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I have a not so hypothetical question.
Last year towards the end of May, while in Raleigh NC, I was playing in the Thursday night PFS game at Game Theory. We were playing Scenario #28 the Lyrics of Extinction. The Scenario was allot of fun. I was pleased because my character got to use his Polyglot.
The party consisted of: (my character)
Fatum Aedituus Venificus then a 7th level character, 1st lvl mystic theurge of Pharasma
Jasmine Sunstar a wizard I think 9th level
Cora Dawnstar a Cleric of Sarenrae I think 9th level
Gelen Al bin a fighter I think 8th level
Ruffles a fighter/ ranger living monolith I think 10 level
I remember my character was 7th level. I don’t remember the exact levels of the other player’s characters, but I think they were between 8 to 10.
And there was Ruffles. There was one small problem with him. His character was openly a practitioner of the faith of Zon Kuthon.
Initially the GM wasn’t sure if the Shaman would let us into the ruins with a powerful worshiper of Zon Kathon as part of our party but he GM didn’t want to sideline the player so he let him in.
After the battle with the main boss at the end of the module the cleric Cora Dawnstar, and my character wanted to destroy the music box. We didn’t even want to take a rubbing of the glyphs on it
When the player running Gelen Al bin the finger pointed out that we might not get a chronicle for this session if we didn’t go back to the pathfinder lodge with something so we returned with a rubbing of the lyrics, after doing our best to destroy the music box
How would you as GM’s handle these two distinct situations?
Situation 1, considering the Lyrics of Extinction Scenario would the shaman allow a high level follower of Zon Kuthon into the ruins
And situation 2: what happens after the players have defeated all the monsters, but in the end the players decide to go off script by destroying the music box and making sure it is impossible to take a rubbing of the notes on the side of the music box.
What are your thoughts?
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How would you as GM’s handle these two distinct situations?
Situation 1, considering the Lyrics of Extinction Scenario would the shaman allow a high level follower of Zon Kuthon into the ruins
And situation 2: what happens after the players have defeated all the monsters, but in the end the players decide to go off script by destroying the music box and making sure it is impossible to take a rubbing of the notes on the side of the music box.
What are your thoughts?
Your GM did well allowing the Ruffles to enter. A character should not be excluded/turned away from a game (or fraction of it) on account of a character creation choice. Gms should however be watchfull of players whos characters worship evil deities or think playing CN lets them get away with evil behaviour and when necesary talk to them about shuch issues.
As for situation 2) if the group has completed three encounters they get 1 XP. Depending on how players choose to complete (or not complete) their assignment the GM should modify the "Concluding the adventure" section - in the most dramatic cases even add a commentary for future reference on the chronicle sheets.
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How would you as GM’s handle these two distinct situations?
Situation 1, considering the Lyrics of Extinction Scenario would the shaman allow a high level follower of Zon Kuthon into the ruins
And situation 2: what happens after the players have defeated all the monsters, but in the end the players decide to go off script by destroying the music box and making sure it is impossible to take a rubbing of the notes on the side of the music box.
What are your thoughts?
Your GM did well allowing the Ruffles to enter. A character should not be excluded/turned away from a game (or fraction of it) on account of a character creation choice. Gms should however be watchfull of players whos characters worship evil deities or think playing CN lets them get away with evil behaviour and when necesary talk to them about shuch issues.
As for situation 2) if the group has completed three encounters they get 1 XP. Depending on how players choose to complete (or not complete) their assignment the GM should modify the "Concluding the adventure" section - in the most dramatic cases even add a commentary for future reference on the chronicle sheets.
I agree with Deigo on one.
On two, I believe that the box is just too powerful a magic item for characters your level to destroy (minor artifact level). Unless you could come up with something good, I wouldn't allow it. I would also see this as failing your Pathfinder mission. You would still get the credit, I would maybe make a note about how that venture-captain no longer cares for your service.
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Well... Playing the game should earn you the Chronicle.
Next, I played that once with an Oracle of Rovagug... I did have to plead to the Shaman that I all sought was the destruction of the ridiculous forces that opposed the return of Rovagug. The rest of the party "helped" by making "CooCoo" signs behind me. The encounter was very memorable and fun. The rest of the adventure ran "normally"
As the DM, I would've used the opportunity to turn this into a role play experience rather than a meta-gaming solution. Force the PCs to convince him they want to help (make a few checks, then have him reluctantly agree).
JP
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Diego Winterborg and cblome59 thank you both for your answers.
Situaion 1)
From a GM’s perspective, the last thing you want to do is exclude a player. If I was the GM, I would have done the same.
From a perspective of “story integrity” I just thought that, considering the lost city was destroyed by worshipers of Zon Kuthon the shaman would not be interested in leading more worshipers of that dark god back into the city.
Ruffles did have to try and explain why he wasn’t like all of those other “hurt me beat me whip me” worshipers of Zon Kothon.
Situation 2) It was the end of the scenario, late, and I think we all were tired. I think the GM did a bit of hand waving, when we mentioned we were intent in flame striking, fire balling, , trying to squash the music box under large pieces of stone etc, and said that we had destroyed the box. We did take a rubbing of the notes of the song to bring back to the grand lodge in Absolom.
If the players had their characters disobey their orders and scuttled their mission given to them by their venture captain, I do think, perhaps a notation on a characters chronicle sheet would be a good solution.
However, I think, particularly in the case of paladins, and by extension inquisitors and clerics, they serve another cause besides the pathfinder organization. If their orders from their venture captain contradict the ethos of a paladin, inquisitor or cleric they can easily walk from the pathfinder organization into their church.
Besides if they do something that grossly violates their ethos, they stand to loose their divinely granted spells and special abilities.
I do think that the venture captain who orders his paladins or good aligned clerics to do things his agents find abhorrent, the venture captain may find he looses his good aligned clerics inquisitors and paladins, and he is left with clerics of neutral or evil alignment.
Now if course I understand that the writers of a scenario have to take a broad perspective in mind and they cant tailor an adventure to a particular character. I also understand that PFS games are a bit different from home games because it is more standardized, rather then the customization you have in a home game.
I also understand that the Pathfinder Organization is Neutrally aligned on the whole, not good aligned.
Again thanks for your thoughtful answers.
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Diego Winterborg and cblome59 thank you both for your answers.
Situaion 1)
From a GM’s perspective, the last thing you want to do is exclude a player. If I was the GM, I would have done the same.
From a perspective of “story integrity” I just thought that, considering the lost city was destroyed by worshipers of Zon Kuthon the shaman would not be interested in leading more worshipers of that dark god back into the city.
Ruffles did have to try and explain why he wasn’t like all of those other “hurt me beat me whip me” worshipers of Zon Kothon.
Situation 2) It was the end of the scenario, late, and I think we all were tired. I think the GM did a bit of hand waving, when we mentioned we were intent in flame striking, fire balling, , trying to squash the music box under large pieces of stone etc, and said that we had destroyed the box. We did take a rubbing of the notes of the song to bring back to the grand lodge in Absolom.
If the players had their characters disobey their orders and scuttled their mission given to them by their venture captain, I do think, perhaps a notation on a characters chronicle sheet would be a good solution.
However, I think, particularly in the case of paladins, and by extension inquisitors and clerics, they serve another cause besides the pathfinder organization. If their orders from their venture captain contradict the ethos of a paladin, inquisitor or cleric they can easily walk from the pathfinder organization into their church.
Besides if they do something that grossly violates their ethos, they stand to loose their divinely granted spells and special abilities.
I do think that the venture captain who orders his paladins or good aligned clerics to do things his agents find abhorrent, the venture captain may find he looses his good aligned clerics inquisitors and paladins, and he is left with clerics of neutral or evil alignment.
Now if course I understand that the writers of a scenario have to take a broad perspective in mind and...
Some of the best RP in PFS comes from that fracturing of duty to the Pathfinders, duty to country, duty to god, etc.
I can see that having been a fun table :)
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It certainly was. with the GM asking poor ruffles to try and explain himself, or rather his faith in Zon Kuthon, both of the priests in the party perked thier ears and joined in the discussion.
he mentioned something about being a slave in Osirion and Zon Kuthon taught him how to deal with pain and that was the only thing that kept him going. He got his freedom and now served Cheliax.
The preistess of Sarenrae, and the Priest of Pharasma, were hopping to lure this poor soul away from the dark twisted and painful grip of Zon Kuthon. We were advocating that perhasp he could make a different choice. Perhaps he could make a choice free of bondage and obligation. Sarenrae for example was all about redemption, and the Andoran faction welcomed freed slaves and gave them their freedom. We suggested Desna for dreams, Shelyn for beauty, Iomadae for Honor serivice or courage, Abadar for order and law, etc.
serving cheliax we pointed out was merly perpetuating another form of the slavery similar to which he was in in osirion.
Ruffles repeated his story.
We did have fun role playing, and the DM suggeted we move in and explore the city.
so yes we had fun.