You can drop Renwed Vigor, it's practically worthless. Unexpected Strike would be a much better rage power if you were going to keep that as a rage power, or you could covert it into a feat (you would need to probably move around when you selected some rage powers though). I would select Improved Critical just so you didn't have to have keen on your weapon. That saves you money that allows you to do other things.
I would also ditch the Boots of Swift fury. Moving 10ft faster is kind of cool, but the deflection bonus against AoO from moving through threatened squares really isn't that good. And as I stated you can just buy a couple pairs of Boots of Speed. Each pair grants you 10 rounds of haste per day, and haste gives you 30ft movement speed bonus, a +1 to attack and AC, and gain an extra attacking. Removing the need for Speed on your weapon.
Which by the way, the cost difference between a +5 weapon and a +5 speed weapon is 78,000 gold. Which is enough to buy 6 pairs of boots of speed. 60 rounds of haste per day would probably way more than you need.
Oh, and as you continued to enhance the weapon the effective saving just continues to increase. It also enables you to put other enhancements on the weapon instead of "wasting the space" with a +3 enhancement that is better done with multiple pairs of shoes.
Thank you, thank you and thank you. I'll clean this up shortly. :)
Ok, sheet adjusted. At level 17 he has only Furious on his Nodachi +5. The Keen is replaced at that level with Improved Critical, and the Boots of Speed replaced Boots of Swift Fury (same level). I moved feats around to give Unexpected Strike the Rage level after he gets CaGM (good combination).
What I need now though, is the best way to upgrade the Nodachi since he has Improved Critical and Boots of Speed. Recommendations? He can take up to +4 in special abilities still.
Also anything -important- for DPR to take in magic items, or is it safe to play from level 18+ with making sure he can do things like fly? (I really never play such a high level, so am no expert on high level gear)
Primary hand and off-hand don't refer to 'hands' except in the metaphorical sense.
So, you can't use iterative attacks as primary and secondary attacks and still take natural attacks unless you've extra primary limbs (like a marilith), and even then takes a feat (Multiattack, Improved Multiattack).
In short, you're going Natural attacks with your right and left hands, or you're going UA TWF with your right and left hands, 'regardless' if you flavor them as kicks.
That's how the rules now stand. Generally, the natural attacks at -2 each are better early then the iteratives.
However, for Come and get me...2h Weapon all the way for returning AoO's.
Make sure you take the natural armor rage power to offset your plunging AC. It actually won't change that much if you do.
And don't forget Witch hUnter for free damage against spellcasters.
==Aelryinth
Hey all...love barbarian threads. Trinams guide has a good base for a invulnerable rager come and get me build. We spent a lot of time on the thread discussing the ins and outs of different rage powers that came with Ult Combat.
One thing that has not been mentioned yet but is very potent.
Dazing assault
Take a -5 to all attacks that rnd to apply a Dazing effect (Fort DC = 10 +BAB) to every attack. This includes on your turn AND on your AoO.
So as a Come and Get Me Barbarian, every time the enemy attacks you, you get an AoO. With dazing assault you apply a daze save to each AoO. The -5 to hit isn't a big deal because each AoO is at full BAB. If the enemy fails the save they are dazed and their turn is prematurely ended. You have thus mitigated a huge amount of damage. On your turn you can then full attack, apply more save vs daze, and keep the enemy daze locked until dead.
Aelryinth: All your suggestions are already in the posted build, however thank you anyway for confirmation. :)
Lab_Rat, Dazing Assault is his 17th level feat. I agree, seems like a good Rage Power. :)
Aelryinth: All your suggestions are already in the posted build, however thank you anyway for confirmation. :)
Lab_Rat, Dazing Assault is his 17th level feat. I agree, seems like a good Rage Power. :)
I would try to get it at 11 if you can. Its that good in combo with come and get me.
Dazing Assault can be good, but I feel I never had a lot of success with the save DC. But when it does work it's incredible.
If you're really wanting to help Dazing Assault to function, you may consider not using power attack on a round, while still using reckless abandon. This raises your attack by 5, negating the penalty from using the feat and your more after the dazing effect than damage at that point. Making 5 attacks at a DC 30 fort save or be unable to act would be pretty awesome.
Edit: Actually, I just looked it up. The average fort save of CR 20 creatures is 23. So you they only fail 30% of the time. Of course, a 30% failure rate 5 times equates to about a 95% chance to fail 1 of the saves.
I would try to get it at 11 if you can. Its that good in combo with come and get me.Aelryinth: All your suggestions are already in the posted build, however thank you anyway for confirmation. :)
Lab_Rat, Dazing Assault is his 17th level feat. I agree, seems like a good Rage Power. :)
You're welcome to look at the sheet and tell me what should be rearranged to fit it in. :P I'm dry on feat slots and rage power slots.
I would try to get it at 11 if you can. Its that good in combo with come and get me.Aelryinth: All your suggestions are already in the posted build, however thank you anyway for confirmation. :)
Lab_Rat, Dazing Assault is his 17th level feat. I agree, seems like a good Rage Power. :)
You're welcome to look at the sheet and tell me what should be rearranged to fit it in. :P I'm dry on feat slots and rage power slots.
You could probably loose Quick Reflexes. You have a high enough dex (at least at high levels, didn't look at all levels) that 1 extra attack of opportunity probably wont make or break anything.
I would try to get it at 11 if you can. Its that good in combo with come and get me.Aelryinth: All your suggestions are already in the posted build, however thank you anyway for confirmation. :)
Lab_Rat, Dazing Assault is his 17th level feat. I agree, seems like a good Rage Power. :)
You're welcome to look at the sheet and tell me what should be rearranged to fit it in. :P I'm dry on feat slots and rage power slots.
I would put off the quick reflexes rage power. You can always buy that extra attack with an enhancement bonus to dex.
Thanks, Done.
PS. Any advise/suggestions on Weapon Specials for the upper levels? Holy was mentioned, as well as adding a pair of Deliquescent Gloves. Was intending to do both at level 18, just need another 90k worth of things to buy. :P
you could go for the scabbard that gives you Bane for a few rounds per day.
In fact. I am not sure an extra AoO is worth a rage power. I would be looking at other rage powers such as eater of magic for the ability to re-roll your failed saving throws and on a successful re-roll gain temp hp.
Dazing Assault can be good, but I feel I never had a lot of success with the save DC. But when it does work it's incredible.
If you're really wanting to help Dazing Assault to function, you may consider not using power attack on a round, while still using reckless abandon. This raises your attack by 5, negating the penalty from using the feat and you're more after the dazing effect than damage at that point. Making 5 attacks at a DC 30 fort save or be unable to act would be pretty awesome.
Edit: Actually, I just looked it up some statistics. The average fort save of CR 20 creatures is 23. So they only fail 30% of the time. Of course, a 30% failure rate 5 times equates to about a 83% chance to fail 1 of the saves.
Edited for grammar and correctness. Don't know how I calculated that value earlier, but it was wrong.
If I've done my calculations correctly, the probability is as follows number of attacks (assuming successful hits) in left column and chance the enemy fails the save:
1 30.00%
2 51.00%
3 65.70%
4 75.99%
5 83.19%
6 88.24%
7 91.76%
8 94.24%
Probability I believe should be calculated in this instance as 1-(0.7^x)*100%, where x is the number of attacks that successfully hit. The probability they succeed on any given saves is 70%, but the chance that they succeed on a series of saves becomes .7^x. The probability that they fail is 1- the probability of success.
I would disagree strongly about putting any or all elemental enchants on a weapon. At 20th level, they're nearly worthless.
A large swathe of enemies at such high level will be immune or have energy resistance of at least 5, meaning that those extra damage dice will only deal actual damage on a roll of 6 (and even then dealing only 1 damage). It's actually a very ineffective method.
Right, take the extra damage that fits the flavor of the campaign. If I know I'm fighting White dragons I'm going to use a flaming/dragon bane weapon.
My point is that more damage can be squeezed into the build by adding the full +10 to the sword. We are talking about level 20.
you could go for the scabbard that gives you Bane for a few rounds per day.
Could not find such a scabbard. :/
In fact. I am not sure an extra AoO is worth a rage power. I would be looking at other rage powers such as eater of magic for the ability to re-roll your failed saving throws and on a successful re-roll gain temp hp.
Done.
I made a ragebred barbarian for a for thread, his DPR at 20 was 1600 or so, not bad.
Wouldn't mind seeing it, but I can't use it since I'm restricting myself to rules found on the paizo prd.
Also spent all but +1 on my weapon (+5 with +2 Holy, +1 Fortuitious, +1 Furious), as well as "wasting" gold on a +5 Amulet of Mighty Fists for his natural attacks he's unlikely to use (but good for a backup). I think we're done on building this. Moving on to Cavalier next. :)
I'm going outside the box: Savage Technologist with an Adaptable Composite Longbow.
+X/+X STR and DEX, most the best barbarian rage powers are not melee based, And suddenly your level 13 turn is firings hail of arrows with rapid shot/manyshot and then using snap shot and ridiculous DEX with Combat Reflexes returning all attacks against you.
Well Tom, I'd be interested in seeing a build, but I really don't know much about Technology in pathfinder, it's a book I've avoided...
you could go for the scabbard that gives you Bane for a few rounds per day.Could not find such a scabbard. :/
Bane Baldric, 10k, got it. :)
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Also spent all but +1 on my weapon (+5 with +2 Holy, +1 Fortuitious, +1 Furious), as well as "wasting" gold on a +5 Amulet of Mighty Fists for his natural attacks he's unlikely to use (but good for a backup). I think we're done on building this. Moving on to Cavalier next. :)
Why not a +3 furious amulet of mighty fists with another +1 worth of abilities on it? Also make it dueling for 14k more for a permanent +4 to your initiative (may be subject to your GM depending on your natural weapons and how he interprets "drawn and in hand").
Good idea, about adding Furious and reducing the plus. I should probably add Dueling to both the Amulet and Nodachi.
Just go Ragebreed unchained barbarian, preferably with the invulnerable rager archetype.
For the build, pick up the Beast totem line, aAnimal fury, Accurate stance and whatever else you may want. Get Extra feature as your first feat and then power attack.
The ragebreeds are a variant of the skinwalkers race, and are essentially distant cousins of the were-boars. You can shapeshift several times a day getting extra +2Con and an animal feature. With the extra feature feat you get two, which will be a gore attack and 2 hoof attacks.
The Animal fury nets you a bite attack, and the Lesser beast totem brings 2 claws to the table (With an additional claw once you have haste avaliable, either by the wizard or some item).
So, by level 3 you are doing a full-round of 6 attacks. Fast-foward to 10th level when you get Pounce via the Greater totem, and you just got the I win botton.
Procure a Furious Amulet of Mighty Fist as fast as you can, and now all your attacks are magical. Past that, is just icing the cake.
Sample build:
Race: Skinwalker Boarkin (Ragebreed)
Character Traits: Indomitable, Reactionary
Abilities (20p/buy)
S16+2 D14 c15 I10 W10+2 C8-2
Class: Unchained Barbarian (Invulnerable Rager) 12
*FCB: HP
1 - Fast movement, Rage, Extra Feature
2 - Rage power (Beast Totem, Lesser), Invulnerability
3 - Extreme Endurance, Power Attack
4 - Rage power (Animal Fury), +1 CON
5 - Extra Rage power (Superstition)
6 - Rage Power (Savage Dirty Trick)
7 - Extra Rage power (Beast Totem)
8 - Rage Power (Accurate Stance), +1 STR
9 - Extra Rage power (Clear Mind)
10 - Rage power (Beast Totem, Greater)
11 - Greater Rage, Extra Rage Power (Internal Fortitude)
12 - Rage Power (Sharpened Accuracy), +1 STR
Not sure anyone mention this:
Raging Brutality
You expend some of your rage to strike your opponents with a more powerful weapon blow.
Prerequisite: Str 13, rage class feature, Power Attack, base attack bonus +12.
Benefit: While raging and using Power Attack, you can spend 3 additional rounds of your rage as a swift action to add your Constitution bonus on damage rolls for melee attacks or thrown weapon attacks you make on your turn. If you are using the weapon two-handed, instead add 1-1/2 times your Constitution bonus. This bonus damage is not multiplied on a critical hit.
Note does not work with Come and Get Me...
Selecting a human and then spending a feat to get racial heritage is a waste, because the things humans really get are the extra skill point per level and the feat (and in this case the FCB). Half-orc gets access to orc feats without needing Racial Heritage, gets access to Human Barbarian FCB. So you're missing out on the +1 skill point per level, but you get other bonuses like darkvision and the ability to pick up a bite as a trait.
Not to mention that if you want the extra skill point/level, Half-Orcs have two different racial substitution options for getting it (Trading away either darkvision, or Ferocity and Weapon Familiarity).
Just keep in mind that the most powerful possible build generally entails having the weakest possible will saves.
Ghost Rager was mentioned earlier. The bonus it adds to touch AC is equal to the one given by superstitition without the FCB boost (so max +7). Also, it explicitly says touch AC cannot exceed regular AC. It's still nice, especially with Ghost Touch on all melee attacks.
I think the ability may have been changed since this thread started (over a year ago) because when I read the current ability now it makes no mention of Superstition, but does mention your touch AC can't exceed your regular AC.
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Ghost Rager was mentioned earlier. The bonus it adds to touch AC is equal to the one given by superstitition without the FCB boost (so max +7). Also, it explicitly says touch AC cannot exceed regular AC. It's still nice, especially with Ghost Touch on all melee attacks.I think the ability may have been changed since this thread started (over a year ago) because when I read the current ability now it makes no mention of Superstition, but does mention your touch AC can't exceed your regular AC.
Hmm, odd. I guess they updated it in the last printing of Ultimate Combat, whenever that was.
My copy and Archives of Nethys lists Superstition as a requirement still, but d20 and the PRD does not.
Funnily enough Unchained Ghost Rager still requires Superstition though.
Just keep in mind that the most powerful possible build generally entails having the weakest possible will saves.
Whatchu talking about? The most powerful possible build gets not only the scaling will save boost from rage and doesn't dump WIS, it gets superstition plus human FCB for a really insane bonus against all magic.
Just keep in mind that the most powerful possible build generally entails having the weakest possible will saves.Whatchu talking about? The most powerful possible build gets not only the scaling will save boost from rage and doesn't dump WIS, it gets superstition plus human FCB for a really insane bonus against all magic.
Technically, it may not be the highest damage build.
I haven't done the math for the human superstitious, greater beast totem, come and get me barbarian versus one that focuses on maximizing damage from natural attacks. The natural attack barbarian may deal more damage, but the other barbarian will deal a ton of damage, has good defenses against magic, dissuades enemies from attacking him thanks to come and get me (or obliterates them).
It is a great build.
Superstition is one rage power though. Almost any build can accommodate it,even if they don't want spell sundering. And most optimized builds probably should.
A natural attack based build with Elemental Blood, Elemental Rage, Lesser and Elemental Rage is likely going to have the highest DPR of any build at level 10. You can probably even afford superstition for such a build.
Oddly enough a TWF dagger chucking Savage Technologist which utilizes some of the new Rage Powers from Villain Codex is a close second. This approach has the advantage that it can full attack in both melee and at range. The hurler Archetype and a handy 100 GP item from ACG ensure that you have 40 range without attack penalties. However such a build has to really milk it's point buy and go for something like:
17 17 12 10 12 7
Also such a build is dependent on specific items and benefits from moving into Ulfen Guard.