, I don't think a GM would at all be obligated to let you duplicate that effect with Limited Wish.
But, if you really want to cast Limited Wish to get the effect of Blend or Gloomblind Bolt, I'd probably say sure.
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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Casting Shadow Conjuration is not casting the spell. It is casting a spell that is able to mimic the effects of the spell Gloombolt.
I get that. The same for a Limited Wish to emulate the spell. None of them should work for racial spells not of your race.
But another way to effectively cast the spell was described by John as a way to "effectively defeat the exclusivity of race-specific spells."
The spells are designed to be exclusive to the race. Are you the race? Then you can use them. Are you not? You can't use them in cute ways designed to defeat the exclusivity. Does that make sense?
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Casting Shadow Conjuration is not casting the spell. It is casting a spell that is able to mimic the effects of the spell Gloombolt.I get that. The same for a Limited Wish to emulate the spell. None of them should work for racial spells not of your race.
But another way to effectively cast the spell was described by John as a way to "effectively defeat the exclusivity of race-specific spells."
The spells are designed to be exclusive to the race. Are you the race? Then you can use them. Are you not? You can't use them in cute ways designed to defeat the exclusivity. Does that make sense?
So you can use these spells with a umd check of 25 then? Cause that's the (cute?) way written in the core rules to defeat the exclusivity of race requirements. (In pfs you still wouldn't have access to purchase the spell, but if you did manage to get a scroll/wand or whatever, a successful umd to emulate race should let you use it).
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Owner - D20 Hobbies
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So you can use these spells with a umd check of 25 then? Cause that's the (cute?) way written in the core rules to defeat the exclusivity of race requirements.
Also, no.
The best way to explain this would be that the spell didn't exist in your universe. You've never seen or heard of anyone casting it. You can't emulate, replicate, activate, or utilize the spell.
Venture-Captain, California—Sacramento
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So you can use these spells with a umd check of 25 then? Cause that's the (cute?) way written in the core rules to defeat the exclusivity of race requirements.Also, no.
The best way to explain this would be that the spell didn't exist in your universe. You've never seen or heard of anyone casting it. You can't emulate, replicate, activate, or utilize the spell.
That is not accurate.
It is as if the spell was on the not allowed in PFS list for you. If you find a scroll or wand of a spell not allowed in PFS in a scenario, can you use it? Yes. If it shows up on the chronicle sheet, then do you have access to it? Yup. That is how a lot of stuff not legal for PFS is made rare but available.
So yes, that is about the only scenario proposed so far where you *can* get the spell (though probably only for that one scenario, unless it also shows up on the chronicle sheet.)
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Owner - D20 Hobbies
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umd check of 25That is not accurate.
If you find a scroll or wand of a spell
True. Ok, how about this. I assumed the UMD was related to "it doesn't appear on a chronicle sheet and I don't have access to it" without thinking that there are not many ways to do that without there being access to it.
So what I said isn't accurate, but since the suggested method gnoams mentioned requires someone in the party have access to it and the UMD person doesn't get to use it while not at the table with someone who has legal access and the UMD can't write it down in his inventory...
RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8
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Just as one could not purchase a scroll of a spell banned in the campaign, one can not purchase a scroll of a spell to which he does not have access (e.g. The Advanced Race Guide's spells restricted to a particular race). Effectively, the PC cannot access that spell, including for spell scribing purposes.
As a corollary, can one purchase a scroll, potion, or wand of a spell to which one does have access that is otherwise banned in the campaign? For example, could a core wizard who has scribed a non-core spell into a spellbook purchase a scroll, potion, or wand of that spell?
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Venture-Lieutenant, Massachusetts—Boston Metro
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Just as one could not purchase a scroll of a spell banned in the campaign, one can not purchase a scroll of a spell to which he does not have access (e.g. The Advanced Race Guide's spells restricted to a particular race). Effectively, the PC cannot access that spell, including for spell scribing purposes.As a corollary, can one purchase a scroll, potion, or wand of a spell to which one does have access that is otherwise banned in the campaign? For example, could a core wizard who has scribed a non-core spell into a spellbook purchase a scroll, potion, or wand of that spell?
As long as they appear in the chronicle sheet which happens often.
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Just as one could not purchase a scroll of a spell banned in the campaign, one can not purchase a scroll of a spell to which he does not have access (e.g. The Advanced Race Guide's spells restricted to a particular race). Effectively, the PC cannot access that spell, including for spell scribing purposes.As a corollary, can one purchase a scroll, potion, or wand of a spell to which one does have access that is otherwise banned in the campaign? For example, could a core wizard who has scribed a non-core spell into a spellbook purchase a scroll, potion, or wand of that spell?
Since character aren't able to use the crafting skills/feats, the Core wizard is buying the scroll/potion/wand, not creating it. So it's subject to the normal purchasing options as limited initially by PFS, then by the PFS Core. Core characters can't purchase anything from resources other than those listed for Core, so scrolls, wands, and potions are limited
That said, it is my understanding that a player of the correct race is able to purchase their racial spells in the form of scrolls/wands/potions, assuming the spell is able to be made into those items normally (like personal spells can't be potions). The PC should, in theory, be able to share within a single session, though this would only exist for that session and very much be subject to GM disgression. As John, and others, have made abundantly clear, the racial options in ARG are intended only for members of that race. Furthermore, ARG is not Core eligible, so this is moot point in Core games.
Would it be possible to get the spell if you actually meet one of the race that has it? Such as if you sit down at a table to play your Human Wizard, and someone else is playing a Wayang wizard, and you decide to swap spells. Would the wizard be able to learn a Wayang only spell from the Wayang if the Wayang had it to teach? Or would this fall under the same blanket PC can not access the spell?
If the spell is banned for your character,there is no way to weasel away around that ban at all. UNLESS, and this IS the only exception, you get a specific exemption on a Chronicle. To my knowledge, no such Chronicles exist.
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Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area North & East
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You can get racial spells from the HEDGEHOG races by having your 5th star under the master of spels aram zey.
Both 5 stars and studying under aram zey are herculean tests of ones endurance and sanity. You will not likely find a more permissive reward easily.
And before you get too excited about that - note that you it's only valid for chapter 1, ie the Core races. I missed that when I was reaching for the boon and noticed when I tried to apply it. Still, was worth it to spread Blend to my other races.
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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 8
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Since character aren't able to use the crafting skills/feats, the Core wizard is buying the scroll/potion/wand, not creating it. So it's subject to the normal purchasing options as limited initially by PFS, then by the PFS Core. Core characters can't purchase anything from resources other than those listed for Core, so scrolls, wands, and potions are limited
That said, it is my understanding that a player of the correct race is able to purchase their racial spells in the form of scrolls/wands/potions, assuming the spell is able to be made into those items normally (like personal spells can't be potions). The PC should, in theory, be able to share within a single session, though this would only exist for that session and very much be subject to GM disgression. As John, and others, have made abundantly clear, the racial options in ARG are intended only for members of that race. Furthermore, ARG is not Core eligible, so this is moot point in Core games.
You have entirely missed my point.
In the standard campaign, you can't purchase scrolls of banned spells. John Compton specifically said that:
"one can not purchase a scroll of a spell to which he does not have access (e.g. The Advanced Race Guide's spells restricted to a particular race)"
Which heavily implies that if one does have access to a spell then one can purchase a scroll of said spell. That should be a general rule that applies to both the standard and core campaign.
IMO that means a core character with access to a non-core spell can purchase a scroll of said spell. I just need to confirm that.
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ARG Race Spells:
- Can only be memorized/known/cast by members of that race.
- Can only be purchased as items by members of that race.
- Are not considered on the class spell lists of other races.
- Could be UMD'd if lent to a member of another race by a member of the race.
- Can be scribed in such a situations for no gain but bragging rights.
Non-ARG Race Spells:
- Are only restricted if the source says so.
Deity-specific Spells:
- Are restricted to worshipers of the deity if the source being used says so. {c.f. Gods & Magic}
- Are not restricted to worshipers in Inner Sea Gods, which reprinted the majority of them, but that would need to be the source.
- Dwarven pantheon spells (those from Dwarves of Golarion and not reprinted in Inner Sea Gods) must be UMD'd by anyone not a worshiper of Torag attuned to the appropriate deity that day.
- Dwarven pantheon spells are otherwise Legal spells in every other way, unlike the Racial spells.
Any question I missed? Any conflicting Campaign postings?
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For a second I thought I could give my magus access to like a spell that gave her spines and adorable squeeks. Then I was disappointed.
my adorable bundle of fluff got the goblinworks kickstarter boon that lets him grow his fur into armored spikes.
Even better, he's a gorrumite, so it's seen as a blessing from his god.
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For a second I thought I could give my magus access to like a spell that gave her spines and adorable squeeks. Then I was disappointed.my adorable bundle of fluff got the goblinworks kickstarter boon that lets him grow his fur into armored spikes.
Even better, he's a gorrumite, so it's seen as a blessing from his god.
Hah, I've been meaning to activate mine for forever. Need to get around to that at some point.
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Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area North & East
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Hah, I've been meaning to activate mine for forever. Need to get around to that at some point.For a second I thought I could give my magus access to like a spell that gave her spines and adorable squeeks. Then I was disappointed.my adorable bundle of fluff got the goblinworks kickstarter boon that lets him grow his fur into armored spikes.
Even better, he's a gorrumite, so it's seen as a blessing from his god.
I've got one to use still too. If you're coming to Gencon or a California con some time, get to a table with me.
Just curious. Would Half-Elves have access to Human and Elven racial spells due to Elf Blood?
Just curious. Would Half-Elves have access to Human and Elven racial spells due to Elf Blood?i believe not, since they're actually different species
Hmm. From this FAQ, I thought they would count as fully Human and Fully Elven for racial spells. I'm not clear why those would work differently from the racial archetypes, racial traits, racial FCBs, and so on.
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Hmm. From this FAQ, I thought they would count as fully Human and Fully Elven for racial spells. I'm not clear why those would work differently from the racial archetypes, racial traits, racial FCBs, and so on.Just curious. Would Half-Elves have access to Human and Elven racial spells due to Elf Blood?i believe not, since they're actually different species
I have been wondering something similar regarding full Elves or Humans learning Half-Elf spells. [For that matter Orcs, and Half Orc spells]
Just curious. Would Half-Elves have access to Human and Elven racial spells due to Elf Blood?Depends on the sanctioning, when it comes to spells and archetypes from the ARG, I suspect that the answer is no.
So are Favored Class Bonuses the only rules elements that Elf Blood lets you 'poach' in PFS?
So are Favored Class Bonuses the only rules elements that Elf Blood lets you 'poach' in PFS?Just curious. Would Half-Elves have access to Human and Elven racial spells due to Elf Blood?Depends on the sanctioning, when it comes to spells and archetypes from the ARG, I suspect that the answer is no.
Gives you access to elven feats as well, such as Elven Accuracy. Pre-reqs may alter cases, such as any that include the phrase "Must Be an Elf."
Settings based exclusions, such as an elven deity that specifically does not accept half-elves, would still apply as well.
So are Favored Class Bonuses the only rules elements that Elf Blood lets you 'poach' in PFS?Just curious. Would Half-Elves have access to Human and Elven racial spells due to Elf Blood?Depends on the sanctioning, when it comes to spells and archetypes from the ARG, I suspect that the answer is no.Gives you access to elven feats as well, such as Elven Accuracy. Pre-reqs may alter cases, such as any that include the phrase "Must Be an Elf."
Settings based exclusions, such as an elven deity that specifically does not accept half-elves, would still apply as well.
Ok. So FCBs and some feats, but no archetypes, spells, or traits. Are these rules on the additional resources page or would I find them someplace else?
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Ok. So FCBs and some feats, but no archetypes, spells, or traits. Are these rules on the additional resources page or would I find them someplace else?
No, that's not right - it's in the FAQ linked above: "Half-elves and half-orcs may select racial favored class options, archetypes, traits, and so on, as if they were a full member of both races (a half-elf can select elf and human rules elements, a half-orc can select human and orc rules elements)."
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Deity-specific Spells:
- Are restricted to worshipers of the deity if the source being used says so. {c.f. Gods & Magic}
- Are not restricted to worshipers in Inner Sea Gods, which reprinted the majority of them, but that would need to be the source.
- Dwarven pantheon spells (those from Dwarves of Golarion and not reprinted in Inner Sea Gods) must be UMD'd by anyone not a worshiper of Torag attuned to the appropriate deity that day.
- Dwarven pantheon spells are otherwise Legal spells in every other way, unlike the Racial spells.
ARG Racial Spells:
- Can only be memorized/known/cast by members of that race.
- Can only be purchased as items by members of that race.
- Are not considered on the class spell lists of other races.
- Could be UMD'd if lent to a member of another race by a member of the race.
- Can be scribed in such a situations for no gain but bragging rights.
Non-ARG Racial Spells:
- Are only restricted if the source says so.
ARG Racial traits, archetypes, evolutions, feats:
- Can only be taken/emulated/flexed by members of that race.
- Neither racial features (e.g. "Elf/Orc Blood") nor the Racial Heritage Feat bypasses this restriction.
Non-ARG Racial traits, archetypes, evolutions, feats:
- Are generally only available to members of that race.
- Abilities such as Elf/Orc Blood or the Racial Heritage feat do bypass this restriction.
Race traits (not racial traits/characteristics, but trait/'half-feats'):
- Are restricted to members of that race.
- Can be selected with the Adopted trait.
Non-race/non-social traits (trait/'half-feats') that are restricted by race:
- Are restricted to members of that race.
- Can be selected with the Adopted trait.
Social traits (trait/'half-feats') that are restricted by race:
- Are restricted to members of that race.
- Cannot be selected with the Adopted trait, as Adopted is also a social trait.
Religion traits/feats:
- Are restricted to members of that religion.
- Character must be within one alignment step of the deity or philosophy (e.g. CG/CN/CG for Desna).
- Characters can only select resticted options of a single religion (e.g. cannot select Lessons of Chaldira trait (religion: Chaldira) and Butterfly Sting feat (Desna).
Regional traits/feats:
- Are restricted to members of that region.
- Characters can only select restricted options of a single region.
- However, very few options are region-restricted other than regional traits.
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Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville
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Clarification there, the Gnome traits can be taken by Adopted according to the PFS clarification doc. It is an exception to the social trait limit that is normally in place. To my knowledge, this is the only place (Gnomes of Golorian) that the Traits are divided up in this way.
Also, no one can take anything from the book Goblins of Golorian without a Goblin boon. Racial Heritage or Adopted does not get past this. (It is the same wording, I believe, as the ARG)
So, here is the question I have. Other than the ARG and Goblins book, can Racial Heritage allow a Human (Or human equivalent) to take feats/traits/resources from race not normally allowed. Can we still access Tiefling and Aasimar resources in this way?