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Another simple Q, can you enchant a black blade or more importantly can you upgrade a black blade with enchantments. Or can a blackblade have enchantments on it when you first receive it
the archetype doesn't seem to specify. Obviously it makes a difference if a blackblade will end up as a +5 weapon or forever a masterwork sword with some abilities you can activate
... y'know it's magical enhancement bonus increases as the magus gains levels, yes? And that it starts out as a +1 weapon, not simply masterwork? Table 1-3? Column two?
I noticed that, what I'm confused on is if you can substitue your +x bonuses for flaming, shock etc so you don't use Arcane Pool points and if so how often could you change them.
It could end up a more permanent form of Arcane Pool ability
Another simple Q, can you enchant a black blade or more importantly can you upgrade a black blade with enchantments. Or can a blackblade have enchantments on it when you first receive it
the archetype doesn't seem to specify. Obviously it makes a difference if a blackblade will end up as a +5 weapon or forever a masterwork sword with some abilities you can activate
... y'know it's magical enhancement bonus increases as the magus gains levels, yes? And that it starts out as a +1 weapon, not simply masterwork? Table 1-3? Column two?
As for magical abilities (ie. Shock or Frost), you could use your arcane pool to drop any needed abilities onto your black blade...
But no +5 (with another +5 enchanting) then further +5 enchants arcane pool. eh I can live with it
But no +5 (with another +5 enchanting) then further +5 enchants arcane pool. eh I can live with itI never said that. As it stands, there does not appear to be a rule prohibiting adding enchants to the Black Blade.
That said, I will houserule (and recommend others do the same) that the Black Blade may not, in fact, be enchanted. Alternately, it may be enchanted, but it has a maximum enchantment value of +10. Once you hit +10 worth of abilities+Enhancement, you're done! (note, that also would prevent a magus from using his arcane pool on his Black Blade.)
I'm pretty sure the intent, though, it to let its enhancement creep upward and apply special abilities on the fly as you feel the need. Used in this manner, the Black Blade compliments the Magus class's rules instead of creating a debate-ably overpowered weapon of doom.
I could be mistaken but I believe one of the bard archtypes from APG can apply an additional +5 of enchantments on top of a +10 item. So there is premise for this already existing. I can't see it breaking either way with a 3/4 BAB class
technically being an intelligent item you could add spells/day on top of +10 enchantment because they increase price and ego not enchantment number. If you go by the can add additional enchantment to the black blade
But no +5 (with another +5 enchanting) then further +5 enchants arcane pool. eh I can live with itI never said that. As it stands, there does not appear to be a rule prohibiting adding enchants to the Black Blade.
That said, I will houserule (and recommend others do the same) that the Black Blade may not, in fact, be enchanted. Alternately, it may be enchanted, but it has a maximum enchantment value of +10. Once you hit +10 worth of abilities+Enhancement, you're done! (note, that also would prevent a magus from using his arcane pool on his Black Blade.)
I'm pretty sure the intent, though, it to let its enhancement creep upward and apply special abilities on the fly as you feel the need. Used in this manner, the Black Blade compliments the Magus class's rules instead of creating a debate-ably overpowered weapon of doom.
I could be mistaken but I believe one of the bard archtypes from APG can apply an additional +5 of enchantments on top of a +10 item. So there is premise for this already existing. I can't see it breaking either way with a 3/4 BAB class
technically being an intelligent item you could add spells/day on top of +10 enchantment because they increase price and ego not enchantment number. If you go by the can add additional enchantment to the black blade
Now this is making my head hurt (im not one for jargon) but a total +15 to a weapon thats just nuts
EDIT: I thought you could only max a +10 anyway
Just my take on it....but I would assume that you could enchant a black blade with permanant enchantments, as long as you don't go above enhancement bonus limits as outlined in the rules.
Just my take on it....but I would assume that you could enchant a black blade with permanant enchantments, as long as you don't go above enhancement bonus limits as outlined in the rules.
Which would be +10 correct?
My understanding is that the Black Blade is less of a true magic item in it's own right and more of a class feature. It's unique nature (and obscure origins) cause it to seek out and bond with a Magus once he/she reaches 3rd level (something that we can assume it has done numerous times before) it has only the powers gained from it's bond with the Magus. The Magus should be able to augment it with spells and spell points, but not to change it's innate nature.
That's my take on it anyway. Personally I think they are pretty awesome as they stand.
Yes but if you fill it out, you won't be able to enhance it with the arcane pool.
Which ultimatly would take away the flexibilty that that particular ability is great for, apart from the energy attunement that the Black Blade gets, making it in my opinion pointless to pump it that high with permamnent enchantment bonuses.
What I will probably house rule is that you can set any enchantment bonuses such as shock & vorpal so long as the total amount doesnt go over the enchantment bonus as depicted in the level bonuses the blade bound gets. Which can also be changed everytime you prepare spells.
Yes but if you fill it out, you won't be able to enhance it with the arcane pool.
Exactly....
I can see certain situations you may not want to pass up, for example if you are playing "Rise of the Runelords" you may not want to pass up the opportunity to get a unique runeforged weapon....but on the whole, I would rather have the flexability.
Had this idea tha a Hexcrafter Blackblade could use the prehensile hair Hex to hold (not weild) the blackblade letting you tap into its various abilities while attacking with a different weapon.
Even without that you can strip away pool point from the blackblade and function pretty close to a regular Magus when you want to when using another weapon should you find one.
Also occured to me Blackblade is a finanical win becuase you've gain what ends up a +5 magic item for free, saving your money for other things , pretty good deal really.
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My understanding is that the Black Blade is less of a true magic item in it's own right and more of a class feature. It's unique nature (and obscure origins) cause it to seek out and bond with a Magus once he/she reaches 3rd level (something that we can assume it has done numerous times before) it has only the powers gained from it's bond with the Magus. The Magus should be able to augment it with spells and spell points, but not to change it's innate nature.
That's my take on it anyway. Personally I think they are pretty awesome as they stand.
+1.
Exactly my thoughts
One Name: Blackrazor :)
One Name: Blackrazor :)
+1, I wanted to play a character based off of that sword!
Here's the tricky part!
If you can enchant a Black Blade, it is cheaper to do so when its enhancement bonus has not yet increased. It's cheaper to bring a Black Blade from a +1 to a +2 weapon than it is to bring it from a +2 to a +3 weapon.
It's this inconsistency that leads me to believe that you cannot enchant a Black Blade, which is balanced by the fact that when combined with the Magus's own ability to enhance her weapons, it can eventually reach the cap of magic weapon power (and by the fact that the magus gets a +5 sword for free - that's a cool 50,000 gp in your pocket).
The black blade probably cannot be enchanted - it's a weapon version of a familiar.
The bladebound Magus gets a free magic weapon that costs next to nothing to replace at 3rd level. At 19th level, that's a FREE +5 vorpal sword - using your Magus' arcane pool to add that lovely vorpal property - that gibbers or what ever your particular black blade does while swallowing souls with every killing blow or head lopped off.
What about if you use Arcane Strike as well?
So if you had a total of +10 in enhancement bonuses for your Black Blade but they were in the form of things like Speed, Flaming, Shock, etc. rather than straight +x bonuses and then you used Arcane Strike you could boost your weapon's total bonuses to above +10?
I am not confusing Arcane Strike with Arcane Bond.
Arcane Strike (Combat)
You draw upon your arcane power to enhance your weapons with magical energy.
Prerequisite: Ability to cast arcane spells.
Benefit: As a swift action, you can imbue your weapons with a fraction of your power. For 1 round, your weapons deal +1 damage and are treated as magic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction. For every five caster levels you possess, this bonus increases by +1, to a maximum of +5 at 20th level.
The question is if you had a total of +10 bonus on your Black Blade (from whatever sources put it to +10) but they were all in the form of enhancements like Speed, Flaming, Shock, etc. and then used Arcane Strike could you boost your weapon's total bonus to above +10?
The question is if you had a total of +10 bonus on your Black Blade (from whatever sources put it to +10) but they were all in the form of enhancements like Speed, Flaming, Shock, etc. and then used Arcane Strike could you boost your weapon's total bonus to above +10?
As far as I can tell the enhancement bonus of your weapon doesn't interact with the mechanics of Arcane Strike. Arcane Strike as it is written applies a typeless damage boost and causes your weapon to count as magic for the purposes of overcoming DR, it doesn't attempt to increase the enhancement bonus at all.
So in the strictest reading of your question the answer would be no, but it's moot.
So no to "enhancement bonus" greater than +10.
But yes to "effective enhancement bonus" greater than +10?
Just trying to establish if people believe there is any precedent for a weapon being above +10 enhancement bonus. I think this qualifies. No?
Notice the word "effective"? I thought I put that there. Oh, I did.
Fine. Not close enough for you. I get it. Ok, say you enchant your Black Blade up to it being a total of +10 bonus on your Black Blade (from whatever sources put it to +10) but they were all in the form of enhancements like Speed, Flaming, Shock, etc. and then used Greater Magic Weapon. Could you boost your weapon's total bonus to above +10?
LazarX: Please read my last post where I present a different option using terminology that you will hopefully find more palatable.
Notice the word "effective"? I thought I put that there. Oh, I did.
Fine. Not close enough for you. I get it.
Note that Arcane Strike doesn't give you a to-hit bonus, so it really doesn't relate.
Ok, say you enchant your Black Blade up to it being a total of +10 bonus on your Black Blade (from whatever sources put it to +10) but they were all in the form of enhancements like Speed, Flaming, Shock, etc. and then used Greater Magic Weapon. Could you boost your weapon's total bonus to above +10?
This question has nothing to do with it being a black blade. Can you have an ordinary +1 weapon with +9 worth of enchants and cast Greater Magic Weapon on it?
The answer I'd give is "Yes". Ditto for a magus or paladin having a +10 weapon and adding to it via their class ability. However, Paizo people have said several times (and released errata) that the +10 is a hard limit and you can't push a weapon over it even temporarily. Which raises the un-answered question of what happens if you try.
A single weapon cannot have a modified bonus (enhancement bonus plus special ability bonus equivalents, including those from character abilities and spells) higher than +10
The answer I'd give is "Yes". Ditto for a magus or paladin having a +10 weapon and adding to it via their class ability. However, Paizo people have said several times that the +10 is a hard limit and you can't push a weapon over it even temporarily. Which raises the un-answered question of what happens if you try.
While you are correct that it doesn't directly relate to Black Blades, this is the point I was poking at. I would agree with you on the "Yes" bit even though it goes against Paizo ruling. And that is mostly because there are no rules that talk about what happens when you try. Personally, I think it works (or at least should work) for temporary effects like this.
The answer I'd give is "Yes". Ditto for a magus or paladin having a +10 weapon and adding to it via their class ability. However, Paizo people have said several times that the +10 is a hard limit and you can't push a weapon over it even temporarily. Which raises the un-answered question of what happens if you try.While you are correct that it doesn't directly relate to Black Blades, this is the point I was poking at. I would agree with you on the "Yes" bit even though it goes against Paizo ruling. And that is mostly because there are no rules that talk about what happens when you try. Personally, I think it works (or at least should work) for temporary effects like this.
I really wish it did. But see the quote I edited into my last post.
I think it's a poorly thought out ruling, leaves many unanswered questions, and renders some major class abilities less useful as you level up. I don't follow it in the games I run. Nonetheless, it is the official rule. I think the developers have said that anything that would raise it above +10 just fails, or caps out at +10 total, but that's not explicit in their errata'd rule.
So by their posts, GMW would just fail if you tried to cast it on a weapon that was already +10 total, even if only +1 was enhancement bonus. And if it was only +9 total, you'd get no more than an additional +1 out of it, assuming that the bonus GMW would normally provide is at least one higher than the actual enhancement bonus of the weapon.
Ah, well thank you for the quote, Bobson. I agree with your interpretation of it for what its worth. But there is your official ruling.
