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Have a guy doing dmg 2d6+10. Lvl. 10 fighter. How much extra dmg does a Power attack grant him? This is a 2H weapon. I believe its +9 dmg/-3 Attack. Am I incorrect? He claims that he gets to use his STR bonus and gets a +50% bonus on that, too. I don't see it but maybe I'm wrong. Anyone know why he might think that?
You can choose to take a –1 penalty on all melee attack rolls and combat maneuver checks to gain a +2 bonus on all melee damage rolls. This bonus to damage is increased by half (+50%) if you are making an attack with a two-handed weapon, a one handed weapon using two hands, or a primary natural weapon that adds 1-1/2 times your Strength modifier on damage rolls. This bonus to damage is halved (–50%) if you are making an attack with an off-hand weapon or secondary natural weapon.
When your base attack bonus reaches +4, and every 4 points thereafter, the penalty increases by –1 and the bonus to damage increases by +2.
You must choose to use this feat before making an attack roll, and its effects last until your next turn. The bonus damage does not apply to touch attacks or effects that do not deal hit point damage.
He gets 1.5 his STR as bonus when wielding a 2-handed weapon or a non-light 1-handed weapon with two-hands; the bonus damage from Power Attack is also increased by 1.5 under the same circumstances.
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The damage really is not even that impressive.
The reason why it is -3/+9 is only because he is wielding the weapon in two hands. Normally it scales at -1/+2 -> -2/+4 -> -3/+6 however because he is using a 2h weapon it gets half again as much so we instead see a 2h weapon scaling at -1/+3 -> -2/+6 -> -3/+9. He also gets to add strength and a half to all attacks made while wielding a weapon two-handedly, this could apply if he say lost his shield and gripped a long sword with both hands or if he is just using a 2h weapon such as a falchion or greatsword.
You have the correct numbers for Power Attack itself.
Using Power Attack doesn't suspend the normal combat rules, which allow STR to damage for melee weapons,
and using 2 hands with non-Light weapons increases that STR damage by 50%.
So your damage will be STR damage (modified by 2H as appropriate) PLUS Power Attack (likewise) PLUS all other damage bonuses.
(only bonuses of the same type don't stack, e.g. Enhancement Bonus to damage, STR and Power Attack damage bonuses aren't typed)
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Have a guy doing dmg 2d6+10. Lvl. 10 fighter. How much extra dmg does a Power attack grant him? This is a 2H weapon.
I am so confused as to how he could be doing so little damage. Level 1 fighters are doing 2d6+9 more often than not--how did he only gain a single point of damage in 10 levels?
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Have a guy doing dmg 2d6+10. Lvl. 10 fighter. How much extra dmg does a Power attack grant him? This is a 2H weapon.I am so confused as to how he could be doing so little damage. Level 1 fighters are doing 2d6+9 more often than not--how did he only gain a single point of damage in 10 levels?
He doesn't, it was a question meant not to point at anyone. The fighter actually does more dmg at a lower level.
However a scenario came up where a lvl. 10 fighter was doing 2d6+9 and a power attack was to be calculated and I'm trying to figure out how much to add to the NPC dmg and how much to subtract from his attack. I'm supposed to play it RAW and I'm not sure what the correct ruling on this would be in PFS.
Come on, he didn't understand how Power Attack and STR bonus damage interact, I'm sure he's overlooked some other details as well.
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The scenario shows an NPC boss with 2d6+9 19/14. Str. 20, +4 2H weapon, weapon focus, spec and training. Yes, I know the base damage is way over 2d6+9 but that's what's in the scenario.
Now add Power Attack. I need PFS rules on this not Pathfinder rules though. Does the RAW stat apply and the fighter only does 2d6+18? Or is the GM allowed to alter a PFS scenario to let this boss do his full dmg?
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The scenario shows an NPC boss with 2d6+9 19/14. Str. 20, +4 2H weapon, weapon focus, spec and training. Yes, I know the base damage is way over 2d6+9 but that's what's in the scenario.
Now add Power Attack. I need PFS rules on this not Pathfinder rules though. Does the RAW stat apply and the fighter only does 2d6+18? Or is the GM allowed to alter a PFS scenario to let this boss do his full dmg?
It's possible that they've dumbed this boss down. Is this a scenario that has two different versions, depending on party level? Because this boss' base damage should be like 2d6+15 before Power Attack. remember, feats like Power Attack and Vital Strike often aren't counted in to a creature or NPC stat block since they may or may not be using them.
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No, that's right. Str 20 on a 2-handed weapon is +5 damage, +2 for wielding it 2-handed, +1 for weapon specialization, +1 weapon training.
Add +9 for power attack, and his damage is 2d6+18.
Weapon Specialization is +2 damage. And Weapon Training at that level should be +2 as well if that's the boss' primary weapon. He also said it was a +4 weapon, so that should be counted in to the damage as well. 2d6+9 is way off, by at least 8 points. He should be looking at 2d6+17 base, bumped to 2d6+26 with Power Attack.
He did say this is for PFS though, maybe this boss is supposed to have to attack blocks depending on whether the group is playing up or down?
Also the attack bonus: +19/+14 seems off, it could be including the +4 Enhancement, but not Weapon Focus/Training.
That the OP may be reading the wrong Level Tier stat-block may be the most likely cause.
Or it could be Errata. Have you searched the PFS GM threads for discussion on that module?
People uncover Errata all the time, and share their solutions for it.
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***That the OP may be reading the wrong Level Tier stat-block may be the most likely cause.
Or it could be Errata. Have you searched the PFS GM threads for discussion on that module?
People uncover Errata all the time, and share their solutions for it.
^^^ This. Either this guy was written up way wrong, or the OP is reading the stat block for a lower tier encounter. If your adventurers are in the (what is it, the 5-7 tier?) lower tier, then this guy's damage may have been intentionally nerfed to make him a level appropriate challenge.
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Sniper in the Deep is the scenario. There doesn't seem to be any errata, that I can find. Its S01-31. The dmg should be higher but it isn't because if he's doing that much dmg, he could potentially kill any PC with 2 swings of his super sword.
This is a tier 5-9 scenario and I'm discussing tier 8-9. Don't know though.
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It sounds like what you're looking at is his lower tier damage. I might discuss the scenario with your Venture Captain before making any changes to his damage, it's going to make a huge difference in the scenario if this guy starts doing appropriate damage for a level 10 fighter with a +4 Falchion when it's balanced to an assumption of decreased damage. I would hazard that either way, his stat block is probably not including the Power Attack bonus to damage, as generally it is up to the GM to decide from round to round if the NPC would be Power Attacking or not.
Well clearly it's not going to deal the same damage in Tier 5-6 as Tier 8-9.
What is the damage at lower tier vs. higher tier? That's the obvious clarification to do first.
Otherwise, AFAIK people can and do work around stat-block errors to use the real numbers justified by stats.
If the NPC stats and gear is on-par for it's level/CR, then the RAW application of those is appropriate.
Two swings of the full damage allotment being discussed shouldn't usually kill all characters of the higher tier anyways (without Crits).
Characters not built to stand up to melee shouldn't be melee'ing BBEGs in the first place,
if they are, that is their problem, not how the BBEG is built according to standard rules.
If you want something more official, you should post in the PFS GM thread,
not the thread for general Pathfinder RPG Rules Questions.
There's OBVIOUSLY an Errata because the stats you just posted don't even account for the +2 Enhancement bonus difference.
If the stats obviously don't include Power Attack, and the tactics tell you to use it, you apply the PA mods.
I don't think Power Attack is really EVER included in base attack stats, regardless of tactics.
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mmkay, so you should definitely be subtracting 3 from his to-hit and adding 9 to his damage for Power Attack....
Is the weapon he's using really a +4 weapon?
I seem to be missing about 4 points of damage no matter which way I cut it, and his to-hit is off a bit too.....
2d6+9 would be appropriate or a non-Power Attacking Fighter of that level with a non-magical weapon. 19/14 would be appropriate for that same guy with a Masterwork weapon given the stats described....
Seems like there may be some math that's off somewhere in there no matter which way you cut it.
Tier 5
+13 to hit with his +2 greatsword (+5 BAB, +4 from strength, +2 from the magic of his weapon, +1 from weapon focus, +1 weapon training)
+11 to damage (+6 from strength-and-a-half, +2 from the magic of his weapon, +2 from weapon specialization, +1 weapon training)
Power Attack with a 2-handed weapon, at this level, is -2 to hit, +6 to damage. That would make the tier 5 stats be:
+11 to hit
2d6+17 for damage
Tier 9
+22/+17 to hit with his +4 greatsword (+10 BAB, +5 from strength, +4 from the magic of his weapon, +1 from weapon focus, +2 weapon training)
+15 to damage (+7 from strength-and-a-half, +4 from the magic of his weapon, +2 from weapon specialization, +2 weapon training)
Power Attack with a 2-handed weapon, at this level, is -3 to hit, +12 to damage. That would make the tier 5 stats be:
+19/+14 to hit
2d6+27 for damage
...provided I did the math right. The book...is lacking right there.
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He gets 1.5 his STR as bonus when wielding a 2-handed weapon or a non-light 1-handed weapon with two-hands; the bonus damage from Power Attack is also increased by 1.5 under the same circumstances.You can choose to take a –1 penalty on all melee attack rolls and combat maneuver checks to gain a +2 bonus on all melee damage rolls. This bonus to damage is increased by half (+50%) if you are making an attack with a two-handed weapon, a one handed weapon using two hands, or a primary natural weapon that adds 1-1/2 times your Strength modifier on damage rolls. This bonus to damage is halved (–50%) if you are making an attack with an off-hand weapon or secondary natural weapon.
When your base attack bonus reaches +4, and every 4 points thereafter, the penalty increases by –1 and the bonus to damage increases by +2.
You must choose to use this feat before making an attack roll, and its effects last until your next turn. The bonus damage does not apply to touch attacks or effects that do not deal hit point damage.
So by RAW, attacking with a two handed weapon used one handed still gets the 3 for 1?
FAQ:
Weapons, Two-Handed in One Hand: When a feat or other special ability says to treat a weapon that is normally wielded in two hands as a one handed weapon, does it get treated as one or two handed weapon for the purposes of how to apply the Strength modifier or the Power Attack feat?
If you're wielding it in one hand (even if it is normally a two-handed weapon), treat it as a one-handed weapon for the purpose of how much Strength to apply, the Power Attack damage bonus, and so on.
—Pathfinder Design Team, 07/19/13
So by RAW, attacking with a two handed weapon used one handed still gets the 3 for 1?He gets 1.5 his STR as bonus when wielding a 2-handed weapon or a non-light 1-handed weapon with two-hands; the bonus damage from Power Attack is also increased by 1.5 under the same circumstances.You can choose to take a –1 penalty on all melee attack rolls and combat maneuver checks to gain a +2 bonus on all melee damage rolls. This bonus to damage is increased by half (+50%) if you are making an attack with a two-handed weapon, a one handed weapon using two hands, or a primary natural weapon that adds 1-1/2 times your Strength modifier on damage rolls. This bonus to damage is halved (–50%) if you are making an attack with an off-hand weapon or secondary natural weapon.
When your base attack bonus reaches +4, and every 4 points thereafter, the penalty increases by –1 and the bonus to damage increases by +2.
You must choose to use this feat before making an attack roll, and its effects last until your next turn. The bonus damage does not apply to touch attacks or effects that do not deal hit point damage.
By RAW, he can't do it at all unless he has an ability which expressly lets him use a two-handed weapon in one hand. If he does, he treats it as a one-handed weapon for all damage-calculation purposes, per the FAQ that Quandary cited.
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FAQ:
Weapons, Two-Handed in One Hand: When a feat or other special ability says to treat a weapon that is normally wielded in two hands as a one handed weapon, does it get treated as one or two handed weapon for the purposes of how to apply the Strength modifier or the Power Attack feat?If you're wielding it in one hand (even if it is normally a two-handed weapon), treat it as a one-handed weapon for the purpose of how much Strength to apply, the Power Attack damage bonus, and so on.
—Pathfinder Design Team, 07/19/13
but
Power Attack: If I am using a two-handed weapon with one hand (such as a lance while mounted), do still I get the +50% damage for using a two-handed weapon?
Yes.
—Pathfinder Design Team, 05/24/13
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Lance is kind of a special case. You don't really do much more with a lance than steady and aim it. While, yes, there is technique to using the lance as a weapon, it is very different from most weapons. This includes the spear, which can and has been used like a lance, but can also be used on foot. Further, 7/19/13 is a more recent date than 5/24/13. Quandary's citation is the one I would operate with, outside of very specific circumstances.
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Sniper in the Deep is the scenario. There doesn't seem to be any errata, that I can find. Its S01-31. The dmg should be higher but it isn't because if he's doing that much dmg, he could potentially kill any PC with 2 swings of his super sword.
This is a tier 5-9 scenario and I'm discussing tier 8-9. Don't know though.
Ah!
Sniper in the Deep is an early Season 1 scenario - the stat blocks are probably confused because of the transition from 3.5 to PF that was probably going on as they were written.
sounds plausible to me.
re: the FAQs, they obviously directly conflict, which is Paizo's issue for why they have both still in the FAQ,
but the newest one should logically take precedence in any conflict, so I don't see the old one as valid...
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sounds plausible to me.
re: the FAQs, they obviously directly conflict, which is Paizo's issue for why they have both still in the FAQ,
but the newest one should logically take precedence in any conflict, so I don't see the old one as valid...
A small discussion on that here.
I don't know if it was discussed elsewhere. I would like further comments.
cool, i hit FAQ over there.