God yes. I hate that feat so much. It's such metagame frippery.
Let's try a different approach:
Will someone who likes weapon swap please speak up?
/nods in agreement.
yay!
Just to prevent group think, I thought the intent was to allow someone to use a weapons magic properties twice. Maybe the flavor text was bit far fetched, but I thought it was to make up for the TWF needing two magic weapons. The one big swing guy and monk don't need two magic weapons! Why does the ranger? I really don't care, I just thought that was the purpose.
Sure I'll speak up.
Jackie Chan does it in his movies if you watch some of the action sequences.
Not only are you not left handed, but you can use both hands well enough that in mid swing you can change to your other hand and continue from another angle.
Here would be a discription I might give of one of my characters doing it:
"I stab with my right hand, let go with the blade still in my foe and pull out with my left hand as I spin counter clockwise pulling the blade out and slashing when I come back around. As the blade pulls free I let if fly from my left hand and use the momentum to keep it travelling to my right hand, which I then use to rake the blade back across my foe. As my right hand crosses my body again I bring my left hand up and exchange on the fly to bring the blade back down in a diagonal to the right to complete my attack."
Here would be another one using Benny as an example:
"I loose my shield and swing it by one of the straps hiting the foe with the front of the shield, as it comes to my left side I grab it with my left hand on the edge and slash with the perimeter of the shield towards the right. I bring my right hand up grab the other edge of the shield with it and with both hands bash my foe with the front of the shield, switching my grip on my right hand I grab the strap again and backhand my opponent one last time pivoting my arm upward once I'm done letting the strap slide down my forearm and grabing the hand hold again."
You can actually change hands in combat in less than a fraction of a second. It takes practice, and you aren't as accurate, and the weapon could be batted away if your foe catches you wrong but it's not impossible and it allows you to attack your enemy from an angle he's not expecting.
It's not swing swing swing swing switch swing swing swing (though it could be, again switching doesn't take that much time). As you complete one attack you manuever your other hand to intercept the first hand and take over the attack to keep your momentum going.
Sure I'll speak up.
Jackie Chan does it in his movies if you watch some of the action sequences.
Not only are you not left handed, but you can use both hands well enough that in mid swing you can change to your other hand and continue from another angle.
Here would be a discription I might give of one of my characters doing it:
"I stab with my right hand, let go with the blade still in my foe and pull out with my left hand as I spin counter clockwise pulling the blade out and slashing when I come back around. As the blade pulls free I let if fly from my left hand and use the momentum to keep it travelling to my right hand, which I then use to rake the blade back across my foe. As my right hand crosses my body again I bring my left hand up and exchange on the fly to bring the blade back down in a diagonal to the right to complete my attack."
Here would be another one using Benny as an example:
"I loose my shield and swing it by one of the straps hiting the foe with the front of the shield, as it comes to my left side I grab it with my left hand on the edge and slash with the perimeter of the shield towards the right. I bring my right hand up grab the other edge of the shield with it and with both hands bash my foe with the front of the shield, switching my grip on my right hand I grab the strap again and backhand my opponent one last time pivoting my arm upward once I'm done letting the strap slide down my forearm and grabing the hand hold again."
You can actually change hands in combat in less than a fraction of a second. It takes practice, and you aren't as accurate, and the weapon could be batted away if your foe catches you wrong but it's not impossible and it allows you to attack your enemy from an angle he's not expecting.
It's not swing swing swing swing switch swing swing swing (though it could be, again switching doesn't take that much time). As you complete one attack you manuever your other hand to intercept the first hand and take over the attack to keep your momentum...
Wow, that was actually a pretty good explanation. I say it like that because I didn't think anyone could explain it. Now it actually sounds pretty cool.
Well done.
Yes We Can!
and I am not just repeating a recent political motto. This one has been on my kill list for a while.
Jason Bulmahn
I find Weapon Swap delightfully cool from an Errol Flynn perspective, and have ABSOLUTELY NO OBJECTIONS to killing it.
I think "Caught Off Guard"'s ability to use anything as an improvised weapon easily allows any two-weapon fighter to at least get the full benefit of their feats, should they lose one of their main weapons.
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I love it, this feat alone explain how to make a Bruce Lee's Nunchaku attack using only one (as normal).Yes We Can!
and I am not just repeating a recent political motto. This one has been on my kill list for a while.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
I think it's a pretty good feat. I like the flavor and imagery it creates; I even think Legolas does this in one scene with his dagger.
Finally, the overall benefit as someone pointed out is definitely the ability to not have to have two weapons magically enhanced to the same level/power, or take advantage of one weapon that may have a distinct advantage (say Giant bane when fighting giants) to be used as often as possible. (which may be what ultimatley makes the feat TOO good - but you still have to have the weapon, the feat, and the appropriate encounter).
Just my opinion.
Robert
RPG Superstar 2013 Top 4, RPG Superstar 2011 Top 16
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I love it, this feat alone explain how to make a Bruce Lee's Nunchaku attack using only one (as normal).
Nah, that's just the monk special weapon and the no off hand ability of the monk.
Weapon swap is silly and must hang by the neck till dead.
--Vrocknrolla
Ok:
Tidus (FF 10)
Cloud (FF 7)
Legolas (LotR)
Highlander (duh)
Zatoichi (Zatoichi Meets Yojimbo)
Several dozen Anime Characters.
Plenty of examples of this in fiction.
Heck it even comes with a decent penalty - 2 extra on your off hand attack.
The Feat does need explained better, but this was a great idea, has tons of imagery and flavor, good use without being overpowering, and is something that can be done "in the real world" where ever that is.
Do people dislike it because it helps the TWF person not have to spend so much on a second weapon?
If it's just a flavor thing, and not a mechanical issue.. in other words, it's not because the feat is overpowered.. we could easily just change the flavor.
Open Hand Technique
Your training in ambidexterity allows you to use your offhand for balance or hand switching to strike all openings and gain additional attacks with a single weapon.
Prerequisites: Dex 17, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Fighting, base attack bonus +6.
Benefit: While your offhand is free, you may make your offhand attacks with your primary weapon. These attacks are made at a -2 penalty.
Since the weapon must be able to swap hands as necessary, the weapon cannot be held by a locked gauntlet or otherwise strapped in place. For the same reason, any attack penalties on your offhand, such as the attack penalty from a buckler, apply to all attacks.
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Honestly, I'd go with a penalty more along the lines of "-1 to all attack, and a -2?5? to your CMB when defending against Disarm since the weapon is light in your grip".
This keeps the attack penalties easier to track, while the disarm penalty makes up for not being as big a penalty, and is thematically appropriate.
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Alternatively, keep the mechanics as is because no one seems to have any problem with the mechanics and the in-game explanation becomes something like:
"You use your off-hand weapon as a distraction to open your opponent up for strikes with your main weapon." Mechanically, it's the same but the explanation is slightly more plausible. Obviously, it would need a new name, but TWF still get the love.
Yes, KILL IT :)
Finally.
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I love it, this feat alone explain how to make a Bruce Lee's Nunchaku attack using only one (as normal).Nah, that's just the monk special weapon and the no off hand ability of the monk.
Weapon swap is silly and must hang by the neck till dead.
--Vrocknrolla
Nope, It is not the same. The monk ability implies that you can either make any of the fallowing progressions:
1- LRLRLRLR
2- RRRRRRRR
3- LLLLLLLL
4- LLLLRRRR
5- any combination of the above.
This benefit does not extend to the attacks made by virtue of TWF.
if you want to Two weapon attack with a Nunchaku, you need two Nunchakus since it is NOT a double weapon.
I love it, this feat alone explain how to make a Bruce Lee's Nunchaku attack using only one (as normal).Nah, that's just the monk special weapon and the no off hand ability of the monk. Weapon swap is silly and must hang by the neck till dead.
Nope, It is not the same. The monk ability implies that you can either make any of the following progressions:
1- LRLRLRLR
2- RRRRRRRR
3- LLLLLLLL
4- LLLLRRRR
5- any combination of the above.This benefit does not extend to the attacks made by virtue of TWF.
If you want to Two weapon attack with a Nunchaku, you need two Nunchakus since it is NOT a double weapon.
I don't know about the rest of you, but on my planet while playing D&D and using one Nunchaku with both hands such as by Bruce Lee aka a Monk... we call that "Flurry of Blows with Nunchaku"(a monk weapon).
I don't care for the Weapon Swap Feat, BUT I would suggest that it be written more clearly or perhaps adding it into the Two-Weapon Fighting description as an alternate option of getting that 2nd attack. I think that opens an interesting door for the 'knife fighter' (or rogue). Either way when the weapon hits your off-hand it has to be a light weapon, which in itself isn't really that scary until magic is involved.
Good. Off with its head!
Good. Off with its head!
*Snorts at KaeYoss, seemingly amused.*
Good. Off with its head!*Snorts at KaeYoss, seemingly amused.*
As long as you're not some mummed vigilante come to free it while publicly renouncing my rule, snort all you want.
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My problem with this feat is not so much the game balance of the 2-weapon fighter now needing to buy only one magic weapon, but more that I find the idea of a fighter slowly working his way up the ranks until at high level, he wields his two swords as one epically enchanted kingslayer, and his rusty farm knife from first level which he never uses, but juggles from hand to hand to gain more attacks somehow. This is solveable through descriptive DMing, though.
glad its going, going, gone....
some of the ideas for feinting, gaining advantage etc i'd like to see developed, not for twf (as i think they do fairly well already, especially finessed multi-class fighter rogues when flanking....) but more for the swf without a shield.
at the moment with a single weapon your off hand might as well be holding a pint of beer in combat if it hasn't got a shield. a feat which allowed you to take advantage of this free hand for CMB, skill checks or feint purpose would give some love to the swashbuckler / fencer style of fighting....
EDIT: Or a feat which allowed you not to spill your pint of beer while fighting.....