The question: Is climate change real?
The Answer is yes,
but are we human responsible for it, NOT REALLY.The climate follows cycles and his a complex interconnected system.
The cycles are likely based off a single cycle that contains numerous harmonics, likely also has a feedback system that makes it hard to predict when and how the climate changes.
Complex system with feedback loops =/= totally unaffected by human activity.
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There are always things that are beyond our control. What we can control is what WE do. That is the real issue that we need to discuss and that is the issue that a lot of people are doing their best to circumvent. Don't tell me that this cycle is doing this and that cycle is doing that. We already know that there are cycles in the climate and we can't control them or the effect they have. The issue I want to talk about is, what effect is humanity having on the world? That is the issue that needs to be addressed.
That why I said
but are we human responsible for it, NOT REALLY.
Humans do have an inpact, but not as big as Al Gore is spitting out.
The Feedback system likely also has a form of system Correction.
Like the North Atlantic current, if the North Atlantic current shuts down, Hello Ice age, and that current is a fresh/salt water controlled system. And I recall from a news paper article that the North Atlantic current system has started to weaken.
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It does not disprove it, but does show that it'll change no matter what we do.
In my opinion we add a few corn kernals to a corn comb in the scheme of things.
In my opinion the moon is made of green cheese.
Unfortunately, like your own opinion, the preponderance of scientific evidence does not agree.
Some people want to stick their heads in the sand while the world goes to hell.
I already know the world is going to hell,
but you can't do a thing about it.Edit: well maybe, but it would require the will of many to cause a change.
Here you go Meat.
One thing I think is worth mentioning is that this is one study. I would like to see follow-up studies done before I believe whole-heartedly in its findings. Not saying it isn't correct, but all studies should be replicatible (spl?).
One thing I think is worth mentioning is that this is one study. I would like to see follow-up studies done before I believe whole-heartedly in its findings. Not saying it isn't correct, but all studies should be replicatible (spl?).
That and the fact that some of these studies get a stacked deck.
Your right thejeff, in that I used the wrong words and made some edits.
If the climate scientists are right, within a generation or so, everyone is going to believe in climate change, because it'll be obvious. By then it'll be too late to do anything but try to survive.
Smoke 'em if you got 'em!
[bubble bubble bubble]
Can someone please explain to me why it even matters whether mankind contributes to climate change? To me it doesnt matter one whit whether we contribute to it or not. What does matter is that we are the only thing that can do anything about it, whether we caused it or not.
Edit- I get that it is important to know what causes change in order to come up with a solution. I just think arguing about what extent mankind messes with the climate is the wrong arguement to be having.
Well, I'm no big science guy, but I presume that it matters because if we didn't cause it, there's probably very little we can do about it.
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Climate change is a reality. It does matter. It is not slowing down it is speeding up. The evidence is out there if you look for it. Most of the evidence shows it is in fact either man-made of sped up by man. We are also entering into a major solar storm period which will likely hasten the already severe heating of this planet.
NOW is the time to do something. We all can do something. We can make choices today that will affect our children and theirs for generations to come. We must choose not to stick our collective heads in the dirt and pretend it is just going to go away.
I am not going to go gently into that good night. I will not be the crab that fights its brethren to stay in the cooking pot.
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Well, I'm no big science guy, but I presume that it matters because if we didn't cause it, there's probably very little we can do about it.
I disagree. We didnt cause polio or amoebic dysentary or locust swarms or a world without beer, yet we managed to do stuff about all of them.
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yeah? If our carbon emissions arent the main factor, then do it up. I would like to see the world off of fossil fuels, if for no other reason than they are non renewable. (full disclosure: I do believe that mankind is one of, if not the, main reason for climate change.) All that I am asserting is the cause of climate change is only important insofar as what it can tell us about the solution. And the solution is 100% guaranteed to be manmade.
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Next time you're driving over a hill, toward a city, and you see that thick layer of crap hanging in the air that blots out the cityscape and makes everything darker, and then you drive down into that city and find you have a headache, and that the temperature is about five degrees higher under all that crap than it is everywhere else, what conclusion will you draw? Well, from these posts it seems that most of you will just go ahead and drink your tea, fill out your Republican voter registration, fill your car up with gas and smile your way through all that denial.
Yes, the Earth experiences climate changes. No scientist worth his salt denies that. What the Earth does not do as a natural course of its business is to chug out millions of metric tons of unbreathable crap every hour. The notion that we can continue doing so and it has no effect on our environment, is insane.
You all are smart people, relatively. Most gamers are. You don't disregard the evidence and conclusions given to you by top-level geniuses because you do not understand it. You disregard it because you want to BELIEVE it is not true. Because your religions or your political leanings have biased you against the truth. But inside, you smart people know better. You can feel what humans can do to the environment on a smaller scale on any given smoggy day. And you ALL have seen and experienced smoggy days. So you all know better.
Deny at your peril. I'd prefer you deniers grew up.
Next time you're driving over a hill, toward a city, and you see that thick layer of crap hanging in the air that blots out the cityscape and makes everything darker, and then you drive down into that city and find you have a headache, and that the temperature is about five degrees higher under all that crap than it is everywhere else, what conclusion will you draw? Well, from these posts it seems that most of you will just go ahead and drink your tea, fill out your Republican voter registration, fill your car up with gas and smile your way through all that denial.
Really? Because I drew the exact opposite conclusion. It seemed that most every post on here was in agreement with you.
Yeah, thats what I was thinking too. I wouldnt even say that we are a very liberal messageboard. I would say that we are a very smart board, tho.
Yeah, thats what I was thinking too. I wouldnt even say that we are a very liberal messageboard. I would say that we are a very smart board, tho.
Potayto, potahto ;)
Everyone believes in climate change. It happens 4 times a year.
No, it does not. Climate is LONG TERM. It is not a season, or a year.
Everyone believes in climate change. It happens 4 times a year.No, it does not. Climate is LONG TERM. It is not a season, or a year.
Traditional time period is 30 years.
That why I said
but are we human responsible for it, NOT REALLY.Humans do have an inpact, but not as big as Al Gore is spitting out.
The Feedback system likely also has a form of system Correction.
Like the North Atlantic current, if the North Atlantic current shuts down, Hello Ice age, and that current is a fresh/salt water controlled system. And I recall from a news paper article that the North Atlantic current system has started to weaken.
The NACC is not a climate feed back system, it is a weather feed back system. It's collapse, which would almost certainly be a major economic and environmental disaster in and off itself, does nothing to reduce the amount of energy within the climate system. All it does is changes how the energy disperse through the atmosphere.
Currently the NACC takes warm water from the gulf of mexico north west across the Atlantic, dumping more and more heat as it goes, until it reachs europe, where it warm the UK and the western nations of europe. Its collapse would mean London's winters would be more like new york's winters. It also means that the gulf would warm up more, potentially leading to more tropical storms and hurricanes, and desertification.
The energy will still get to the north pole, where it will disperse, and contribute to polar forcing, it will just take longer and cause a whole bunch of havok along the way.
It isn't an ice ages. In ice ages, average global temperatures drop. This can all happen while average global temperature continues to increases.
Can someone please explain to me why it even matters whether mankind contributes to climate change? To me it doesnt matter one whit whether we contribute to it or not. What does matter is that we are the only thing that can do anything about it, whether we caused it or not.
Edit- I get that it is important to know what causes change in order to come up with a solution. I just think arguing about what extent mankind messes with the climate is the wrong arguement to be having.
It matters because changes regardless of their cause are very likely to be very bad for us.
If the observed changes that are currently occurring are man made (and the evidence largely support this hypothesis, and it is the consensus view of climate scientist that it is man made), then changes in our behaviour now can reduce the level of economic damage and suffering that we are likely to experience in the next hundred years as a result of climate change.
so you just reiterated exactly what I wrote.
It doesnt matter all that much whether or not what we did caused climate change, it matters exponetially more what we are doing to prevent it.