Hey guys
What are people's thoughts on the balance of the traits in the Player's Guide
The Northern Ancestry almost seems too good in that it negates one of the biggest hazards of the campaign
Call me crazy but when one particular thing is almost a no-brainer it suggests it is too good
On the opposite side the Vigilante Witch Hunter one seems really lame (even if you get max nails)
Does anyone have any thought? How can I balance them?
Potential ideas:
2 traits but only 1 if Northern Ancestry
1 less hero point is N.A (in a hero point game)
Power down the trait somehow
(Don't have many ideas for witch hunter trait atm, perhaps an attack or damage bonus?)
Would appreciate the thoughts of others...
Reduce Cold resistance to 1. And it's not that powerful really; it reduces by a third the damage of Winter-fey cold touch, sure, but it doesn't provide immunity from hypothermia or the like.
Does it not. I thought Cold Resistance gave immunity to non-lethal damage caused by the cold
Is there any clarification on this anywhere?
I just looked through the rules. It does not states Cold Resistance gives immunity to non-lethal damage from the cold. The confusion comes with the "unprotected" aspect mentioned in checking for hypothermia. Seeing that cold-weather gear does not protect someone (it only gives a +5 to Fortitude checks), I'd say only Cold Immunity, or the spell Endure Elements would be considered "protection" and thus prevent damage from the cold.
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I disagree with both interpretations.
The non-lethal damage is still from the cold, so subtract resistance normally.
And cold-weather gear does completely protect you from the damage until extreme cold (-20). This has been clarified in these boards.
Honestly, taking 2 off of cold damage is not unbalancing - it is good at low levels, but will soon be made up for by anyone who doesn't have the trait by spells or magic items.
I agree that VWH is weaker, but Sense Motive is pretty good skill to pick up.
I plan to run them as is, tho I may let the VWH get more nails (either max, or up the die).
BTW, I would say Warded Against Witchery or Adaptive Magic would be at least as good as Northern Ancestry.
A re-read has brought me to a similar conclusion. I misinterpreted "resistance" as immunity initially. My mistake. When that interpretation is considered I agree that it is not overpowered at all (and like you said the trait that grants magical defense and the one that gives umd are both also very good)
Blood of giants seems weak as well. Against creatures likely to bull rush and overrun +1 will be of negligible use
Traits arent really supposed give big mechanical advantages, they are supposed to "flesh out the character"
a boost to a skill here, a +1 to hit gnolls there... yea some are better than others; not on purpose it's all situational.
One of the characters in our group has the 2 cold resistance. Ive been applying it to non lethal damage, so if he takes 3 non lethal, he only suffers 1, if he takes 2 he takes none.
The cold weather outfit is supposed to protect you to "normal" cold weather, and give you a +5 to extreme, default to the CRB, the module's abbreviated version confuses things.
when the PCs start they live in Taldor, and dont have a reason to own cold weather outfits, there is certain cases where they might not have any and go out there "unprotected" at which case those rules in the module apply.
If they do have cold weather outfits, then follow the normal rules for cold weather.
Thanks for clarifying Pendagast
I fully expect players to metagame at the start and buy a cold weather outfit (reading the name of the Adventure Path)
Is there anyway to limit this, or should I just go with it?
Note: Not that I want them to freeze, I just am not a big fan of metagaming
Well, yes, buying a cold weather outfit before the game starts could be an issue lol.
If you have a character with northern ancestry, it might no be odd, seeing as he is from there.
but other character backgrounds? Yea I would just veto that personally.
"WHY do you have a cold weather outfit?"
IF they insist on it, I would draw out the game for several weeks of play before the winter portal shows up and have them sweat their bag off in their furs, have people laugh and make fun of their fuzzie booties and all sorts of other things, let them "sweat out" (literally) the whole when is it going to get cold? thing.
In this case, they would have to make environmental checks not to get heat exhaustion, or buy a more appropriate outfit, of walk around topless, a bonus for the female characters!
How ever you play it, I wouldnt make having the cold weather outfit for the whole party be a shoe it from day one.
Heck, id definitely play several sessions in and around heldren before starting the AP anyway,
we did half a session 'futzing around in heldren'....wish I had done more.
Do a mini adventure or two, have them use heldren as a home base and get a few xps here and there, nothing is going to be hurt by them having a few extra xps before the start of the "official stuff'. In fact it might help.
Some early run in with bandits, some wild animals, and/or forest kobolds would be in order methinks.
Actually, there are five cold-weather outfits available for sale at the general store for Heldren. Thus if they hear about the really cold weather and talk to Yuln (and see his frostbitten face) then if they have the funds? Let them buy cold-weather gear.
A couple things to recall about cold weather gear. This isn't modern cold weather gear. This is what people a couple hundred years ago would have had. So it's bulky and not always effective. The rules in Ultimate Equipment state it gives a +5 circumstance bonus on Fortitude saving throws against exposure to cold weather. It doesn't state it protects against cold weather. And don't forget - until you're at 0 degrees Fahrenheit, you check once an hour.
If it did, then it would protect against severe cold because the rules state unprotected characters make a Fortitude check every 10 minutes... and that cold weather gear reduces the check to once an hour. Thus the rules are not stating you can't suffer the effects of cold weather while in cold weather gear. It's just you're more likely to resist them and don't check as often.
Is there some magnificent difference between modern cold weather gear of "olden times" cold weather gear?
With the exception of modern materials being lighter, and maybe less stinky, there really isnt a difference.
A lot of native alaskans still make and wear the "old stuff" and is barely a place in the world it gets colder.
Wearing a jacket, gloves, and a hat in 34 degree weather, while moving about in a semi active manner (wether that isnt even freezing mind you) is not going to make you catch hypothermia.
Trying to me INACTIVE and maybe even SLEEP like that might be considered "unprotected"
IF the PCs are wearing cold weather outfits, are walking or fighting and hav not stopped for prolonged periods, there is no reason to make checks (unless they are wet somehow) if they cross into the colder areas then they should make checks,
IF they have no cold weather outfits, 40 degrees-1 degrees makes them make a check every hour. or every ten minutes in the 0 degree and colder areas.
Actually? Yes. Waterproofing. Back a couple hundred years ago fats and oils were often used for waterproofing. Nowadays jackets tend to repel water quite nicely due to coatings and weave design.
The Inuit, by the way, possess a lot more brown fat (a type of fat normally found in infants and helps with insulation) than non-Inuit. They've evolved to handle the cold weather more efficiently than people in warmer climes.
And you can still get chilled in cold weather despite being physically active and dressed warmly. That's the point of the Fortitude checks - to see if a person gets chilled despite their activity level. But ultimately the decision is up to the GM. I'm just providing the argument for playing the rules as written.
1) it depends on which rules as written you are reading. there are several discrepancies.
2) The inuit aren't the only native alaskans, or natives to the general region.
3) waterproofing is pretty common even in the natural materials if you know what to use
4) sub zero temps, waterproofing isnt an issue, everything is a solid.
5) if you read the boards, RAW/RAI has been clarified on this subject already, no one is supposed to be making checks in 40 degree weather with cold weather outfits on,
In 40 degrees, sure. But 20? 10? The role of the GM is to interpret rules and determine when to not use them... and when to use them. Or even the situation in which to use the rules - would 40 degrees but with a heavy snowfall that starts to accumulate and is getting everything wet be a situation where someone in heavy winter gear should check (with bonuses) once an hour? Maybe. Especially if there's a heavy wind causing a windchill effect.
In short, I'm saying that there are times when using the rules as written may be the right thing. It's up to each GM to decide on those factors.