Would you play a Lawful Good AP

[thenovalord]

maybe you could get away with LN or NG, but essentially to get the most out of it you'd have to be LG

this is what im working on for my home group. i have parts 1-4 mind mapped out and the first couple more heavily detailed

This is what i have planned (and i wouldnt be so brazen as to suggest the fate of Aroden or close the world wound!!)

THE VALIANTS VIGIL AP

MODULE 1: THE LAST PRAYER OF THE DYING
Signing up to join the 4th Mendev Crusade, you have finally found like minded souls. A call for help by a dying warrior leads the party against a demonic plot, and on a mission to fulfil a former heroes last wish, or fail at their first attempt?

MODULE 2: MERCYS MISSION
The party seek a high temple of Iomadae in order to hand over some important relics. They then race to a forgotten watch-tower on a long abandoned route

MODULE 3: THE LOST BEACON OF LIGHT
Finally arriving at the front line of the 4th crusade the party see the horrors of war, and the brutality and greed of the seasons crusaders. Can they hold to what they know to be dear and true, or will the brutality and truth of battle be their downfall?

MODULE 4: WITH FLIGHTS OF ANGELS
Arriving at the capital city of Mendev, the diamond of the North, Nerosyan, just in time to foil an assassination. Meeting with the queen herself she sets them on a quest that will try even the most devout of souls

MODULE 5: A CLASH OF SWORDS
The enemy of my enemy is my friend no longer holds true. Making a deal with the devil is always hazardous, even when the threat that faces you both is so terrible the deal must be struck at any cost. And that’s before you leave this material plane

MODULE 6: LIGHTS LAST VIGIL
Through broiling chaos and festering evil the party have journeyed, but this journey now reaches it epic conclusion. Victory means the terrible tide is halted, defeat would lead to endless torment and despair thoughout Avistan. Can the party deeds mirror those of an aged warrior they met what seems like an age ago?

Can a person spend 6 months playing an AP while being righteous and true without being a zealot? Can you kill, or talk to, things and return stuff to the rightful owner?

[Nathan Nasif]

Sounds awesome. Always (well, since I first heard of mendev) wanted to play a Mendevian crusade campaign.

[doctor_wu]

I think you should not use vigil in the name as then I started thinking about lastwall and the capital city of Vigil. Lastwall is also a lawful good nation.

[ElyasRavenwood]

Cool. I would enjoy a LG adventure path

[doctor_wu]

I should mention I would play a LG adventure path. I am currently GMing a homebrew Lastwall pbp.

[Jason Nelson]

I'd be all over it!

[DM_aka_Dudemeister]

Lawful Good doesn't get enough love. I'd run or play in something like this.

[thenovalord]

good points

I really want to call it The Righteous Ressurection, as thats an underlying theme...but apparently that has a lot of 'real world' issues!!

Ok so we need a name a double term name that fits

Avenger Ascendant
Righteous Retributuion
Guardians Glory

or something suitabley sickly

I realise Lastwall to is LG, but i wanted to make more european feel (that awesome piece of artwork that is the Lastwall crusade, looks a tad deserty)

I figure Mendev is a bit North Europe

I considering a sub-system of 'Taint', that sort of gives an action-point-style thing but risks a darkening of the soul

[Kerney]

I have a problem with this, but I think it's more me. I guess I see law IRL as a tool for the powerful to run over others; not always but way too much. I more a Robin Hood was a good guy and King Arthur was simply the less oppressive alternative.

I wonder if my own cynicism would get in the way.

[thenovalord]

Kerney wrote:

I have a problem with this, but I think it's more me. I guess I see law IRL as a tool for the powerful to run over others; not always but way too much. I more a Robin Hood was a good guy and King Arthur was simply the less oppressive alternative.

I wonder if my own cynicism would get in the way.

it is a good point. Im really trying to not do 'zealot' which the only two LG regions in Golarion seem to eminate...so trying to be the more pure arthurian knight ideal. Humility, Self Sacrifice, Challenging chaos not for glory but because its not a way to run a society, vanguishing evil because if it isnt faced down the innocent & weak always suffer first

Ill maybe add more to this when im not in a rush

guess the proof will be when i have playtested and put out first mod for general consumption!

[thenovalord]

http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz5905?Trait-list-for-my-Lawful-Good-AP#1

trait list for discussion

[Onemore]

Personally, I think it sounds good "on paper" but running a game like this (at least with my group) would be WAY to challenging or not that much fun... Especailly the "returning items to their rightful owner" part... Besides, who doesn't love the constant arguements between the CG good or Nuetral guy and the LG guy?? Some of the best times as a role player! Just my thoughts...

[thenovalord]

Onemore: Thats true, inter party conflict is interesting, so im just looking at something different. I am hioping to playtest the nearly written first mod sometime because things that look good on paper, often dont work out the way planned

for example the campaign im wrapping up tonight (and hence need a new project!!) is a party of all wizards. On paper we where cautious, but it has been awesome in action

[Belle Mythix]

Personally, I probably wouldn't play one, unless the DM/GM loosened the definitions of Lawful and Good a little.

[GeraintElberion]

Reading that synopsis, it's clearly a Good campaign but there is nothing that really suggests you would need to play a Lawful character.

My CG sorcerer would happily fit in with those events.

[thenovalord]

ger: i like CG,it is my fav alignment.
--you fight the good by your own definition, dont take being slighted by anyone, quite vengeful and always seek revenge (not always by violent means). Above all alignments I think they 'know' what is right and proper). dont take fools lightly, and will help a beggar one day with a fine sum or aid, but if you see him out begging the next day then he will get a self opinionated earful from you. If a party finds a mighty item, you are in no doubt you should wield it against the darkness and corruption.

Whether you can as CG
-make the self sacrfice needed for some of the AP
-go against your nature wuth regard wealth, helping those who wont help themselves etc would be quite a test

but again, you may be right, not until i/we playtest will i/we know!!

thanks for interest and output

[Kerney]

thenovalord wrote:

ger: i like CG,it is my fav alignment.

--you fight the good by your own definition, dont take being slighted by anyone, quite vengeful and always seek revenge (not always by violent means). Above all alignments I think they 'know' what is right and proper). dont take fools lightly, and will help a beggar one day with a fine sum or aid, but if you see him out begging the next day then he will get a self opinionated earful from you. If a party finds a mighty item, you are in no doubt you should wield it against the darkness and corruption.

Whether you can as CG
-make the self sacrfice needed for some of the AP
-go against your nature wuth regard wealth, helping those who wont help themselves etc would be quite a test

but again, you may be right, not until i/we playtest will i/we know!!

thanks for interest and output

Quite vengful? that isn't good per se. Not suffering fools? A CG character might not like or respect fool but will defend and protect said fool from bullies if they get in trouble.

Self Sacrifice with regard to wealth? I suggest looking at one of quintisentially CG characters, Robin Hood (ignoring the pro Richard stuff obviously pasted on to make him respectable). He steals, but he gives up wealth and is certainly self sacrificing. There is nothing going against your nature as a CG character defining your relationship to money per se.
A CG character 'sharing' would share his money with a few he saw as needy, believing they could help themselves, except perhaps the drunk he knows will spend it on booze. Meanwhile the LG person would set up a soup kitchen or a grant process or something like that.

I suspect you are seeing LG as the 'highest' good, which is absolute excrement.

[thenovalord]

I meant vengeful as in 'i will not let you get away with that...it will not likely be violent but maybe by word or deed or something clever of me'....with your bully example, CG likes nothing better than a bully to bring down, in a variety of ways....and if the victim has listened to what the CG said, he wouldnt have got bullied in the first place!

I never saw Robin Hood as CG. He is tricky to nail down (as he wasnt 'real', and comes from a series of conflicting sources)

And no, NG is the absolute measure of good. no need to start bringing the thread down with insult please

LG is a good struggle to play in. A CG can chop and change and adapt as needed, and a NG can go with doing whatever is needed as long as it brings no harm to the 'innocent'.

So can a LG stick to their principles without being a zealot about it? one thing im trying to examine with the AP

So its a challenge for me to write and pitch right, and a challenge for your to play Kerney, w/o as you say your cynicism getting in the way....and being slightly challenged is one reason i play a wide range of rpgs

[Zarzulan]

Hmm, your description of CG sounds more like CN to me. I like the classic D&D alignment system, but the problem comes with the arguments about exacty what acts count as lawful vs. chaotic, etc.

[Zarzulan]

This sounds cool, but then I enjoy playing LG characters--the classic noble, principled Hero types.

[Belle Mythix]

Zarzulan wrote:

Hmm, your description of CG sounds more like CN to me. I like the classic D&D alignment system, but the problem comes with the arguments about exacty what acts count as lawful vs. chaotic, etc.

.

.
Kinda sounds like Runequest "You are either Lawful Good or Chaotic Evil" thing... then again, many DM/GM/ST/etc and developers are into "PC of any alignment shall be played as Lawful Good and the DM/GM/ST/etc is free to run any NPC as Chaotic Evil".

[Kerney]

thenovalord wrote:

I never saw Robin Hood as CG. He is tricky to nail down (as he wasnt 'real', and comes from a series of conflicting sources)

Other examples of CG, V in the movie V for Vendetta. Malcolm Reynolds at the end of Serenity (first half of the movie and parts of the series he's on the border between CG/CN). In fact, Serenity is one of the most clear cut CG vs LE movies out there (though the Operative is LN).

As for Robin Hood, King Arthur was only semi real, but the composite of his legend is LG. I think, other than the one strain I mentioned before, Robin Hood is CG.

Also my offensive comment was meant in general, not at you or anyone, but at the meme that LG is somehow the greatest good. Still, I was waking up and failed to use good judgement. Sorry if it was taken as such.

thenovalord wrote:

And no, NG is the absolute measure of good. no need to start bringing the thread down with insult please

Agreed.

thenovalord wrote:

LG is a good struggle to play in. A CG can chop and change and adapt as needed, and a NG can go with doing whatever is needed as long as it brings no harm to the 'innocent'.

So can a LG stick to their principles without being a zealot about it? one thing im trying to examine with the AP

RP situation I wish I had lived up to. In Silent Tide PFS

Spoiler:

We have to go to the information broker Grandmaster Torch to get info, something which we are able to do by solving puzzles. Goal is to prevent an undead invasion of Absalon.

Before revealing existence of the puzzles, Torch, makes a pass at my female Paladin. I turn it down because I as a player I know a way will present itself. What I should have done is said, "If my body will protect the city, it is yours" (Yes, there are no blue laws I don't think).

Good is giving whatever is needed of yourself, with humility, putting aside ego. If my action could save the city, I should have done it. Regardless, I would have been living up to my Paladin code.

A simular example is Shiba in the L5R verse, bowing to Isawa and living up to the vow.

thenovalord wrote:

So its a challenge for me to write and pitch right, and a challenge for your to play Kerney, w/o as you say your cynicism getting in the way....and being slightly challenged is one reason i play a wide range of rpgs

As do I. I only recognise that I have a harder time sumspending my disbelief here

[Eric Zylstra]

I also would like a LG-focused AP.

[thenovalord]

good repsonses all round
thanks

The issue I am thinking a lot on is the poor little CE

it must be ridiculously hard work the poor CR 7/8 demonic captain in charge of a large squad of CR 1/2-1 demonic larvae, half a dozen dretch and a couple of NCO Babau, and trying to get them 'organised' for cohesive action in the mortal realm, when the demon himself really cant be bothered and just want to play and eat a few mortal souls. must be good at herding cats!

so therefore any NPC/CE baddies i need to get pitched right. In the PRD description it does count as 'worst' those mortals who worship the most powerful demons as gods, and who pledge their lives in support of that which would bring destruction to all.

I think the PCs may face some slightly-above-EL encounters with CE, just because there will be no cohseion in the defence, PLUS if the paladins can slaughter my rival/boss, I can just leg it and be in charge later! So the CE mortals arent stupid just unable to overcome their nature, lust, madness etc

except for

Spoiler:

anti-paladins, who i think will set as those whose cunning can just overcome their instincts, and can set some temporary organisation against the PCs

[thenovalord]

if anyone is interested i can send them a pdf of some of the first mod

it will be a bit crude and need editing for better language, but does contain some background, the intro, a dungeon and 8 not-so-random-encounters

im hoping to start playtest with my local group soon so some 'stranger' feedback would be cool

email

jrrtalkingATaolDOTcom

[thenovalord]

thenovalord wrote:

good points

I really want to call it The Righteous Ressurection, as thats an underlying theme...but apparently that has a lot of 'real world' issues!!

Ok so we need a name a double term name that fits

Avenger Ascendant
Righteous Retributuion
Guardians Glory

man i was close, and many months before the AP title was announced

[Endrian]

Are you still sending out the first mod of the AP to interested parties? If so, expect an email from me :)

[Trinite]

Yes, an all-LG campaign would be fun.