
Turin the Mad |

I might have been biased against the 'tactical movement' because my old DM required it be me that did it. I think thats because he could never beat me at chess....the D&D board was his territory. Yeah...it was REALLY shady.
I'll try the 3-4 word cap out next time, see how it works for me.
That is indeed truly shady. Frankly, I'd be biased against it just because I never got to move my own character - doing that for someone else when necessary is one thing - doing it when required, offensive.
And yeah, the word-limit thing, it will depend on how you and your group finds it works best. I've found the challenge to my players to come up with a way to communicate within the 4-word framework to be ideal. ^_^ It also forces them to pay attention through the other players' turns, which is rather important in a large group.

Turin the Mad |

Hey, Turin, I realize that I have personally never perused the Sinister Spire. What sort of nastiness is going to be in store for them when they foray farther in?
Well, they are a good chunk of the way through it, so I am fervently hoping that the end encounter does in all or most of the party.
As written, the party faces off with:
* A pair of puny drow spellchuckers (female cleric, male sorceror), currently at beginning of that fight.
* A Hall of Haunted Mirrors (with mirror golems, almost impossible to bypass)
* A Shrine to Lolth (with a bone spider golem, if they take the bait)
* A ghoul mimic in the kitchen (if they don't completely bypass it)
* A few glyphs of warding
* A flesh golem with a pair of undead swarms (just about impossible to bypass barring the group getting a successful turn attempt)
* A handful of living spells (meh)
* A couple of fairly tough undead encounters (which they may well bypass)
* A Shrine to Orcus (which again could well be bypassed)
* The big showdown - the BBEG herself (Yuan-Ti/Medusa hybrid, a blood golem of some sort and a handful of mooks)
So far, all I've done in the module is maximize thier hit points and adjust the numbers of critters encountered when it seemed appropriate to do so. I will probably leave all but the BBEG and her mini-onions as-modified, while upgunning that specific encounter with the below-mentioned 'upgrade package'.

Turin the Mad |

Not too bad....what is the projected character level by the end of all this?
I would also be interested in hearing what you have actually decided to do to beef up the Bullywug's Gambit for these powered up PCs.
Largely, it depends on when I will be shipped DD3 : Fortress of the Yuan-Ti - as well as whether or not the BBEG at the end acquires herself a nice statuary collection. If I am to receive it soon, I expect to basically "shut down" everything but the unavoidable encounters and mush the chuckleheads through the place to greatly slow down the XP pile up. In this case, I suspect most or all of them will be 5th level before they get to her, certainly so afterwards.
If they go through the whole pile (i.e., I'm looking at 2 or 3 more sessions before receiving DD3) however, I'm guesstimating them at 5th and maybe even 6th level when the showdown occurs with the BBEG and her mini-onions.
In essence, I expect to have a 7th or 8th level (or worse, even 9th level) numbering 9 characters total party by the time they return to the Bullywug Gambit. I plan to be rather liberal with the application of alarm spells and potions for the mooks at Vanderboren Manor and to apply some sort of 'innate bonus' to the krewe that bushwhacks them before they get to the Manor itself. (My guideline will be to hit the group's average AC about half the time across the board.) Kraken Cove I plan to make as unpleasant as possible for them as well, especially in the one or two primary encounter areas of that location.
More likely, I'll simply tack on the elite ability score array (without the pesky -2 penalty), maximize hit points and grant them some kind of insight attack bonus (most likely an insight bonus to attack rolls equal to thier highest mental ability modifier) to everything they face without actually advancing anything in CR. (Or, if I do adjust the CR, it won't be more than a single point.)Frankly, I will still adjust xp awards depending upon how easily they walk through the encounters until they catch up to thier proper point in the Savage Tide itself.
Actually, I rather like this last 'package' modification. In the short term it will be a fair bit of legwork, but in the long run it will make it pretty rewarding for me to run the scalliwags through the rest of the AP.

Turin the Mad |

I've seen you mention that particular....'Upgrade Package' before.
I have to admit, I like it. I've used something similar in the past before, but nothing that actually had structure. Simple, easy to apply. Just have to remember to add in the bonuses and adjustments.
Yup, think I'll work it up in a more "stat block-ish" format and post it here tonight.
It also has the especially nice additional bonus of not providing unintended additional stockpiles of low-end magical swag in the party's mitts...digs out his Monster Manual

Yasha0006 |

Yeah, you can only tack on so many 'little' magic items before you realize the party has a stockpile large enough of Quaal's Feather Tokens to buy themselves some nice magical gear.
I'm actually not joking here, I gamed a few sessions with this strange strange DM who seemed to have some obsession with Quaal's. I'm not sure why, nearly every mook had a handful. It was decidedly strange. On the other hand, my cavalier went through most of that adventure barefoot.
Good boost, no pesky treasure. Better challenge.

Turin the Mad |

Yeah, you can only tack on so many 'little' magic items before you realize the party has a stockpile large enough of Quaal's Feather Tokens to buy themselves some nice magical gear.
I'm actually not joking here, I gamed a few sessions with this strange strange DM who seemed to have some obsession with Quaal's. I'm not sure why, nearly every mook had a handful. It was decidedly strange. On the other hand, my cavalier went through most of that adventure barefoot.Good boost, no pesky treasure. Better challenge.
QFT's eh ? Those things are surprisingly handy (like Figurines of Wondrous Power, only much cheaper). And of course they sell well - and I do believe Quaal gets an 'honorable mention' in the Expedition to Greyhawk Ruins 'mini AP' hardcover. The description of some of the old names of yesteryore is quite gratifying.
Using the Bullywug Gambit, with a total of about 2 dozen or so mooks of various stripes, each getting about 5k gpv of swag - all of a sudden, you've handed the party an extra 120,000 gp in one Chapter! And even with 8 or 9 PCs, that is a LOT of swag they shouldn't have until much later on. Since they'll already be getting 'book standard swag' from the side quests and the AP proper, plus the incalculable value of the Legacy items themselves, there's no way I'm going to snowball it worse than it already is.

Yasha0006 |

Yes...its all about Wands and other charged items, with only a handful of charges remaining. Or the ubitquitous One-Shot items, that the mooks can completely burn through before the PCs have a chance to go for them.
Or you can just always use something the PCs have done before against them, and throw a angry Druid or Monk with Vow of Poverty against them.
Have they done anything to offend the green gods yet? Like inadverdently burning down a major swathe of jungle? They did throw around alot of lamp oil.

Turin the Mad |

Yes...its all about Wands and other charged items, with only a handful of charges remaining. Or the ubitquitous One-Shot items, that the mooks can completely burn through before the PCs have a chance to go for them.
Or you can just always use something the PCs have done before against them, and throw a angry Druid or Monk with Vow of Poverty against them.
Have they done anything to offend the green gods yet? Like inadverdently burning down a major swathe of jungle? They did throw around alot of lamp oil.
Well... they did incinerate an AWFUL lot of cockroaches ...
And I prefer the 'upgrade package' to tacking on the piles of low-charge items ... they will still not be fully depleted...

Turin the Mad |

As promised, the "Upgrade Your Bad Guys without Swag" Template:
AUGMENTED ANTAGONIST TEMPLATE
"Augmented Antagonist" is an assigned template that can be added to any creature you deem fit as the GM which will be facing a party far in excess of where you are in the campaign arc. An augmented antagonist uses all of the base creature's statistics and special abilities, plus the following:
Size and type: Type does not change, subtype changes to augmented of whatever the critter is to begin with. 'Nuff said.
Modify the ability scores listed for your critter / NPC by +4, +4, +2, +2, +0, +0 as you deem necessary. Adjust all pertinent bonuses, saving throws, attack bonuses, hit points, skill points, etc. as necessitated by the adjusted ability scores (ex).
Hit points per Hit Die are maximized (ex).
Add an attack bonus (as an extraordinary or supernatural ability) for all attacks the critter / NPC is capable of equal to the highest of thier mental ability score bonuses. If none are applicable, add the DEX modifier to the STR modifier for melee attacks, add the DEX modifier twice for ranged attacks. If all else fails, tack on an appropriate attack bonus to bring its best multi-attack sequence to where it can generally hit your party's best normal AC on an 11 or better. Type it appropriately: insight, sacred, profane, luck, morale, enhancement,
Challenge Rating: At best this warrants a +1 increase to the base creature's CR. Award XP accordingly to how much of a kiester-kicking your augmented antagonist actually dishes out to your player characters. Be sure to award any of these that survive full XP for any PC's they frag, according to how easy (or hard) it was for them to kick your PC's rear ends.
Oh ... the obligatory sample critter, almost forgot:
Advanced Augmented Antagonist Rhagodessa, bka 'Super Deathbugs'
Flavor Text: as per Dungeon #139 p.46, replacing "pony" with "destrier", or perhaps "small house". Or, get a certain movie out with similar-looking critters and freeze-frame it for your players - and watch 'em squirm ...
Always Neutral Large Vermin (Augmented Vermin): CR 6 (base 2,+2 for +8 vermin HD,+1 for template,+1 for tremorsense added on)
Init. + 1;Senses: darkvision 60ft,low-light vision,tremorsense 60ft; Listen +3;Spot+3
AC: 15(natural armor+5;DEX mod.+1;-1 size); Touch AC 10; Flat-footed AC 14; Flat-footed Touch AC 9
HP:156 (12d8+60 CON, maximized){statistical average hit points would be a mere 114, although I would reduce the CR to 5 in such cases.}
Immune: Vermin traits
Fort +13; Reflex+5; Will+7
Speed 40ft,Climb 40ft
Melee pedilpalp+22 (0 damage plus improved grab = free bite attack)
Full Melee Attack:2 pedilpalps+21(0 damage, or 1d4 damage if grappled creature escapes with an opposed grapple check instead of an Escape Artist check, plus improved grab)and bite+16(2d6+15 B/S/P)[The free
action bite from winning each pedilpalp grapple check is at a +20 on the attack roll. The -1 size penalty to attack rolls is factored in.]
Space 10ft, Reach 5ft, Base Attack Bonus+9 (effectively +12 with WIS modifier as insight attack bonus), Grapple+27 (BAB+9, size+4, STR+10, racial+4)
Attack Options: Spring Attack (as per the feat), Improved Grab (pedilpalp), Powerful Bite [These are detailed in Dungeon magazine issue #139, page 46]
Abilities: STR 31 (19,+8 size,+4 template),DEX 12(+2 template,-2 size), CON 21(+4 size,+4 template),INT -,WIS 16(+2 template),CHA 6
FEATS: Multiattack(bonus), Spring Attack (bonus)
SKILLS: Climb +18 (can always take 10, as per Climb speed description),Listen+3,Spot+3
Environment: Any underground or by Figurine of Wondrous Power (Aquamarine Deathbug)
Organization: Solitary, Pair, Brood (3-8) or as many figurines as the BBEG can afford (about 95,000 gpv per)
Treasure: none unless the GM is feeling generous; could be from the carcasses of your previous PCs, you Monster Manual-reading player you.
Advancement: none or by templates that are compatible with augmented vermin.
Enjoy everyone!! ^_^

Turin the Mad |

Yes...its all about Wands and other charged items, with only a handful of charges remaining. Or the ubitquitous One-Shot items, that the mooks can completely burn through before the PCs have a chance to go for them.
Or you can just always use something the PCs have done before against them, and throw a angry Druid or Monk with Vow of Poverty against them.
Have they done anything to offend the green gods yet? Like inadverdently burning down a major swathe of jungle? They did throw around alot of lamp oil.
An angry, not personable Druid with Vow of Poverty, an animal summoning fetish and some seriously dubious ability score and hit point rolls, yep yep - sounds good to me.
At the rate they're degenerating into Evil by the behavior most of them are playing, I won't be surprised in the least.

Yasha0006 |

If you really want to make them feel bad, you could always find some way to start sending Paladins and other do-gooders after them.
I did that in a campaign where the characters slipped into evil once.
Here they are terrorizing villagers for loot and free lodgings, and the were actually SHOCKED out of their minds when the LG crusader party showed up. (i.e. a couple of paladins and clerics).
They even tried to defend their actions to the group. Oh yeah, that went over well. After the battle, a few characters even surrendered (the group was from the Heironian church, a god that the party leader 'supposedly' worshipped). The others were healed or raised so that they might actually pay for their crimes, as if dying wasn't enough. Hehehe
They straightened up right quick after that. Bear in mind I've only done this the one time, and mainly because these supposedly good PCs started the downward spiral of moral degradation. It was worth it for the looks alone.

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Gentle Readers,
What did you think of the Augmented Antagonist template and the sample advanced deathbug ?
If I was a tribe, I would worship it.
The template looks like fun, and is completely fair and what they deserve to boot. I'll try it on a few things and let you know what happens. It'll be a while though - a plague of influenza has taken my players and families.

Arctaris |

Ow. This looks like something that'll keep in reserve for sometime when my players get a little too uppity for theri own good.
I'd like to point out that it has no intelligence score, which is usually something only found in constructs and (I think) a few types of undead. Animal usually have an Int score of 1-3.
Once those suckers hit 6th level...

Turin the Mad |

Ow. This looks like something that'll keep in reserve for sometime when my players get a little too uppity for theri own good.
I'd like to point out that it has no intelligence score, which is usually something only found in constructs and (I think) a few types of undead. Animal usually have an Int score of 1-3.
Once those suckers hit 6th level...
Arctaris, it is vermin, which have no INT score (and the attendant immunity to mind-affecting effects) as a general rule of thumb. With tremorsense and its limited visual acuity, it hunts what prey it can catch - and being of an underground habitat by preference, the odds of easy escape are rather small. I built this critter directly of James Jacobs' write-up of rhagodessa in the first Chapter of the Savage Tide (which also lists it with no INT score - and more importantly is what comes with having the vermin creature type), advanced it as far as it can go then tacked on my home-brewed "augmented antagonist" template for good measure.
And if they think one of these is nasty ... wait until they are able to handle a brood of 3-8 of these puppies ... especially if they have a 'wrangler' in the background...
I'm glad they are likable beasties ... nothing like 6d6+45 points of biting damage in one round to wake some one up from a spate of overconfidence. ^_^

Turin the Mad |

Turin the Mad wrote:Gentle Readers,
What did you think of the Augmented Antagonist template and the sample advanced deathbug ?
If I was a tribe, I would worship it.
The template looks like fun, and is completely fair and what they deserve to boot. I'll try it on a few things and let you know what happens. It'll be a while though - a plague of influenza has taken my players and families.
I wanted something that would present a modest challenge to either an oversized or an overlevelled group (or both) without having to use the traditional (dispellable and lootable) collection of potions, one-use wondrous items and low-charges-remaining wands that (in my experience) all too often winds up getting dispelled and/or looted far earlier than even the standard buffing methods provided for. (Especially I wanted to avoid escalation of party loot.)
I also most definitely did NOT want to resort to the standard templates, which would generally distort the creature/NPC too far from the original write-up's intended 'feel'. This template seems to strike a happy medium between buffing the critter/NPC enough to make a noticable difference without boosting it so far that it would be undefeatable. Nor do I wish to equally ramp up the XP award for the critter, which too many players (at least in my group) are able to mentally calculate based on known species/race and templates.
Since I expect this to come into play whenever I notice that the group is ahead of the anticipated 'power curve' in the STAP (as they are now), it will be very easy for me to 'plug-n-play' before or - if need be - during game play.
Carborundum, my best wishes to your family and friends in overcome the early flu season.

Turin the Mad |

Excellent news gentle readers and cravers of carnage (which I admit to having too-long neglected to provide at the expense of my players' characters of late). DD3: Fortress of the Yuan-Ti has arrived as of yesterday, so I shall elect to 'deactivate' all but 2 of the encounters remaining in the Sinister Spire in order to permit them to fully appreciate the nastiness that is Fadheela, yuan-ti medusa, assassin for hire. Suitably augmented as an antagonist for thier terrifying displeasure.
After all, I can certainly re-activate them (DD3 permitting) as they return through the ozone gate and attempt to depart the Sinister Spire if I so choose to further torment them.
Now watch, they bypass the rest of the 'Side Quest' completely come Sunday, fearful of becoming loot.
My thanks to the Paizo folks for the excellent timing of thier shipment. My group tends to find my gleeful chuckling and "oh my, that is rather nasty " comments from behind the cover of a module rather distressing for some reason... probably because I did just that when I first read through the deathbug's 'generic' stat block just prior to dismembering 6 of them in the first session.
To recap breifly, the band of scurrilous scalliwags (unofficially dubbed "Minions of a Pimp") has just begun a combat with the two drow Es Sarch sends them to forcibly remove from the remnants of the political power structure in the otherwise insignificant Underdark city of Pedestal. The curving 10ft wide hallway outside the drow matron's torture chamber is fairly filled with a Web spell. Two summoned demon-spiders are about to attempt to chow on the bard/rogue and warlock at the eastern end of said hallway. The rest of the party is at the western end, incinerating thier way through the webbing.
What they will find during round 2 is (a) the matron knows how to use Organripper (at the to-be-graphically-audibled [I have a modest knack for vocalizations and uttered sound effects] expense of the sacrificial victim already on the alter), (b) that the mage knows Flaming Sphere and really wants to cook a surface dweller alive, and (c) the mad prophet Numa's status as a carrier of Ash Doom in life did him no stead after his messy demise at the group's hands not long before.
The bard/rogue, the cloistered cleric/wizard of Boccob and the INT 7 Favored Soul of Tharizdun are infected (no symptoms showing), infected (no symptoms showing) and showing signs of having been infected (dim green points of light beneath his skin) by Ash Doom respectively. (Sadly, the favored soul has already suffered 1 pt of CON drain.)
And Numa's incorporeal vengeance will be striking the rear-most ranks of the party during round 2 as well, spreading both whispered mutterings of Tharizdun-like rambling and the always entertaining Ash Doom. Remove Disease is not available to them (although Delay Disease is should the cleric/wizard survive long enough to be able to prepare the spell on the morrow game time), they are about to find themselves in a pincer, and I may yet get a hot d20 (which is long overdue me) with the demon-spiders to masticate the pair of PCs off by thier lonesome...

Turin the Mad |

Now....I just can't wait to see who kills more this weekend, you Turin or Allen (provided he actually got to run AoW).
Actually, the session this afternoon/evening was a rather interesting one, in spite of a late start time (hour and a half late - d'oh!) and taking far longer than I thought it would.
Picking up right where we left off in the midst of combat with the drow cleric and wizard (and 2 summoned fiendish Medium spiders), the party quickly suffered from the mad plaguelost Numa attacking the party from its rear ranks where only the grey elf wizard remained.
The crusader lobbed a flask of alchemists' fire into the midst of the webbing (with a very high ranged attack roll) incinerating a huge swath of the stuff in one go. The drow wizard rolled a Flaming Sphere out into the hallway through the still-open secret door. The two demon-spiders were messily dispatched (and my dice were not too kind) by the pimp and the warlock with a pitch-hit from the barbarian.
The wizard smartly fled the wrath of the plaguelost, into the torture chamber with the bulk of the rest of the party.
The crusader entered into the fray with the wizard (who had maneuvered to achieve a straight-line roll of the flaming sphere into the hallway through the door) but missed. As the fight played out, the drow cleric gutted the sacrificial gnome like a fish, tried and failed on both the blindness and contagion spells to do anything significant to the druid-shapeshifter, smote the crusader as he moved through her space to achieve flank - all in all, she took a chunk out but of course it was insufficient. The drow wizard was brutally slain (as I transferred his amulet to Fadheela) by the Fighter as I recall.
The plaguelost proved to be a more formidable combatant than his formerly living self. He was successful in damaging the wizard's CON to a 4 (having at one point dropped her to negative hp before the killing blow scored by the crusader via Crusader Strike brought her back to positive hp) and ministering the loving Ash Doom disease to the wizard. At the high point, 3 characters had Ash Doom ravaging thier systems. Eventually, despite numerous missed eldritch blasts, blown spell penetration checks and incorporeal miss chances, the sheer volume of firepower that the party of 9 characters could generate brought Numa the Plaguelost Drow low (a CR 5).
Smartly, the party retreated to Es Sarch's "inn" for 2 nights' rest, using multiple aid-anothered Heal checks to administer long-term care and rid themselves of the Ash Doom disease without need to travel to the Glowy Blue Island of Invisible Mushroom Death.
Upon completing the deed, Sarch gave them the protective ring that would permit them to (one at a time) bypass the Thousand-fold Destruction Trap guarding the sole entry way into the Necromancer's Spike.
After a scuffle with 2 48hp drow fighter guards - which almost brought the pimp to negative hp and did see the barbarian Sir Hexen Ineptus [not his real character name] succumb to the infamous drow sleep poison - messily dispatching them and looting the bodies, they set up to hustle through the entry chamber and into the Spike itself.
The spirit of the Forgotten King bade the mage take the left-most doorway to acquire the Queen's Staff.
The generally attentive pimp, rather inattentive to the instructions of the 'token', accompanied the cloistered cleric/wizard into the entry chamber, failed his Fortitude save miserably and promptly destructed into gray ash and a heap of his equipment.
After 2 rounds (out of 10 that the token provides as protection) total time for the cloistered cleric, they devised a fishing line contraption to permit them to ferry the ring back and forth from entry to door. Sadly, they were meticulously efficient in ensuring they shared the ring appropriately, and (barely) got the 8 surviving characters into the left-hand hallway beyond the entry chamber, the last round of protection expiring as the absentee player character (the crusader, whose player had to go to work not long after the session began) made it into the hallway.
So, 13 character deaths thus far, only 1 on this side quest, the other 12 on the main campaign arc.
Our brave band of scalliwags - now short the pimp's player due to group size and a desire to have some kind of free time on the weekend - now finds itself in the Necromancer's Spike, with no trapfinder, and no way to go back out through the entryway for 24 hours' time. I will have the Kingmaker guide the bearer through the not-absolutely-necessary encounters to hurry through to the Queen's Staff, so I expect to be able to conclude the Sinister Spire next session. (3 encounters, 8 players maximum, no problem.) Of course, there are a few glyphs of warding on thier route up...

Turin the Mad |

After posting this, I had a discussion with the player of the cloistered cleric/wizard, received an e-mail from the pimp's player and have (previous to tonight) been discussing with Allen Stewart regarding the group composition for the Saturday Savage Tide campaign slated to begin on 17 November.
In summary, the Sunday 'crew' would shrink to 5 with 4 of them transferring to the Saturday 'crew' to join with Allen and perhaps one other (who remains 'yet to be determined') to sign on for the long haul for a fresh Savage Tide campaign. In effect, I would have TWO Savage Tides to run, using the weekly Sunday crew to 'playtest' certain concepts for the Saturday crew. Both would be at a far more managable size, and both should have a healthy rate of progress.
I've also realized that my 'reporting' of the games' events has been ... uneven, to be nice to myself. I shall attempt to amend that situation shortly.

Turin the Mad |

Session 10, Sunday Savage Tide Crew, only 3 1/2 hours playtime due to a late start by the GM due to a family mini-trip.
The battle resumed where it had left off at. Profuse thanks to the Paizonians who came up with the combat pad, as it had the initiative order on it from the end of the last session. I've acquired a 2nd pad to accomodate running 2 different groups... I shall have to acquire a couple of notebooks or something to keep campaign notes in and preserve my sanity I think.
The 10' wide curving hallway outside the torture chamber of the Matron of House Dusklorn, Elessarwa, was filled with a Web spell cast by her pet wizard. (She is a drow cleric of Lolth, he a vanilla 12 hp drow wizard.) A pair of demon-spiders threatens to masticate the Pimp and the Warlock at the eastern end, while the Favored Soul of Tharizdun, the Crusader, the shapeshifter druidess of Obad-Hai (now affiliated with the Azure Cathedral due to her donations from her Vow of Poverty), the Barbarian, the Fighter, the Cloistered Cleric/Wizard of Boccob and the grey elf Wizard (patron gawd unknown) extend westwards from the other side of the Web. A helpless female svirfneblin is strapped to the altar (while two male svirfneblin look on from the cell). The newly-spawned plaguelost drow warrior Numa is about to pounce on the party from the west, unbeknownst to them.
As the initiative resumes, the pair of demon-spiders fail in thier feeble attempts to masticate either the pimp or the warlock. (With a puny +4 attack bonus and no orders to webbify thier targets, they simply attempted to munch.) The pimp elects to fight defensively, skewering one of the spiders most thoroughly. The warlock vaporizes the same spider a moment later. The crusader lobs a flask of alchemists' fire into the webbing and incinerates a swath of webbing blocking the open secret door, while the previously-burning swath of webbing collapses into a heap of ash with hefty encouragement by the boot-stomping of the favored soul. The wizard elects to place a spell on herself, the druid buffs herself with a resistance spell, the cleric/wizard cheers the party on and the fighter likewise assists the favored soul with putting down a burning stretch of webbing.
The Matron uses Organripper to coup de gras the female svirfneblin on her action (who acts next-to-last in the round), while the wizard (who acts first in the round) maneuvers to achieve line of sight-and-effect on the doorway before rolling a Flaming Sphere into the 5ft space just outside the (not-so) secret door leading into the torture chamber. The pimp, warlock and barbarian (who braved the Web spell, bulling his way through to contribute to exterminating the demon-spiders) proceed to annihilate the ineffective critter. The Crusader dashes past the Flaming Sphere and amazingly whiffed on squishing the wizard. The Fighter trundles forward into the room for his double move, as does the druidess, the favored soul, and the cleric/wizard, while the grey elf wizard casts a Melf's Acid Arrow and elects to hold the charge. At that point, Numa drifts in beside the unarmed wizard and jabs her, draining a point of CON and damaging 1 or 2 more, concluding the round.
The drow wizard steps back from the crusader, rolls his flaming sphere onto the crusader and blasts him with his wand of magic missiles - only to see them stopped cold by the Shield spell item he commissioned in Sasserine before returning to the Barrow. The pimp, as he moves into the torture chamber, Quick Reconnoiter-spots Numa and barks out a warning to the rest of the group.
Over the next several rounds, the wizard is brutally crushed by the crusader (who had to give his amulet over to Fadheela or be turned into a lawn ornament), the matron is hounded into road pizza by the crusader, the druidess, the favored soul, the fighter and the pimp. The wizard is brought to a 4 CON and joins the Ash Doom club with the favored soul and the warlock. Numerous blows missed due to incorporeality, eldritch blasts and acid arrows failed to either penetrate his meager SR or his incorporeality and the hit points gained from the easy prey the wizardess presents Numa prolong his blasphemous existance far longer than it otherwise would have. In the end, the group prevails, loots the bodies of the drow and frees the svirfneblin from the cell.
Upon completing the task assigned by Es Sarch, they return, collect the token to get past the 'foyer' of the Necromancer's Spike and spend two nights' using long-term care by Heal checks to recuperate from and throw off the Ash Doom (save for the 1 pt of CON drain currently enjoyed by the wizard, the favored soul and the warlock). They have now gone through a total of 4 months, 12 days of game time. The cloistered cleric/wizard and the pimp finally achieved 5th level in the aftermath, with several other characters not too far behind. The others are all 4th level.
After spells preparations and breaking fast, they set out to the Necromancer's Spike, receiving a hostile greeting from the two tough (48hp) Drow Fighters tasked to guard the entryway in the name of House Dusklorn.
Combat ensues here with a surprise round sneak attack shot (which misses) by the pimp's light crossbow. Top of the round sees the barbarian gleefully charging forward to wail on the outermost guard - and whiffing. That guard goes next, slashes the barbarian ... and amazingly, said barbarian totals an 11 Fort save against the infamous sleep poison and takes a one minute nap. After a drawn out fight, which the drow archer fought valiantly to escape (and losing his poisoned scimitar to the pimp's formidable disarming technique), successfully baited the pimp into a cheap shot with a dagger - and even better, the GM scoring a critical hit on the next action by that fighter, sorely wounding the pimp. Although 2 players were attempting to secure his surrender, the other party members ruthlessly prosecuted the combat, butchering all the foes they came across. The favored soul was kind enough to prevent the Long Nap from the secondary save of the poison from affecting the babarian.
After looting the corpses, they proceed to follow the slightly-flawed direction of the pimp. The cleric/wizard (bearing the token-ring) and the pimp stroll forward into the Guardian Chamber of the Spike - and the pimp is outright Destructioned. The cleric/wizard promptly sweeps up his ashes and his swag and the party plots how to proceed further into the Spike after such a graphic display of what awaits them.
The DC 20 Fortitude (10+7 for spell level+3 for ability modifier) save was more than the pimp could generate, thus the Destruction was swift and permanent.
With a meticulous plan for sharing the ring involving a creative use of fishing line, they (barely, literally expiring the last round of the token's protection as they get the crusader across the chamber) are piled up in the hallway on the left-most side of the bottom level of the Spike. The characters camp out in an empty chamber on the west side of that floor and camp for the night.

Yasha0006 |

Allow me just to say..."He's the pimp of the year..."
And "Another one bites the Dust!" literally in this case. So ends the Saga of the Pimpmeister of Sasserine. Ashes to Ashes, Dust to Dust.
Good one Turin! From what I saw he was the brains of that party too. Thats too bad. Is he going to move over to your other Savage Tide game then once it gets running?
Now if I could only Teleport as a spell-like twice per week, I could take part.

Turin the Mad |

Allow me just to say..."He's the pimp of the year..."
And "Another one bites the Dust!" literally in this case. So ends the Saga of the Pimpmeister of Sasserine. Ashes to Ashes, Dust to Dust.
Good one Turin! From what I saw he was the brains of that party too. Thats too bad. Is he going to move over to your other Savage Tide game then once it gets running?
Now if I could only Teleport as a spell-like twice per week, I could take part.
Hey Yasha - if I could acquire that ability IRL, I'd be greedy enough to shoot for "at will" like so many outsiders get. It'd save me SO much money on the vehicle, gas, insurance, etc etc...
He was one of 3 reliably intelligent players - and you are correct, he is going to 'transfer' to the Saturday Savage Tide crew when that campaign starts upon the conclusion of Allen's Age of Worms campaign - more details on that when I have solid information as opposed to speculation.
Yes indeed, the ST Obits thread post already drew a comment regarding that trap. I altered it to permit the minimum possible save DC for the trap's spell (Destruction, DC 20 Fortitude) since the written description is overwhelmingly unfair (your character goes *pouf* end of story).)
And were it not for your west coast geography - as opposed to our east coast - you would be more than welcome to attend. ^_^

Turin the Mad |

Oh Noes ... the end BBEG of the Fortress of the Yuan-Ti - should my players prove so greedy as to attempt it - is absolutely brutal!! (Anticipated party level of 8th for 4 characters ... against an encounter level of 16 ... whoa...)
I think I shall have to gleefully permit them to hack thier way through the rest of the Sinister Spire in its full glory just to get them enough xp to have a snowballs' chance in a furnace against that fellow!
*Robocop thug voice* I LIKE IT!!

Allen Stewart |

Yes, our dearly departed pimp was a sure thing in the 'Pimp of the Year' competition. What cemented it for me was his beautiful poem, "My B***H Better Have My Money", truly a moving and heartfelt tribute to those whom he worked with... (if you can guess the movie that poem comes from Turin, I'll give you 100 bonus XP in AoW)

Turin the Mad |

Yes, our dearly departed pimp was a sure thing in the 'Pimp of the Year' competition. What cemented it for me was his beautiful poem, "My B***H Better Have My Money", truly a moving and heartfelt tribute to those whom he worked with... (if you can guess the movie that poem comes from Turin, I'll give you 100 bonus XP in AoW)
Guess eh ? I'm Gonna Git You Sucka ?
I'm such an xp whore sometimes ...

Turin the Mad |

Hey, you can't beat the yellow pimp suit and fishtank platforms he wears in his attempted comeback. Sweet!
LoL. Being stealthy, he was smarter than to dress up in bright colors, instead choosing more tastefully pimpish purples, greys and blacks. (His choice of tailoring was another matter of course, but at least he wasn't a day-glo target.) The now-deceased Bard/Rogue Pimp that is, not the movie character.

Yasha0006 |

Heheh...
He still deserved to die, regardless of whether he was or wasn't prismatically challenged. Hmm...I like that term.
Now did you say the endgame of the Barrow-Spire-Yuan-Ti Trilogy was an EL 16?
0.o
Thaaat should be interesting....
I still want a chance to use a Yuan-Ti Anathema again...I love those things! I have only ever been able to use one once, only once....
Oh yes...after about 8 rounds of combat...the party fled...oh yes they did. Hmm...maybe there is some way to throw one into the latter part of the AP somewhere...?
Though I think a Yuan Ti would be more appropriate in Savage Tide than AoW. As you are doing of course, Turin.
Now are you planning any more sidequests after this point? I'm starting to think that they are going to be high enough level to get lulled into a false sense of security through the next 2-3 arcs of the AP. I think some of the difficulty should really catch up once they make the trip to the Isle. Another nice thing Turin. With the advanced party level going on here, you can use Turbo Olangru that was posted previously. Talk about nasty.

Turin the Mad |

Heheh...
He still deserved to die, regardless of whether he was or wasn't prismatically challenged. Hmm...I like that term.
Now did you say the endgame of the Barrow-Spire-Yuan-Ti Trilogy was an EL 16?
0.oThaaat should be interesting....
I still want a chance to use a Yuan-Ti Anathema again...I love those things! I have only ever been able to use one once, only once....
Oh yes...after about 8 rounds of combat...the party fled...oh yes they did. Hmm...maybe there is some way to throw one into the latter part of the AP somewhere...?
Though I think a Yuan Ti would be more appropriate in Savage Tide than AoW. As you are doing of course, Turin.Now are you planning any more sidequests after this point? I'm starting to think that they are going to be high enough level to get lulled into a false sense of security through the next 2-3 arcs of the AP. I think some of the difficulty should really catch up once they make the trip to the Isle. Another nice thing Turin. With the advanced party level going on here, you can use Turbo Olangru that was posted previously. Talk about nasty.
*Chuckling* I would prefer the term "fashion challenged" and reserve prismatically-challenged for the suckers that get vaped by Prismatic Sprays or running through an Illusory Wall in front of a Prismatic Wall.
Oh yes, the end-game uberbosscritter of the Fortress of the Yuan-Ti is the corrupted melding of the bones of the Forgotten King with a dash of demon lord essence and a healthy dose of about 250 hp as-written. 21 HD undead packing a CR 16 and several quickened spell-like abilities - utterly utterly NASTY, especially for an 8th level party. And that's a mere handful of rounds after getting thier asses kicked by a CR 11! (Yeah, they can get some nice dooflichies to stomp on him with and whatnot, and even a small pool of "party" action points ala Eberron, but I remain uncertain as to how much oomph that really tacks onto the party. Granted, with 4th level spells available to them (hopefully), it MIGHT not be a death sentence ... but it IS nasty, no question.)
I myself am seriously considering retooling the kupri critters out to yuan-ti ... but that would entail retooling two entire chapters if memory serves, a particularly unpleasant task. However, nothing says that yuan-ti cannot be swapped out at other parts of the Savage Tide.
Yes, even with the Augmented Antagonist template liberally applied, they should get through the chapters leading up to the Isle of Dread - well, at least up until they hit the Sargasso - with relative ease, achieving a wonderful sense of false security indeed.
Granted, I did a magic item switch (as mentioned previously), and applied the "auggie" template to Fadheela to boot. I doubt they will get to her any time soon though, since they will likely persist in a "sweep and clear" for the entire Spike. She is very, very nasty indeed - and the 24 temporary hit point amulet I swapped from the puke drow wizard to her puts her just over 100 hp. With petrification and poison packing a DC 18 save, she is a real threat to the entire party.
Granted, if the group shift happens I'm thinking will happen, I *might* adjust the encounter a bit ... but probably not. I'll burn that bridge when the time comes.
Regarding side quests, oh yes. I plan to acquire (from Allen) the expanded Shrine of Tamoachoan (which is en route to the Isle of Dread) and then homebrewing up a nice juicy pile of baddies for the Magnificent Seven indigenous to the Isle itself. Then there will be the final side quest pertaining to a group of hungry monks or something (I cannot remember the name off the top of my head) in or around Scuttlecove proper.
Finally, I've been giving the concept of a 'paradigm shift' to both campaigns regarding magic items. (Think I mentioned that above.)
And yes, Olangru and a few other baddies on the Isle will get my undivided attention. The better to fold, maim, mutilate, spindle and staple the PCs with ... nyuknyuknyuk.

Yasha0006 |

This is one of the things that I absolutely...like, about you and Allen. You both seem to enjoy the Design stage as much as the Implementation Stage, as do I. I just wish my wife would give me more time...oh well, I have vacation coming up here. Crunch Time.
Seriously getting work done on AoW and trying to make as many adjustments as I feel are needed ahead of time will save me a great deal of trouble in the long run, but running about 6 hours of game every other night (last four nights in row actually with Sat night going about 10 hours) simply drains me sometimes.
Think on this too Turin, I am looking very closely at your Savage Tide, because, should the ever elusive Regular Weekly Gaming Group be caught by yours truly, I will most likely use what you have done with ST as a guide for what to do with mine. So every little bit of help and advice I can give you I am essentially giving to myself in written form, for perusal later. Its a win win situation. Heh, even just looking back on the encouragement will help.

Turin the Mad |

This is one of the things that I absolutely...like, about you and Allen. You both seem to enjoy the Design stage as much as the Implementation Stage, as do I. I just wish my wife would give me more time...oh well, I have vacation coming up here. Crunch Time.
Seriously getting work done on AoW and trying to make as many adjustments as I feel are needed ahead of time will save me a great deal of trouble in the long run, but running about 6 hours of game every other night (last four nights in row actually with Sat night going about 10 hours) simply drains me sometimes.
Think on this too Turin, I am looking very closely at your Savage Tide, because, should the ever elusive Regular Weekly Gaming Group be caught by yours truly, I will most likely use what you have done with ST as a guide for what to do with mine. So every little bit of help and advice I can give you I am essentially giving to myself in written form, for perusal later. Its a win win situation. Heh, even just looking back on the encouragement will help.
In hindsight at this point, I would recommend that the one thing above all (despite the splatbooks being such a pain in the butt) you reign in hardcore is the magic items that the party members are able to access. In and of itself, the Magic Item Compendium has great stuff, even if many items in the same slot are combined. The trick is to sharply curb the 'customized' versions that self-styled creative types have a nasty habit of coming up with. Almost universally they will be overpowered and underpriced. If they are not inclined to craft thier own, it is much easier to manage, as the NPC-crafters are entirely under your purview as the GM.
I do wonder at your endurance though - 20 or so hours of gaming (or more) a week plus sleep and work ... yeouch. I'll be at my personal tolerance of an absolute maximum of 3 sessions (6 hours per) a week come mid-November.
hrm ...

Yasha0006 |

Yeah I know. Thats one of the reasons I am trying so hard to get a group game going. My wife has made me promise that once I can get a group, that I play (not DM) for at least 5-6 months before putting forward myself as DM. So I need a group so I can plan my AP for the near future.
Yes, Its tough...keeps wife happy...I often think it is too much also...but I cannot deny the benefits package that comes with this little arrangement.
Yet still, I must play. On an actual DMing level, single-player games are simply not very satisfying. For personal enjoyment, we have fun, but as an adventure, it lacks so many elements that I would love to use. One of the reasons I froth even now to DM a group game. If I haven't said this before Turin (and Allen if you are reading this too), but I rarely trust other DMs to run games. Usually I will sit down with a group, see who is going to run, then volunteer so as to avoid playing in a game I would rather avoid. You two though, are some of the few DMs I have ever seen/talked to that I would actually have confidence in running a game. Not just because of the cut-throat manner you both have, but in your enjoyment of running a good game. So cheers to you both for that.
.....can't sleep...clown will eat me....

Turin the Mad |

Running a good game is rewarding - provided the players aren't a slavering pack of chowderheads hell bent on powergaming beyond the degree required by the game itself of course. I actually prefer playing myself, so it is ironic that I get requested to run fairly often.
At this point at least, Allen & I pretty much take turns running D&D. Once the STAP is concluded, we're considering going to a shorter rotation time frame - say, 3 to 6 months at a clip - between gigs to reduce GM'ing brain death. The real trick nowadays is finding players that love the game that are NOT addicted to superfast powerup Mighty Endorphin Power Stranger types of characters.
Sadly, however, with 3e the double-edged blade is that you can try out - and hopefully see through to conclusion - a particular concept pretty fast (within 12-18 months presuming a weekly game) from start to finish. While I miss many elements of the old school progression, there is some advantage in not having to play for a decade in the same class.
On the flip side, I had the pleasure of being able to play in a long, long campaign. Dual-classing was the rule, and all the PCs wound up dual-classing 4 or 5 times over the course of the campaign, carving out swaths of wilderness from the critters, doing damn near everything we could get our grubby mitts on ... good times, good times, and years of play. Sadly, that group shuffled off this mortal coil (as a group) quite a few years back. *Sighs*

Yasha0006 |

Yeah, I know. There is a certain sense of satisfaction in playing a character that long. At the same time I agree that I like the idea of being able to try different character concepts. All things considered...the only characters (due to 2nd edition xp advancement) that I have played for long term included:
Gray Elf Mage 26
Sun Elf Cleric of Lathander 24
Green Elf Ranger 17
Sun Elf Cavalier 19 (1st edition version....so munchkinny)
Human Evoker 8/Thief 13/Fighter 15 Old school dual class, this was the level at which he died...squished by a Great Wyrm Deep Dragon. Literally.
wow...I guess I've played a lot of elves....maybe thats one of the reasons I haven't really touched one in 3rd edition yet. o.O
Plenty of other characters have been in there too, just not so many that survived long.
I guess if I play an Elf they live...otherwise they die. Hmm....

Turin the Mad |

Yeah, I know. There is a certain sense of satisfaction in playing a character that long. At the same time I agree that I like the idea of being able to try different character concepts. All things considered...the only characters (due to 2nd edition xp advancement) that I have played for long term included:
Gray Elf Mage 26
Sun Elf Cleric of Lathander 24
Green Elf Ranger 17
Sun Elf Cavalier 19 (1st edition version....so munchkinny)
Human Evoker 8/Thief 13/Fighter 15 Old school dual class, this was the level at which he died...squished by a Great Wyrm Deep Dragon. Literally.wow...I guess I've played a lot of elves....maybe thats one of the reasons I haven't really touched one in 3rd edition yet. o.O
Plenty of other characters have been in there too, just not so many that survived long.
I guess if I play an Elf they live...otherwise they die. Hmm....
The old-old-old character I have would be "too munchkin" to post, so I won't bother. (When 4e is released in full I will dutifully convert him over in pursuit of attaining the 'spirit' of the character concept as opposed to the convoluted path presently available to me in 3e. However, we're talking about a lot of character levels ... hopefully thier multiclassing system will be able to handle a good analog to the 1st edition dual-classing.)
Out of the few that lived besides him however, I would have to say that the Green Slime Thief was my most memorable character besides 'oldie' above that wasn't killed pre-3e. It's impressive to get a GM to force-retire your character in the same session he is created in. ^_^Hrm, now that I mention it, I cannot recall any other 1e/2e characters that lived longer than six months - most died horribly within a few sessions.
3e, my avatar (Athasian hobbit/weretiger NE/n Druid 24)& a forest gnome ex-monk 6/rogue 6 (NE) with a hardcore fire fetish (that tag-teamed with Allen's wizard to rather rapidly take a wrecking ball to a GM's campaign) are the two 3e characters of mine that survived from character creation until play ceased or permadeath occured - at least as far as I can remember.
While I enjoy Cardinal Tiberium immensely in Allen's AoW (Cleric 3.0), he'll be relegated to NPC status should he survive Dragotha's tender ministrations next session. I'll get the pertinent bragging rights as it were, but it's not the same as it would have been had I been able to retain the dwarven cleric (Cleric 1.0) in existence until that same point in the AoWAP.
Bishop Tiberium (his predecessor, Cleric 2.0) will be the same, at best. As would any successor character(s) deployed into the AoW that somehow survive.
All told, I'd guesstimate my personal D&D character death count somewhere in the viciniy of 120 or so characters, give or take a dozen.

Yasha0006 |

Yeah I know how you feel. I've converted some of my old folks over...and the sad part is, I think my Priestess is more powerful than my mage now. Ahh...the differences of editions.
As for being munchkinny, I think every seasoned player has had at least one in their past. Playing a character that was so nasty that even the DM couldn't kill them (my Elf Mage...through luck and relatively fair rulings) is memorable, but ultimately something that simply takes away from enjoying the game itself. Sure I had fun with that Wizard, but mainly because my DM was specifically trying to kill him (in game, but with a vengeance), and I still survived.
The character lost something as we had our little rivalry going. I forgive myself, I was 18 then, so a little machismo is to be expected. I will tell you one thing though, with him trying to kill him in such fashion, I really learned how to play a mage. So at least I came away with something tangible.
Man I really get going on your thread huh? Maybe we should actually get back to Savage Tide...

Turin the Mad |

Man I really get going on your thread huh? Maybe we should actually get back to Savage Tide...
^_^ What fun is a [campaign] journal without oodles of notes in the margins and any other ordinarily blank space ?
Besides, without others dropping in and commenting/saying stuff, this would get kinda boring.
By the by, this is now officially dubbed the First (or Sunday) Savage Tide Campaign Journal. The Second (Saturday) Savage Tide is due to commence hostilities on the 17th of November, although I'm not sure as to what the proper forum etiquette would be regarding journalling both groups carving thier way through the same adventure path. This is due to unforseen immaturities that came into brighter light during the past 10 sessions, so a splintering of the group was required to preserve GM sanity and prevent manslaughter charges being filed.
The group that will resume play are almost all familiar from Allen's Age of Worms: Sir Hexen Ineptus (barbarian/former hexblade in Allen's gig, now a feral, mutant-dwagon-duskblade), Torsin Tightbutt (grey elf wizard in both), She-durah (druidess shapeshifter, vow of poverty in both [I think - I know she has that in the Sunday crew], feral in Allen's), Da Fighter (not in Allen's gig) and Brutard (crusader/half-minotaur feral frenzied berserker/warhulk in Allen's) are the players that remain in the Sunday crew.
Transferring to the Saturday crew are the following players:
Boccobite (cloistered cleric/wizard/wanna-be mystic theurge), Lenny (Favored Soul of Tharizdun), Sir Zapsalot (Warlock) and Da Pimp (deceased). They will be bellying up to the table alongside Allen and our resident artiste extraordinaire. The transferees will not get to jump into a 1st level chapter with 4th level characters obviously.

Allen Stewart |

I have only several characters that ever went from 1st level to high level and survived. Back in 1st edition days, we almost exclusively played the printed modules, so I have a number of 1st edition characters that were played at some levels but were not played at other levels. All in all, I have two Wizard PC's that went from 1st to mid-teen level without getting killed, and two Fighters that have nearly done the same. Not very many is it... I have a number of other characters that have not been killed over the years, but have not played through enough levels to merit mention here.

Yasha0006 |

Yes of course. Heres the question then, do you plan the same side-quests and such for this Saturday group as well? Or are you going to alter things?
I will hope, since this Sat group seems to be the gathering of more mature players that the Pimp and Co. can seperate Character from Metagaming knowledge?
Oh, and I'd like to petition the Saturday group to join. In spirit at least. So depressing...stupid sunny California. Personally, I prefer the rain/snow/sleet/thunder/cometstrike spell...
Speaking of Cometstrike (i.e. powerful spells...) if you haven't seen it Turin, take a look at the spell Eruption? I believe it was in the Forgotten Real...Realities Campaign Setting's Serpent Kingdoms book. It is sooooo Broken its funny. It is the Ninth level spell...from hell essentially.

Turin the Mad |

Yes of course. Heres the question then, do you plan the same side-quests and such for this Saturday group as well? Or are you going to alter things?
I will hope, since this Sat group seems to be the gathering of more mature players that the Pimp and Co. can seperate Character from Metagaming knowledge?Oh, and I'd like to petition the Saturday group to join. In spirit at least. So depressing...stupid sunny California. Personally, I prefer the rain/snow/sleet/thunder/cometstrike spell...
Speaking of Cometstrike (i.e. powerful spells...) if you haven't seen it Turin, take a look at the spell Eruption? I believe it was in the Forgotten Real...Realities Campaign Setting's Serpent Kingdoms book. It is sooooo Broken its funny. It is the Ninth level spell...from hell essentially.
Regarding the possibility of the Saturday crew delving into the Barrow/Spire/(other) 'side quest', I will go with 'majority rules' - if most of them wish to go, they can, otherwise not.
And by all means, feel free to hack n slash, er "Diet Roleplay" with us in spirit my friend.
And "Eruption" is just one reason for carte-blanche banning of Faerunian, Eberronian and virtually all OGL materials from the STAP for the players. I'll have to go through the path and jot down what they used to write the chapters with, then most likely use that as the players' guidelines for feats/classes/swag commissioned.
Stay tuned for retconning of the first group of PC's...