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Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber. Organized Play Member. 41 posts. 1 review. 1 list. No wishlists. 3 Organized Play characters.




Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Rolling a more specific or more applicable skill gives a lower DC than a more general or less relevant skill - this is mentioned a couple times in the book, for example in the Adjusting Difficulty section:

Adjusting Difficulty wrote:

You might use different DCs for a task based on the particular skill or statistic used for the check. Let’s say your PCs encounter a magical tome about aberrant creatures. The tome is 4th-level and has the occult trait, so you set the DC of an Occultism check to Identify the Magic to 19, based on Table 10-5. As noted in Identify Magic, other magic-related skills can typically be used at a higher DC, so you might decide the check is very hard for a character using Arcana and set the DC at 24 for characters using that skill. If a character in your group had Aberration Lore, you might determine that it would be easy or very easy to use that skill and adjust the DC to 17 or 14. These adjustments aren’t taking the place of characters’ bonuses, modifiers, and penalties-they are due to the applicability of the skills being used.

This also applies to things that aren't lore, or to lore skills of varying relevance, as mentioned in, for example, Creature Identification:

Creature Identification wrote:

The skill used to identify a creature usually depends on that creature’s trait, as shown on Table 10-7, but you have leeway on which skills apply. For instance, hags are humanoids but have a strong connection to occult spells and live outside society, so you might allow a character to use Occultism to identify them without any DC adjustment, while Society is harder. Lore skills can also be used to identify their specific creature. Using the applicable Lore usually has an easy or very easy DC (before adjusting for rarity).

Does Bardic Lore, or Loremaster Lore, benefit from an easier DC as though it were a more specific skill?


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Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Can Bards use Lingering Performance and Inspire Heroics on the same casting of Inspire Courage?

RAW, it seems it's up to the GM, because the triggers are not "identical". Do you agree?

If you do, as a GM, what would you say?

Triggers p. 297 wrote:

Triggers

The triggers listed in the stat blocks of reactions and free actions limit when you can use them. You can use only 1 free action on a single trigger, but you can take both a free action and a reaction on the same trigger. If you somehow get more than 1 reaction per round, you can also use only 1 reaction per trigger. If two triggers are similar, but not identical, the GM determines whether you can use multiple free actions or reactions.
Lingering Performance p. 235 wrote:

[[F]] Verbal Casting; Trigger You finish casting a cantrip composition with a duration of 1 round.

Inspire Heroics p. 233 wrote:

[[F]] Verbal Casting; Trigger You finish casting inspire courage.


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Enfeeble provides a penalty to damage rolls. Lots of other effects affect damage rolls too, but let's stick with enfeebled.

Why are spell damage rolls affected by Enfeeble?

As far as I can tell (thank you Tholomyes) p293 which calls out "A damage roll typically uses a number and type of dice determined by the weapon or unarmed attack used or the spell cast" so yeah, by RAW, Enfeeble affects your spells.

:(


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Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

What saving throw is used for Divine Wrath? It's not a 1e spell, so I can't infer it.


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Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I can't find in the rules where the various combat maneuver uses of Athletics that have the Attack trait cause the Athletics skill checks to be considered "Attack rolls".

This means:

  • While Athletics activities with the Attack trait contribute to the Multiple Attack Penalty, the Athletics checks made never suffer a penalty.
  • Maneuvers cannot benefit from bonuses to Attack Rolls, like Inspire Courage.
  • Maneuvers made with Finesse weapons (e.g. Rapier to take a Disarm action) cannot use their Dexterity bonus instead of Strength.
  • Maneuvers rarely suffer from penalties from Conditions (like Sluggish).

This doesn't make sense to me, it seems like it's unintended.

Disarm Activity p147:
Traits: Attack
Requirements You have at least one hand free. The target can’t be more than two sizes larger than you.

You try to knock something out of an opponent’s grasp. A Disarm attack requires you to roll an Athletics check against the opponent’s Reflex DC.

Success You weaken your opponent’s grasp on the item. Until the start of that creature’s turn, attempts to Disarm the opponent of that item get a +2 circumstance bonus.

Critical Success You knock the item out of the opponent’s grasp. It falls to the ground in the opponent’s space.

Critical Failure You lose your balance and become flat-footed until the start of your next turn.

Multiple Attack Penalty's definition implies that actions that have the Attack trait might be considered Attack rolls. It never actually states that though.

Multiple Attack Penalty p305:
Attacks are particularly strenuous and become less and less effective the more you use them during a single turn. The second time you use an attack action (anything with the attack trait) during your turn, you take a –5 penalty to your attack roll. On your third attack (and any
subsequent attacks if you have a way to take more) you take a –10 penalty. This penalty is called your multiple attack penalty. The multiple attack penalty applies only on your turn and resets at the end of your turn. Attacks you can make outside of your turn might include their own penalties.

But then the Disarm weapon trait implies that attack rolls and Athletics checks to disarm are two different things that need special handling.

Disarm Weapon Trait p415:
Disarm: You can use this weapon to Disarm with the Athletics skill even if you don’t have a free hand. This uses the weapon’s reach (if different from your own) and adds the weapon’s item bonus to attack rolls (if any) as a bonus to the Athletics check. If you critically fail a check to Disarm using the weapon, you can drop the weapon to treat it as a normal failure. On a critical success, you still need a free hand if you want to take the item.


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I can't find anything in the book about light sources creating dim light beyond their Bright light range. I'm going to default to what feels like a sane choice of Dim light extends twice as far as Bright.

So the Light spell casts 20' Bright light, and 20 feet beyond that of Dim light.


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Sneak p.158 wrote:
You can attempt to move to another place while becoming or staying unseen. Stride up to half your Speed.
Questions on Stealth:
  • Is it true that if I take 3 Sneak actions, I have to make 3 Stealth rolls? Against an equal level opponent, I probably have a 3-4 bonus advantage, which means I succeed on a 7 or higher. Statistically speaking, I'm going to fail, and become Sensed.
  • Is initiative the only contested Stealth roll, opposed by Perception? I have to make another Stealth roll?

I'm looking forward to testing out to see how it works in game, but I'm struggling with the number of opportunities I have for failure.


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Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Hello PCRogue, I understand you want to sneak up on the goblin and put a knife in him? Excellent!

Naturally, we're currently in Exploration Mode [p. 316], and it sounds like you've chosen the Sneaking tactic! So let's have you roll a Stealth roll for the tactic, enabling you to move around the dimly lit (so you have the Concealed status) room. Good thing too, if it were a Brightly lit room, you wouldn't be able to Sneak around without cover.

I rolled a 15 Stealth for you (because Sneak has the Secret trait), beating the Perception DC of 14. You're able to sneak around the room, and are close to the Hobgoblin's back. He picks his nose.

According to the Sneaking tactic, when we start this encounter, you will roll Stealth for your initiative instead of a Perception check. This check will determine your initiative order, and to see if the enemies notice you.

You declare you're attacking, which (according to p. 331) is a creature on your side deciding to take an action against someone on the other side.

You roll a Stealth for Initiative, and you get a 17!
I roll a Perception for the Hobgoblin, and only get a 12.

He hasn't spotted you, and you're going first. He hasn't acted in this first round of combat, so the Rogue class feature Surprise Attack activates, and he is flat-footed to you.

It's your turn.

You take an action other than Stealth, and attack him. You lose the "Unseen" condition, and are now "Seen", before your action starts. Normally, this would make it so the Hobgoblin is no longer flat-footed, but because of Surprise Attack, he still is flat-footed. You hit with your attack and get Sneak Attack damage!

But what if initiative happened differently?

You roll a Stealth for Initiative, and you get a 15!
I roll a Perception for the Hobgoblin, and only get a 17.

Even though your Stealth was higher than the Hobgoblin's Perception DC of 14, he spots you as you move to attack, and is able to react. As far as I can tell, the Stealth initiative roll is the ONLY contested roll in the game. As you creep forward, you foot scatters some pebble on the ground, alerting the Hobgoblin to your presence!

It's the Hobgoblin's turn. He attacks you, and you don't get Sneak Attack damage for this fight.

What else can I do?

You can't use Deception to Create a Distraction, it follows the same rules as "Attacking ends the Sensed condition right before your attack."

You can use the Feint action (Deception Trained).

If you're not a Rogue, even if you go first in Initiative, the Hobgoblin is not flat-footed to your attacks. (But you don't have Sneak Attack either, so it would just be the -2 AC anyway).

I can't say I'm a fan of having a contested roll to determine Sneaking up on someone, especially after you already had to make a Stealth roll in Exploration mode. It's essentially 2 chances to be spotted, and the second is a lot more "Swingy" as odds go.

If anyone has rules/comments that would paint a different picture, I'd love it. Or if a Paizo staff wants to clarify something I missed?


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Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Why is there a Dire Rat in Lost Star's A10 (Befouled Shrine)?


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Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

So, I just started reading through these forums, as I've played PF since beta, and DND since I was 9 years old back in first edition (although those memories are blurry). In my experience, as I've followed the game through out it's many implementations, it's remained a game of roles, not balance.

Each player picks a character concept that fulfills a role with regards to a party, and fleshes out the character to truly embody and have fun with that concept. Fighters are front line hitters, taking hits just as well as they dish them out. Wizards are squishy, but can do more damage than anyone else.

I think 3 or 4 of the top General Discussion forums at point of this writing are about how the Rogue is imbalanced, where either the Rogue needs improvements, or the Rogue needs his SA nerfed.

Well I disagree with both points. In fact the Rogue fulfills his puzzle piece perfectly, going above and beyond his role in the party. He can face, he can trap-find, he can manuever tactically.

I can hear you already though... and I agree! The fighter CAN hit more, and gets Strength to every attack. (Currently playing with a power-gamer of a father who can, at level 10, conduct 250 points of damage with an archer-fighter). The Wizard concept can do more damage than even that fighter though! Metamagic feats propel damage so much higher. But that's the point of the Wizard. He fulfills his role!

Now we return to our Rogue. What's his deal? I play the rogue in our group, and I drive the party forward. I wheel, deal, and race into position tactically when I need to. (And because my father challenged me with his 250 damage, I've managed to wrangle similar or higher numbers out of my level 10 rogue with some absurd dancing, presuming all my attacks hit. Oh and I get hurt. A LOT.) But that doesn't change that above anything else, I fulfill my role as the specialist. Because that's what the rogue is. So he doesn't need changing, or limits. By RAW alone, he's good at what he does, and isn't good at what he doesn't do.


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