In second edition many PCs and NPCs used potions of longevity to extend their lives. There is even a group in the city of Greyhawk that specifically works to create these much sought after items. I have not seen them convented for 3.x. What magic is available to prolong one's life?
In second edition many PCs and NPCs used potions of longevity to extend their lives. There is even a group in the city of Greyhawk that specifically works to create these much sought after items. I have not seen them convented for 3.x. What magic is available to prolong one's life?
None. 3e has made a very consistent effort to eradicate life-prolonging effects from the game. There are abilities like "Timeless Body" that prevent you from suffering the negative effects of aging, but you still die when "your time is up."
Personally, I think this is a Very Good Thing, but that's at least in part because I appreciate the Tolkien-esque flavor of it.
becoming a lich or vampire lasts an eternity. although you may have to change you're interpritation of "life"
I agree that the idea of a potion should not work. That is far too easily. At the same time, there are great quests to extend one's life. The Black One, mage of the Valley, has spent years trying to become a shade because he did not like the idea of becoming a lich. In Dragon recently it was said that Iggwilv is two centuries old. Also in LGJ #0, some of the Circle of Eight have extended their lives.
I think a potion of longevity should be an artifact. If some player really wants their character to "live forever" then such an item could be sought in the ultimate quest for the Fountain of Youth or something.
The Elixir of Immortality--several Chinese emperors paid Taoist priests large amounts of money for such concoctions, historically. Of course most of them died of mercury poisoning, since this alchemical concoction contained cinnabar, a mercury ore. In the realm of myth, there were the Eight Immortals, Taoist priests who engaged in a variety of yoga-like disciplines and gradually weaned themselves from the necessity to eat, ultimately discovering the secret of immortality. Of course, this meant that they were, for all practical purposes, gods.
Then there was the Monkey King, who sneeked into the laboratory of Lao Tzu (the premier Taoist sage/deity) in Heaven, and managed to filch, and consume, a pill that made him immortal. When the gods subdued him (he put up a great fight, of course), he was punished by being imprisoned under a mountain for ten millenia. (His subsequent adventures as henchman of a Buddhist monk who controlled him with a magical squeezing iron headband are a must for all fans of Oriental fantasy--read Arthur Waley's translation "Monkey").
There were also the Isles of the Immortals, supposed to be located somewhere in the great eastern ocean--the first emperor sent an expedition there, but it never came back.
The lesson in all this for the DM? Immortality probably has a place in your campaign world, but it if mortals aspire to it, they are liable to be fooled by charlatans and perhaps even poisoned or otherwise harmed by elixirs, artifacts, etc. that are advertised to deliver immortality but can't deliver. There are, however, ways to achieve immortality, but they require epic-level efforts to succeed, and result in quasi-deity status for the character. In short, the very rare PC who succeeds in becoming immortal is removed from the ranks of PC-dom and becomes a tool of the DM.
In short, the very rare PC who succeeds in becoming immortal is removed from the ranks of PC-dom and becomes a tool of the DM.
Agreed...but in terms of the Potion of Longevity...what are we talkin? A lone potion doesn't grant Immortality...so I would say it might come along once in a great while...perhaps not even work anymore...being old and exposed to whatever elements the DM might dream up.
Another balance is that you can limit it's effect by the type of creature imbibing it...for instance...Elves may not feel the effects, but humans would...etc.
My 2 cents.
Stillfoxx
"Live or die, you decide..."
There is an Epic feat:
EXTENDED LIFE SPAN [EPIC]
Benefit: Add one-half the maximum result of the character’s race’s maximum age modifier to the character’s normal middle age, old, and venerable age categories. Calculate the character’s maximum age using the new venerable number. This feat can’t lower the character’s current age category.
Special: A character can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects stack.
|
There is an Epic feat:
EXTENDED LIFE SPAN [EPIC]
Benefit: Add one-half the maximum result of the character’s race’s maximum age modifier to the character’s normal middle age, old, and venerable age categories. Calculate the character’s maximum age using the new venerable number. This feat can’t lower the character’s current age category.
Special: A character can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects stack.
Which book can i find epic feats, described?
Thoth-Amon the Atlantian Mindflayerian
There is an Epic feat:
EXTENDED LIFE SPAN [EPIC]
Benefit: Add one-half the maximum result of the character’s race’s maximum age modifier to the character’s normal middle age, old, and venerable age categories. Calculate the character’s maximum age using the new venerable number. This feat can’t lower the character’s current age category.
Special: A character can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects stack.
Which book can i find epic feats, described?
Thoth-Amon the Atlantian Mindflayerian
Epic level Handbook a 3.0 product-page 56
In "Lords of Madness: The Book of Aberrations" there is a description of a new kind of beholder: the "Elder Orb". This creatures are immortal, unless they are killed by violence or disease. Of course, this creatures are extremly rare, as only one in various hundreds of beholders are born with this quality.
To be clear what a potion of longevity did-reduced the character's age by 1d12 years. Each use has a 1% cumulative chance to reverse age reduction of all potions ever consumed.
While there does not seem to be any aging attacks anymore. I could imagine Iggwilv, once a year, bathing in the blood of 20 virgins, to regain that lost year. Is this too much for a 8th or 9th level spell. Has anyone seen anything in any d20 books?
It seems foolish to think that a ninth level spell could not either extend one's life for 10-20 years or subtract a like amount from the natural end of a life. Even an imperfectly worded wish spell should be able to accomplish this.
As for potions, it seems reasonable to assume that high level potions created by a Master Alchemist (at least I think that's the Prestige class name) could be made/purchased that would extend a life 1d12 years with a 1% cumulative chance of undoing them all at once. I would even go so far as to say that most mages that seek to extend their lives past racial limits try something akin to a potion of longevity and wish spells before they are twisted by turning into a lich, or a shade, etc.
But, that is certainly not the only answer to living past your time. There are lots of ways to achieve immortality in the D&D universe. You could eat a golden apple, embrace lichdom (or Baelorn-dom), live on the Astral Plane, become a gods Chosen representitive (at least in the Realms), your phyche could remain forever locked in the pommel of your favorite weapon, or the ever popular Become A God (which has happened at least 6 times in the realms - though not to my players...).
Again, I really only know about Realm-lore, but there are tons of examples in Faerun around the time of the Netherese where longevity was a given. I can't think of any examples from GH, but Fistantandilus (sp) in the Dragonlance campaign is a great example of someone that wanted to live forever, yet not become a lich or a god, and he certainly found a way to do so.
In the Forgotten Realms, there is a glut of Npcs who at least centuires old. The latest excuse is instead of a potion they now use wishes.
Another d20 improvement -- nowadays, most NPCs are created so that they are consistent with the rules. In theory, a player could one day have a character identical to Mordenkainen.
I always felt that players are being somewhat 'cheated' when bad guys are made with little or no regard for the rules. What's good for the goose should be good for the gander.
Jack
|
It gets even worse when they are long lived they are Lichs or because they are the Chosen of this god or that. Mystra is the worst of the lot. I mean does she reaaly need ten of them? That's why i made Ao the overegod create one more commandent : only 1 Chosen per god. Mysrta had to strip the others of their powers except Elminster. The Red wizards of Thay consider the day of the stripping of the Simbul's Power a national holiday.
Speaking the thayans, making phony potions of longitity sounds like it right their alley. Of course they might add addictive substances to give customers the temporary illusion of youth and make them come back for more.
A question : does the potion of longeitivity work by adding years to your lifespan? or it makes younger or just keep you in the same age you are when you first drank it. the 2nd ed. rules were somewhat unclear at this point>
I personally don't see a problem with life extension. It's not an issue that often comes up in a campaign, first of all. And if it /were/ an issue, I'm going to bet that if, in a still ongoing campaign, after all that adventuring some DM were to tell their player "Dude, I hate to tell you this, but your character had a heart attack and died. Sorry man, it was just his time.", said player would be less than pleased.
Should life extension be available to everyone in a convenient little bottle? Nah. That cheapens it. It should be difficult, and in the spirit of adventure should spawn many a quest to find a way that's acceptable to your player. Some will chose undeath, some will seek certain prestige classes (Dragon Prophesier in Magic of Eberron) to extend their lives, and others still will seek other means. In the end, I think the only 'natural' end that should come without a means of escape is the end of the campaign.
|
There was also something important with the old potions of longevity. The main ingredient was fresh elf marrow, which made making and imbibing them, arguably, en evil act. The group which in Greyhawk provided the ingredients for these potions would do it by kindapping victims in a park.
I once had a campaign revolve around the Thayan enclave in Waterdeep and their attempts at making and selling these potions to the Whaterdavian nobility.
Given how they work (take 1d12 years off a person) and the evilness/rarity of them I don't have a problem having them in my campaigns.
|
|
There was also something important with the old potions of longevity. The main ingredient was fresh elf marrow, which made making and imbibing them, arguably, en evil act. The group which in Greyhawk provided the ingredients for these potions would do it by kindapping victims in a park.
I once had a campaign revolve around the Thayan enclave in Waterdeep and their attempts at making and selling these potions to the Whaterdavian nobility.
Given how they work (take 1d12 years off a person) and the evilness/rarity of them I don't have a problem having them in my campaigns.
Fresh elf marrows. That explains the Retreat.
It gets even worse when they are long lived they are Lichs or because they are the Chosen of this god or that. Mystra is the worst of the lot. I mean does she reaaly need ten of them? That's why i made Ao the overegod create one more commandent : only 1 Chosen per god. Mysrta had to strip the others of their powers except Elminster. The Red wizards of Thay consider the day of the stripping of the Simbul's Power a national holiday.
Speaking the thayans, making phony potions of longitity sounds like it right their alley. Of course they might add addictive substances to give customers the temporary illusion of youth and make them come back for more.A question : does the potion of longeitivity work by adding years to your lifespan? or it makes younger or just keep you in the same age you are when you first drank it. the 2nd ed. rules were somewhat unclear at this point>
The description in DMG 2nd edition states reduces age by restoring youth and vigor. I would take that to mean your physicallly get younger. I like your limiting of the Chosen, otherwise other gods would realize these folks are the movers and shakers of the world and start to each have 10 chosen.
Celric great points, I have only played FR as a player so I don't have the sources to look through. My DM frowns on that.
I just found a source over on the wizards site. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=lg/lgmp/20050628a
Castle Karistyne mention the elixir of longevity which seems to work the same as the 2nd edition potion.
On the other hand, the Elan in XPH is written as immortal. Personally, since they are also of the abberation type, I don't allow them as it leads to serious exploits of Alter Self.
I realize this is off topic... But is the potential for abuse really that bad? Don't forget that Alter Self has a HD limit of the caster's level, or 5HD, whichever is less. While it would allow them to take some unusual forms, they aren't going to get any more mileage out of 5HD than a humanoid does.
There is an Epic feat:
EXTENDED LIFE SPAN [EPIC]
Benefit: Add one-half the maximum result of the character’s race’s maximum age modifier to the character’s normal middle age, old, and venerable age categories. Calculate the character’s maximum age using the new venerable number. This feat can’t lower the character’s current age category.
Special: A character can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects stack.
Which book can i find epic feats, described?
Thoth-Amon the Atlantian Mindflayerian
Or there:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/srd35
For anyone interested, I found a discussion on immortality over on enworld.org/showthread php?=160913
i get a 404 on that one.
Since we are talking primarily about wizards, why should they need anything other than this:
https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/arcane-discoveries/arc ane-discoveries-paizo/immortality/