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Any other suggestions of articles from the Dragon or Dungeon back catalog that could be useful here? I'm already using Dungeon 128 (frogemoth update) and Dragon 280 (radioactive monsters). I'm sure dozens of other articles would be appropriate, whether specific monsters, general plot suggestions, or anything else that could help. Any ideas?
I'll probably use the rules for radiation sickness from d20 modern instead. No extra fingers or eyes -- just CON damage. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20modern/we/20021103a
And as it turns out, it looks like Wizards just published an article called "Return to the Temple of the Frog", expanding a bit on the advanced technology per d20 Modern. This could be helpful to me here. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20modern/article/20070301a
The visitors from Temple of the Frog (DA2) are the same ones from DA3, only DA3 describes their crashed ship and technology in greater detail. DA3 should be useful in updating S3, as the situations and technologies are somewhat similar. There's even a list of various robot types in DA3. I did not know the Frogemoth had been updated in Dungeon 128. Thanks for that.
Ah, I see the Beagle is from DA3 City of the Gods.
Yes. As you probably already know, The Warden (from Metamorphosis Alpha) was the inspiration for the ship from the Barrier Peaks tournament module, according to Gygax in the BP introduction. However, as you alluded to, the Warden is waaay too big to be a single adventure, or even an adventure series. It is really an entire campaign world that can't really be fully explored. Technically, I wouldn't say that the Warden is part of D&D. The other two were indeed described in D&D modules. I've read through the "Metaporhosis Alpha to Omega" module several times, and pulled what bits I could from it to this much smaller ship in BP (like including a cargo bay with gun turrets), but most of the module focuses on various factions that have developed on different levels, and various large facilities (like android factories), both of which wouldn't make any sense on a smaller ship. Unfortunatly, since the Warden is so large, almost nothing is described in detail. I would probably have much more to work with here if MA had been much more popular. Since your first mention of it, I have taken a look at the Oard in the module Where Chaos Reigns and in D&D Creature Catalogue. Do they appear anywhere else that you know of, or is the Beagle expored further anywhere else? I will also look at your suggestions regarding Oard adventure paths elsewhere on this board. Thank you for your suggestions.
OK, I think I have a basic skeleton for a revised storyline that preserves the cool aspects of the original tournament crawl while adding some story flow. Thanks very much for all the suggestions. The decks are the same as I listed above. Decks 7, 6, 5, and 4 basically follow the module. The garden level includes some encounters from the "upper walkway" level of the original module (OM). The lounge from the OM has been moved to the rec level. The security officer quarters and captain quarters from OM level 1 have been moved to the officer's quarters. "Computer central" (OM LVL 1) has been moved to the bridge level. Decks 3, 2 and 1 are mostly new. Level 7 - Cargo holds: The exit elevator is blocked by a radioactive area guarded by a nyth (FR MOF). Level 6 - Quarters and medical: Follows the OM closely, with the exceptions above. Medical area contains introductory info on the plague and the insanity it induced prior to death. PC will be concerned that they have been infected. Level 5 - Recreation and marine observatory: Follows the module closely. Central area is the marine observatory/aquarium looking out onto the bottom of the lake from the level above, but the doors to that room will not open initially. In the holodeck, players will experience some sort of odd entertainment simulation. The main computer will intervene afterwards, in the form of a holographic avatar. The computer will beg the PCs to rescue "the children" on deck 2, who are "enslaved". It will also warn about a small group of creatures that kill anything that enters level 3. Then the main computer will open the doors to the marine observatory and break off communication. The PCs must enter the marine observatory, get underwater gear, enter the water through a decompression chamber, and ascend to level 4 Gardens. Armor must be removed and stored. In the water is a dangerous creature (frogemoth miniboss?), and the PCs will be at a distinct disadvantage in underwater gear. Level 4 - Garden: This follows the OM closely. Lots of hostile flora and fauna. Level 3 - Stasis: this level appears dark and deserted, a striking difference from the teeming life of the garden level. This deck was where hundreds of creatures were stored in stasis during the exploration mission. Some creatures still remain in stasis, but most stasis cages are now empty. The only creatures actually roaming the level are several *extremely* powerful alien xenomorphs. These creatures are extremely resistant and quite powerful killing machines. A head-on attack, even with futuristic weapons, is not a good idea. The players have two possible advantages. One is to release some remaining stasis creatures to wear down the xenomorphs. Another is to use a power loader/exosuit located near the exit from the level to beat the heck out of the xenos. This level is dark, full of bones and debris, and full of random noises. The xenos use stealth and camouflage to full advantage. Horror turned up to 11 as a miniboss encounter. Exosuit is way too large to leave this deck. Level 2 - Officers' quarters: Populated by descendents of the children who survived the plague. A primitive culture was established here, but not long ago they were mentally enslaved by the Big Bad Boss as thralls. PCs will be aware of this, even if the computer must repeat it over and over on the PA system. PCs will have access to paralysis/needler weaponry, so non-lethal takedown of the thralls will be an option. However, they are equipped with high tech weaponry, and they know how to use it thanks to the BBB's influence. Basically, this will be room-to-room fighting, with the added angle of the computer's insistence on nonlethal combat. Survivors are confined to the corridors and minimal medical/kitchen areas of the level, due to having no proper access cards. PCs with proper access cards can obtain the very best in high-tech weaponry from senior officer's private caches. Level 1 - Bridge. BBB is here -- highly psionic, highly malevolent. Similar in appearance to an Ultroloth. Will use extensive offensive and defensive combat-oriented psionics to largely negate magic/mundane weapons, and has high resistance to high tech weaponry due to a personal shield device. BBB will not attempt charm/domination/etc. This is all about combat. Basically, this is an all-out brawl in which the PCs should exhaust most of their new toys. Main computer can perhaps assist PCs if "children" were not killed. BBB will initiate self-destruct sequence at start of combat, and main computer is unable to intervene (except for instructing PCs as to how to disarm it afterwards). After BBB is defeated, PCs can interact with the main computer and crew survivors, wrapping up loose ends. PCs can exit the ship here through an airlock. Ship will automatically launch and return to homeworld once PCs are a safe distance away. Any and all suggestions about all this are most welcome. Any thoughts about pacing, plot flow, alternate ideas for encounters, etc.? Thanks for reading!
Yes, the plan is to use a few "Alien"-type xenomorphs as an enemy on the otherwise deserted stasis level. (Grendelspawn from d20 modern, to be exact.) They'll have a slightly higher CR than expected - but then again, the PCs will have the option to release some of the other creatures from stasis if they need to keep them busy. Should make for a pretty creepy change of pace after the abundant and lush garden level. And since the xenos are fairly simplistic low-intelligence killing machines, that placement allows for a much more intelligent boss of some sort towards the end, which in my mind is more satisfying.
So it sounds like no Dungeon adventures include the sort of tight long-term 'dungeon ecology' we're talking about here?
Just as a general frameword, here's my general framework for the ship levels. PCs start at the bottom (lvl 9) and work their way up. Level 1. Bridge - Boss fight. Possible countdown to self destruct.
Needless to say, d20 Modern's futuristic material is also going to be extremely helpful here.
Thanks for those suggestions. I'm glad to see I'm on the right track here. For reference, the original module considers the ship buried and sealed for at least a few decades. Periodically the malfunctioning computers instructs the resident worker robots to release a creature or two from stasis and throw them out an "airlock". These creatures subsequently terrorize the locals. If I'm going with descendents of survivors, I'll have to assume more time has passed (either pre- or post-crash). The ship life support systems and general power grid still function, so food replicators are available, in addition to lots of plants on a lush garden/hydroponics level. Were the present inhabitants not trapped, they probably would have headed for the hills long ago. Are there any modules like this, where a few different groups are sealed away together in something like a self-sufficient "biosphere" type setting until the PCs intrude? I know there are tons of modules with poor or illogical "dungeon ecology", but are there any that try to purposefully set up an ecologically self-sufficient sealed dungeon (like a terrarium)? Because that's basically what we have here. BTW, thanks for mentioning using remote viewscreens for foreshadowing. That will be very useful.
Thanks very much for your suggestions! These are good ideas. The veggie raid hook definitely seems to fit. The bigger problem is how to develop the "story" once the PCs are inside the ship. Basically, the original module just lets the PCs move without limit from deck to deck exploring, with no real goals or bosses. Basically you go from room to room, and the only "goal" is to find certain colored keycards and then backtrack to those rooms that you couldn't access before. And while the unique setting, items and monsters are pretty cool as a one-shot, I really think giving the module more structure will make it even more enjoyable, while also retaining the appeal of the original adventure and the reasons why some people really loved it. My basic idea is to seperate the ship into levels, and have the PCs progress through them from bottom to top, restricting access to most levels above until some sort of goal is achieved on the previous level (obtain keycard, turn on/off malfunctioning power grid, etc.) While this could turn into a standard DOOM "find the red key" scenario if handled poorly, it at least allows me to plan some sort of linear plot with periodic goals. There can be bosses and factions in the higher levels, and they could even be foreshadowed as the PCs are progressing, so that when they are finally encountered they are more interesting. (Ex: the barely-verbal vegepygmies could warn friendly PCs of the legendary "black ones" who sometimes attack their villages in the night.) Much better than the standard "you open the umpteenth security door, and out jumps a mind flayer" approach. But it still needs work. The setting and circumstances are unique, and they present unique problems with regard to "dungeon ecology". And yet, when you take away all the cool tech, you basically do have a dungeon. So it's not completely unfamiliar territory.
**** MAJOR SPOILERS BELOW! **** I'm planning on running S3 Expedition to the Barrier Peaks. I have an ESD conversion from rpgnow.com, and I'm also referencing the d20 modern article from Wizards and an article from Dragon 280. So the conversion isn't a problem. HOWEVER, upon rereading the module, it *really* shows its age. There is essentially no plot whatsoever, no climax -- it's just a basic dungeon crawl in a very unique setting. I'd really like to flesh this thing out to have more of a plot flow and some sort of climax, at the very least. Yes, there's a lot here to enjoy **IF** you're one of those people that are into that sort of thing, but even then, the original module falls a bit flat. A little TLC would allow me to keep all the good aspects of the original and yet add some more of the flow and complexity that is expected these days. The reason I'm specifically asking here is twofold. First, in this interview with Erik Mona (link below), he mentions kicking around the idea of Barrier Peaks as a Dungeon mega-adventure. In short, he at one point threw around the idea with Sean Glenn and James Jacobs, but they came to the conclusion that the adventure would be impractical for the pages of Dungeon. It would have been huge, bigger than an issue, and let's face it -- you either love or hate the "hook" of the module, so it's really not everyone's cup of tea. While some people would love it, others would hate it, and Dungeon needs to be careful about blowing a whole issue or AP on that sort of thing due to limited appeal. I think that sounds practical. http://www.silven.com/resources/Default.asp?case=show&id=363 That said, if this idea truly is a non-starter within the pages of Dungeon, I'd love to hear about how they considered revising the plot or any other changes that would have brought this module more in line with the higher standards of 3.5 modules. So if Erik, Sean, or James care to share, it would help me immensely here. Secondly, the module basically represents a "prison break" scenario -- the 'jailors' are dead, and some of the inmates have escaped their cells. However, they still can't leave the 'prison', so they've established a sort of twisted coexistence/ecology. The whole concept is that of several different factions forced to coexist in a fairly restricted space (although perhaps with limited overlap due to restricted access between decks). Are there any dungeon modules that involve this sort of forced cohabitation by escapees within a small space? I looked at the obvious candidate, the illithid prison in issue 94, but that isn't quite what I need. I need something where several factions have been forced to share a confined space for a long period of time, and thereby developed an awkward equilibrium out of necessity. As far as factions go, the source material is light. The vegepygmies are in, but they end up being fairly weak as NPCs due to severely low intelligence. The only other "faction" from the original module would be one mindflayer, and that's almost so obvious as to be disappointing. (Although psionics will *definitely* be included.) Another faction I thought of is a group of descendents of a few ship crewmembers who happened to be immune to the plague for some reason. Any and all ideas would be greatly appreciated. The link to the other thread is below as well, including more detailed information about my general layout of the ship for my update. http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=11383742#post11383742 Thanks very much for any suggestions you are kind enough to provide!
Hmm...now that's an interesting idea. I can't quite see making all 9 swords githyanki silver swords, and the githyanki don't seem terribly interested in non-githyanki swords, but I do see where you're going with this. It certainly could fit in well if done right.
For anyone interested, more published sources: http://www.planewalker.com/forums/viewThread.php?intPostID=21281
What does the book of nine swords have to do with anything discussed above? I'm reading it now, and I see no connection at all. Please enlighten us.
Still looking for ideas and suggestions, if anyone is interested. Thanks!
* bump * Any thoughts on any of this?
Previously, it was mentioned that githyanki have been depicted using gear that is very reminiscent of classic oriental (japanese) gear, particularly in the 2E Planscape material. Does anyone have any opinions as to whether the oriental vibe works well with githyanki, or is it too mundane? In other words, are githyanki better served having truly otherworldly gear, or is un-european-medieval gear exotic enough? I'm not quite sure how I feel about this one. Using existing oriental armor and such would allow me to easily use visual aids. The published docs generally don't even show githyanki wearing armor at all -- just wrappings.
So, any idea for astral excursions, other than the same old "storm the fortress" mission? "Interlopers of Ruun Khazai" is a variation on that, with the PCs and some githyanki scrambling for possession of an astral tower. And there will be one gith fortress scenario, but the players will be disguised as githyanki. Not sure if that's enough -- seems a bit light. Going straight from that into the Lich-Queen may be a bit abrupt.
And depending on the party makeup, illithids would work better for evil-leaning characters than githzerai anyway. And in either case, revealing the true nature of the ally could be postponed until absolutely necessary. Interesting ideas.
That was suggested in the magazine as well. I just don't see anyone volunteering for that, and to find out out after the fact would probably be worse. HOWEVER, it's a valid point that they would be highly interested in stopping any sort of githyanki power grab. The very definition of "strange bedfellows".
Excellent suggestions. Thank you. You bring up an excellent point about fighting too many githyanki. Part 1 will be milking the sudden unexpected appearance of the githyanki in the red ragon lair, and then a prime fortress/hatchery chock full of low to medium level githyanki. Part 4 features mostly the Duthka'gith (red dragon githyanki hybrids), githyanki undead, and Vlaakith. But it would be very wise to mix it up in parts 2 & 3 so that fighting githyanki doesn't get boring. I will be using the widest possible range of githyanki (all the gith prestige classes, psionics, etc.), but there's no doubt that will still get monotonous if not handled carefully. Having a more nearby githyanki ally, and seeding division between the two, is a fantastic idea that both adds complexity and realism, while also managing fun across the campaign. Brilliant. One part of part 3 (or 4?) that I just came up with is an assault on an astral githyanki fortress from "Into the Silver Realm" from Dungeon 43. (There should be at least one of these in the story somewhere.) The hook here is that an ally (githzerai) magically disguises the PCs as githyanki, and the PCs must complete their missions while avoiding combat, conversations, etc. due to the overwhelming odds. That's how it was written in that module, and it might be nice as a change from all the combat. Plus, it gives the PCs an up-close look at the bad guys. And it probably will allow less utilized characters to step to the forefront as the tanks are briefly prevented from doing what comes naturally. (For example, a ranger with gith as a favored enemy finds that skill useless when blowing his cover by fighting is suicidal). Also, thanks for the FR-specific suggestions. Once I get the general plotline established, the campaign setting is the next big decision to make. And unfortunately, I'm not terribly fluent in the popular campaign settings, although I have the books available. Our past modules have not been heavily setting-oriented. But with a major war going on, the names and history of the locale will matter a lot this time. I'd be interested in hearing other suggestions regarding campaign settings and specific locations and personalities that might work well here. I'll also look into the many other suggestions mentioned, as they all are really good ideas. Thanks for the help! BTW, STAP = Savage Tide Adventure Path, right? Had to look that one up. I only have up to #135, but that issue does give an overview of the storyline.
Thanks very much for all the excellent suggestions! I'll definitely check out the Warcraft3 scenarios. Sounds like exactly what I need. I still wonder if there are some D&D published adventures along these lines. But considering the scale of a world-invasion war, maybe the format of the individual D&D module is too limited to address something so big at the granular level I'm looking for here. Your specific suggestions are absolutely spot-on, and hopefully I can pull off the feeling of glimpses of a much larger war that you described. As to proactive versus reactive -- you're absolutely right. Getting the players involved in driving the plot is much better than dragging them along. I'll definitely have to think about how to entice the PCs into the long journey towards a final confrontation with Vlaakith. I wonder how I can frame that opportunity in such a way as to make it irresistible, and have it happen fairly early on (end of part 2?). I'll have to revisit Q1 and see how they did it. This is really helpful.
Yes, I have those. There part where I'm stuck is adventures that can lead up to "Lich-Queen's Beloved".
Apologies for the crosspost, but I've posted some questions about an incursion-centered campaign over on the Dungeon boards (because the lynchpins are Dungeon adventures). After reading some of the discussions over here, I thought some of the readers of this forum might have some suggestions as well, since my questions really boil down to general campaign design regarding this lengthy githyanki plotline. Link:
Please post responses over in the first thread to keep things simple. Thanks!
I can't believe I have a typo on the subject of my first post...sheesh
I'm preparing to start a campaign based on the githyanki incursion. The general plan is for 4 parts to the campaign: 1. Start with "Into the Silver Realm" from Dungeon 43, retrofitted with the red dragon lair from Draconomicon web enhancement. This leads to a raid on the (prime) githyanki fortress from Module OP1. Incursion plans are discovered. 2. The PCs defend their homeland in several prime-based incursion missions related to gith forces gating in. 3. The PCs are sent to perform several commando missions on the Astral Plane to shut down gates. Included will be "Interlopers of Ruun-Khazai". PCs in tight cooperation with the Githzerai. The final astral Gate explodes during a climactic battle. 4. PCs awaken to discover themselves captured, ending up on Tunarath in prison (from Dark Sun module "Black Spine"). PCs escape and move on to "The Lich-Queen's Beloved" As you can see, parts 1 and 4 are pretty well defined. Part 2 is a complete mystery, and part 3 has holes. Does anyone have any suggestions for other pieces to this campaign, from Dungeon or otherwise? I'm particularly stuck on part 2. I'm sure there are other adventures that deal with otherplanar invasions (or even regular invasions), but I couldn't find any. I have several other githyanki-based adventures that don't quite fit in yet (Death of Lashimire - Dungeon 116, Fedifensor - Dragon 67, Citadel of Gith Reborn from Vortex of Madness). I've honestly got all of the githyanki source material available (PS GTTAP and others, Dragon 309, etc.), but what I really need are the ideas to connect all these cool parts of the story arc. Any and all suggestions are welcome. Thanks! |