BLASTER CASTER BLAST!


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


Ok, so we all know how people say blasters are "weak" when it comes to caster roles.

Well sisters and brothers, we are here to prove them wrong! The we will discuss the power of blasters and different builds that maximize the efficiency of blasting. Bonus points for also maintaining versatility while being a powerful blaster.

After all, the "god wizard" can go and cast all the spells he wants to manipulate the battlefield, but at the end of the turn, the monster is still alive, where as a blaster can lay down a few spells and just end the problem without much hassle xD.


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Check out Brewer's Guide to the Blockbuster Wizard. The major points are:

- Between cheapened Metamagic (Magical Lineage and Wayang Spellhunter traits) and a one-level dip in Crossblooded Sorcerer, the direct damage becomes worthwhile.

- Be an Evocation (Admixture) Wizard so your Fireballs can be changed to whatever element you need, when you need it.

- Preferred Spell means you can prepare all the utility spells, and trade them out for Fireballs with whatever Metamagic you need, as needed.

- Heighten Spell is a prerequisite for Preferred Spell, and is still useful for raising DCs and piercing Globes of Invulnerability.

- Dazing Spell means your Fireballs are now battlefield control spells too. Persistent Spell requires them to successfully save twice.

- Spell Perfection is broken, you should get it at 15.

- Fireball is the spell of choice. Large radius, long range, eligible for Admixture, good base damage, low base spell level. It targets Reflex saves, which are most enemies' weak save.

- Take Selective Spell so you don't hut your teammates.

- The character is a very compelling argument for PF -not- being backwards-compatible with 3.5. Imagine all of the above, plus Twin Spell, Energy Admixture, and even more metamagic cheapeners like Arcane Thesis and the Incantatrix PRC.


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It's not that they're "weak", its just that they're "inefficient". Make no mistake you'll make non-casters cry with your damage, but if you have a bunch of dudes with swords lying around (or that summoned you up yourself), it much more efficient to just cripple the enemy and let them clean up.


Anzyr wrote:
It's not that they're "weak", its just that they're "inefficient". Make no mistake you'll make non-casters cry with your damage, but if you have a bunch of dudes with swords lying around (or that summoned you up yourself), it much more efficient to just cripple the enemy and let them clean up.

The question is though, is it really more efficient? You can cast 3 spells to manipulate the battlefield/buff/debuff or you can drop 3 stupid powered fireballs with goblin wardrums and just kind of decimate the enemy. Idk, it seems to me that blasting the enemy into smitherines kinda skips the whole requirement of depending on your tanks to kill them after weakening them xD. Just me though :p


Anzyr wrote:
It's not that they're "weak", its just that they're "inefficient". Make no mistake you'll make non-casters cry with your damage, but if you have a bunch of dudes with swords lying around (or that summoned you up yourself), it much more efficient to just cripple the enemy and let them clean up.

This is the type of statement that shows a lack of experience playing high level martials versus high level casters. Damage is something casters cannot do as well as martial no matter how they are built.

I've played a blaster sorcerer to lvl 18. The only time you make non-casters cry with your damage is when you're set up for AoE. You do not touch martials single target. You can take out a big bunch of enemies like no one else. Blasters crush everyone for AoE damage and effectiveness. I made the save or suck wizards look like a joke.

You don't really need to be an Evoker. Cross-blooded sorcerer is better in my opinion. Spontaneous casting is superior to prepared casting for evocation. You only need two types of energy to hit just about everything.

The new ruling is that evocation bonus from Intense Spells is not modified by Empower Spell. The same rule by RAW does not appear to apply to Bloodline Arcana.

Cross-blooded sorcerer is the master of Blasting. You also aren't limited to Evocation blaster spells as a sorcerer. Caustic Eruption with Project Image is a superior option to most ranged evocation at high levels. The superior number of spell slots also helps.

You won't do more single target damage than a martial.

I do suggest creating a staff with utility spells you use most often, so you don't have to waste slots on non-damage spell. Project image being the main one, if you're doing the Caustic Eruption build.


Blasting works really well. It is neither weak nor inefficient.
It might not be the most optimal option out there, since it require extensive specialization, but it is certainly viable.

I prefer sorcerer blaster. While Wizards (at some point, and with a sorcerer dip) can win a numbers comparison, it is going to take a while before they can spam their chosen spell and have other options.

Blaster sorcerers can be pretty versatile, since they only depend on a couple of spells for combat (primarily one, but a couple of other when it doesn't work). This leaves them plenty of spells known for utility and buff spells.

Shadow Lodge

I don't usually play this type of character, but I did try one for Dragon's Demand. I made a pyromaniac gnome sorcerer crossblooded elemental/draconic. It's fun for a low level game, I would never play it for high level. You lose a lot of versatility going this route, and that is a good thing. Let the martials have something man, if you can do more damage and still have all the situational versatility you become the bull in the proverbial china shop, stomping all over everyone's fun and taking up too much space.

All my gnome could do was throw "fireballs" (snowballs that dealt fire damage) and make some illusions, but that was plenty to have a good time. The reason to play a blaster caster IMO is to fulfil the urge to roll lots dice.

1st level gnome, pyromaniac race trait, gifted adept trait (snowball), elemental bloodline fire/draconic. PB shot. 3d6+4 is kindof overkill at first level. I mostly just shot the bloodline power fire rays for 1d6+2.


Blasting is inefficient resource use for single-target attacking. That is the majority of BBEG encounters. You can always throw a few good single-target spells like enervation or prediction of failure on your list to set up single targets. It can be good fun to be the master of group trash destruction.


Intense Spells isn't the main draw of Evocation, the Admixture ability and faster casting progression are. Sorcerers are already a level behind Wizards, Crossblooded are another level behind other Sorcerers.

And you still have the Wizard's main advantage of knowing all the good spells. Full Crossblooded is even weaker in that area than a normal Sorcerer. Preferred Spell means you aren't giving up any Wizard utility.

When you go Admixture Wizard and take the Crossblooded dip, the Will save penalty is canceled out by the +2 from the Sorcerer level. Your caster progression is only slowed to that of a regular Sorcerer. Preferred Spell gives you all the spontaneity you need, and won't increase your casting times. You get more bonus feats, and they can be any Metamagic or Item Creation feats, not a choice from a mostly mediocre list.

On top of all that, Intelligence is a superior stat to Charisma.


Raith Shadar wrote:
Anzyr wrote:
It's not that they're "weak", its just that they're "inefficient". Make no mistake you'll make non-casters cry with your damage, but if you have a bunch of dudes with swords lying around (or that summoned you up yourself), it much more efficient to just cripple the enemy and let them clean up.

This is the type of statement that shows a lack of experience playing high level martials versus high level casters. Damage is something casters cannot do as well as martial no matter how they are built.

I've played a blaster sorcerer to lvl 18. The only time you make non-casters cry with your damage is when you're set up for AoE. You do not touch martials single target. You can take out a big bunch of enemies like no one else. Blasters crush everyone for AoE damage and effectiveness. I made the save or suck wizards look like a joke.

You don't really need to be an Evoker. Cross-blooded sorcerer is better in my opinion. Spontaneous casting is superior to prepared casting for evocation. You only need two types of energy to hit just about everything.

The new ruling is that evocation bonus from Intense Spells is not modified by Empower Spell. The same rule by RAW does not appear to apply to Bloodline Arcana.

Cross-blooded sorcerer is the master of Blasting. You also aren't limited to Evocation blaster spells as a sorcerer. Caustic Eruption with Project Image is a superior option to most ranged evocation at high levels. The superior number of spell slots also helps.

You won't do more single target damage than a martial.

I do suggest creating a staff with utility spells you use most often, so you don't have to waste slots on non-damage spell. Project image being the main one, if you're doing the Caustic Eruption build.

Actually a Wizard makes a much better blaster. WIth a single dip into sorcerer to get crossblooded to get the Orc and Dragon Arcana's you get some nasty damage bonuses. With bonus feats you can nab up the meta-magic feats to push evo wizards into powerhouses. Additionally, with preferred spell you can effectively be a psuedo-spontanious caster with your blast spells.

The big question though is how Arcanists stand up to Sorcerers and Wizards in the blasting front since they are the supposed masters of Meta-magic and have some fun abilities to really screw with the whole meta-magic things. Additionally, they have some fun flavorful abilities that can really drive home the whole "Master of X element thing" (catchings on fire or such is really funny).

Shadow Lodge

Athaleon wrote:

Intense Spells isn't the main draw of Evocation, the Admixture ability and faster casting progression are. Sorcerers are already a level behind Wizards, Crossblooded are another level behind other Sorcerers.

And you still have the Wizard's main advantage of knowing all the good spells. Full Crossblooded is even weaker in that area than a normal Sorcerer. Preferred Spell means you aren't giving up any Wizard utility.

When you go Admixture Wizard and take the Crossblooded dip, the Will save penalty is canceled out by the +2 from the Sorcerer level. Your caster progression is only slowed to that of a regular Sorcerer. Preferred Spell gives you all the spontaneity you need, and won't increase your casting times. You get more bonus feats, and they can be any Metamagic or Item Creation feats, not a choice from a mostly mediocre list.

On top of all that, Intelligence is a superior stat to Charisma.

If you're looking for ways to dominate the game, then yeah, that's a wiz not a sorc.

The reason to go sorc is you get more casts of your snowball, more consistency to be able to attack over and over. It's the attempt to replicate the 3rd edition Warlock. I look at the blaster as wanting to fry people, not wanting to be a spellcaster.


I do miss the 3.5 warlock!

It was so awesome being able to just blast. TO blow things to smithers and be awesome looking while doing it. xD


Oh, and the Wizard gets a Familiar, which the Crossblodded Sorcerer does not (unless he took Arcane as one of his bloodlines, in which case he's losing out on damage).

Give your Familiar a few Fireballs of his own via Familiar Spell. For a round or three a day, you can potentially nova with four Fireballs per round. Now we're cooking with gas.


Athaleon wrote:
Intense Spells isn't the main draw of Evocation, the Admixture ability and faster casting progression are. Sorcerers are already a level behind Wizards, Crossblooded are another level behind other Sorcerers.

This is a common misunderstanding.

Crossblooded are not a spell level behind, the are a spell known behind. For a blaster this doesn't matter much, since they are going to be using their spell slots for metamagic'ed spells anyway.


Hahaha. So another question. Can you really make a blaster when you are a divine caster?


HaraldKlak wrote:
Athaleon wrote:
Intense Spells isn't the main draw of Evocation, the Admixture ability and faster casting progression are. Sorcerers are already a level behind Wizards, Crossblooded are another level behind other Sorcerers.

This is a common misunderstanding.

Crossblooded are not a spell level behind, the are a spell known behind. For a blaster this doesn't matter much, since they are going to be using their spell slots for metamagic'ed spells anyway.

It's practically the same thing. While the Crossblooded Sorcerer can only use those three slots for metamagic versions of a lower spell level, the Wizard with the Crossblooded dip has three "real" slots (two base plus one bonus Evocation) for that spell level, at the same level. One level earlier he had one slot + one bonus Evocation.


Raith Shadar wrote:
Anzyr wrote:
It's not that they're "weak", its just that they're "inefficient". Make no mistake you'll make non-casters cry with your damage, but if you have a bunch of dudes with swords lying around (or that summoned you up yourself), it much more efficient to just cripple the enemy and let them clean up.

This is the type of statement that shows a lack of experience playing high level martials versus high level casters. Damage is something casters cannot do as well as martial no matter how they are built.

I've played a blaster sorcerer to lvl 18. The only time you make non-casters cry with your damage is when you're set up for AoE. You do not touch martials single target. You can take out a big bunch of enemies like no one else. Blasters crush everyone for AoE damage and effectiveness. I made the save or suck wizards look like a joke.

You don't really need to be an Evoker. Cross-blooded sorcerer is better in my opinion. Spontaneous casting is superior to prepared casting for evocation. You only need two types of energy to hit just about everything.

The new ruling is that evocation bonus from Intense Spells is not modified by Empower Spell. The same rule by RAW does not appear to apply to Bloodline Arcana.

Cross-blooded sorcerer is the master of Blasting. You also aren't limited to Evocation blaster spells as a sorcerer. Caustic Eruption with Project Image is a superior option to most ranged evocation at high levels. The superior number of spell slots also helps.

You won't do more single target damage than a martial.

I do suggest creating a staff with utility spells you use most often, so you don't have to waste slots on non-damage spell. Project image being the main one, if you're doing the Caustic Eruption build.

Considering casters can move and drop not one but 2 blast spells are turn, I think you may want to rethink that. And while yes I was taking into account more then one target (because why would your spell only have 1 target? No seriously, Kipp I'm asking you a question.), unless you have Pounce or another way to move full attack, realistically your martial is going to be a sad damage panda next to a caster.


Damage with a blaster is inefficient. If you are going to do a blaster, it is best to mix in some combat control.

Wall of Fire = the balls.

Obviously an Admixture Evoker is the way to go. If you want to crossblood for good DPR I guess that's fine, but you don't really care about doing damage, you care about having wide area effects that cripple multiple enemies before your melee team gets in there to wack 'em down.

Initiative is the most important combat statistic, over AC and saves.

Rime Spell and Dazing Spell are your friends.

I agree with Spontaneous Fireballs, though taking Spell Focus Evoc. and Spell Specialization (Fireball) is not a bad idea. Intensified Spell, and eventually taking Greater Spell Specialization could prove to be more feat efficient than Preferred Spell, but Preferred Spell can be taken sooner, and is overall better because of casting time involved.


It's not really more feat-efficient. You will need Heightened Spell when Globes of Invulnerability start appearing, and it's handy during critical moments when you want to raise the save DC as high as possible.


Athaleon wrote:
It's not really more feat-efficient. You will need Heightened Spell when Globes of Invulnerability start appearing, and it's handy during critical moments when you want to raise the save DC as high as possible.

A blaster is likely to have Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus anyway, regardless of whether he is going the Preferred or Greater Specialization route. I agree though that Preferred is better.


I have a few comments on the Sorcerer vs. Wizard question:

First of all, in terms of blasting damage, the sorcerer clearly wins over the wizard.

Yes, as the proposed wizard builds actually is, a wizard/sorcerer can out damage a pure sorcerer. The drawback is that it takes a while to do what the sorcerer can. You can't get Greater Spell Specialization until lvl 10 (due to the lvl dip) if taking that route, and choosing Preferred spell set you behind the sorcerer in feats until the very late levels. Feats that are used to boost the blasting.

And even then, multiclassing works just fine for a blaster when looking at it at a fixed point in time. Since you are focusing on lower level spells (with a cl cap), you might as well be a sorcerer/wizard/oracle for some extra damage, or take some rogue+arcane trickster levels for that boost. Of course, this comes with drawbacks that make the choices loose appeal.


Anzyr wrote:
It's not that they're "weak", its just that they're "inefficient". Make no mistake you'll make non-casters cry with your damage, but if you have a bunch of dudes with swords lying around (or that summoned you up yourself), it much more efficient to just cripple the enemy and let them clean up.

Cripple them like takign 50%-75% of their HPs so the party member kill them quickly?

WHy the god wizard have/need help but witht he blaster wizard the help from the party mebmers get never accounterd?


master_marshmallow wrote:
Athaleon wrote:
It's not really more feat-efficient. You will need Heightened Spell when Globes of Invulnerability start appearing, and it's handy during critical moments when you want to raise the save DC as high as possible.
A blaster is likely to have Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus anyway, regardless of whether he is going the Preferred or Greater Specialization route. I agree though that Preferred is better.

One advantage to Greater Spell Specialization is the option to change which spell it boosts by exchanging the Spell Specialization, and potentially get several, if you choose the first feat for more than one spell.


HaraldKlak wrote:

I have a few comments on the Sorcerer vs. Wizard question:

First of all, in terms of blasting damage, the sorcerer clearly wins over the wizard.

Yes, as the proposed wizard builds actually is, a wizard/sorcerer can out damage a pure sorcerer. The drawback is that it takes a while to do what the sorcerer can. You can't get Greater Spell Specialization until lvl 10 (due to the lvl dip) if taking that route, and choosing Preferred spell set you behind the sorcerer in feats until the very late levels. Feats that are used to boost the blasting.

And even then, multiclassing works just fine for a blaster when looking at it at a fixed point in time. Since you are focusing on lower level spells (with a cl cap), you might as well be a sorcerer/wizard/oracle for some extra damage, or take some rogue+arcane trickster levels for that boost. Of course, this comes with drawbacks that make the choices loose appeal.

Except Wizards also get bonus feats, and they have their Arcane Discoveries, of which sorcerers don't get. Things like Split Slot, Fast Study, and Opposition Research the wizard is actually capable of quite a bit. Oh! And remember, the Wizard also gets his specialization abilities.


So where would you guys put the Arcanist in the blasting potential? They seem weird sicne they can potentially have 1 Arcana and are VERY good at meta-magic.


K177Y C47 wrote:


Except Wizards also get bonus feats, and they have their Arcane Discoveries, of which sorcerers don't get. Things like Split Slot, Fast Study, and Opposition Research the wizard is actually capable of quite a bit. Oh! And remember, the Wizard also gets his specialization abilities.

Well, as far as wizard/sorcerer-dip go, they get bonus feats at lvls 5, 11, and 16. The sorcerer get bloodline feats at 7, 13, and 19, although only one of them is adding directly to the blasting power. Even then, it takes the wizard to lvl 11 or 16, before he has extra feats to 'pay' for the feat(s) required to cast spontaneously. Before this, he is going to have less feats than the sorcerer to spend on other things.

Just to be clear, I am not saying that the sorcerer is better than wizard. Neither am I saying that going all out on blasting, and spending every feat there, is the most efficient choice.
But since the 'Admix Wiz is superior to Sorc in blasting' is quite common, I believe it is important to have in mind that it doesn't work well until mid to high levels, and that it require significant investments.

Shadow Lodge

so.. I kept thinking about the trying to be a warlock thing. so here goes:

trying to be a warlock
crossblooded draconic gold/elemental fire
gnome pyromancer alternate race trait +1CL w/fire spells
gifted adept trait (snowball)

1-pb, 3-precise, 5-intensify spell, 7-empower spell, 9 maximise spell
snowball
level-spells/day (not counting bonuses for high ability score)
1- 3/day @3d6+4
2- 4/day @4d6+5
3-5/day @5d6+6
4- 9/day @5d6+6
5- 6/day @5d6+6, 2nd 3/day level slot 7d6+8
6- 6/day @5d6+6, 7/day @8d6+9
7- 6/day @5d6+6, 9/day @9d6+10
8- 6/day @5d6+6, 11/day@ 10d6+11, 3/day @(10d6+11)*1.5
9- 6/day @5d6+6, 12/day@ 10d6+11, 4/day @(10d6+11)*1.5
10- 6/day @5d6+6, 12/day@ 10d6+11, 8/day @(10d6+11)*1.5

it's not unlimited uses, but it's a fair amount. Plus you get the elemental ray 3+cha/day which is good at low levels.


K177Y C47 wrote:
Anzyr wrote:
It's not that they're "weak", its just that they're "inefficient". Make no mistake you'll make non-casters cry with your damage, but if you have a bunch of dudes with swords lying around (or that summoned you up yourself), it much more efficient to just cripple the enemy and let them clean up.
The question is though, is it really more efficient? You can cast 3 spells to manipulate the battlefield/buff/debuff or you can drop 3 stupid powered fireballs with goblin wardrums and just kind of decimate the enemy. Idk, it seems to me that blasting the enemy into smitherines kinda skips the whole requirement of depending on your tanks to kill them after weakening them xD. Just me though :p

If you know what you're doing, you only need one spell.


Athaleon wrote:
It's not really more feat-efficient. You will need Heightened Spell when Globes of Invulnerability start appearing, and it's handy during critical moments when you want to raise the save DC as high as possible.

I have never yet seen anyone cast Globe of Invulnerability, whether PC or NPC as it is widely considered globe of being stationary and therefore dead.


HaraldKlak wrote:
Blasting works really well. It is neither weak nor inefficient.

Yes, it really is. Unless you are extremely specialised in blasting then the damage you produce comes nowhere close to being encounter relevant at APL+2. This is an artefact of damage caps from 2e AD&D being retained while monster HP inflated massively at the start of 3e as monsters were given actual statistics and therefore got HD related Con bonuses.

Having said that if you do heavily specialise in blasting then you can put out damage which makes a smiting Paladin Archer cry and to every enemy on the battlefield rather than just one and you are still a full caster.


gnoams wrote:
If you're looking for ways to dominate the game, then yeah, that's a wiz not a sorc.

You are kidding yes? Sorcerer and Oracle are both capable of breaking the game wide open as easily as Wizard, Cleric, Druid or Witch, easier if Paragon Surge is in play.


Athaleon wrote:

Intense Spells isn't the main draw of Evocation, the Admixture ability and faster casting progression are. Sorcerers are already a level behind Wizards, Crossblooded are another level behind other Sorcerers.

And you still have the Wizard's main advantage of knowing all the good spells. Full Crossblooded is even weaker in that area than a normal Sorcerer. Preferred Spell means you aren't giving up any Wizard utility.

When you go Admixture Wizard and take the Crossblooded dip, the Will save penalty is canceled out by the +2 from the Sorcerer level. Your caster progression is only slowed to that of a regular Sorcerer. Preferred Spell gives you all the spontaneity you need, and won't increase your casting times. You get more bonus feats, and they can be any Metamagic or Item Creation feats, not a choice from a mostly mediocre list.

On top of all that, Intelligence is a superior stat to Charisma.

I've played both of these classes. The wizard to lvl 9. The sorcerer to lvl 18.

Admixture is over-rated. You usually only need two types of energy to do damage, even that second type is rarely used as it reduces your damage bonus from cross-blooded. An evocation wizard has to focus on evocation spells. The big one is he has to memorize his metamagic spells in advance until he gets Greater Spell Specialization or Preferred Spell.

As a pure blaster you don't need much versatility. A cross-blooded sorcerer gets to add metamagic as needed multiple times per day. My build was a Caustic Eruption build using Project Image for delivery. Caustic Eruption is the best damage dealing AoE spell in the game. I prefer that for pure damage.

You are correct that intelligence is a superior stat to charisma. If you desire versatility, then the wizard is better. For pure blaster damage the cross-blooded sorcerer is superior. That is what I was going for.


K177Y C47 wrote:
Hahaha. So another question. Can you really make a blaster when you are a divine caster?

I'm trying this out.

I'm not going for pure blast damage spells. I'm making a holy destroyer. I'm focused on Holy Word. It's the best pure death spell in the game. I found a way to get my caster level 10 levels above my level at least one time a day. I will be able to kill in a single huge holy word blast creature of equal HD or lower. It's going to be interesting if it works.


K177Y C47 wrote:
So where would you guys put the Arcanist in the blasting potential? They seem weird sicne they can potentially have 1 Arcana and are VERY good at meta-magic.

I haven't tried a blaster arcanist yet. If you have a very loose DM, you could make a nasty blaster arcanist.

1 level dip into Orc/Wild-blooded Primal Elemental cross-blooded.

Arcanist Exploit Draconic Bloodline and Evocation school.

That would be +3 points per die for one type of energy and up to +9 for intense spells. At lvl 20 with Empower Spell you would do with your chosen energy spell +90 Bloodline Arcana +9 intense spell +20d6 x 1.5 damage.

99 + 105 = 204 points of average energy damage with an AoE spell. Not too shabby.

Still might be better to build an Arcanist Necromancer using Wail of the Banshee boosted for around 240 to 260 damage AoE or crush people with uber suffocates. But AoE energy damage looks cool. I'm doing the Arcanist Necromancer first. I find the necromancy school very synergistic with the Arcanist. I made my Arcanist a Samsaran, so he can add Destruction and Heal to his spell list. An arcanist that can heal himself is going to be good fun.

To use the wild-blooded option for cross-blooded would require a DM that allowed a little outside the rules mixing. I allow it because it makes sense. I know not every DM would.


Raith Shadar wrote:

I'm trying this out.

I'm not going for pure blast damage spells. I'm making a holy destroyer. I'm focused on Holy Word. It's the best pure death spell in the game. I found a way to get my caster level 10 levels above my level at least one time a day. I will be able to kill in a single huge holy word blast creature of equal HD or lower. It's going to be interesting if it works.

Varisian Tattoo and Spell Specialisation combined with Spell Perfection gives you an always on +6. An Orange Ioun Stone in a Wayfinder gives +0-3. Prayer Beads can add +4 for a period of time.


andreww wrote:
Raith Shadar wrote:

I'm trying this out.

I'm not going for pure blast damage spells. I'm making a holy destroyer. I'm focused on Holy Word. It's the best pure death spell in the game. I found a way to get my caster level 10 levels above my level at least one time a day. I will be able to kill in a single huge holy word blast creature of equal HD or lower. It's going to be interesting if it works.

Varisian Tattoo and Spell Specialisation combined with Spell Perfection gives you an always on +6. An Orange Ioun Stone in a Wayfinder gives +0-3. Prayer Beads can add +4 for a period of time.

Yep. With a trait add +1 caster level and I'm making an Aasimar with an alternate racial trait that adds +1 to spells with good descriptor.

Let me see.

Spell Specialization and Spell Perfection +4
Varsian Tattoo with Spell Perfection: +2
Orange Ioun Stone: +1
Trait: +1
Aasimar Trait: +1
Karma Beads: +4 ten minutes a day.

Total: +13 caster level once a day

Even better. It's going to be nasty.


It is really horribly effective. The only issue is that it takes rather a lot of feats to do on a Cleric or Oracle. You pretty much have to have:

Spell Focus
Spell Specialisation
Greater Spell Focus
3 metamagic - probably Quicken, Persistent and one other, Dazing maybe
Spell Perfection
Some way of beating SR. Spell Penetration or maybe Piercing Spell as your third metamagic

I would add Improved Initiative to the list. If you go down the Oracle route then Noble Scion of War on a Lore or Lunar Oracle lets you ignore Dex. Oracles also get to use all of the word spells so you have a back up in case of being stuck fighting good outsiders, such as the evil wizards planar bound minions.


Raith Shadar wrote:

Even better. It's going to be nasty.

One issue it does have is that obviously the main trick doesn't come on line until high level. If playing the character from lower level then check out Burst of Radiance. I have a level 7 Oracle at the moment who gets great mileage out of a Persistent version.


Be sure your party companion are good, since any neutral among them will be istantly killed.


Or pick Selective Spell or buy a greater metamagic Rod of it.

With magical lineage and spell perfection you can easily cast Selective Persistent Holy Word from a level 7 spell slot.

I wouldn't live with magical lineage (holy word) if starting from 1 so you need to either convince your GM too allow some retraining (not currently legal for traits) or pick up yet another feat with Additional Traits.


andreww wrote:
Raith Shadar wrote:

Even better. It's going to be nasty.

One issue it does have is that obviously the main trick doesn't come on line until high level. If playing the character from lower level then check out Burst of Radiance. I have a level 7 Oracle at the moment who gets great mileage out of a Persistent version.

Interesting spell.


Dekalinder wrote:
Be sure your party companion are good, since any neutral among them will be istantly killed.

Now you must ask yourself...does she care.

I'll let the other players know what she is doing in advance. If they choose to be neutral to avoid alignment effects as they almost always do, they suffer the consequences of their choice.

Shadow Lodge

Raith Shadar wrote:
Dekalinder wrote:
Be sure your party companion are good, since any neutral among them will be istantly killed.

Now you must ask yourself...does she care.

I'll let the other players know what she is doing in advance. If they choose to be neutral to avoid alignment effects as they almost always do, they suffer the consequences of their choice.

What is being good if not caring? If she did not care that her actions caused harm to others, then she would not be of good alignment.


gnoams wrote:
Raith Shadar wrote:
Dekalinder wrote:
Be sure your party companion are good, since any neutral among them will be istantly killed.

Now you must ask yourself...does she care.

I'll let the other players know what she is doing in advance. If they choose to be neutral to avoid alignment effects as they almost always do, they suffer the consequences of their choice.

What is being good if not caring? If she did not care that her actions caused harm to others, then she would not be of good alignment.

You seem to think good is much more tolerant than evil. They aren't always. Good people might kill neutral as well as evil folk looking at their death as proof of an unclean soul. In Pathfinder you can prove a person is good by how holy power interacts with them. If they can't withstand it, then proof they aren't on her side.

Good people can be avengers. Her intent is to destroy those that aren't good. If people with her are unclear as to which side they are on, they had better choose in her eyes.

She takes care of people. She teaches them to be good. If they don't take to the lesson, then it's on them. The only time she will be careful is in towns and areas where civilized folk live. If her adventuring companions aren't good, they can take the train. She intends to blast evil with pure holy power. If her companions souls aren't shining with goodness, they will suffer the pain of their equivocation.

This line walking by the neutrals won't be tolerated. Neutral people sit on their ass while evil does what they want as long as it doesn't interfere with their lives or plans. They have no clear moral boundaries. She won't tolerate their lack of action or their overly grey personas. She is GOOD...in capitals. She doesn't understand neutral or evil people, nor does she want to associate with them.

Shadow Lodge

Yes, I do think good is much more tolerant than evil. To be good is to have empathy. To be evil is to have none. Now that's not to say your holy avenger characters don't exist. But they are people whose good nature is being blinded by hatred, and they are slowly slipping into evil. They can be terrific personas to play. They are characters that walk along the very edge of the good spectrum, frequently failing to maintain their balance and plummeting straight to evildom. This was Anakin before he became Darth Vader.

Anyhow, getting wildly off on a tangent.

I was looking more at other classes options for blasting, and I saw the shaman waves spirit. The crashing waves hex adds 1 caster level to spells with the water descriptor and a fort save or knocks the target down. They get snowball on their list so theres a d6/level range touch, no Sr, knocks down and staggers the target on a failed fort save. Seems like it could be a nice basis for a blaster shaman.

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