| 3 people marked this as FAQ candidate. |
Lets say your alignment is True Neutral and are currently under the affects of
School conjuration (healing) [evil]; Level cleric/oracle 1, magus 1, sorcerer/wizard 1, summoner 1, witch 1
CASTING
Casting Time 1 round
Components V, S, M (1 drop of devil blood or 1 dose of unholy water)
EFFECT
Range touch
Target creature touched
Duration 1 minute
Saving Throw Will negates (harmless); Spell Resistance yes (harmless)
[This content was created by Paizo Publishing LLC for the Pathfinder rules but is not from the Pathfinder RPG product line.]
DESCRIPTION
You anoint a wounded creature with devil’s blood or unholy water, giving it fast healing 1. This ability cannot repair damage caused by silver weapons, good-aligned weapons, or spells or effects with the good descriptor. The target detects as an evil creature for the duration of the spell and can sense the evil of the magic, though this has no long-term effect on the target’s alignment.
Now you detect as Evil while under the effects of the spell with spells/abilities that Detect Evil or alignment, but if you were targeted by a spell that uses alignment like:
School evocation [good]; Level cleric/oracle 4, inquisitor 4; Domain glory 4, good 4
CASTING
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
EFFECT
Range medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Area 20-ft.-radius burst
Duration instantaneous (1 round); see text
Saving Throw Will partial; see text; Spell Resistance yes
[This content was created for the Pathfinder rules by Paizo Publishing LLC and is part of the Pathfinder RPG product line.]
DESCRIPTION
You draw down holy power to smite your enemies. Only evil and neutral creatures are harmed by the spell; good creatures are unaffected.
The spell deals 1d8 points of damage per two caster levels (maximum 5d8) to each evil creature in the area (or 1d6 points of damage per caster level, maximum 10d6, to an evil outsider) and causes it to become blinded for 1 round. A successful Will saving throw reduces damage to half and negates the blinded effect.
The spell deals only half damage to creatures who are neither good nor evil, and they are not blinded. Such a creature can reduce that damage by half (down to one-quarter of the roll) with a successful Will save.
School evocation [evil]; Level cleric/oracle 4, inquisitor 4; Domain evil 4
CASTING
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
EFFECT
Range medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Area 20-ft.-radius spread
Duration instantaneous (1d4 rounds); see text
Saving Throw Will partial; Spell Resistance yes
[This content was created for the Pathfinder rules by Paizo Publishing LLC and is part of the Pathfinder RPG product line.]
DESCRIPTION
You call up unholy power to smite your enemies. The power takes the form of a cold, cloying miasma of greasy darkness. Only good and neutral (not evil) creatures are harmed by the spell.
The spell deals 1d8 points of damage per two caster levels (maximum 5d8) to a good creature (or 1d6 per caster level, maximum 10d6, to a good outsider) and causes it to be sickened for 1d4 rounds. A successful Will save reduces damage to half and negates the sickened effect. The effects cannot be negated by remove disease or heal, but remove curse is effective.
The spell deals only half damage to creatures who are neither evil nor good, and they are not sickened. Such a creature can reduce the damage by half again (down to one-quarter) with a successful Will save.
etc...
are you considered evil for those effects?
Nope. You only detect as evil. You don't actually become evil for the purpose of anything else.
I reckon Harmor has a valid point and it isn't as cut and dried.
Interested in whether 'detects as' is the same as 'treated as'. There are some interesting implications if thats the case.
You have to be evil in order to be subject to certain things. When a spell is cast on you the spell does not make you evil for the purpose of personal alignment. Infernal Healing just says you detect as evil. That is entirely different than being evil. The inquisitor archetype that can change how he detects for the purpose of detect spells could make himself immune to certain spells and class features if that was the case. It would also mean that undetectable alignment would make bad guys immune to a paladin's smite since they can make their alignment undetectable. In short being able to change or hide how something is detect has no bearing on how they actually function. Would you force a good cleric hit with such a spell to lose his powers if he had a good deity?
If I am ever an evil overlord, I'll cast Infernal Healing on a neutral minion right before the paladin kicks in my door.
If I am ever an evil overlord, I'll cast Infernal Healing on a neutral minion right before the paladin kicks in my door.Why not your LG slave?
Dropping it on the good princess chained to my throne would be even more ... entertaining.
I read it like being hit with a sudden (but temporary) injection of radioactive substance, like they do for certain types of scans done in hospitals. For awhile, while the substance is in your body, scanners that detect for that substance will register. Over time your body purges it and the scans no longer register anything.
In this case, presumably evil magic is being used to heal you. For awhile, it leaves a trace that makes you register on "scans" for evil. Over time it dissipates and you scan normally.
It says explicitly 'detects' as evil. Doesn't say is treated as evil. Wouldn't have been hard to put that in there. I can't imagine Non-detection nor misdirection would affect what damage you take because of your alignment.
I see it as the sort of thing a devil would get a giggle out of actually. Assuming you have a smite-icus pally, detects the person, they come over as evil. SMITE.
.... assuming that it's an ally that the BBEG has cast it on, then their ally has taken no additional damage, but forced the pally to burn a fairly valuable resource.
... And the pally realises their smite has failed, and therefore have laid the smacketh down upon a non-evil creature. If the smite worked, then the pally would feel all righteous and noble about it working and that they are doing the right thing. Now, they know their sense was tricked. Was that part of the BBEGs trick to hit them? Is your deity trying to tell you something? Should you have re-done basic numeracy at smite school to count how many times you've smitten today.
As with Misdirection, tell me I'm not the only one who can see the potential for psychological warfare in this.
But isn't doing damage based on alignment a form of detection?
Yet then we have Angelskin changing the whole 'detects as'/effected by paradigm
Yet then we have Angelskin changing the whole 'detects as'/effected by paradigm
Specific overrules general. The general rule is that detecting as something is not the same as being treated as that thing. The Angelskin's specifics change that. Doesn't mean it's changed for all the other instances of detecting as a different alignment.
In addition, the angelskin gives a 20% chance to be treated as non-evil for evil creatures, regardless of whether they detect as evil or neutral. Note the specific language: treated as vs detected as.
No question that Angelskin has a special rule, but is it reducing the 100% to 20% or increasing the 0% to 20% if you get my meaning?
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Now I want a spell that *does* make someone else count as evil (or good) for the purposes of effects related to alignment.
"Oh, hi, Mr. Antipaladin. Save or count as good, and suffer some negative levels from holding your own unholy reaver, please."
"Keep throwing those unholy blights around, Mr. Glabrezu, I just made you count as a good creature, so you'll be nuking yourself too!"
Might also be a decent way to prevent someone from casting certain spells, as an evil cleric temporarily made 'good' for alignment purposes might find himself unable to cast [evil] descriptor spells until the effect wears off or is dispelled.
But isn't doing damage based on alignment a form of detection?
Nope. The paladin can unable to detect you as evil, but you will still feel the smite. Undetectable alignment, as an example, won't help you at all.
No question that Angelskin has a special rule, but is it reducing the 100% to 20% or increasing the 0% to 20% if you get my meaning?
If treat as were always detect as then "treat as" would be used. The fact that they had to go out of the way to use "treat as" which would automatically include "detect as" means that the lesser of the two would not apply.
Detect as and treat as are not the same thing at all. How are detected has no bearing on what you are, which is what many abilities operate on. However if you are treated as ___ then the abilities that operate according to what you are still come into play, for the purpose of that effect.
"Treat as" always determines how things interact in the game. Detect as does not.
Now I want a spell that *does* make someone else count as evil (or good) for the purposes of effects related to alignment.
"Oh, hi, Mr. Antipaladin. Save or count as good, and suffer some negative levels from holding your own unholy reaver, please."
"Keep throwing those unholy blights around, Mr. Glabrezu, I just made you count as a good creature, so you'll be nuking yourself too!"
Might also be a decent way to prevent someone from casting certain spells, as an evil cleric temporarily made 'good' for alignment purposes might find himself unable to cast [evil] descriptor spells until the effect wears off or is dispelled.