Alekto Winterborn's page

How much effort goes into optimization vs how much goes into personality and background is a false dichotomy: there is NO vs, at all. Someone can have a two handed fighter with a 7 strength and the personality of wet cardboard or a stirring tale of love and loss of Ingvar:Beauty school drop out even if Ingvar has a 20 strength.

I think you misunderstood me BigNorseWolf. What I am saying is all about the attitude, about how you use your power and not being a jerk with it. If you are able to have a great concept while being optimized, it doesn't bother me (much).

If you don't like how your characters are performing then change something about your character and leave other players characters to the other players. I don't think its fair to imply that other players are being jerks by making their fighter good at fighting.

Again,it's all about the attitude. For example, I had to tell a fellow pathfinder not so long ago to stop killing everything because I wanted to be able to do something in combat. I have a decent ninja and I was able to put my fair share in combat but the example I gave about the fighter happened then. The player felt compelled to kill everything in sight just because he could (dropping them in one blow actually). The fight was very unbalanced and not very fun for some players (including me). I told him really clearly to stop bashing everything in sight and leave some of the fun to the other players (which he didn't). When you play PFS, you have to take other players into consideration.

The game is so combat focused that combat effectiveness takes precedence. Dont get me wrong, i love the skill challenges, I love the RP when it happens, but most of your success and failure depends on your ability to put someone in the ground before they do the same to you. If pfs is getting Cuisinarts of death its because the scenarios are looking for Cuisinarts...

I agree with you that the game is combat focused but it shouldn't be combat-only. IMHO, every challenge is an encounter. And the whole point of being a Lamplighter is to be able to pull your own weight, no matter what the encounter is. During an encounter in which social skills are required, if you min-maxed in combat, chances are you can't pull your own weight, leaving everything to your teammates for the rest of the encounter. Just as a purely social character doesn't have a place in PFS because you let the other players handle bigger encounters (because you raise the CR), you have to take that into consideration when you play a more combat-oriented character. Even a fighter with a cha of -2 could still put a rank in intimidate and bring it to +2, more than enough to intimidate most people or help another character achieve a tough challenge. This is what is being asked about being a lamplighter.

An analogy would be playing hockey. PFS is like a street hockey league full of friends trying to have a good time once or twice a week. If one player is clearly better than the others AND he is hogging the puck, then the other players become frustrated. And I hate being frustrated because of a puck hog.

I am a teacher by day and a father of 2 by night. When I meet my friends at the friendly neighbourhood RPG store, I want to have a good time because I don't get out often. And when your lodge has more than 80 members with half of that number being quite active, you encounter different people. Sometime I have a great time and sometimes I don't and it is usually because of the puck hog (or min-maxer if you will). I might be old fashioned but I like my encounters to be more than just "fireball + quickened fireball"... The Lamplighters, to me, offer a way to make sure noone hogs the puck, that everybody is considerate to each other around the table and not overly specialized. You can still be a good player, and if you're a great one, just make sure to pass the puck once in a while. And if your only skill is being good at slapshots, then the game will be very repetitive (Jimbo passes the puck to Big Hog, Big Hog slapshots and scores... again...)

And truth be told, if I could, I would choose to only play with other Lamplighters to maximize my chances of having fun...

Good one Scott! You know I support you 100% on this initiative. And just to put a bit of background into the discussion for everybody else not part of our Lodge here in Winnipeg, it had been an ongoing discussion for a while now in our Facebook forum. Some players, myself included, are a bit sick of min-maxers and one trick ponies. Here's a message I wrote a couple weeks ago on this topic:

"Seriously, it all comes back to the almighty rule #0. [...] unless players start putting more efforts into their background and character concepts, and less efforts into optimizing characters, we are doomed to see all of that happening over and over again. I am personally sick of level 4 fighters and barbarians doing 25-30 points of damage (str of 20, 2-hands, power atack, charging, furious focus, etc.) while I am trying to play a well-balanced fighter or rogue and can't even come close to that damage output even while doing a coup de grace on a flanked sleeping ennemy just because I chose to have normal stats, a few strong points and a versatility of feats and items. (/end rant) [...] I may sound pretentious or some might be offended but I think some players just don't care about the negative potential a min-maxer can have around the table, especially the minimal amount of fun the other players can have while the min-maxer is always under the spotlight and/or putting others in danger because of its actions or behaviour. Some combinations of classes/races/feats seem to be more prone to that kind of behaviour but at the end it is the player's attitude that makes all the difference. And some players just have a bad attitude."

The Lamplighters seem to offer a philosophy more than a faction or any tangible game effects. It offers an opportunity to think of other players, of your faction, and the general well-being of the Society (in and out of game) while creating a new character.

On the topic of dump stats, I hate seeing dump stats just to fuel a really high stat. But I think they could be acceptable in certain occasions, especially if the Pathfinder is making a reasonnable effort to compensate. However, one has to think, when crating of new character that, that said character is fresh out of training. How was training for a character with a str of 7? Would a barbarian without tact or common sense be able to pass some of the tests set by your "teachers" or recruiters during training? The Lamplighters offer an opportunity to think about it before jumping into the fray.

I also agree that having something as "meeting 6 of the 8 requirements" would open the group a little bit more, especially for some of the classes that aren't skillful like fighters or clerics. Altough, I wish PFS would have strict requirements representing the necessary skills to "pass" training... Thus said, it would be nice to see some of these characters choosing a trait that will offer them a new class skill instead of just choosing "reactionary"...