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Hello all. Just checking if anyone know any rumour about when and if they'll release an updated Magus class for the 2e Remaster. I have both Core books, just wondering. Meanwhile, can I use the same Magus from the older books or would you say it's better to change something? Thanks in advance.


Also found another way: Unending Youth.
All you gotta do is accept to obey the command of an evil queen whenever she wants, 1 minute per day.
https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=762
It's on the Legends book.

But hey! You get young again and cease againg and may even lower your Doomed condition to 0 once per day.
Of course, you'd have to be really useful as a person for Queen Abrogail to be interested in making a contract with you, but still.

Still, I wish we had more options, instead of:
Be a lvl 14 monk;
Be a lvl 14 druid;
Change bodies with permanent Mind Swap ritual;
Make a contract with Abrogail for Unending Youth;
Be a stubborn (and machine-looking) android;
Be a plant/leshy;
Be a very hectic gnome with ADHD and refuse to ever get bored or you'll get sick/gray and die.

We do have rules for undeath now, and they're awesome. But they're a different flavor.


Also found another way: Unending Youth.
All you gotta do is accept to obey the command of an evil queen whenever she wants, 1 minute per day.
https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=762
It's on the Legends book.

But hey! You get young again and cease againg and may even lower your Doomed condition to 0 once per day.
Of course, you'd have to be really useful as a person for Queen Abrogail to be interested in making a contract with you, but still.


Hello again.

I LOVE Androids. I love Brigh and Casandalee. But the idea that I have right now isn't quite what Androids are...

So the idea is that my human inventor will build a kingdom/temple to Brigh in the Stolen Lands (just bought Kingmaker) to improve science, technology and/or AI acceptance. In return, he wants to be made "like an android". But Androids are made and then receive a soul. This human already has a soul and was born normally.
He would then receive cibernetic implants and turn something new. His heritage would change. I love the idea of Cyborg Heritage, cause I'm sure Gnomes would try it out, and Goblins would make steampunk implants and the sky's the limit for the creative.

Rulewise, though, I'm stumped. Should I just "adapt" Android feats? Should I just use Android and the rules for android and "name" it differently, until Paizo release a Cyborg heritage for real? Do you think they'll launch something like this someday? Can you help me homebrew it? Would you like to play something like this? AND ACTUALLY, the rare background SAVED BY CLOCKWORK is pretty much "you have a clockwork implant". What do you think about that, huh?

Thanks for your ever insightful answers o/


QuidEst wrote:

No rules would be as effective as "go look at our existing rituals".

If I were making it, though, I would just take the Mind Swap permanent version and use that as the basis for a ritual to swap ages. Not murdery enough yet, so let's throw on that you age twice as fast while the other person is still alive. You could swap bodies for the same difficulty, so it's not unbalanced, even if it's a better deal than Bathe in Blood.

Alternatively, take Bathe in Blood, make it a ritual sacrifice instead of a blood requirement, it only takes off one year of aging, and allow it to be repeated without penalty.

I'd drop the stat draining because that feels aggressively 3.5-ish and out of place.

You know what, yes, just YES. Why create a whole new thing when a small tweak in an existing thing would do the job. Thanks for the idea o/


Hello there, everyone. Yes, it's me again XD

SO! I was hoping to find rules to create rituals or design spells in Secrets of Magic, since the spell/ritual I want simply don't exist (as of October 2022), but couldn't find any rule anywhere.
Are there rules for creation of brand new rituals/spells somewhere?

So what I want to create is the Steal Life spell from the Book of Vile Darkness from 3.5. Remember the Book of Vile Darkness? That. The spell was Sor/Wiz 8 (level 8th spell from the Sorcerer/Wizard spell list). Necromancy [Evil], Close Range, Constitution Negates, Concentration duration.
By itself it wasn't that impressive: You drain 1 point of ability (Str, Dex, Con, Int, Wis, Cha), in any order, but only 1 point per turn and if Con reaches zero the victim dies. HOWEVER, if you would cast this spell during the night of full moon inside an area under the effect of desecrate or unhallow, the caster would also rejuvenate (get younger) one week per point drained. Draining a normal person (10 on all stats) make the caster 60 weeks younger, that's 420 days. Each victim you kill in this particularly ritualistic way makes you one year (and 55 days) younger, effectively making you "live young forever", if you don't mind the sacrifices.

I understand in PF2 age is just fluff, but as I said in previous posts #fluffmatters.
I understand rituals like Bathe in Blood have similar function and Mind Swap too (if you don't mind the body exchange), but I was hoping to use this ritual/spell, because Bathe in Blood has a limit (cast it 20 times and you'll have -19 on the test of your 21st attempt).

So, that's it: are there rules to create rituals? Where? How would this ritual be if you were designing it? Thanks a bunch o/


Hello there.

So this is not meant to be an OP build for combat, but for social interactions.
The char is meant to solve (almost) everything by using Diplomacy to Make an Impression followed by a Request. I scoured the texts I have for ways to maximize bonus and benefits and I call upon you, my fellow min/maxers for advice (and validation?): The idea is to gather all bonus (item, status, circumstance) and having a chance of conving the gods.

"How high would it take?"
Depends. If you're trying to convince Gorum, the god of WAR, to stop an epic battle that he's winning with a conversation, it would be DC 60: Level 25 (50) + Adjustement Incredibly Hard (10). As far as I know we don't have the gods level, so I just went with the maximum in the book (25). Again, it depends, convincing Calistriat, the goddes of LUST, to have a "good time" would have a different adjustement (maybe even Easy (-2)).

We can use any ancestry/class/mechanic, but we must remember same type bonus do not stack.

Bonus I found:
Ancestries:
Truespeech (Angelkin) - +1 status to Diplomacy (LOAG /11)
Courteous Comeback (Keleshite Human) - Reroll critical fails in Diplomacy (LOCG /11)

Best Items:
Major Cloak of Repute (LOCG /72)
21,750 gp = +3 item bonus to Make an Impression
3/day when I success at Request, it turns into Critical Success
If I crit fail when I use this power, I just fail instead.

Mask of Allure (SoM /186) 24,000 gp
+2 item bonus to Deception and Diplomacy (any, not just Make an Impression like the Cloak)
Increase Cha by 2 and once per day gain +4 status to one of the skills

NOTE: I understand the item bonus from these two items wouldn't stack, therefore the cloak would be better, but the +4 status is the highest status bonus I could find, for that one attempt that MUST succeed.

Consumable
Matchmaker Fulu (SoM /160) - +2 status to Diplomacy, if crit fail, just fail instead

Magical Terrain: Occult - +1 circumstance to Diplomacy if casted an occult spell

Class Archetype: Wellspring Mage
Strike up the Band: For 1 min +2 status to Diplomacy

Familiar Ability: Ambassador (LOGB /35) - use Aid when I Make an Impression and auto-crit succeed (this could theorically, and please, correct me if I'm wrong, grant +4 circumstance to Diplomacy if both me and my familiar are masters in Diplomacy, right?)

True Name = +2 circumstance to Deception and Diplomacy if you know their True Name.

===============

This brings me to a Human (Keleshite) for Courteous Comeback.
Class: ??? (you tell me, any that max cha is good, but which one would be ideal?)
Charisma 18 +4 (levels) +2 (the mask of allure) = 24 (+7)
Level 20 with Legendary Diplomacy: Proficiency: 28

Make an Impression
GET A FAMILIAR WITH AMBASSADOR: My understanding is that my familiar has my level as skill check and uses my level proficiency (legendary) and auto-cri, so +4 circumstance.

Item: Major Cloak of Repute (LOCG /72) = +3 item

Consumable: Matchmaker Fulu (SoM /160) - +2 status to Diplomacy
OR IF YOU USE THE MAKE ONCE PER DAY POWER: +4 status to Diplomacy

Final Make an Impression bonus: 7+28+4+3+2 = 44 (or 46 if you used the once per day power from the mask). So if you roll really high you could convince Gorum to stop and listen to your request, congratulations, let's hope your Request is high as well.

Request
Unlike Make an Impression, we lack stuff to give us specific bonus. Ambassador familiar does not help and the max item bonus is +2 (that I could find).

Item: Mask of Allure = +2 item

Consumable: Matchmaker Fulu (SoM /160) - +2 status to Diplomacy
OR IF YOU USE THE MAKE ONCE PER DAY POWER: +4 status to Diplomacy

Circumstance: True Name is VERY hard to find, even more of a DEITY. If you do get it, you gain a +2 circumstance bonus to it, otherwise you'd have to cast an occult spell in an occult spell magic terrain, which does not often make a proper battlefield. So I'll say you spent all the time from lvl 1 to 20 to find out the deities true names = +2 circumstance

Final Request: 7+28+2+2+2 = 41 (or 43 if you used the daily power from the mask).
============

Conclusion
You can reach 60 in both Make an Impression and Request. I'd save the daily power of the Mask of Allure for Request and end up with:
Make an Impression d20+44 = you need to roll 16 or higher;
Request d20+43 = you need to roll 17 or higher.

Do you have ways to make it more likely to succeed?


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Hello there.

So, when I stopped paying attention people were excited about the Armory. So yeah, it's been a while. Would you be so kind as to answer a few questions and share your opinion?

1) Can I be ageless due to class feature? Not a race that's ageless, I mean like, can a human receive the "don't age nor die of old age". The only thing I remember had that was the capstone 20th level Mystic Enlightenment. Is there any other way I can make a human lasts forever (aka until killed)? Or any item/ritual that gives that?

2) Do we have rules somewhere to build our own planet/business/society? Kingmaker style, kinda. Are they nice?

3) Did they do something with the Solarian to make them stronger? It's such an interesting class, but I can't seem to build him correctly.

4) Same question above, but for the witchwarper. Such great concept, but the mechanics seem so... weird o.O Not bad, but definetly not good. You know? Is it just me?

5) How do you enjoy some of the more *ahem* unique races. Like, things that are nowhere near humanoid format. Do you guys use them? Do you charge different prices for accomodations and armor for things without arms and/or legs? If a humanoid enemy drops a nice piece of armor, can the blob of gelatinous flesh wear it normally?

6) A friend mentioned that there are new functions for the starship battles. I will say he is not the most trusted of sources. Is it true? Where are they (which book)? Do you use them? Do you like them?

7) I'm trying to return, would you say there is something I should look up? Some great new thing that made this great game even better?

8) Is there a way I can play with people online? Any community somewhere to play Starfinder online? Most of my old team isn't playing anything, I'd like to meet new people and play, you know?

Thank you very much for answering.


Hello there.

Would you be so kind to help me out with the math/formula/build?
The point is to try and cause as much damage in a single, melee attack, but there are some rules:

- The books allowed are: Core, Advanced Player, Advanced Class and all the Ultimates (Battle, Campaign, Combat, Equipment, Intrigue and Magic).
- The character cannot be any half anything that buffs it by raising it's ECL. So no half-giants, monstruous hybrids, monster races. Just the normal races from Corebook.
- Built with 25 points build, infinite money, level 20, NO MYTHIC RULES ALLOWED (that's from other book that is not this one).
- For the sake of math, we'll check what is the most we can get dice-wise.

What I made so far was a normal human that crits on a mounted charge... mounting a mammoth or a t-rex. Any mount with huge Str mod.

Build: Race: Human (Core /28)

Points Base Race Initial Age Level Manual/Tome Item Total Mod.
17 Str 18 2 20 5 5 6 36 13
1 Dex 11 11 5 16 3
1 Cons 11 11 5 6 22 6
-2 Int 8 8 3 5 16 3
-2 Wis 8 8 3 5 16 3
10 Cha 16 16 3 5 6 30 10

Level Class Feat Feature
1 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Mounted Combat (Core /132), Ride-By Attack (Core /133) Spirited Charge (Core /135)
2 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37)
3 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Power Attack (Core /132)
4 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37)
5 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Furious Focus (APG /161) Spring Attack (Core /135)
6 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37)
7 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Leadership (Core /130)
8 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Improved Bull Rush (Core /127), Unseat (Core /137)
9 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Cleave (Core /120)
10 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37)
11 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Cleaving Finish (UCom /92) Great Cleave (Core /125)
12 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37)
13 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Improved Cleaving Finish (UCom /105)
14 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Weapon Focus (lance) (Core /137)
15 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Improved Critical (scythe) (Core /127)
16 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37)
17 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Toughness (Core /136) Combat Reflexes (Core /120)
18 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37)
19 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Improved Initiative (Core /128)
20 Cavalier (APG /32) Gendarme (UCom /37) Blind-Fight (Core /119)

Weapon: Lance +5 Thundering, Icy Burst, Shock Burst.

Build: Str 36, Charisma 30, lance +5, mammoth mount,
cavalier gendarme lvl 20:
8 (weapon) + 19 (str*1,5 for using two hands) + 18 (power attack with -6 to hit using two hands) + 11 (mount strength) + 10 (Charisma from Knight's Challenge)
+ 20 (cavalier challenge) +5 (magic lance) = 91x4 = 364 on a normal mounted charge or 546 (91x6) dmg on a crit.

Explanation: Order of the Sword allows me to add my Charisma to damage and my mount's strength (t-rex and mammoths are official mounts, check druid's animal companions, and they have the highest str). Gendarme final power causes damage from mounted lance charges to deal quadruple damage. According to the rules, lance is x3 crit, so the math is 4+3-1 = x6 on the 91. Since it's x6, it adds 5d8 sonic (thundering), +1d6 ice, +1d6 shock, +5d10 cold, +5d10 shock. Again, supposing all dice go as high as possible:

Final count: 594+40+6+6+50+50 = 746 damage, if the enemy has no DR or resistances.

Just to give you an idea, let's say, instead, I'm using just a Lance +5. It's still 546 dmg. The motherf!$&ing Tarrasque (Bestiary pg 262) has 525 HP and DR 15/epic. So If I hit it and crit it, I'd still cause 531 damage. The Tarrasque does not have Diehard, it'll be knockout senseless until it's Regenaration 40 kicks in.

Additionally, against many foes, thanks to reach from lance+mammoth and these feats, it can kill 35 to 70 enemies per turn with a 40 ft mount. +10 enemies per +10 ft the mount can walk.

I made this build listening to King Theoden speech on repeat. I'm sure it can cause even more damage using a different lance and mount, but I feel like killing gods with one blow it's enough. I'd just like to hear your opinions on this build, under these rules and I'm curious if you have other builds that can cause as much destruction, do share! Thanks for reading.


Hello there, everyone.

I'll be short and sweet: I want to make an immortal monk. I'll have him be the opposite of the usual monks and he'll be a bon vivant. I am torn between two builds, both nice and neat and functional, one is melee and one is ranged:

Ethan, Human Monk (focused on causing conditions):
1st: Ki Strike (158), Tiger Stance (159)
2nd: Stunning Fist (160)
4th: Cobra Stance (APG/128)
6th: Tiger Slash (161)
8th: Wild Winds Initiate (163)
10th: Cobra Envenom (APG/129)
12th: Disrupt Ki (163)
14th: Timeless Body (164)
16th: Wild Winds Gust (165)
18th: Ki Form (APG/131)
20th: Impossible Technique (165)

So the idea of this build is to cause as many conditions as possible, then fly away in his super sayan form and range attack. So start cobra stance, use disrupt ki and envenom, then tiger slash to bleed and finally wild winds, fly away and shoot.
If everything happens perfectly (which never does, but let me dream) it causes (at level 20): 1d4+6 bleed + 3d6 negative + 4d4 poison, all persistent damage at the beginning of the unfortunate enemy turn, plus any attack I land on my turn. I think it's neat, but we only got close to it fighting a biggass giant with a ton of HP to make the battle last long enough, still, when it did happen it was great.

Athan, Human(Maybe Aasimar for the flying at late levels) Monk (annoying archer):
1st: Monastic Archer Stance (APG /128), Ki Strike
2nd: Stunning Fist (Core /160)
4th: Deflect Arrow (Core /160)
6th: Return Fire (APG /129)
8th: Pinning Fire (APG /129)
10th: Wholeness of Body
12th: Focused Shot (APG /130)
14th: Timeless Body (164)
16th: Medusa's Wrath (APG /130)
18th: Triangle Shot (APG /131)
20th: Impossible Technique (165)

So the idea here is to make an enemy not act. Medusa's Wrath due to maxed out Wis will slow (or outright petrify), Pinning Fire will make the enemy spend an action to remove the arrow that is stucking him in place, and I can Stunning Fist at distance with arrows, so even more actions they'll lose. If they do have an action I'll be flying away (aasimar wings) and they'll have to attack me at range, which I'll Return Fire. My damage with major striking longbow will be 4d8 because the monastic archer stance forbids composite longbows, and as far as I'm aware there are no bow with monk trait (is there?) so my damage won't be mind blowing, but I'll derive sadistic satisfaction from not letting my foes do what they want. I also do enjoy wholeness of body, saved my life twice, quite literally, amazing heal for a single action.

So these are the options, due share insights and opinions on which one I should go with, I'm aware it could be better, but I don't want to age, so Timeless Body is the thing I want the most, even if, mechanically, it's meh. Thanks for any comment.


Hi, I hope I'm not ressurecting anything, but I also seek immortality whenever possible. So, there's the Mind Swap ritual in Secrets of Magic.

It allows you to change body with someone of your ancestry, so you can change to a younger body and "live forever", Orochimaru style. You don't even need to have Occultism, you can just be friends with someone that has. It IS an evil act, but I think this add extra spice to it. It must be heightned to level 9th, so you can only use it if both you and the ritual caster are level 17th+. And it costs some gold, but FAR LESS than the orchid sun elixir of something something.

It is the one in-game, RAW rule I found, that is not being a monk or druid to "be immortal". Hope this helps.


Claxon wrote:

The way Ethereal Jaunt reads, you can't affect anything on the material plane but force effects from the material plane can affect you.

See the follow text portion from the spell:

Quote:
Force effects and abjurations affect an ethereal creature normally. Their effects extend onto the Ethereal Plane from the Material Plane, but not vice versa. An ethereal creature can’t attack material creatures, and spells you cast while ethereal affect only other ethereal things. Certain material creatures or objects have attacks or effects that work on the Ethereal Plane.
So no, you don't have an invincible force mode.

Thank you! Makes more sense this way.


Hello everyone.

I checked the internet and couldn't find the explanation for what I'm trying to "cheese". Let's talk about a possible level 20 monk "combo":

Empty Body is a level 18 feat, two actions, let's you use ethereal jump, but only on yourself, for one minute, without need to sustain. Cool.

Ki Form (APG /131) is another level 18 feat, one action, turns you into Super Saiyan and let's you add 1d6 Force damage on strikes and 2d6 Force damage just by being nearby.

Now Ethereal Jaunt reads: "You travel to the Ethereal Plane, which overlaps the Material Plane. Material Plane creatures can't see you, and you can move through things on the Material Plane. You move at half your normal Speeds, but can move in any direction (including up and down).

You can see onto the Material Plane within a radius of 60 feet; it is gray, hazy, and concealed from you. You can't affect the Material Plane, and you can't be affected by the Material Plane except by force effects and abjurations originating there."

Does this mean I can only be affected by Force damage or that Force damage is the exception to both ways of "can't affect and be affected"?

Because, if so, I'll Ki Form and Empty Body in one turn and on the next turn, I'm invisible (and enemies can't even use See Invisibility, because I'm not only invisible, I'm ACTUALLY not "there"), and can cause the Force portion of damage for 10 rounds (I'll assume 3 hits plus the "being close hurts" damage for 5d6 per turn) in total safety, unless my enemies have Force attacks AND a way to see into the Ethereal, is it?

And this combo, at level 20, is worth not taking Impossible Technique?

Thanks for the clarification.


Thanks all for the great suggestions and points.

I guess I should went with "Khazad ai-menu", since they'll be in melee, but not necessary with axes only.

I had no idea gears and guns was out, just bought it, I'll read it after work. See how this inventor works out.

The group are brainstorming ideas like "let's have a couple focused on tripping foes, and the others smash when they're prone". Or things like "let the buffers buff, debuffers debuff and casters explode at ranged before we charge together on the second turn".

It needs not be a min-max thing, but we would like if it was at least "good".

Do keep the suggestions coming, I'm loving it.


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Good morning everyone o/

So, after a long, LONG pause from Pathfinder 2e, me and my party are debating making a party exclusively of dwarves that dreams of colonizing the Fog Peaks (between Galt and Taldor). We call the group The Dwarven Hand, we use fingers as codenames. We're, peharps, too open to options, and since everybody went with "I can play whatever" we're lacking "directions". This is because we're more into learning to love the character as we see them grow, instead of bringing to the game something we already love.

This is what we want:

- Fingers: We plan to max out one characteristic (which is easy in this system) according to the position: the Little will have max Dex, the Ring max Int, the Middle max Str, the Index max Wis and the Thumb max Cha (yes, a Cha focused dwarf, the leader/ruler of the enclave they're dreaming to build);

- Baruk Khazad: We fight melee. Even the casters. Dwarves can have weapons and critical specializations from their race feats. I heard gossip about a Magical Strike build, although I don't fully understand it (since I didn't read it XD);

- Full party: Five is a big number. We should be able to do everything out of combat: face skills, survival to find the way, disable all traps.

We'll be some do-gooders until we can face the dangers of Fog Peaks and gather other frontier dwarves to join us. We'll try to keep the dwarf-theme going (for instance, a Wizard or Witch would be a Rivethun adept, etc.)

I'd love to hear your bright ideas and suggestions, since in Fog Peaks there are derros, rocs, ice trolls, ice giants (one of which has a vorpal axe), remorhaz, frost worms, white dragons (3 of which are famous), a magic prison from Galt, an unknown magic tower and more.

Thanks in advance!


I put these questions on another post, just to be sure I'm putting here too, in case someone knows the answer here:

1) Ostentatious Arrivel (SoM /69) creates an explosion (emanation) surronding the Eidolon. Manifest Eidolon demands I manifest the Eidolon adjacent to me. If we take this RAW (rules as written) my Eidolon will burn me too, right? Which sounds counterintuitive since we share the same HP. On Core Rulebook, rules on emanation says "the caster choses if the creature at the center is also subjected to the effect". Do I count on this or only if I have Meld Into Eidolon? And finally, what if my Eidolon is small or a mount and we share a square at the moment of the manifestation? That would keep me out of the "line of fire", right? Please say yes.

2) Master Summoner (SoM /69) says I can prepare two slots for summoning spells. Does it have to be the same spell? Like both of them has to be Summon Elemental?

3) The "summoning" and "incarnate" spells that are covered by Master Summoner appears on a box on SoM page 73. However it does not include the primal 10th level spell Summon Kaiju. Which makes sense, since originally, Summoners don't have access to 10th level spells. HOWEVER, at 20th level we get Legendary Summoner, which allows me to trade one level 9th spell for two level 10 summoning spells. The only 10th level summoning spell is Summon Kaiju. But Summon Kaiju isn't on the list on page 73. But it's the only 10th level YOU GET IT! I got into a loop and I REALLY want to summon a Kaiju and make it explode it's surrondings when it arrives. Can we all agree (this is more a request than a question) that Summon Kaiju was forgotten on the list on page 73 and a primal summoner could summon it if he had Legendary Summoner? Please say yes.

Thank you very much for the taking the time to answer.


See what I did there? ... I'll see myself out...
AFTER someone please clarify some stuff for me:

1) Ostentatious Arrivel (SoM /69) creates an explosion (emanation) surronding the Eidolon. Manifest Eidolon demands I manifest the Eidolon adjacent to me. If we take this RAW (rules as written) my Eidolon will burn me too, right? Which sounds counterintuitive since we share the same HP. On Core Rulebook, rules on emanation says "the caster choses if the creature at the center is also subjected to the effect". Do I count on this or only if I have Meld Into Eidolon? And finally, what if my Eidolon is small or a mount and we share a square at the moment of the manifestation? That would keep me out of the "line of fire", right? Please say yes.

2) Master Summoner (SoM /69) says I can prepare two slots for summoning spells. Does it have to be the same spell? Like both of them has to be Summon Elemental?

3) The "summoning" and "incarnate" spells that are covered by Master Summoner appears on a box on SoM page 73. However it does not include the primal 10th level spell Summon Kaiju. Which makes sense, since originally, Summoners don't have access to 10th level spells. HOWEVER, at 20th level we get Legendary Summoner, which allows me to trade one level 9th spell for two level 10 summoning spells. The only 10th level summoning spell is Summon Kaiju. But Summon Kaiju isn't on the list on page 73. But it's the only 10th level YOU GET IT! I got into a loop and I REALLY want to summon a Kaiju and make it explode it's surrondings when it arrives. Can we all agree (this is more a request than a question) that Summon Kaiju was forgotten on the list on page 73 and a primal summoner could summon it if he had Legendary Summoner? Please say yes.

Thank you very much for the taking the time to answer.


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HELLO PEOPLE!

With Advanced Player Guide and Secrets of Magic, I'd like to know if you guys would like me to update the (or create an entirely new) quiz to include the new classes.

I sincerely appreciate the compliments, I thrilled so many people liked it!


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Xenocrat wrote:
9th level Mindswap let’s you steal young bodies in perpetuity. Boost your physical traits, too, if you pick the right one.

YOU BEAUTIFUL LEGEND, THANK YOU. Orochimaru is the way to go!

Yes, I can change my mind to another being of my ancestry permanently!
I checked it out but didn't read the heightened version.
THANK YOU XENOCRAT.

The-Magic-Sword wrote:
damn, I came to recommend Bathe in Blood, its really damn cool.

It's wonderfully cool, except we can use it a limited amount of times, only sadly.

----------

I'm trying to make a PC, yes being "immortal" gives nothing on Pathfinder 2E, it is just for the fluff, but as I wrote above #fluffmatters.

---------------------------

Wish, Miracle and Alter Reality depends on GM fiat, so any success would "feel" like a houserule. My mind is broken.

--------------

I deeply appreciate all the advice and suggestions.
Excuse me while I make a body-stealing PC now.


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Secrets of Magic is out and my dreams of an immortality ritual are squandered.

The only thing in the entire book that makes you "young again" is the ritual Bathe in Blood, that requires you to be at max level 16, and gets harder to cast each time you do it.

Anyone found anything on the book that makes you eternally young that I might (hopefully) have missed?


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John Ryan 783 wrote:
Invictus Spartan wrote:

*deep breathing*

I'm not mad... I just would very much like to know why the date was changed. Pretty please, with sugar on top. Why?

This is how the Paizo model has worked for years. They send out pdfs to subscribers when they ship the product, which I believe has something to do with when they can charge them.

But for your more specific question, it has to do with agreements with traditional brick and mortar stores. Street date is a hard thing, and violating it in any market is usually a huge deal. So, if they push back street date to September 1st, then they *Cannot* be selling product directly before that date.

I do think it is a bit of an outdated system, but we don't have access to Paizo's numbers, as the Marketing Manager has made clear they have looked at alternatives and found them to not be financially viable.

Welp, I'll be damned, it is a good reason, after all. I share the bad mood most people are having, but to break contracts is suicide for a company (unless you're Disney and you're finished with Scarlet Johanson).

Maybe it'll change in the future, but as of now, I think Paizo did the right thing. It's better to upset a few (impatient) people (me included) than to gather legal fees that outshine the profit of an "early" launch.

Now, back to the book: I'm excited to see a weapon-and-shield magus in action. I really want to see all the new stuff, specially rituals. I'm REALLY hopeful there'll be options to reach immortality (not aging) for casters. For RP reasons, since aging doesn't give benefits anymore. Anyone know anything about that being in the book?


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*deep breathing*

My birthday was August 24th. I check the website only sporadically so it was a surprise to me, even with the information being available on other sources.

But you know what? I'm trying my best to be understanding. Delays happen. S$@* happens. We can't point fingers at Paizo or the writers or whomever is nearby.

HOWEVER, it sure would be nice to read some reasoning behind this. Surely the book is complete, so... are they adding the errata? Was there last minute touches? Or was it simply because the physical book will be delayed for reasons out of the publisher control and it's writen somewhere secret that book-buyers need to receive the book first and only then can people FROM OTHER CONTINENTS (like me) be able to read them too?

I'm not mad... I just would very much like to know why the date was changed. Pretty please, with sugar on top. Why?


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Hello everyone!

So, back in Pathfinder one, if you don't know the story of The Land of the Linnorm Kings and Irrisen and Baba Yaga (it's awesome), let me give you a tl;dr: huge area where the humans of ulfen ethinicity (basically scandinavians) got attacked by a minor deity called Baba Yaga and lost half their lands in one month. This land is now Irrisen and is ruled by Baba Yaga daughters. The lands to the west are the lands of the Linnorm Kings, viking-ish people where to be king, you have to solo a Linnorm. It's hard, but awesome. There's also the "minor-deity-fairy-dragon" know as Fafnheir and he is THE FIRST Linnorm. He lives in a huge forest and prophecy says whoever fell this foul beast becomes the king of all ulfen and will lead the ulfen in war against Baba Yaga offspring and return summer to that land cursed by eternal winters... AWESOME, ISN'T IT?

Anyway, years ago, my friends and I tried it, and my char was called Magnus, he was a Human Skald (from the manual of advanced classes). And it was GREAT. He wasn't by any means super OP, but he was SO NICE TO PLAY AS. To inspire my fellow men and charge into certain death and yet win somehow. I want that again in PF2.

Sadly, the "bardbarian" class would be the Warrior Muse Bard from Advanced Player Guide and it's... it's... not Magnus. You see, the Skald didn't overfocus on spellcasting and now the bard is a fullcaster which is good!, don't get me wrong, but that is not, well, a skald. I even tried playing as a warrior muse bard, but it was so... so... subpar. Maxed out as expert proficiency for melee attacks, no medium armor, relying so heavily on spells.

I come then to you, my brethren, who probably read much more than me. Can you help me make an ulfen human that uses shield and axe and inspires his comrades? Someone that fights melee, has more guts than sense, but it's still a joy to have around? All ideas are very welcome, I have almost all books in PDF format, so I can mix and match classes and archetypes, but I'd very much want him to be an ulfen human chaotic good with shield and axe. Despite that, all is fair game.

I'm eager to hear your ideas and suggestions and thank you for sharing your thoughts with me!


Thanks all for the answers. I read Leshy and it didn't quite "hit the spot" for me, but they're nice. They're just a bit too alien for me.

Being a "normal" Gnome that may live forever (and may not) also isn't the certainty that I have in mind, plus Gnomes in general are too hectic for me. I like peace and calm.

Guess I'll be doing a Timeless Body Monk for the moment and just wait and see if they'll make other options on other books. Thank you all again for your input.


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Hello again everyone.

I'll keep it simple: I don't want to age. Dying is fine, Pharasma will have me eventually, but until then...

I'm aware of Druid Timeless Nature and the Monk Timeless Body. But do they still have that rule of "still die of old age when the time comes"?

Also, any other way to reach It? I want a Charisma focused, preferably non-undead, ageless kinda guy.

Also, I'm okay with ageless races, like the Android and the Bleachling Gnome, but we don't have rules for them yet... Do we?

Thanks in advance!


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ArchSage20 wrote:
nice to see i'm not the only who likes playing a immortal character

Basically every char I make in every game is to reach immortality or godhood. It speaks to me.

jdripley wrote:
Liches “live” forever, and after you’ve gained ultimate arcane power, it's no big thing to put an illusion on yourself to look however you want or need to look :)

Are there rules for lichdom? Like how to, powers you gain, stuff like that? If so, where?

Lucas Yew wrote:
Or you can wing up epic level rules and multiclass to Monk or Druid after 20 (I prefer the former, as I have no idea whether the latter's anathema might interfere). Level 28 will let you nab one of the anti-aging feats!

Are there rules for epic levels? Where are they?


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Nitro~Nina wrote:

I think that this is a really specific thing you're after, but I do think it's possible! As best I can tell, your best shot might indeed be Druid or Monk.

A high-level druid has some truly almighty power and the respect of any number of primal forces. Plus, being able to tell what people want (Wisdom) can often greatly aid in attempts to leverage one's Charisma. Plus... the Influence Nature feat could become creatively quite powerful if you are A: Legendary in Nature, which is but one level above Timeless Nature, and B: established in a single region with a lot of time on your hands, which being immortal helps with. This is a king who has shaped the wildlife of the region to subtly and unsubtly support his rule. The birds sing as he greets his people, wild hogs harry unmarked carriages... and nature riots whenever his daily rounds are disrupted. Hard to depose a king who keeps his beasts free and his enemies marked by-scent, after all. The Animal Druid makes sense here, as does a Leaf Druid with Green Tongue; they say that there are no secrets in The Green Kingdom, for any insect might be a bug, and any plant could be, well, a plant...
Plus, if you must have diplomatic talent... You're a Druid. And a King. Attend court with the local Dryad Queen or similar; gain powerful, witty, Fey allies whose personalities are more than a match for most mortal wisdom but whose tricks you understand and whose tastes you can afford.

The Monk, on the other hand, may be easier to justifiably make Charismatic in the first place. Wisdom makes sense, but it's not strictly required for all that much outside of spellcasting. Especially with Stumbling, Gorilla or Dragon Stance, Charisma can be very useful, and being a paragon of physical perfection helps leverage that over the flawed mortals once counted amongst your peers. Frankly, if you do not age, if you demonstrate such perfect health and unassailable form, it will not be hard to convince the people of your...

Holy s$++, so well spoken! You're inspired and inspiring Nitro-Nina. Thanks! I'm strongly considering a Leaf Druid now.


Captain Morgan wrote:
We got some settlement rules in the game mastery guide.

Sadly the Settlement rules in the Game Mastery Guide isn't about kingdom building :/ - thanks for mentioning it though.

Deadmanwalking wrote:

At least one NPC in-setting uses Reincarnate to do this. That absolutely works, and given that it's a Ritual, requires no specific Class. It does require you to do it repeatedly, and being dead, and thus requires allies to perform the ritual, but it works. Getting back to your base Ancestry is a bit tricky, but Wish, Miracle, or Alter Reality probably work for that at GM discretion.

The Sun Orchid Elixir also solves this problem in-setting, though that requires rather ludicrous amounts of money.

The Sun Orchid Elixir brings one back to youth, but then they'll age again, meaning that in 50 or 60 years I'd have to drink another, and as you mentioned, each one costs a kingdom.

I thought about Reincarnate, but really doesn't sit well with the concept of an "forever young king", if he's not that young, also I'd wager Pharasma would object if the cause of death was natural causes due to aging.

Nitro~Nina wrote:

If you want some basis for that and don't mind asking the GM (which you'd have to do for Threefold Aspect anyway), the Blessed Background could also help. It's supposed to have more mechanical relevance, so the GM might still give you the at-will guidance to represent your advanced and slightly-divine experience, especially since living a long time doesn't really do much in a campaign. You'd have to determine why you got that boon and why Pharasma's chill with it, but there are tons of ways to finagle that in the lore so long as you stay in whatever deity's good graces.

Perhaps, to give the GM that plot-hook gleam in their eye, you could opt into an Anathema and Edict that you have to follow to maintain the long life? Could be fun! Maybe Grandmother Spider has freed you from the shackles of time, but in return you must never harm a spider? Perhaps Gorum has bound your soul to your blade, and you must maintain its perfection to retain your youth? Maybe even Pharasma herself sees you as a more useful agent on-the-ground, and you must constantly work to vanquish undead...

If you really wanted to jam some divine intervention up your character's nose, you could even channel that Charisma into the Oracle class. A fun Mystery could be Tempest; even the weather thinks it's uncool that you've lived this long... but, hey, you always have a dramatic wind a'ruffling your cape!

If we speak purely mechanically, however... Threefold Aspect can be foiled with a particularly perceptive Seek action, so I'm not sure it really does much for your innards. Even if it's better than skin-deep, aging is super complex and it doesn't make a lot of sense to me that a third-level Bard spell is going to reverse it forever when that usually requires super-human mastery of one's body (Monk) or an arrangement with the forces of nature (Druid). Could definitely help you seem a lot younger than you are though!

Very hard to argue with the Threefold Aspect argument you made, so I agree. Regarding the other points, one would say a Wish or Miracle (if well formulated) could give such benefit if the GM allow and that would be fine, but in my broken head this "sounds" like houserules. I do appreciate the inputs, though! Thank you.

--------------------

Maybe I'm seeing this the wrong way? Maybe the new rules that are yet to come will allow different stats for different kingdom types (like using Wisdom instead of Charisma for a Theocracy or Intelligence for a Magocracy). The Druid of the Wild Order is the only one that can't "live in civilization" since it's anathema for him. So maybe a full Wisdom druid would-be-king would fit?
What you guys think?


Captain Morgan wrote:
We got some settlement rules in the game mastery guide.

I had no idea this book existed! Thank you so much.

Claxon wrote:
The Gleeful Grognard wrote:

Threefold aspect works for your purpose as long as you can continuously sustain it.

Or at least it might, some GMs might argue you still age internally despite the spell obviously changing internals as well as externals and not being an illusion.

I think the problem is sustaining it, and as a GM I would still say you die when you reach the age limit for your race (although I don't think that information transferred editions because it's not typically relevant).

Not sure if that sort of thing is important or not to the OP but if the ritual drops you return to your true age, which could mean death or at least inconvenience if you've reached an incredibly old age.

Peronsally I don't see threefold aspect extending your life beyond what it could naturally be, but that you could appear to be young until you drop dead of "old age".

Makes sense. My idea was to make a human-aasimar, so I'd die with 110 years old (70+2d20, if memory serves me from 1st edition) while looking like I'm in my mid 20s? On the other hand, doesn't "max age for race" happens due to the biology of that ancestry (for example, we have humans who are over 110 years old). Therefore if the spell that polymorphs my insides, I'd still have the heart and lungs of a healthy 20-something. I guess the problem would be if a Psychopomp would show up one day and "it's time to go" me, which, for some reason, I don't think would be the case for Timeless Body/Nature.

I'm still open to suggestions if more people have it!


The Gleeful Grognard wrote:

Threefold aspect works for your purpose as long as you can continuously sustain it.

Or at least it might, some GMs might argue you still age internally despite the spell obviously changing internals as well as externals and not being an illusion.

Didn't see that. I guess it checks! Could make a Primal Sorcerer or Bard and would have the spell, which physically rejuvenates me every morning. Even if the "still die when their time comes" were a thing, that time wouldn't come cause I'd keep postponing it with magic.

Thank you Grognard!


Greetings everyone.

I want to build an "Eternal King" of sorts. I'll be using the Kingmaker/Ultimate Campaign rules from the 1st edition (while desperately patiently waiting for such Settlement rules for 2nd edition (any update on that, btw?).

I bought the Advanced Player's Guide certain that would be a ritual of Eternal Youth or something similar (I know there are no benefits for old age, it's just fluff, but #fluffmatters), but there's nothing of the sort.

The only two "official" ways to, as written "cease aging", are Timeless Body (Monk 14) and Timeless Nature (Druid 14). In my head I was hoping to make a Bard (Warrior muse is broken? I didn't read in-depth, but making allies Stride and Strike or make two allies Strike when one of them critically hits and even, with a Performance check, prevent a caster from spending a Focus Point or Spell Slot, sounds... "too" useful? If there is such thing) or Sorcerer, bohemian in behavior, diplomatic, saavy, even a non-optimal Swashbuckler with more Charisma and charm than skill.

But I can't find any way (official way, at least) to make them Forever Young (I guess there's the clone spell, but it isn't quite the same, is it? There's a passage mentioning Pharasma getting upset and I'd prefer to avoid that).

In short, any way I could make a Charismatic character "live forever". Can I get those feats from Druid or Monk being another class?


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Falco271 wrote:

Adding this to my own pf2 resource site if you don't mind. LINK

Got a flurry ranger as result, which is what I'm going to play...

Oh gosh, I'd be honored!

Also, very nice site you have there. Well done!


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Wow, I thought no one answered after the first couple days I posted it and forgot to check till now!

Thank you all for your answers and I'm so glad you liked it and had a laugh answering it.

Just to give an idea, 1350 people took the quiz, here's the results:

Personality Type Stats Takers
Alchemist - Research Field: Bomber 23
Alchemist - Research Field: Chirurgeon 91
Alchemist - Research Field: Mutagenist 29
Barbarian - Instinct: Animal 17
Barbarian - Instinct: Dragon 7
Barbarian - Instinct: Fury 17
Barbarian - Instinct: Giant 27
Barbarian - Instinct: Spirit Rage 18
Bard - Muse: Enigma 133
Bard - Muse: Maestro 55
Bard - Muse: Polymath 36
Champion - Cause: Paladin 70
Champion - Cause: Redeemer 48
Champion - Cause: Liberator 53
Cleric - Doctrine: Cloistered Cleric 71
Cleric - Doctrine: Warpriest 25
Druid - Order: Animal 37
Druid - Order: Leaf 28
Druid - Order: Storm 8
Druid - Order: Wild 1
Fighter - Strong 14
Fighter - Tank 37
Fighter - Quick 20
Fighter - Archer 12
Monk - Strong Style 41
Monk - Agile Style 24
Ranger - Edge: Flurry 15
Ranger - Edge: Precision 13
Ranger - Edge: Outwit 31
Rogue - Racket: Ruffian 9
Rogue - Racket: Scoundrel 39
Rogue - Racket: Thief 39
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Aberrant 6
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Angelic 33
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Demonic 6
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Diabolic 9
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Draconic 10
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Elemental 17
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Fey 33
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Hag 4
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Imperial 32
Sorcerer - Bloodline: Undead 17
Wizard - Thesis: Improved Familiar 33
Wizard - Thesis: Metamagical Experimentation 8
Wizard - Thesis: Spell Blending 30
Wizard - Thesis: Spell Substitution 24

I think I must have done SOMETHING wrong to justify only one person out of 1350 to get Druid of the Order of the Wild and I absolutely did not expected so many Alchemist Chirurgeons (the Enigma Bards number I actually did expected to be high, although not the highest).

Just out of curiosity I got Wizard of the Spell Blending Thesis, and I do love it!


Greetings everyone. So I play games for a long, long time. My last one was Kingmaker and it was great. Now I want something new and oh boy, is Starfinder new! (For me at last). I want your opinions (I know it's a dangerous thing to have on the Internet) because I am trying to play a campaign about colonizing a different solar system. Based on that premise:

1) Too many options?
I'm struggling to grasp everything in the Core Rulebook, and there are the Armory and Operation Manuals, and Pact Worlds and Near Space and I have no idea what else. I'm feeling overwhelmed. I love that there's just so much content, but I nevertheless feel lost. What would you suggest I should do? Focus solely on the Core Rulebook and ignore the rest? Or the classes from Operations Manual are just that good/fill a niche the others didn't? Or the options for the classes raise the power level in such way they're necessary to fight the strongest foes from the AA and AA2?

2) Is the witchwarper... Good? I feel like Infite Worlds are disappointing, the spell list is lackluster and only his last special power (the one that stuns for 3 turns) are actually pretty good. I loved the concept (similar to the Solarian) but I find both him and the Solarian... Erh... "Off"? Can't put to words properly what I mean.

3) I like ships and shipbuilding and shipfighting, but I wish they made a cheat list with all the options each role can use at any given time. Is there in the books somewhere? Did someone make it and if so can you link it to me?

4) Is there a program or something where I can draw the ship to visualize it or something? The blueprint I mean it.

5) I'd like to ask whomever read it all for some tier lists regarding classes (with subclasses if it makes major difference). For instance (and this is just for example):

DPS:
1. Soldier (sharpshooter)
2. Soldier (Blitz)
3. Technomancer
4. Solarian (melee)

Tank:
1. Vanguard
2. Soldier (Bodyguard)

Support (healing and buffs):
1. Envoy
2. Biohacker
3. Mystic

Utility (control and other useful stuff):
1. Mystic
2. Technomancer
3. Biohacker
4. Witchwarper

I'm curious to hear your opinions and why. I understand this is subjective, but I'm eager to listen/read your build ideas.

Thanks everyone.


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Hello all!
I just finished this quiz to help out which class (with subclass) you should play next if you haven't decided yet. I might have overdone it with FORTY-SIX possible results. Please let me know what you think and if you liked the result: https://uquiz.com/CcH1mB


Ooohh, I see now.
Thank you all for the explanation ^^


Page 64, about Bard Spell Repertoire
So when you reach 2nd level, you select another 1st-level spell; at 3rd level, you select two 2nd-level spells, and at 4th level you select a 2nd-level spell.

I think this is wrong. It must have meant select 1 2nd level spell at level 3, and then a second 2nd-level spell at level 4, right?
Otherwise, does this mean I get two 3rd level spells at level 5? Then 2 4th level spells at level 7?
I might be overthinking this, I just wanted to make sure.


Nennafir, as you said yourself, after a kingdom's Size is 101 or more, Ruler's Charisma is added to all 3 (look for the words AS WELL, and TOO), while the Spymaster only have the benefit to give to one trait at any given month.

Just to conclude how things went: The DM accepted using a modified Clever Wordplay, since Clever Wordplay trait affects a SKILL, not a particular use of Charisma per se. Therefore, instead of the actual use of Clever Wordplay (let's say, use Int instead of Cha for Diplomacy), I'll keep using my Charisma (10) for charisma-based skills, but will use Int to Kingdom-related rolls, when Charisma is called to.

Thank you all for your suggestions :D
I really appreciate it.


EXCELLENTE SUGGESTIONS Finlanderboy. Thank you!
We'll have an oracle on the team to do that for me, but brilliant anyway!

Thank you all, I highly appreciate it.


Finlanderboy, I believe it would be a Controller, quite what I'm looking for.

And yes, charismatic idiots everywhere!!! I will talk to the DM about the trait thing.

Thanks all for the great help.


The rules say that Kingdoms traits (Stability, Economy and one more I just forgot) adds the Charisma of the ruler to them. It's what I'm looking for. The Ruler is the only leadership role that adds a stat to all Kingdom traits. That's the problem.


Thanks for all the comments.

Avoron, About "powerful", I meant very, very high spell CD, save or die spells, dominate, and things that make the life for the DM just hard (and the party happy, since we usually have 2 DPS, I don't mind ultra high damage). I like the idea of having several spells, to prepare in advance, so "limiting" to a thematic (like fire or ice) would be the opposite.

Rennaivx, What "FWIW" means? And yes, I agree, smart people should rule, not "famous" people, maybe making a magocracy... still thinking, I'll talk to my team. And it was suggested that I'd be the Treasurer, instead of the Ruler, but I really wanted to be the Ruler (since I was the High Priest on the past one, and throughtfully disliked to roleplay it), so I dunno, the books just made so much worth regarding Charisma.


DrNegative, we talked to the GM about it, and we were trying to avoid "rule-bending" unless we ran out of options.

The Guy With A Face, brilliant! Clever Wordplay would be precisely what I need, but that isn't from one of the books I mentioned right? (or did I overlooked it somewhere?)


Hello all.

I've been reading a lot and me and my party tried to build a Dwarvish Kingdom using a party of 5 dwarves and the rules from Ultimate Campaign. It was super challenging, daring, and we got emotionally bounded, but now that kingdom has grown and we felt like it's time to try something new (specially because people wanted to try other chars and leadership roles).

Thing is, the more I read, the least I wanted to play a high charisma character. I'll be the "ruler" and I'm really interested in playing a wizard (specially a human one). I'm aware elves have some mechanical benefits, but the main problem is: how to make an efficient ruler that has charisma as a dump stat? Talking to the GM brought no new ideas, so I come to you all for help.

Is there a way to make an Intelligent Ruler? Wouldn't a smart, strategistic mind be a better ruler than a "guy-we-all-like"? Can you also help me making an OP non-elven (hopefully, but not necessarily, human) wizard (archetypes, new spells, new feats, traits from Ultimate Campaign, etc). We'll be using "only" The Core Rulebook, The Advanced, The Ultimate Magic, The Ultimate Combat and the Ultimate Campaign. I'm aware of other books, but the GM feels it's better to limit to what he already read and knows. Honestly so do I.

Thank you all.


I know this post has YEARS, but in fact, the thing is, what he asked WASN'T give to him.

" All I really need is a digital Kingdom sheet where I can fill in the different values, without it doing any calculation for me."

I also want this, VERY MUCH, AND I CAN'T FIND IT ANYWHERE. Can someone who knows how to do it, please do it? Pretty please? Just like the one on page 59 of Rivers Run Red.

my e-mail is wagner-nsf@hotmail.com

Thank you SO much if you take the time to do it.


Oh, thank you for the good comment.

The idea of giving the puppet a bonus based on the puppeteer dexterity is the "good side" of the part that the puppeteer had to focus on him, but I'm accepting ideas.

I read the link you sent, very nice indeed, but again, I don't know how to apply it on the mechanics. Anyone else has ideas? Thanks a lot.


Good day to all.

It's been generations since I last played Pathfinder, but inspiration brought me back to try something I haven't tried before. I want to make a "Puppeteer". Something akin to Summoner, but instead of the "Eidolon" it would be a "Puppet".

I did some research and found nothing official, so why not creating something new, although I don't know as much as I wish, so I thought of seeking your help. Here are my basic ideas:

- Rules for Eidolon/Puppet evolution just the same (you can craft a puppet in any shape and whatnot);
- Puppets are Eidolon of the Construct type (there is no such option in books), but they have all advantages and weakness of a Construct (thus the Puppeteer would have "Repair Damage" spell to "heal" his puppet);
- The puppet grows more "real" as the Summoner grows in levels. (pretty much like Pinocchio, the Puppet became a "living being", gathering the best of both worlds (advantages of constructs and non-constructs);
- The Puppeteer needs to "control" the puppet through invisible "soul lines". These can be severed by force spells or weapons, making the puppet inert. The Puppeteer adds his Dexterity to the puppet own Armor Class and attacks. (So the AC of a puppet would be its own Dexterity + the puppeteer Dexterity; the puppeteer Dexterity would also be added to the Attack rolls and Reflex rolls os the puppet);
- As levels grow, the puppet would be able to act on some turns by himself (not receiving the Dex from the puppeteer) and have its own ideas and personality;
- At the highest levels, the puppet would gain levels in classes, becoming effectivelly a "first of its kind" being, treating the Puppeteer as a creator-god and following him with obsession;
- The puppeteer would have powers not of summoning, but with the "soul lines" he create. Adding spells to its list that control the enemy body instead of mind and using the "soul lines" on enemies directly for a variety of effects.

I wish someone could help me pass this on rules from 1-20 and beyond, and I'd love to hear your comments and critics, as I still have just a raw idea. Thank you very much.


Here's some math...

If you start with 18 Str and put human bonus of +2 on it. You'll have 20. Add all your 20th level char points on it for every 4 levels you'll have +5. Add the reading of the Tome/manual (+5 (second most expensive item in the game) You'll have 30 of str. Add a belt of +6 str and the max you can have is 36. That's the "max" Str you can have without focusing on classes, just raw itens and rolls.

You can go barbarian for a great boost from level 20th super hyper rage (+8 in str, giving you 44 str). Or mix barbarian and sorc or bard so you can take the prestige class Dragon Disciple and get the +8 bonus from str the class gives you at 10th level (you raise your strength in +2, +2, +4) and then rage (for +4) and reach amazing 48 str.

That's amazing, right? No... A 20th level EIDOLON, with the right evolutions can reach 5 attacks with Str 56 (quadruped, huge size, all points in str, tome, item, etc). Then again a Eidolon like this is hardly playable in a dungeon. Back to human: You said you wanted to super boost your carrying capacity and strength checks? Here's the short answer: Cleric of the Strength domain. Once per day gives you +20 Str (if you're cleric 20), but for 1 round and doesn't count to damage nor attack, only str checks and skills. If take the 36 everyone can have, you'll reach the Str of a Huge Eidolon. Now that's amazing.


Thank you everybody for your advices. I found a radio/record about two guys discussing the class Cavalier, I guess it was 3.5 sanctuary or something. It opened my eyes.

I'm making a beast rider, large mount, medium human character. The focus is not the charge. It is the Pushing Assault + Lance (reach weapon) + Lunge + Steam the Tide (Shield Order level 8). Basicly I keep my foes AWAY, 15 feet away from all my allies.

with the right feats, even though I attack only once (so I have the Vital Strike combo AND the mounted combat combo of feats) it effectivelly protect any melee from attacking anyone in the party, unless ranged.

Exactly as I dreamed. Awesome without a mount, overpowered in a mount. I'll be using Mithral Breastplate and so will my mount. As I got this more defensive, strategic role, the fifth guy will be fighter/barbarian half-orc.

So, our party will have a human, an elf, a half elf, a half orc and a dwarf. What are the odds, right? The barbarian guy will have skills points in Survival, the rogue elf will have gather information and knowledge (local) and perception, the dwarf healer will have sense motive, heal and perception, i will have climb, ride, diplomacy, the sorc will have bluff, knowledge arcana and spellcraft. We have a great party, both in and out of combat. We'll start today. Again, thanks all.


That's a lot of excelent advices everyone.
I think I found my reason of being, a Cavalier of the Shield, probably medium, probably (which means I'm thinking).

I talked to the GM and the answer wasn't good. He said "it'll be a ton of battles, but worry not about dungeons, remember harsh terrain also screw you up" So I guess he's planning to reduce my number of charges.

My friend decided he'll go melee ranger or fighter (or both) and the rogue said he will also go melee (finesse) and so will the healer (hammer and shield), so we'll be a lot of melee, the rogue, sorceress and ranger can hit at distance very well too.

I'll be taking the role of tank as well, I'm really, really liking it, but now I'm thinking about my mount, and about what feats to take, I feel there's too much I want and not enough space, also wondering what to take first, as I NEED to survive the very first levels. Advice?

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