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Bah internet ate my post so lets try this again.
How often do gm's and players find themselves in gaming groups that are composed in large part or entirely of players who are not the traditionally thought of players of tabletop games (i.e. hetero, white, cis, male players)? As it stands I just started a new group and for the first time I have a group that is not composed in large part or almost entirely of women and I'm wondering if it is common to get groups like what I have been able to play with and group diversity has become more common or if I've just gotten very lucky up until now to have that many groups not composed of what might be thought of as the standard group.
I go to an art school so it isn't exactly the most normative place in any sense of the word, but for me it's pretty much every time.
My regular groups include: A really tall, skinny black guy with a silly looking fro, two lesbians, an asexual (myself), an Indian man who speaks 5 languages (which is awesome for RP), just to list the most surface-level oddities of the bunch.
If you start going into things like the fact that one of us is spending an entire year making scarves that have heated robotic hands to hold on the ends, there's no going back.
Looks like between 1/6 and 1/3 of female gamers I had contact with are or claim to be bisexual to some degree (but still favoring males for long term relationships). I played in groups in which all female gamers present (2-4) were bisexual to a degree.
You know, I just realized that I've never played in a group without at least one female. Sometimes it's only the GM, but, yeah - I'd never really thought about the idea that "girls aren't a standard part of gaming" relative to my own experience.
I would say that the number majority of my players/GMs have been hetero/male, but it really depends on "white" - fully half or more of all of my players have been Hispanic to some degree or another (it comes from living in Miami for a while).
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cis,
wiki "While cisgender terms (ie. cis-woman, cis-man, cis-privilege) are used by certain trans theorists, there are other gender theorists who resist this term as they consider this term offensive and inaccurate."
The group that I play with currently has one woman. Haven't played enough to say how normal that is. I do recall my friend used to play in a group with at least one gay person in it.
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Considering that I'm Hispanic myself, no group I've been in has been all white males. I've had plenty of races go through my groups over the years, too.
However, in the over 25 years I've been in the hobby, I can literally count on one hand the number of women who have been regulars at the table--5, precisely. Now, part of that reason is, quite simply, because I have over 25 years of experience; the hobby used to be very much male in the 80s and early 90s, and thus the age cohort I spend the most time with remains the same guys. If I were to go to my local college to drum up a new group, say, I would not expect it to be all guys.
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You know, I just realized that I've never played in a group without at least one female. Sometimes it's only the GM, but, yeah - I'd never really thought about the idea that "girls aren't a standard part of gaming" relative to my own experience.
I would say that the number majority of my players/GMs have been hetero/male, but it really depends on "white" - fully half or more of all of my players have been Hispanic to some degree or another (it comes from living in Miami for a while).
Yeah it was a weird moment for me as well when I looked at my group and realized there were no women and it feels off to me lol. I've been getting to play a lot of pfs lately and a lot of the players have been a bit surprised by the group compositions I usually play in and, to me at least, it always feels a bit stale to not have that diversity with my groups.
Like the 1st group I ran was all women save myself and a friends younger brother, my second group had a revolving door of players but always was at least 25% female and sometimes up to 75% female, and my last group came down just me and my GM as men.
Then amongst all that I've gotten a few black players, and a surprising number of trans players which has been really cool.
As for orientation I've gotten gotten one pansexual and a few bisexual but not much else beyond that (excluding hetero).
Honestly for me it feels really weird when when I look at my table and don't see a lot of that variation at my table especially how diverse I've started to see the player base become. Like one of my favorite things when I GM Gencon is seeing how diverse the player base is getting each year.
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Considering that I'm Hispanic myself, no group I've been in has been all white males. I've had plenty of races go through my groups over the years, too.
However, in the over 25 years I've been in the hobby, I can literally count on one hand the number of women who have been regulars at the table--5, precisely. Now, part of that reason is, quite simply, because I have over 25 years of experience; the hobby used to be very much male in the 80s and early 90s, and thus the age cohort I spend the most time with remains the same guys. If I were to go to my local college to drum up a new group, say, I would not expect it to be all guys.
Yeah that's kind of what I've assumed as of late since it seems the older the player the more hetero, white, cis, and male the groups seem to be. That being said most of the gaming groups I'm starting to see especially in colleges are gaining more and more women and other groups which is so cool to start seeing since it really seems to bring more new and interesting stories and perspectives to the game. Also as a GM I've always found that having a more diverse group is a great resource for getting perspectives for characters and cultures who's experiences are more outside of my own as well as creating characters I would have never thought about playing which is always awesome as a GM and player when said players are really being fun and involved in the game.
I play locally with family and friends of family - all white guys. I've played with women on a few different occasions. The one most recently was awesome. She had never played before, but her boyfriend explained it to her, and she was interested. She immediately read the "Example of Play" in the book and had a million questions of course. Fun times.
When I've run online games, I don't ask what the composition of everyone is, and it rarely comes up.
Nontraditional is awesome.
It's also a little more frequent these days. Much of that has to do with a more welcoming environment. That is, we are a product of our times. As society in general has become more welcoming, so have the social institutions within it: say, gaming groups.
I am used to playing in groups containing between 1 to 5 women - for last 12 years I rarely played in groups without women included at all. But it might be European thing.
My groups have usually had one or two minority representatives, but I've yet to have a group that wasn't primarily composed of white hetero guys.
Four guys, three girls in my group; I'm one of the guys. Two of the girls and I are asexual or otherwise sexually neutral/uninterested (there has been much sympathizing/lamentation over this between the three of us about the current state of society re: people are way too interested in sex), and one guy and one girl are a married couple (my brother and his wife); as far as I know the other two guys are straight (one's mentioned girlfriends in the past). We tend to be a not-very-talkative about relationships and such group.
Like others have mentioned, always have had a girl in the group - my future sister-in-law introduced me to the game and taught me how to play, and the only time I didn't have her in the group was during some downtime after my original group had all moved around the country, but we had the other two girls of my current group in the party at the time so it was never all-guys.
4 white heteros in our group at the moment. We've had one girl (wife of the gm) on and off but she didnt seem to necessarily enjoy gaming and her husband was rather vocally bi... several white gay men came and went... One straight black man at one point...
Never had a table with more than one woman, don't even know any non hetero women even outside of gaming... So for me yeah. Mostly hetero white men.
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Frankly, I don't tend to pay attention and bean-count who I play with and try to shive them into category boxes other than 'thats joe, thats Sue, and thats Veanne'
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I have two Canadians in my group, does that count?
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Frankly, I don't tend to pay attention and bean-count who I play with and try to shive them into category boxes other than 'thats joe, thats Sue, and thats Veanne'
That's kind of what I meant above: I just kind of accepted the general stereotype that "gamers are X" without really comparing it to my own experience, which I knew was at least somewhat different without ever really thinking about it. I just gamed with my friends, whoever they were.
I do think this is an interesting question, though, and one that reveals a mostly positive trend toward increasing diversity within a subculture that, frankly, needs expansion in order to survive.
EDIT: finishing a sentence I started, then forgot about...
Heck, it's a big enough trop to get a book that's built around the idea* from Wizards themselves.
*
cis,wiki "While cisgender terms (ie. cis-woman, cis-man, cis-privilege) are used by certain trans theorists, there are other gender theorists who resist this term as they consider this term offensive and inaccurate."
It's funny. "Cis" (in "cisgender" or similar words) is one of those terms that I often find really, really weird, and is most often (in my experience on other forums) used immediately prior to some large and highly heated argument about LGBT-related stuff (regardless of who starts said argument or who's on the right/wrong end of it). Yet has somehow managed to insert itself into cultural consciousness very rapidly as "the term to use".
In this case, the OP clearly isn't trying to be insulting, just curious, so I took it at face value and accepted it as a non-insult but clarification, which kind of makes sense on boards as heavily diverse as these.
I also think that, given it's opposition to trans- in origin, it's about the most internally consistent way someone could come up with a new non-pejorative term. And, given human nature, we will come up with a term that will stick around for a while. We name things. It's what we do.
Does it rankle? A bit, but mostly because "it's weird" and thus uncomfortable - I usually don't tend to think about people as "cis" anything. But I don't really think it's insulting. I know other people feel differently.
Why bother being offended?
I have two Canadians in my group, does that count?
Have one here too. =)
Why bother being offended?
Very true!
I rarely find things offensive unless they're meant to be, or at least seem to be. It's not so much "bothering", as it is a "reflex". I try and squish it, though, or make a minor comment with the ultimate goal of uplifting all. Doesn't always work. Sometimes I'm just a jerk.
In any event: how 'bout those non-stereo-typical player groups, eh? :)
Bah internet ate my post so lets try this again.
How often do gm's and players find themselves in gaming groups that are composed in large part or entirely of players who are not the traditionally thought of players of tabletop games (i.e. hetero, white, cis, male players)? As it stands I just started a new group and for the first time I have a group that is not composed in large part or almost entirely of women and I'm wondering if it is common to get groups like what I have been able to play with and group diversity has become more common or if I've just gotten very lucky up until now to have that many groups not composed of what might be thought of as the standard group.
Almost every group I have played with in the last 6 years, has had at least one female.
Most of the games I have played in over the last 6 years, have had at least one homosexual player.
In the last six years I have played in one group with a drag king.
I have been in a 3 year semi-regular game with my partner, who is Filipino/Caucasian, and for a large chunk of the last 6 years I have played in a regular game with a African Caribbean/Caucasian guy too. While my primary war gaming opponent is malayan/caucasian, as where the two guys who got me into role-playing when I was very young.
cis,wiki "While cisgender terms (ie. cis-woman, cis-man, cis-privilege) are used by certain trans theorists, there are other gender theorists who resist this term as they consider this term offensive and inaccurate."It's funny. "Cis" (in "cisgender" or similar words) is one of those terms that I often find really, really weird, and is most often (in my experience on other forums) used immediately prior to some large...
Which is why I just quoted the link. I am sure the OP had no bad intentions, but that word has set of a guanostorm on some boards. It's just a FYI.
Oddly, we have a non- traditional group in one way as altho we are mostly hetero males, we are also mostly older professionals.
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Yar. The words itself isn't inherently an issue, it's the venom with which it's too often said (often paired with the word "scum" and somewhat more rarely with a "die" in front. =/).
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My two regular groups have an equal share or a majority of female players. All of the players are heterosexual or bisexual but living in a long-term heterosexual relationship. All of the players are white (which is no surprise in rural Germany - of the ~250 people who made their high school diploma with me, there were three non-white - it gets better, but that's more or less one or two generations apart from me and my regular groups).
I had two homosexual players in former regular groups (shortly after high-school) but both moved away. The few irregular groups I have played in the last ~10 years all had female players, I didn't ask for sexual orientation (mostly convention games), only one or two were non-white (again, no biggie in rural Germany).
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Only ever had 3 female players that I played serious Tabletop RP games with, but a couple others have voiced interest but were unable to join my current games because of real life considerations (darn good considerations - they both serve in the army, which leaves surprisingly little time for acquiring new hobbies, especially time consuming ones like role playing).
Rest of the people I gamed with are all males, though not all of them heterosexuals. Only ever had two non white players (one's my best friend, though, so he's a regular, and the other is the most avid RP fan of the group so he is too).
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My current group 4 males ( 3 straight) 2 females(1 straight 1 bi). I have been gaming for about 40 years and have always has some female presence at out tables. The group from my collage days was about 80% male but both my wives are gamer girls. I don't really care the sexual orientation of my fellow gamers cause its gaming.
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Huh, it seems that we end up with a lot of female players but not as many POC players, particularly black or African American. Is this something most people run into? As it stands I've realized that though I've grown up and still live in an predominately black and hispanic neighborhood I've only really had 2 black players in my home games and usually only for short spans (work schedules and transportation issues to game) and no hispanic players. Do others run into this as well with groups largely composed of white players?
I only played with white gamers but it's a direct result of composition of Polish population - non-white minorities are very-very small there and only recently arrived.
Our current gaming group is 3 women, 2 men.
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I have two Canadians in my group, does that count?Have one here too. =)
I too have a Canadian (disappointed he doesn't have a flappy head like on South Park though) . Also a Swede. I run my games on roll20 so the skies the limit for possible player types.
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I'm an asexual Black female, so 3 for 1? My last gaming group was a bunch of white guys. (two were technically Jewish, but I'm not sure it counts?) The one before that had an Asian guy too - that one had a lot of age diversity - a 40 year span among the 6 of us.
I've resigned myself to not seeing that many other people of color for the most part and generally refuse to let other people make me a 'representative' of my ethnicity, my sexuality or my gender.
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Ethnicity is for the most part a matter of region, as it probably is for other things as well. I attend a college that is closer to a 60/40 split of female/male, so the fact that there are more female gamers where I'm at is to be expected, as if the fact there is only only black man and very few people that adhere to organized religion in the club. It's just the nature of my environment.
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It's funny. "Cis" (in "cisgender" or similar words) is one of those terms that I often find really, really weird, and is most often (in my experience on other forums) used immediately prior to some large and highly heated argument about LGBT-related stuff (regardless of who starts said argument or who's on the right/wrong end of it). Yet has somehow managed to insert itself into cultural consciousness very rapidly as "the term to use".
The term predates those sort of online arguments, as far as I can tell, arising in the mid-90s. It is through that earlier tradition of usage, I think, and through the work of people like Julia Serano, that is has become the go-to term for non-trans people in the cultural consciousness.
Personally, I've seen it used more often uncontentiously and outside of argument. (That's how I tend to use it myself, as a simple descriptor.) As you say, I have seen it used argumentatively (from people on different sides of trans issues), but I've never seen anyone mount a solid argument against the term itself, which is basic and accurate in its meaning, and seems to have a suitable etymology for its current use.
For the time being, until someone comes up with something better, I think it's the best term we have to distinguish people who are not transgender from those who are. Then again, terms regarding transgender and transsexuality continue to evolve, so maybe another term will come along at some point.
that word has set of a guanostorm on some boards. It's just a FYI.
I don't think I've seen anyone on this specific board object to it when it's come up, though I could be wrong.
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I personally do not object to it, though I can't speak for others. If we have a term for people with a gender identity that differs from physical sex we also need to have a term for people that don't. Otherwise you create a situation of "Well they're transgender, we're just normal people", which is far more offensive and, if I'm being honest here, is in all likelihood a reason why some more conservative cisgendered theorists don't want to have a term to apply to themselves.
I said SOME.
Boy, I wish I had the luck you guys have with female players!
I'm very often the one and only female player/GM in our rotating group. I was even involved in a school club which was 100% male, excluding me (15-20 people).
The few women I've played with were either girlfriend tag-alongs (which were either one-time shows, or highly disinterested in the game), or too involved with other activities to stay committed.
It sure gets lonely @-@
Although, I did have the opportunity to play a few PFS games around my area, and played with a few women there. Pity my schedule doesn't allow for that anymore.
This thread has changed from "non traditional" to "how many females". I'm not even sure what traditional even means, surely it's more than the male/female ratio?
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Traditional as defined in the first post is the group being composed exclusively of white heterosexual males.
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I organize bi-weekly PFS events and we have been growing since we started but from the start we were pretty diverse. About half our attendees are female and while white is the primary ethnicity because of where we are, it is not all we have come out to play. As far as sexual orientation I can only speak for a friend who is gay.
So, here in Maine, we are pretty diverse in our gaming community.
From the mid 1980's when I was in college to now we have always had girls in our groups though we have never gone about asking if they were bi-sexual. Always thought it was their business, not ours if they were. There have been players of different color and religion. Until Friday, I didn't know one guy was Jewish. Once again, I didn't ask because I didn't think it was my business to ask. Lots of different players, lots of different games.
My current main group (not counting myself) is composed of three males and two females. One couple is Asian, and my wife is Hispanic. That group has a sometimes additional player who is gay.
For a while we had two groups going, one similar to the current one (but with a different white dude in the current white dude's place), and the second composed of three females (one of them black) and three males (one of them black - no relation to the female).
There's a long history of Hispanics in my groups. And going back, a good number of gay people, as well. And Asians. Plenty of Asians.
I live in the San Francisco Bay Area, so I guess none of this is surprising. There are a lot of gamers of all different stripes here, which is a nice thing. Many of my girlfriends (before I got married, of course) gamed with me.
Roughly 76% of Australians have European ancestry, about 60% of that is from the UK and Ireland. 15% are from Asia (India to China) 5% are from the Middle East, 2% are Aboriginal. Less than 1% are from Africa and the Americas.
I have gamed with an Indian, and several Vietnamese and Chinese(Hong Kong)players.
Previous incarnations of our group were a 50/50 male female split... Currently its all male, we are all hetero as far as I know but sexual preference is not an issue for us.
What about transgender players? Does anyone else here get groups with transgender players on any regular basis besides myself? As it stands I've had quite a few in my home games and I'm wondering how common that is for others.
One, but he doesn't actually play in our TRPG games anymore, just hangs out. He just had a hard time staying focused, which is fine. We still do card games and other things all the time.
I've gamed for the better part of 40 years (since 1974). Wargaming before that. The bulk of my fellow players have been white male over the decades. Some female, a couple were Hispanic, several Asian and one Black. I've never asked about sexual orientation although casual conversation indicated a couple were gay / bisexual. The current crop is all white male and have gamed for about 20+ years...
Thinking about it my older players have been almost all white male, with the one exception being Japanese American. Diversity didn't creep into my group until about 30 years ago (in graduate school). It wasn't a significant number until I moved away from home (for grad school and work).