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OceanshieldwolPF 2.5 wrote:


Umm…where? It would be nice if folx could link “confirmations” or at least describe where they got the info from…

Paizo instagram post following an accidental leak in an Amazon product discription.

Link: https://www.instagram.com/p/C56bJnluxLG/?igsh=OXZwNm80eWJucGRp


I wonder how dominant these dragons were when proper prophecy *did* work. Or if they never had any ties to those long-term powers at all.


Also, why oh why does Come and Get Me work against enemies with ranged attacks?! How does it make any sense to open yourself up to those and somehow make them flat-footed from that exchange if you're standing miles away from them. It should only work against opponents that are in your reach, and the barbarian shouldn't be flat-footed to anyone else since they'd be targeting who to open up their guard to.


It seems really odd to me that you can't choose to stop the effects of Come and Get Me during your turn as a free action, and that you're stuck with your guard open until you stop raging.

Besides that, it's weird that the only time the feat is really worth using is when you're already off-guard, where you get basically none of the drawbacks but also kinda break the flavor of the feat. If you're off-guard, chances are they already were coming to get you.

One thing to consider for using this against bosses is bosses will crit you a lot, and if you get knocked down, you will have to rage and lose on action economy (not to mention picking up weapons...). It seems like a great trade for the boss. Plus, if they knock you out in one hit due to a crit, I don't think you can use your reaction as you go down. It's not like the temp HP you get will shield you against its initial blows, since you need to hit it after it hits you to get them.

Plus this costs an action to do... There's so many better uses of that action I can think of that would help to kill the boss faster. If it was a free action during your turn, I would still hesitate to use it, unless I'm off-guarded anyways. And the ability only becomes worse against multiple enemies.

The feat also seems like a general waste of an action until you get Vengeful Strike.


YuriP wrote:

Guts concept is way different. He's way more a Fighter that gets a cursed uncontrolled rage due Berserker Armor.

Whaaaat? Maybe in the Golden Age arc, but after he gets betrayed and becomes rage-filled, he's constantly compared to a raging monster when he lashes out against Apostles, even before he gets the Berserker Armor. In fact, the example I brought up was before he got it. It is true that the armor brings out the worst in him, though.


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HeHateMe wrote:

Ummm...Conan is THE ORIGINAL Barbarian, and in the Robert Howard stories he was described as having the reflexes of a cobra, or a panther, when he went berserk. He hardly ever took a hit, bad guys would end up hitting each other cuz he was so fast.

I remember recently seeing a Conan panel where he barely dodges a blow and his helmet comes off instead, so that adds up. Although, that kind of equipment attrition doesn't lend itself well to this system, so I think it's perfectly fair to translate those instances into having taken actual damage. However, I haven't read Conan so I don't know how often his equipment takes damage for him to determine if he's kind of reckless.

I can however bring up the example of Guts from Berserk, who is a pretty smart and scrappy combatant who usually tries to dodge stuff and he's pretty quick on his feet, but he's also really ballsy when enraged, and he has to be to outsmart his monstrous opponents who underestimate his tolerance for pain.

In chapters 110-116, he sets a field on fire and runs through it to burn up the bugs eating him, and gets stabbed through the arm and dragged through the air by a flying monster in order to get them closer to him so he can unload his arm cannon at point-blank range. Plus he has hundreds of wounds all covering his body, so he's definitely no stranger to taking blows to end fights.


Do you not expect Barbarians to be more reckless, SuperBidi? That sounds odd given how they're based entirely on raging to enable their class features. Plus it's flavored in such a way that they are incapable of concentrating and thinking things through, so playing "stupidly" seems like the only correct way to play. At least when you're raging.


exequiel759 wrote:
If we have to jump through so many loops to solve the -1 to AC, why don't remove it? As we already discussed the -1 AC goes against the basic idea of barbarians being tanks that shrug off blows as they get hit and crit more often.

Mostly just because getting hit more often makes sense for someone throwing caution to the wind. They ignore the pain through grit, which the temporary hitpoints represent well. If you just ignored the blow entirely since you didn't have the -1 AC, then the player wouldn't really get that part of the fantasy that they're tanking hits that would bring other classes down; they would just think they deflected or dodged the blow, since the mechanics aren't really pointing to another possibility. At least, it seems like something that would be easy to forget about when the GM is narrating the barbarian getting hit.

Plus, temp HP lets the Barbarian tank hits from damaging saving throw effects without any penalty, which is a point I haven't seen brought up yet.

The only remaining issue is that critical hits can knock you down more often, but barbarians could get some measure of crit resistance to mitigate that, flavored as them positioning themselves so that a blow will hit a non-vital part while continuing their onslaught.


HeHateMe wrote:


As you mentioned, that shrugging off attacks fantasy no longer works cuz lowering AC opens Barbarians up to eating more crits. When I played a Barbarian I didn't feel tough at all, I felt extremely fragile. Not at all the experience I was expecting. Hopefully they dump the AC penalty in the Remaster, or if they want to keep it then Barbs need damage resistance from lvl 1. Temp HPs don't even come close to making up for the AC penalty.

Yup, I think another solution could be that enemies now have to beat your lowered AC by +11 instead of +10 to crit, but that might be tricky to remember...


Ed Reppert wrote:
And one has become, albeit reluctantly, a Paladin of Tokamak, the god of war.

TOKAMAK! Destroy my enemies, and my life is yours.


It also seems weird that the -2 to skill checks would apply to Recalling Knowledge against the target you're fascinated by. I'm nitpicking, though.


Derry L. Zimeye wrote:
Ruling question, cuz I'm dumb! When it says 2d6 void damage and sickened 1 until you eat raw meat, does that mean you can't heal the void damage either until you eat the raw meat? Cuz if so, siiiiick.

I feel like it would be spelled out explicitly in this section, but it isn't: https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=2396

So for now I'm assuming the damage doesn't persist.

One argument is that "any other effect of the stage that doesn’t list a duration" includes damage, but I doubt it, I think the intent for that is to handle any unusual condition, as the paragraph first covers how damage is handled, then conditions. The title for the paragraph section clearly distinguishes between damage and conditions.


Or the knowledge they've been holding back spills out and drives people insane.


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For b) you can just grab the official paid module to save yourself some time: https://paizo.com/products/btq02eat?FoundryVTT-Pathfinder-2E-Tokens-Bestiar y


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Quote:
How would one go about finding Barbarians+? It's not coming up on a web search for me. Is it cool to link third party stuff here?

Just tried it and noticed that Google replaced the search with "Showing results for Barbarian pf2e". I pressed "Search instead for Barbarians+ pf2e" and it showed up. It's on pathfinderinfinite .com if that doesn't help.


Some crit resistance while raging sounds like the way to go yeah. Sure you leave some openings willingly, but you try to make sure they aren't vital.

I'd say it should only make it so enemies have to roll 11+ above your AC instead of 10+, would be simpler and it won't grant resistance to nat 20 crits.


Sounds great, hope to see a link to it thrown in the forums one day.


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Because then it's part of their power budget and not every group enjoys having that mental burden around. If you don't use that part of the power budget, it's wasted. Or at least it'll feel wasted for the alchemist player. Which leads to the alchemist begging others to use their stuff so they're playing optimally.

You could still pass items to the group by crafting some, since an alchemist should be really good at crafting. At least then it won't be a constant stress on the party since it would require downtime and money to perform, and you could ask the party if they'd like such items, instead of being forced to hand them items because you crafted a crapton of stuff with reagents for free automatically each day.


I would hope for at least a feat to occasionally opt-into not being able to hand out your infused items in exchange for a power boost for those items. That way you don't have to burden your team with learning the benefits of a bunch of different items and force them to use their free hand for them since that's usually the optimal play. It could easily be justified as making the item have a complicated/sensitive activation requiring an alchemist to handle it in order to not spoil the item.

This way the alchemist can choose whether or not some of their power budget goes to being an item dispenser.


Nightwhisper wrote:
Personally, I think the alchemist would benefit from a design that was more like Focus points for Quick Alchemy, with Advanced Alchemy being a separate resource. This would also make room to have unique actions usable with Quick Alchemy instead of only replicating existing items.

I love this idea for a couple of reasons, but mostly I just love the idea of alchemists actually getting to do some light ingredient-searching in the form of the potential flavor you could choose for "refocusing" to get back some "quick reagents". Just seems like a place where you could get a lot more flavorful with how your alchemist is making these reagents, whereas having it all be in daily preparations could lead to having it be glossed over.


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Squiggit wrote:
I guess it's beyond the scope of day 1 errata but a bit disappointed there was no change to psychic refocusing. IME it was a key part of the class' power pre-remaster.

Not sure if you've seen it, but Sayre has said that this was just an incidental power boost:

M. Sayre wrote:
Amps, unleashes, and psyche actions are what psychics get instead of a third spell slot per level; their Focus Point advantage is a largely incidental boost meant to ensure they have enough resource that their amps feel and function as a more essential part of their kit than their spell slots.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder2e/comments/17ox39r/comment/k83isd5/?utm _source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3


PossibleCabbage wrote:

I wonder if the Panache mechanic couldn't operate via- "Psyching yourself up is easy, but staying in the groove is hard."

Which is to say that you gain panache trivially, but it tends to just fade away quickly if you can't maintain that "hot streak" by succeeding at stuff.

I like this hot streak idea. It inspires me to rework Panache as a sort of combo meter that goes down every round unless you keep it up. Very fitting thematically as you'd basically be gaining style points for showing off over and over, instead of doing something flashy only to revert back to the regular martial mindset of hitting stuff hard (with your finisher) over and over.

Could be implemented by allowing Panache to stack, with it counting down by 1 every round unless you gained or attempted to gain a stack of Panache or consumed one in that round. Each stack doesn't grant additional numerical bonuses, but it can be used to make consecutive 'finishers', and perhaps even enable more devastating finishers that use a greater amount of Panache stacks. This panache-stacking would combo really well with the bonus to your panache actions you gain while in Panache, which is otherwise rarely used (in my experience).
Of course, this would go best with your idea of making Panache generation easier.

EDIT: Adding a response to this text now that I've read it, since it goes along with what I'm saying:

Sanityfaerie wrote:
Some tangible immediate benefit for doing things that would gain you panache while you already have panache, to encourage you to keep doing the awesome things.

Exactly my issue with Panache besides it being hard to generate; once you have it, you typically just want to go deal your damage instead of staying in the zone, which I think is a shame for a class all about showing off. Instead, as it is, you show off a bit, and then revert to an unga bunga melee strike, ad nauseam. I think a panache combo meter would help a lot with this, since there could be really cool finishers to try to use that would require a decent stack of panache, so you're encouraged to stay in the flow state until you have a big enough combo to use the awesome flashy move. All the while, you get to actually benefit from the panache bonus to your panache-generating actions.


Cyder wrote:
A completely alternative idea is to have Panache as something you use to buff he actions that currently gain you panache, so Panache gives you a bonus to your next feint, trip, Bon Mot effect and have it scale up - +1 at low levels and +3 at high levels.

That's already how Panache passively operates at low levels. Or do you mean consume the Panache to gain an even higher bonus for those actions?


Sanityfaerie wrote:
- Additionally, any time you get a crit success on anything that involved str, dex, or cha, you gain panache.

I would maybe amend this so that you don't gain panache just for crit succeeding a saving throw.

EDIT: Especially because you could have a single teammate fully enable a team of swashbucklers just by throwing out a saving throw effect from a low-level item where the DC becomes trivial to beat. Actually never mind, that would be a hilarious strategy and is suitably showoff-y, I approve.

Otherwise, I love everything about this. I especially agree that Finishers are weird flavor-wise and I wouldn't miss them if they got removed, though that sadly sounds like too big a change for the remaster. Still, interesting idea for a homebrew...


Deriven Firelion wrote:
I really would like staves and wands or magic weapons for wizards to boost attack rolls and spells. The classic powerful staff or wand often used like a magic weapon by a caster is a classic fantasy trope. No one has quite captured that in D&D in any edition. Usually they are additional casting or a consumable. I'd much rather have staves and wands operate more like magic weapons for martials but adding to spellcasting power. That would be pretty cool.

The "Spell Foci" homebrew by Darth & Drow does exactly this, though it's a Patreon exclusive right now.

I haven't had a chance to check it out myself since I haven't played a caster yet, but if you're interested I'll drop the link to their Discord server here: https://discord.gg/MXAjhMxzef


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This blurb of text: "The GM may increase the Perception DCs of these observers if they’re distracted."

It should say "decrease" instead.