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* Pathfinder Society GM. 143 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 19 Organized Play characters.


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thelemonache wrote:
The MAD comes from needing really high con to power fast healer, but if i drop the fast healer and stalwart chains, i may be able to afford vmc oracle. With life link being early entry, i wonder if it would be worth having a dip, but i admit tagging multiple at once with a higher character level is attractive

This is why the celestial totem is banned in society play -- it is insanely overpowered ... so, let's take that piece of the build, and the skald's buffing of people to do the following.

Totally different idea:
Bard 1:
Spirit Guide Life Oracle (double life oracle) 9:

Stats: High Charisma

Feats: (can take all these if human)
Skill Focus
Eldritch Heritage (for familiar with protector archetype)
Lingering Performance
Battle Cry (optional)
Selective Channel (optional)
Quick Channel (optional)

trait - scarred by war

Wear Medium armor made of Singing Steel (start performance as a move)
Have a Poet's Cloak (lesser celestial totem)

Round one: Sing as a move, battle cry as a swift, cast whatever spell you want
Round two and onwards ...
Heal all party members for
(5+1 (trait) + 9 (totem) = 15 twice) 30 points of damage.
You take 6 damage, and your familiar takes 4. (your familiar has life link on itself as well -- effectively giving it fast healing 22).

Since that healing doesn't take an action, you still have a full round to do whatever you want as an oracle.

Quick Channel : You have two pools of channels, each which should be huge (at level 10, assuming your char is a +6 -- you have 2 pools of 7 channels each) ... so lets say you can use this 5/day easy ...
each channel is 4d6+9 healing (average 23 healing) ... and you still have your full round to do whatever you want with.

... if you want to boost your bonuses given by your song, there are lots of ways to stack bonuses onto a bard's performance.


Biggest question i have is what level do you start at? A build starting at level 1 sometimes has vastly different needs than a build which skips the first X painful levels.


Unconventional Healer Tank.

Stats are high Dex and Charisma, low Str ... the rest of the stats don't matter too much.

Level 1:
Life Oracle, trait Heirloom weapon, feat divine fighting "Way of the shooting stars" .. equipment, medium armor and shield ... you do ok with fighting and your AC is respectable
Level 2: Scaled Fist Monk ... ditch your medium armor and shield, for Mage Armor (wand and buddy, or potion)
Levels 3+ Life Oracle ...

This is a great low level build, but it quickly can't keep up damage wise, so around levels 7+ you will be regretting this toon as a tank as enemies will ignore you as you aren't a threat.


Malik Gyan Daumantas wrote:


Spoiler:
Long story short I wanted to build a character in the vein of the acolyte class in Ragnarok online, one that casts divine magic-using various symbols of their god as crutches of conduits as they never got proper training, but when pushed has shown to be able to do a few tricks unique to them.

This build is a Preacher/Relic Hunter Inquisitor and a good example of a trick is being able to use servitor to summon a hound archon and then just litany of righteousness to double all its damage. making it a viable combat buddy. Here's the build and for those who are asking why I didn't go for transmutation asap, I wanted to go a more support route.

Relic Hunter/Preacher(Neophyte:Play like a Cleric/Occultist)

Traits:Fate's Favored

Arodenite Sword Training

Relics(Implements)

1.Conjuration and Enchantment

4.Abjuration

7.Evocation

10.Transmutation

Resonant Powers:

Casting Focus

Glorious Presence

Warding Talisman

Intense Focus

Physical Enhancement

Base Focus Powers

Servitor:Summon Monster, but one at a time

Cloud Mind

Mind Shield

Energy Ray

Legacy Weapon

------------------------------------

Focus Powers

1.Mind Steed

4.Mend Flesh

8.Resistence Mastery

12.Ability Mastery

1.Spell Focus (Conjuration)

3.Power Attack

5.Augment Summoning

7.Implement Mastery

9.Extra Mental Focus

11.Summon Good Monster

13.Divine Interference

I'm not really familiar with lots of your build ... what does it do? Like, I saw you post about a hound archon (CR4, summon monster 4) and spamming level 3 spells on the hound archon.

I have to be missing something ... like do you summon it early? how does it stay viable?

You mention you play like a Cleric/Occultist, but with your reduced spell levels ... it seems more like you are trying to play as a sub-part Warpriest/Occultist ... You don't seem to have channel / etc ...

Sorry, I'm sure your build makes perfect sense to you -- I completely understand playing as a jack-of-all-trades ... and how being a generalist is less powerful than a specialist, I am just not seeing this


Malik Gyan Daumantas wrote:
Chell Raighn wrote:
Minigiant, I think you completely missed the purpose and intent of their build… they are making a self-taught novice divine Spellcaster… it’s not so much a min-max power build as it is a viable thematic build. Summoning is only one facet of the build, and like the rest of the build is deliberately intended to not be “the best”. I can tell you from experience, sometimes the most enjoyable builds are the ones that don’t actually excell at anything. Builds that struggle every step of the way can be very enjoyable, especially when you are used to steamrolling everything and want a change of pace.
You pretty much got the exact idea. Like I got an eldritch scoundrel rouge build that I really like that has high utility, but I know a well-made magus will likely run circles around it, that was never the point.

What does it mean that you are an eldritch scoundrel rogue build that has high utility, but a well-mage magus will likely run circles around it?

If you are saying that in (virtually) all cases, the mage is better than you (disabling devices, damage, skills, etc.) -- I have to ask, why are you playing a scoundrel instead of a magus?

If you are saying that your two toons are similar, with minor bonuses to one or the other ... that's fair ... like, an unchained rogue should be able to deal tons of debuffs to the enemy, but the magus should have more oomph in his attacks/spells. (spell strike with shocking grasp is usually more than a sneak attack) -- it's a wash.

In my opinion ... if you have two choices, one of which is superior in (almost) all cases ... why wouldn't you chose that one every time?

I'm not saying "Is a prepared spellcaster with foreknowledge better than a fighter" ... I am saying "If I am going to be a healer, why play a warpriest when I could play a life oracle" -- and "If I am going to be playing an off healer which mostly attacks in combat, then a life oracle is (usually) the wrong choice"


Sorry to belabor the questions ... I have a toon who is a scaled fist with a couple levels of paladin, and want to make sure I am doing this right.

One ability (monk) adds CHA to AC -- the other adds it to his DEX bonus to AC ... yes, the end point is that the CHA is added twice, but one is added as a DEX bonus while the other is added as a CHA bonus (different types). -- this would be similar to "deflection bonus equal to Charisma modified" and your charisma modifier from the FAQ.

The two bonuses even work differently, one is a flat bonus, the other is maxed at 1 per level.

One you lose if you are flatfooted, the other you do not.


I'm reading people post that the scaled fist monk AC bonus doesn't stack, and trying to understand why?

Monk = Add CHA to AC as untyped bonus
Paladin = Add one point of CHA to DEX for AC.

Completely different.


MrCharisma wrote:


I kinda want to run Giantslayer but my whole group listens to the Glass Cannon Podcast, so I decided if I run it we're going Gestalt and Mythic (and I might start them at level 3). They'll all be metagaming anyway, so we might as well let them power-game it too right? But on the flipside I'm gonna double the number of enemies, give them all the advanced template and straight up try to murder the players. And probably add levels and mythic abilities to bosses. Go big or go home I say!

I've played gestalt in 3.5 ... and mythic in pf1 ... i can't imagine the sheer bigness of numbers / abilities if both were allowed. My brain is actively hurting now ... in a "I would love to try it" kind of way.


Like AVR said, once you figure out what you want ... you can then build the toon. Keep in mind how long it takes to make some things come online, you wouldn't want an ability to come online after your character retires for instance.

And remember that there are items which can help you out ... like Helm of the Mammoth Lord, which can give you a gore attack for only 8500 gp.


My favorite rogue has always been a STR based 2 handed normal (not unchained) rogue. It's the easiest one to play for combat.

Half-orc, power attack, cleave, surprising follow-through, as a scout

I used earthbreaker as a sap master to do silly amounts of damage and offensive defense gets hilarious.

Mid-to-higher levels of play I alternated between snake style/panther style and ninja-ki for invisibility/improved invisibility.


PCScipio wrote:


I don't think you're saving on a 2 at 3rd lvl.

EDIT: My point is that forgoing a cloak of resistance weakens your PC unnecessarily.

I missed the level 3 part -- apologies.

Yes, that is totally possible if I encounter that to fail, especially at low levels like that. But ... its always an opportunity cost. Based on the numbers I posted, do you really think a +1 or +2 is more important than whatever else I can spend that gold on?

For instance, a lucky horseshow, or a cracked ioun stone would be better for me than a cloak - neither uses the shoulder slot (which I'm told is crucial for this build, so that I can carry treasure)


yukongil wrote:
except when grappled you'll take a double hit, the -4 to Dex and then the -2 to attack

You are correct, the -4 dex and -2 to attack will give me a total of -4 -- since the giant is grappling me, then it loses 2 points of AC due to dex, so that's effectively only a -2 ... meaning, the giant is still dead pretty quickly

yukongil wrote:


you should still be taking the -3 penalty from your 5 strength, bringing it to 27.

Good catch!! Thanks!

yukongil wrote:


Earliest giant one runs into, save troll, is probably the Hill, giant (CR 7) and they still nab you on a 12, Frost Giants are well within your CR (@11) and they are +20. You present as a nice target being rail thin and shuddering under the mountainous weight of *checks notes* your clothes, making you a tempting target. Should you prove burdensome to hold, well, you're much lighter than a rock which they can throw a 1/4 mile...

They nab me on a 12 if I haven't debuffed them ... If I have, they have (-2 shaken, -2 sickened, -4 debilitating injury) so they need a 20 to hit me.

And no, I am not shuddering under the mountainous weight of my clothes. Everything posted showed that at all points in time, I am clearly within lightly encumbered.

yukongil wrote:


really your CMD isn't bad, it's about average, meaning anything meant to perform a combat maneuver is going to succeed, but you present too nice a target (you're small and weak, you're a force multiplier with your group with heals and debuffs and are a moderate threat in melee). I mean something could simply trip you and then free action drop a shield or great axe on you and you'd be effectively pinned ;P (as I GM, I'd hit you with tanglefoot bags until the weight of goo was more than you could bear)

See, here's the thing though ... Giants (at least the one's I've skimmed) aren't grapplers by nature. Sure, they can switch to grappling, but that goes completely against their nature (nature represented by their description in the monster manual and feat selection. At WORST ... my numbers are comparable to the iconic paladin 3 levels higher than I am. I can guarantee you that my numbers will raise with three levels under my belt to higher than the paladins (I keep choosing him as that is closest to what I am running role-wise).

If you attempted to hit me with a tanglefoot bag ... could you really hit me? Remember, this is a high AC build (including touch attack) ... and, unless the AP has tons of tanglefoot bag wielding monsters, then you plan on changing the module to defeat my toon. Is this something done for other characters? Per what was posted earlier, at some point in time if weight is an issue, then muleback cords means that you'd need (checking notes) ... 11 or so to hit me and the entire weight of all 11 would apply before I became medium encumbered.

Please show me the rule that says you can (as a free action), drop an item and cause it to pin a player (or appear in their inventory, or however you think this to be accomplished).

yukongil wrote:


at the end of the day, it's not the mechanics you can squeeze out though, compensating however you want, it's that you are barely stronger than an ordinary house cat. Min/maxing aside, that's ridiculous and should be a glaring hole to be exploited at all encounters much to the detriment of yourself and your group.

Why? If this character is powerful enough that the DM focuses all monsters / encounters / traps on str based attacks on my character (remembering the high AC and high saves) ... the DM will win, but if the other toons are ignored during this debacle, then we are not really playing pathfinder anymore -- we are playing "gank the PC"

My intent is to respond to hyperbole and ask "why is that so" -- this toon is not the end-all-be-all of toons ... however, if complaints on this are equally valid on iconics 3 levels higher, then I have to ask if the complaints are real


PCScipio wrote:
meyerwilliam wrote:


At level 7, my saves look to be around:
Fort +18, Ref + 23, Will +15

Thats basically saving on a 2 in most cases. So yes, overkill.

I've seen a DC 17 Fear Aura in Book 1 of a Paizo AP (3rd lvl PCs). Just saying.

That's saving on a 2.

(15+2=17)


VoodistMonk wrote:

Dirty Trick (AoN), wrote:

... hitting a foe in a sensitive spot to make him sickened for a round.

Cannot hitting the foe in a sensitive spot be done with an unarmed strike? Would such a thing still work with Pummeling Style?

Pummeling Style (AoN), wrote:
... This ability works only with unarmed strikes, no matter what other abilities you might possess.

Is Quick Dirty Trick just some "other abilites you might possess"?

Dirty trick is a combat maneuver (it is listed under "combat maneuvers"). The feat you referenced (quick dirty trick) points out that you are replacing a melee attack with a combat maneuver. This looks cut-and-dry to me that it doesn't work the way you think it should.

Quick Dirty Trick
Benefit: On your turn, you can perform a single dirty trick combat maneuver in place of one of your melee attacks. You must choose the melee attack with the highest base attack bonus to make the dirty trick combat maneuver.


VoodistMonk wrote:

Bedroll, clothes, mirror, caltrops, soap, rations, rope, pitons, tool kits, extra canvas cloth, chaulk, alchemical items, random loot that doesn't come in the form of coins or gems...

Your gear... all of it... how do you plan on carrying all the stuff required for adventurering?

What if the party finds loot in the way of expensive magical items, say enchanted armor... there is enough for everyone to have their own piece of expensive enchanted armor, doesn't matter if you wear it or not, this is your prize... your payment... all you get, take it or leave it, wear it or sell it... it's yours.

Everyone else in the party picks up their prize and heads for the door, but you... I can't, meh, ugh... can someone help me?

Yes! Yes! 100 times Yes!!

We received horses earlier, so I guess that stuff is on my horse? So far, we haven't received loot (other than the horse I mentioned just now) in levels 1-3, so that hasn't been an issue.

I don't know what types of groups you normally adventure in, but mine normally don't mind carrying something for someone else (particularly if you have a 20 str character in the party). Just never came up. Similarly, the fact that I'm currently the only person in the party with the ability to heal doesn't cause me to ask for payment from other players. It's a team game.

PCScipio wrote:
meyerwilliam wrote:
No way would I use a cloak of resistance, with multiclassing and paladin's grace, that would be severe overkill.
Unless you can make your saves on a 2, it's not overkill. You may be underestimating how deadly failed saves can be.

At level 7, my saves look to be around:

Fort +18, Ref + 23, Will +15

Thats basically saving on a 2 in most cases. So yes, overkill.

VoodistMonk wrote:

No such thing as overkill on a "tank" build... what, you made your tank too hard to kill?

Could go Half-Orc for Ferocity, one level of Unbreakable Fighter, and split the rest of your levels between Warrior Poet Samurai and Hospitaler Paladin... Fey Foundling, Endurance, Diehard, Fast Healer, Unconquerable Resolve, Greater Mercy, Ultimate Mercy, Ultimate Resolve... there's a tank...

Thats a horrible tank.

Ferocity is something I hate even existing ... I would much rather fall unconscious and the enemy usually moves on to another target, than be standing at -9 hps and have the enemy consider me a threat.
Fast healer? To gain 2-3 hps max per heal cast on me? At the level you are routinely going to be taking this feat, thats laughable compared to the damage enemies are doing. Someone mentioned giants. Those do lots of damage.
Warrior poet samurai -- this ... is intriguing. I think I like it -- somehow I missed reading this archetype. Thank you for pointing this out to me. I'll have to look at it for future builds.

The problem with this tank though, is that the enemy will ignore you as you are doing very little damage (every feat is focused on defence or self-heal) and no real non-damage abilities.

yukongil wrote:

as someone mentioned earlier, there may be quite a few giants in the AP, perhaps the more pertinent question about dumping strength to very small child levels, is what do you do about grapples or really anything vs your CMD?

Personally, I'd kick you around the battlefield like a soccer ball for s+*+zngiggles

See, here's the thing ... in a grapple you are allowed to use one handed/light weapons -- like natural attacks. If I get grappled, that is one dead giant. As far as CMD questions ... remember, since I am not wearing armor, my AC is basically my CMD which will be higher than a full-plate wearing tank. And since I am finessing things, I use my Dex instead of my STR for CMB (as explained in earlier posts) so this reduction has no impact on my CMB.

Example: estimated level 9 version of my toon compared to iconic level 12 paladin
CMD: 10 (base) + dex (6) + bab (6) + char (6) + ring (2) = CMD 30 vs CMD 27
An Ash Giant (CR11 -- First giant appearing in a google search for giant) has a CMB of +22
Comparing Smite Evil vs Debuffing (similar role)
(effectively) me: 38 vs 31 (paladin)

Not sure how it would be easy to kick me around the battlefield. Can you post numbers?

Ryze Kuja wrote:

I personally don't think there's a better debuffing tank out there than a Quick Dirty Tricks Master-focused Brawler with Pummeling Charge and Boots of Haste.

At level 11, you could be charging 120ft + Full attack (6 attacks) and one of those attacks is going to be a Quick Dirty Trick to Blind or Sicken-->Nauseate(the following round) that can only be removed with a Standard Action. Without considering Cornugon Smash or a Cruel AoMF in this mix for the Shaken/Sicken combo, this QDT Master + 120ft Charge w/ Full Attack alone is straight lock-down status for anyone the Brawler decides is the highest current threat.

Awhile back, I remember helping theorycraft a level 13 DT Master Brawler for someone in an Advice forums thread for a One-shot specifically designed for a CR 21 Krampus fight (CMD 58), and this Brawler had a host of specific items and buffs that allowed him to: charge 120ft, full attack, and hit 58 CMD on every roll except a nat 1 (with certain items active & flanking) or a 5 roll (with no items/flanking), and a 3 roll while charging (no items/flanking). So he would charge 120ft, Sicken with QDT + Finish his Full attack, and if Krampus doesn't use his Standard Action to clear the Sicken condition, then the following round = Nauseate, so Move Actions only now, and the fight is essentially over; Krampus is now a Loot Piñata because he needs a Standard Action to remove the Nauseate Condition and can only take Move Actions. And if Krampus clears the Sicken condition with a Standard in the 1st round, then you Sicken again the following round. Basically Krampus gets nothing but Move Actions once the Brawler is on him. With a specific item active and also while flanking, that Brawler could make average 71.5 CMB rolls with a DT, and average 63.5 CMB roll without the item, charging, or flanking.

And that style of build doesn't just work on Krampus, it works on anything CR21 and below (avg CMD 56-58 or less) that isn't immune to Blind AND Nauseate conditions, which is pretty rare. Even if a...

Can you explain how you use Pummeling Charge with Quick Dirty Strike (all attacks have to be unarmed strikes ... dirty trick is not an unarmed strike)?

Those numbers are really really really high, I am both impressed and intensely disturbed.
Does this character operate well from level 1, or is there a level it comes online?


MrCharisma wrote:

At STR:5 you have to stay at or below 16 lbs or you'll be encumbered.

Monk's Robes: 2 lbs
Headband: 1 lb
Belt: 1 lb
Starknife: 4 lbs
Cloak of Resistance: 1 lb

That's 9 lbs, leaving you 7 lbs to carry anything else you might want.

The lightest bag of holding is 15 lbs, though I guess you can get yourself a handy Haversack, which is only 5 lbs. But that only leaves 2 lbs.

It's a legitimate question, you'll almost certainly want to carry something at some point.

Starknife (as mentioned above) is tossed once I get my amulet of might fist: agile -- frees up some weight ... and really, what do I actually need to carry (ok -- some potions -- one ounce each -- yes) ... If I REALLY need to personally carry something (and not just have a party member who isn't as weak) I just cast ant haul on myself for a few hours.

No way would I use a cloak of resistance, with multiclassing and paladin's grace, that would be severe overkill. Monk's robes? 13k for only a +1 to AC and one more stunning fist? Why ever would I use that -- I am a natural attack person and there are cheaper ways to increase AC

Oh -- just thought about it ... you are concerned about the weight of the coins I would be carrying when we get treasure! Valid concern here. When I get to that point in time, I'll buy muleback cords for 1000 gp (light now goes up to 50 pounds) then buy a bag of holding type 3 to hold up to 1000 pounds ... then I'll be able to carry my gold pieces.


*Khan* wrote:

Well your AC is not absurdly high if you are medium loaded.

10 base 3 dex 0 cha and some natural armor, deflection and perhaps mage armor from a wand if you are ready for a fight.

I shouldn't ever be encumbered ... since as I posted above, I won't really be carrying anything ... headband / belt weigh one pound each ... rings, amulet and stones are also pretty light.

*Khan* wrote:

I would focus more on one thing.

Intimidate str/cha paladin build with full plate. Go for a reach weapon and spiked armor. Works from level 1.

With a natural weapon build I would drop intimidate as a debuff.
Something like
1 lev. Urban Salamander Bloodrager, 1 lev. Scaled fist unchained monk, the rest in Beastmorph vivsectionist alchemist and grab feral mutagen.
With rage and mutagen your dex will be 26 early on. Remember to take the extra rage feat.
Alchemist can make cure extracts.
You could dump cha and Scaled fist monk and just go with a high Wis instead and normal unchained monk.

Since I am level 3 at the moment, changing my character around like this isn't actually an option. At level 3, my AC is 23 for using mage armor (we don't have treasure yet).


Zwordsman wrote:

Off hand. I'd ask. Are you wanting to playa debuffer but got stuck in te "tank role" ? With an excess of players you probably can get away as a group without a "tank like role" if the group focus fires well.

Otherwise. What abilities or methods are you wanting to do ultimately? Given a concept we can help bolster it. But as it sounds, I feel like you want to play a sneak attacking/debuffing rogadin? Which is fine generally but not sure if it'd do what you want it to do exactly?

Also I would agree with the stat dumping being a real issue for mechanics

Yeah ... that's what happened. When building characters, there was a decided lack of tank and healer. I decided to go off-script and build an unusual tank which debuffs the enemy so that the rest of the team can shine better.

Based on the feedback here ... it sounds like I have some real concerns to worry about with my build, so I'll make sure to try to shore those gaps up with equipment


VoodistMonk wrote:
I just don't see it working the way you think it will.

Possibly ... It looks great to me on paper, but I'm looking forward to seeing if it works as I hope it works.

VoodistMonk wrote:


The Strength is unnecessarily pathetic. Why would you ever do that to yourself? A Spider Swarm is pretty much guaranteed to kill you until you get your Paladin levels. You don't even have Leadership, so you clearly expect the party to carry extra weight. That's not cool. You could be the ideal tank of all tankiness, but if you can't carry your own weight...

Yes, a spider swarm might be painful, but they can't kill me due to strength damage -- you only die to con damage (shadows and such are different, but those need to hit my nice AC). And at level 3, I succeed on the save on an 8, and need to fail a minimum of three times to fall unconscious -- which is unlikely (1 in 27).

Not sure what extra weight you are talking about here that the party will need to pull.

VoodistMonk wrote:


Speaking of the ideal tank of all tankiness, how do you avoid damage/negate hits? This tank doesn't have anything like Opportune Parry & Riposte to avoid would-be hits, nothing like Cut From the Air or Deflect Arrows to provide any sort of missile defense, no Resolve or Ferocity or Stalwart to provide insurance when you do get hit (because you WILL get hit), you have a 12 Con with no Toughness and too much multiclassing to rely on FCB for HP, no reach or ability to contend with flying enemies so is too easily avoidable to begin with...

I will point you to the iconic pathfinder paladin. At all levels, my AC is silly high compared to hers. If she can function, not sure why I cannot.

For Riposte ... with my AC being absurdly high, the only way this works is if the enemy can hit my AC and if I can roll a higher number. Since it's been pointed out that my attack numbers are not out-of-this-world, I am not sure this could work. I thought about dipping but couldn't grasp how to make my attack be that might higher than my AC.

VoodistMonk wrote:
Debuffing through Dazzlying Display and possibly Debilitating Injury is largely what I see this character relying on. Without actual investment in Trip, I don't see it being a viable tactic that ever pays off. I doubt you ever use Viscious Stomp, literally never. I imagine you failing and falling prone yourself, or provoking AoO for your attempt (unless I am missing something). And even with the proper investment for tripping, you still don't have the reach or fancy movement to effectively control the battlefield around you.

I plan on provoking AoOs for tripping ... and relying on my AC to protect me .... last night we were in the glassworks and I was able to disarm an opponent that way. But yes, this could be a problem -- trip / vicious stomp was there to help trigger Diabolic Style.

VoodistMonk wrote:


Tanks have cannons. I do not see how this build plans on dealing damage to anything with higher than average AC.

For dealing damage, here's a comparison between myself and the iconic paladin:

Me: 14/13/13/13/13 (1d4+7+2d6)
Level 7: +13/8 (1d8+5)
Level 12: +20/15/10 (1d8+7)

vs AC 23 (ignoring crits and nat 1s to keep it simple)
Me: 60%+55%*4 = expect to hit between 2-3 times per round (2.8)
Level 7 = expect to hit .85 times per round
Level 12 = expect to hit 2 times per round (1.95)

vs AC 27 (ignoring crits and nat 1s to keep it simple)
Me: expect to hit 1.8 times a round
Level 7 = expect to hit .45 times/round
Level 12 = expect to hit 1.35 times a round

AC 30 (ignoring crits and nat 1s to keep it simple)
Me: expect to hit once a round (1.05)
Level 7: expect to hit .15 times/round
Level 12: expect to hit .9 times a round

VoodistMonk wrote:


In fact, I don't see how this build addresses flying enemies, incorporeal enemies, invisible enemies, swarms, damage reduction, or undead (anything else immune to fear, for that matter). Sure, you eventually will have Smite a few times a day, but otherwise...? Most of your natural weapons also have limited uses per day, which may or may not pose a problem.

Most of those are handled by equipment, the same way all other melee characters deal with those.

Yes -- immune to fear will ignore dazzling display/shattered defenses, incorporeal/flying will ignore tripping, which just means the other parts of the build are used instead. How does a normal melee character handle those same issues?


Critical Assessment wrote:
So I've always liked the idea of a debuff tank so I've made quite a few but I'm at a loss on how you are tripping people, you don't have improved trip or any significant bonus to CMB in the first place. As far as I can tell Weapon Finesse doesn't apply to combat maneuvers because of the existence of the agile maneuvers feat. So without any reliable way to knock enemies prone barring command vicious stomp looks kind of looks a wasted feat to me. Other than that I love the mix of healing and debuff whilst remaining difficult to hit but still a threat.

https://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/weapon-finesse-combat/

Weapon Finesse applies to CMB with finessable weapon per the link provided above.

The buffing bard is proving a +2 at the moment, flanking, charging, and going first helps. I might not be able to vs bosses, but as I level, the stackable bonuses should outweigh the lack of feats/etc. (stunning fist and shattered defenses both lower most enemies CMD as they lose their dex)

Thanks, glad you like it

Name Violation wrote:
2 levels Cavalier will get you dazzling display as a standard action

I wish I could afford that, would free up two feats, but unsure where I can fit that in -- it was part of my original build, but swapped it out when I just bit the bullet ... the other parts of the build are too crunchy for me.

Claxon wrote:
PCScipio wrote:
It requires a permissive GM to allow you to be a Paladin of Desna.

That's a good point.

You can't be a paladin (LG) and worship Desna (CG) to get her divine fighting technique with Starknives. That's pretty incompatible.

Now, the feat is dropped at level 5. But changing your deity mid campaign would typically require some good reason to do so.

If I were your GM this would require extended roleplaying with good reasons for you to leave behind Desna and switch to a lawful good deity instead.

From a practical standpoint, I would say you can't build around this happening.

Good catch, though I own the books, I rarely use them and instead use the srd, quicker/easier to find what I'm looking for -- and I fall into these traps occasionally, having said that ...

Per Weapon Master's Handbook, it says "Although each deity’s divine fighting technique is primarily preserved and passed on by her faithful, worship is not required to learn one. Instead, these fighting styles simply require a certain manner of looking at the world and specific combat training."

So, around the time I give up the divine fighting feat, I no longer match the fighting style due to the switch to natural attacks ... which means it's a simple hop-skip-and-jump to a new AL (L instead of C) -- could even pick up a couple ranks in knowledge religion to learn how amazingly awesome (LG deity is) and switch that way.

If I were a cleric, warpriest, or any other class that worships a deity, this would be a lot more difficult to stomach.


I'm running this build through Rise of the Rune Lords and just hit level3
Party includes a Buffing Bard, a twf dex based unchained rogue, a fighter archer, a control/blaster sorcerer (psychic bloodline for fear affect), and a magus.

Since we don't have a tank, I built one. We also don't have a healer, so I'm performing spot heals after combat.

Race Kitsune
Starting Stats (25pt buy)
Str 5
Int 10
Wis 10
Dex 18
Con 12
Char 20

Projected Stats at level 9:

Ac = 34
5 attacks at = +15, 1d4+7+2d6 (with an extra +5/5 from the bard)
saves Fort = 19, Ref = 24, Will = 16

Traits
Family Heirloom (starknife)
Reactionary (initiative)

1: Herbalist Oracle with Draconic Mystery
2: Unchained Scaled fist Monk
3: Unchained Thug Rogue
4: Unchained Thug Rogue
5: Shifter
6: Enlightened Paladin
7: Enlightened Paladin
8: Unchained Thug Rogue
9: Unchained Thug Rogue

feats:
1: Divine Fighting Feat (retrain to WF Bite at level 5)
Monk 1: IUS
Monk 1: Combat Reflexes
3: Vicious Stomp
Rogue 1: Weapon Finesse
Rogue 2: Diabolic Style
5: Dazzling Display
7: Extra Revelation: Dragon Claws
Rogue 4: Mein of Despair
9: Shattered Defenses

Level 1:

Walking around with my starknife, +5 to attack, dealing 1d4+5 damage, AC 20, lay on hands 6/day and ability to cast murderous command/cure light multiple times a day.
Playing similar to a paladin

Heirloom trait gives me proficiency in starknife
Divine fighting feat give me the ability to fight

Level 2:

Toss off my armor, grab a wand of mage armor to have the sorcerer use on me when we are getting ready to walk into a dangerous area.
AC is now 23

Level 3:

Grab a level of rogue, SA is nice, but the Thug intimidate bonus is better.
Grab Vicious stomp to prep for level 4.
I deal almost no damage with this attack, 1d6-3 -- but my starknife is still rocking it

level 4:

Grab a second level of rogue - evasion is nice, but so is the rogue talent ninja trick : style master: Diabolic Style ...
Now, when I trip someone, they need to make a will save or by staggered for a round.

level 5:

Grab a level of Shifter: I now have a gore and slam attack and my kitsune bite attack

Assuming we get gold, as the first few levels have been pretty sparse, I buy an amulet of mighty fist: agile, and perform some retraining shenanigans.
Level 5 feat = WF IUS
Retrain Divine Combat Feat into Dazzling Display.

Combat options:
Dazzling Display: Intimidate all enemies for multiple rounds
Trip/stagger anyone -- remember, that you can replace any attack with a trip attack, and I am currently up to 3 natural attacks/round)

level 6:

Picking up a level of Enlightened Paladin

Kind of a blah level honestly

level 7:

Picking up my second level of Enlightened Paladin ... which means more retraining shenanigans.

With Paladin giving me a second pool of lay on hands, no need for the first set.
Retrain Herbalist Oracle into Dual Cursed Oracle -- which lets me switch my mystery from Lay on Hands to Misfortune.
Extra Revelation: gaining Dragon claws ... now up to 5 attacks / round
Grace with my charisma means uber-high saves

I can stunning fist, intimidate, trip, stagger my enemies.

level 8:

Back to picking up a level of rogue/thug ... one more die of sneak attack
which I can give up to make the enemy sickened (thug)

I can stunning fist, intimidate, sicken, trip, stagger my enemies.

level 9:

Another level of Rogue
Shattered Defenses ... SA heaven but more importantly, flatfooted means lower CMD
Retrain Class Feature -- switch curse from powerless to another one, as I have uncanny dodge through rogue)

Rogue talent: Mien of Despair

Debilitating injury ...
I can stunning fist, intimidate, sicken, trip, stagger my enemies, they get no morale bonuses, and more penalties to hit or loss of AC.

Gear
Most important piece of gear is the amulet of mighty fist: agile
After that, it is normal stuff (headband, belt, etc.)
Buying a ring of revelation at level 7 means I get Mien of despair through extra rogue talent level 7, and level 8 i choose combat feat: shatter defenses.


Best way is to do battlefield control. Big bad guy wants to attack pc? You make him wet his pants. Party surrounds npc, make them run away provoking from everyone. The guy with the high saves? Sorry but you are shaken (-2 to saves), stack on a couple more conditions and you are set


Arms reach for someone who can use an unarmed strike without reach is literally their square or the adjacent square, to prove, ask, is there anywhere in the adjacent square I cannot attack? (Raw is no: you can attack the adjacent square)


Guys, I think you're focusing on the wrong thing here. I'm pretty impressed with the lack of need for confirmation rolls for crits.

A monster with a x3 or x4 weapon crits 5% of the time, regardless of pcs ac. That sounds very dangerous. Much worse than the 1 damage the monk took


Not to beat a dead horse on the whole ferocity issue ... but it seems like there are two camps ... one which says its deadly to take it, as the DM usually ignores characters who are bleeding out ... whereas the other is saying it is awesome, as you get to heal while bleeding out.

What do you think when the enemy still has at least one attack left when they drop you into the negatives? Is it helpful, or hurtful.

For the post about spending feats on fast healer ... there are traits you can take which increase magical healing (or a level in medium / hierophant) which is a much less expensive way of doing what you are describing (3 feats is huge).

I guess the question I want to ask the OP is ... why is this campaign interesting to you? If the DM is doing CR+5 monsters against you, with additional environmental conditions ... are you trying to beat the DM? Or are you just playing around with making severely overpowered characters?

If you want survivability ... go high AC build ... (multi-class kitsune, fox shape, level 4 pick up amulet of mighty fists (agile)) -- you have almost no skills, but you have the DPS, the saves, and the AC.


meyerwilliam wrote:

Check out my thread.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2uh7v?Spirit-guide-oracle-Of-life#7

I'm currently level 9, only had one tough fight, when I was stun locked. Soaking damage is easy


What happens when you have two level two mediums in the same party.

1) seance bonus doesn't stack (similar to two paladins auras)
2) seance bonus stack (untyped different sources)


Looking at your build in the first post, you probably will not be happy with this character.

Most Oradins go melee, to reduce the number of stats to STR/CON/Char and dump some of the remaining stats -- as a ranged character, you are going DEX/STR/CON/Char, and not dumping any.

With your feats going to two dissimilar feat chains (healing and archery), you will be behind the curve in both.

What is the goal of being a ranged Oradin? Meaning, do you need those two clases? For instance:

If you max UMD, and use arcane wands/scrolls to deal ranged damage, would that suffice? This removes the need for STR and DEX from your build and ups your DPS, but costs gold.
If you go thrown starknife and human, there is a divine fighting feat you can take which lets you use charisma instead of dex/str. This is still feat intensive, but your numbers would be higher (more channels, spells, higher dc, better saves, etc.)
If you plan on only healing out-of-combat, what about being a ranger with wands? I mention this as I'm not seeing your healing scaling up with the party. (1d6 channel at level 3-4 for a standard and without selective channel -- and lifelink takes effort (and levels) to make it work).
Or, a ranged warpriest?

Lastly, what level do you see this build coming online?


Celeborne wrote:

The consensus is clear, at least, even if the RAW is jacked up...

"Friends don't let friends stack Warpriest and Fighter levels..."

Celeborne,

The issue is that the ability you quoted says the following:

Finally, for the purposes of these feats, the warpriest can select feats that have a minimum number of fighter levels as a prerequisite, treating his warpriest level as his fighter level.

Unfortunately, the bolded part is all that you get from the warpriest. The entire extent of what the warpriest gets is just the ability to pick up feats easier.


Feauce,
My questions is more along the realm of

Polymorph Rules:
While under the effects of a polymorph spell, you lose all extraordinary and supernatural abilities that depend on your original form (such as keen senses, scent, and darkvision), as well as any natural attacks and movement types possessed by your original form. You also lose any class features that depend upon form, but those that allow you to add features (such as sorcerers that can grow claws) still function. While most of these should be obvious, the GM is the final arbiter of what abilities depend on form and are lost when a new form is assumed. Your new form might restore a number of these abilities if they are possessed by the new form.

The white haired witch's class ability ... is it the use of her (own / natural) hair, or is it the use of the hair she has on her, even if it's from a new form?

I believe it to be retained, but since this is for PFS, I want to verify beforehand.


Last question ... when I use fox-shape to turn into a tiny fox ... does my white haired witch hair attack still work using my fox hair, or does it disappear?


While you cannot wait to take a feat, you can retrain the level 9 feat at level 10 per the rules in ultimate campaign.


Strange question .... how do they KNOW if you dip? For instance, if you take a level of medium (channeling Champion), you get +2 will (class), then your spirit + séance gives you +1 to hit/fort saves and +3 to damage.

Be the relic version of the medium so you never have to worry about finding a good spot to channel the spirit.

Don't use your spirit burst power, or anything else ... just continue to be a beat stick with slightly higher will saves/damage.


Murdock. For my tiny character. I don't have the option of using str for grapple. Forget about weapon finesse. It's due to my size and the cmb rules.

When the white witch archetype attempts to swap str for int. I think it fails as there is no str in the equation.

The better wording for whw would have been "use int instead of the governing attribute, apply this substitution last"


Wow! That is a cool trait


KitsuneWarlock wrote:

I would take those Rogue levels much earlier, probably after your first level each of Mouser Swashbuckler, Scaled Fist Unchained Monk and Snake Striker Brawler. Dex to Damage and Debilitating Injury is just so nice, even if you have to take Fox Shape a little later due to the decreased base attack bonus. An Amulet will give your natural attacks Magic, so you don't need arcane strike. You could instead take Sap Adept and Sap Master, since they work with Unarmed Strikes and you have Improved Unarmed Strike with Brawler. That'll make your sneak attack dice actually higher than a rogue who didn't multi-class (at level 11). If you still really want Arcane Strike, you can also take Combat Feat as your rogue talent.

Catching people flat-footed at least during the first round of combat won't be that difficult: your bonuses to stealth are really high!

You can also go dual bloodline (Psychic) to be able to cast spells in Fox Form.

Fox shape is gotten at level one due to the alternate racial abilities (bypassing BAB requirements)

re: first round of combat ... not just the stealth, but also the init bonus!!!

I am already getting Dex to Damage at level character level 4 from my Agility amulet ... the unchained rogue ability only affects one weapon (not the claw/claw/bite/gore/sting) combo I am using -- and it would come online later than the amulet did.

Yes ... amulet can make my attacks magic. Once I can afford it (I just turned level 4, and haven't played yet), I can look into retraining Arcane Strike. In the meantime though, it'll be 1-2 levels more before I can afford the +1 agile amulet.

As far as unarmed strikes are concerned ... there is considerable debate as to whether a fox or other non-humanoid can use improved unarmed strike. I am bypassing that discussion by not doing that. I agree that Sap Adept / Master is a great combo, my first rogue went that approach.

My original thought for this character was just taking rogue starting at level 4 onwards ... but then I looked at all the juice dips available, and the more I looked, the further rogue was pushed out. See Louise's conversation and mine ... I'm on the fence of just getting rid of the rogue levels.

I love the idea of cross blooded psychic Thank you!! This lets me use Arcane Mark by pushing my nose against things to "mark" them and lets me sniff out magic (detect magic)!


Louise Bishop wrote:
Dirty Fighting is a thing. But since you are dex you will need agile manuevers.

As a tiny creature, per rules on CMB, I already use Dex instead of STR.

Louise Bishop wrote:
Optimizers all agree the more you Increase your chances to hit the more damage you do. That +2 to attack and +2 to damage far outweighs the Lower BaB and Sneak attack. Sneak attack has some enemies you can not use it on and as someone else pointed out your familiar can not flank for you like you were wanting. Thus you NEED a flanking partner for that ability to work.

Optimizing past a certain point is not feasible (once you hit on a 2, there is nothing to optimize) ... I'll run the numbers.

And no, the person pointing out that my familiar couldn't be a flank buddy was incorrect as I posted.

To recap: Tiny creatures (0 reach) must be in the square of the person they are attacking ... both my familiar and I are ... Underfoot says that any adjacent allies are considered flanking (as am I) ... adjacent is defined as no more than 5' away. Hence, flanking with my familiar.

Louise Bishop wrote:

I would not allow someone who can not talk use the skill. Gathering Information requires talking, Changing someone's attitude requires talking, and making a request requires verbalizing the request.

A talking Fox seems cool to me. You don't need to speak much but as a GM I would require it for a Diplomacy as the skill states you can not use it if the creature can not understand you. The sad looking eyes conveys very little. Not sure why PFS allows this unless the person running it does not know the ins and out of the skill.

It could be ... it only happened once, and I am unsure if it was me aid-another'ing or whatnot. -- Either way, I now know this doesn't work.

Louise Bishop wrote:
Lastly, you can not use Unchained rogue for Vexing Dodger because Vexing replaces trap sense and Unchained has danger sense. So the Skill unlock would need to be a feat which you are kind of low on.

Per Unchained Rogue Danger Sense:

This ability counts as trap sense for the purpose of any feat or class prerequisite, and can be replaced by any archetype class feature that replaces trap sense.

So although I could use Vexing dodger, it doesn't seem to give me anything I would want.

And unfortunately, if I remember, the skill unlocks feat is not currently allowed in PFS ...


Sorry, to explain further .. I'm a kitsune using fox shape. Not a familiar, anthropomorphic, or any other method.

I have weapon finesse as a feat chosen at level 1, as mentioned above, cmb is calculated using Dex per the rules on cmb.

My question is that being tiny, weapon finesse, and white haired witch all attempt to replace str with either Dex or int.

The original question stands, when multiple sources attempt to replace the same stat, is there a hard rule on this?


My character is a fox (tiny creature) which the rules say uses dex instead of strength for it's CMB. Would the white witch's replacement not be valid, as at no point in time could I use strength for that roll?

Or is this a case of specific trumping general?

So confusing.


The difference is this:

Me to Team: Hey guys, anyone have an idea of how to help me?
Them: Yeah, we have a spell / feature we can easily use. I'm surprised I didn't think of this beforehand.
Outcome: Great

Me to Team: Hey guys. I've noticed I've a low will save. Here's what we need to do, every combat, you need to cast these spells on me in this order.
Them: But what if I want to cast something else?
Me: Well, I just upgraded my sword ... your choice.
Outcome: Bad -- team is unhappy

Me to Team: Hey guys. Just a word of warning, I know that I almost killed you a few times. I've looked over my options, and it doesn't look like I can solve this. Beware I'm gonna get dominated and kill you guys (I just upgraded my weapon)
Them: Ready an action to cast slay-living on him.
Outcome: Bad -- my toon is dead.


I 100% agree that the +2 fort that the warrior gives is better than the +2 ref that the rogue gives ... poison though, I disregard -- the spell delay poison is such a good spell to be cast on front-liners, that I consider it a staple. But +2d6 sneak attack vs the +2 to hit/Damage/Ref, +4 AC seems bigger somehow.

My biggest concern is via role-playing, to have to switch to kitsune form to drink the mutagen just feels wrong. Don't get me wrong, I have a couple toons which mix-up rage and mutagen and have a blast. This guy though, is all about static-persistent bonuses, instead of temporary ones (mage armor (3 hours = basically all day) or the occasional shield spell is different)

You can actually diplomacy as a fox ... grin ... the way I do it, is to make puppy dog eyes at the NPCs ... might be a bit of a penalty due to lack of common language, but still :)

And yes, skills are not as important in higher levels -- I will never make the knowledge checks (knowledge is not a class skill, negative int bonus, lack of skill ranks) to identify monsters. My perception is low

Re: ring of eloquence: that should be a needed item, but the way I'm playing it, the fox tries never to talk (this is difficult for me as a player, as I usually like to be up-front-and-talking) ...

What do you think of the hunter animal focus? Is there any ones that look good? Alternately, the style feats ... I'm trying to see if I can dirty trick instead of making an attack, but it looks to take quite a large amount of feats ... I also looked into the vexing dodger archetype for the rogue, but losing my dex while climbing seemed insane. Now, level 5 rogue for the skill unlock would fix that, but that's way too many levels.


SorrySleeping ... help me out here to understand what you are saying:

A fox (Tiny) has reach 0, just like a thrush (diminutive). With 0' reach, we need to be in the enemies square.

My familiar is in the same square as me (i.e. in the same square as the enemy) ... can you explain why I can attack the enemy, but the thrush cannot? If the thrush can attack the enemy (even if it doesn't) then it threatens them, which means flanking, right?

With the pathfinder definition of adjacent meaning 5' or closer, the familiar and I are adjacent.

Can you point out what I am missing?


Arcane strike is more than +1 damage, it makes my natural attacks count as magic ... which is amazing to bypass Dr/Magic until/unless I upgrade my amulet of might fists: agile to agile+1 (level 5 or 6 due to fame)

3 levels Mutagen Fighter vs Rogue:
2d6 SA, evasion, 8 skills/level, rogue talent (feat) +2 BAB, +1 fort/will, +3 Ref, +18 skill points vs
Mutagen (+2 damage, +2 Natural AC), two feats, +3 BAB, +1 will/ref, +3 Fort, +3 skill points, +3 hps

I'm not seeing the awesomeness of the mutagenic fighter ...

Hmmm .. ranger, there's an idea. Is power attack better than piranha strike?


My flanking buddy is my thrust familiar ... he occupies my square and just sits there ... underfoot from mouser says that any adjacent allies provide flanking -- rules state that adjacent is anything 5' or closer (i.e. including the same square).

This is for PFS so no vivisectionist Alchemist ... plus since I am in fox shape almost 24x7, taking the standard to drink the mutagen is actually upwards of three rounds (standard to switch to kitsune form, standard to drink, standard to return to fox shape). You are correct that technically I would have extracts, but with my low casting stat, I would be unable to use them.

The casting of mage armor lasts 3 hours (trait gave +2 CL for sorcerer), so that's basically all day (3 rounds every 3 hours is fine).

The three levels of rogue were mainly for the Sneak Attack damage (+2d6 damage per hit, for 5 attacks) ... the evasion is ok ... the extra combat feat (rogue talent) isn't bad ... but the higher level plan I'm not so sure of ... initially I was looking at rogue from level 5 onwards ... but the more I looked at it, and the more I played it, the less inclined I was to go rogue.

Snakebite brawler was initially to get Sneak Attack while not losing another point of BAB, so that I could get my next teamwork feat (prereq of +4 BAB) as well as accomplished sneak attacker ... but having seen the enemies 5' step away from me while I am in their square, I chose step-up instead ...

Great suggestions though ...

I'm half tempted to take a second level of medium to give my allies the séance bonus ... or either two levels of Paladin (grace / lay on hands) or three levels of holy tactician paladin (easier teamwork feat stuff)


Grin ... I've been playing this since level 1, and about to hit level 4 (when I get to do damage) ... Looking for feedback on this build

Shippo:

Race: Kitsune, using the alternate racial trait to get fox shape at level 1. I spend virtually all my time in fox shape and I am the party tank.

1: Mouser Swashbuckler
Underfoot deed... combat style is to annoy the enemy, disarm, steal, dirty trips, grapple.
Weapon Finesse-lite (works on bite attack only)
2: Scaled Fist monk
Charisma to AC
3: Draconic Bloodline Sorcerer
Claw attack, ability to cast mage armor and shield while not in fox-form.
4: Cavalier (Flame Order)
Tactician ... rawr!!
5: Urban Bloodrager
Valet Thrush Familiar (diminutive, sits on me), +10 move
6: Snakebiter Brawler
Sneak attack
7: Relic Channeler Medium
Ability to add 1d6 to any ally's (including me) failed d20 roll, +2 damage.
8: Cavalier
Ability to move during the initiative check!!! This lets me get into the enemies square to harass them.
9: Unchained Rogue
Sneak attack, retraining feat.
10: Unchained Rogue
Evasion
11: Unchained Rogue
Sneak attack

Feats:
Racial: Fox Shape
1: Weapon Finesse (retrain to Practiced Tactician at level 9)
Monk1: Dragon Style
3: Arcane Strike
5: Step Up
Cavalier: Paired Opportunist
7: Outflank
Rogue 1: Weapon Finesse
9: Accomplished Sneak Attack
Rogue 2 Talent: Open
11: Open

Tactics:
Level 1-3. I did 1 point of nonlethal per hit, as 1d3-4 is nothing. I contribute to the party by soaking AoOs, performing combat maneuvers (grapple, steal, disarm, dirty tricks, etc) and provide flanking buddies to team members.
Level 4+ I have the fame to purchase the amulet of mighty fists: agile. So, I now do damage. 1d3+10 at level 4 with a single bite, or 1d3+7 for claw/claw/bite ... Starting at this level, for boss fights ... I can use tactician to give allies the ability to take AoOs from things like the boss provoking to get away from me (underfoot).
Level 5: Enemies can no longer escape me by 5' stepping from me to perform their actions. I now have a thrust familiar which has my teamwork feats ... so, I am always getting a bonus to hit for AoOs.
Level 7: My familiar is now giving me another +2 to hit from outflank. Note: this attack bonus also translates into bonuses to CMB checks.
Level 9-11: Numbers just get bigger.

Stats in Fox Shape at level 11
Str: 3
Int: 7
Wis: 7
Dex: 32
Con: 14
Char: 22
AC: 33 unbuffed, 37 with mage armor, 41 with shield as well.
Touch AC: 33
HP: 85
Fort: 16
Ref: 24
Will: 9 (+11 vs mind affecting)
Attack: bite+25 (1d3+14+3d6 SA), Clawx2+25(1d2+14+3d6 SA), Gore+25 (1d2+14+3d6 SA), Sting+25 (1d2+14+3d6 SA)
Init +17
movement: 50', can charge through allies / difficult terrain.
Scent

Equipment
Amulet of Mighty Fist: Agile
Belt of dex +6
Ring of Protection +3
Cloak of Protection +3
Headband of Charisma +4
Helm of Mammoth Lord
Fleshwarped Scorpion's Tail
Cracked ioun stone (+1 to hit)
Cracked ioun stone (+1 to saves)
Cracked ioun stone (+1 to init)

Skills:
Stealth: +25
Acrobatics: 20
Climb: 15
Diplomacy: +23
Perception: +2
Survival: +7
Disable Device: +18
Sleight of Hand: +25

I'm looking for advice for levels 4+, if you see a glaring issue or if there is a better way to do something ...


Strange question

If I had a white haired witch, with weapon finesse how do I determine which order to use in stat substitution for grapples.

1) white haired witch ability replaces str with int. Nothing for weapon finesse to interact with
2) weapon finesse replaces str with Dex, nothing for white haired witch to interact with
3) players choice?


5 Hps/level is fine for passive/out-of-combat healing, but for in-combat healing, it won't really be enough for you.

Check out my double-life linked oracle:
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2uh7v?Spirit-guide-oracle-Of-life#7

He heals 16 hps/person/round, and the damage is split between him and his toad familiar, so each takes 5 damage.


Swashbucklers are pretty good tanks. With the right feats, you can be battlefield control with the ability to have teamwork feats with your flank buddy to make it really painful for the enemy.


I'd love to see the builds you are looking at ...


Just remember. You cannot have an improved familiar take an archetype(like protector)

If you go kitsune, for flavor you can sit on a party members shoulders as a familiar. Channeling and other things can be done in fox shape.

Sounds like you will have a lot of fun

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