21 Huzzahs's page

One of the key things you should do as a GM is make yourself familiar with the classes, skills, traits, spells, abilities, etc that the player characters have. It can be a lot of work, but I don't see how you can deliberate a game fairly without at least having some basic familiarity.

Well, the thing is I am actually very familiar with this kind of stuff. Classes, abilities, spells, monsters, combat rules. The parts where I struggle seem to be the ones he finds in the parts of the book I never really read (Foliage rules, forest fires, weird applications of skills, polymorphing). Come to think of it, maybe I need to reread the Druid >_> However, your point is well taken. I've consigned myself to learning the rules better to perhaps reduce the anxiety this player is feeling towards the game. Besides, I could always use more knowledge when I'm running a game.

Yeah, there was a player in our group like this. He was an insane paranoid survivalist, who held that same view of DMs vs players, it was hilarious.

Odd isn't it? I'm not actively facilitating this sort of behavior, I wonder if it's some sort of player stereotype that I was never aware of? I tell him all the time I'm not actually against (or targeting) him.

• He tends to play characters that hog the spotlight. Mainly due to this player's tendency to talk constantly, never giving other players a chance to react or take actions. He does this without cease, every session, to the point where other players are now complaining to me.

• He is a combat lover and rarely RPs.

*Raises hand*

How are these not mutually exclusive?

They really aren't if you think about it. You don't have to RP to spotlight hog. He basically continually takes actions, references rules/numbers out loud while doing so and simply won't stop. He doesn't speak in character most of the time - he rarely interacts with NPCs other than to kill them. Example:

PP: I cast plant growth.
Me: Okay. Jim, what do yo---
PP: Oh, and I cast spike stones. (begins reading its effect).
Me: Neato, but I'm helping (Jim).
PP: Cool. I cast Beast shape, and turn into a bat. (Begins reading stat changes out loud). DM, I've got blindsight!
Me: Nice. But (Jim) hasn't had a turn yet.
Jim: I'm going to put some food on the campfire.
Me: Make a roll for Profession: Cooking for the quality of the stew.
Jim: (Begins to roll, is interrupted as he calls out the result)
PP: Hey DM, I'm crafting a pearl of power. DM, you know what that does?

etc. He's basically just not waiting for his turn and tends to always interrupt.

Regarding his behavior aside from dealing with rules, it's probably a good idea to institute some kind of Parliamentary system by which people have fair turns to declare their actions.

Yeah, I like this idea. It may help in the long run if I make non- combat actions more of a "standard" progression of turns rather than freeform it.

here is a secret to GMing that lots of people who have not GMed or don't know how to GM don't know. It is a rule that is there, but not written in any books, and it is ever-present in PFS scenarios and a GM's best friend. Its called plot.

Explain to your friend that what happened is part of the game's plot, and needs to happen, and that as far as you know, you followed all of the rules written in the books and succeeded in progressing the plot. Then explain that you still are learning the rules, and may slip up every once in a while, but the magic item needed to be stolen for story purposes regardless of the rules you needed to follow to steal it.

I smiled when I read this. This is, almost word for word, exactly what I told him in the last argument. He didn't like it. I think the fact that some things in a campaign can happen without his total control over them makes him uncomfortable - and it's understandable, but doesn't really mesh with the other players or myself.

Typing these things out really helps me crystallize the problem in my own thoughts. I believe that the combination of my lack of detailed rules knowledge and the fact that I occasionally do things because of plot may be making him feel insecure, so he's acting up, trying to enforce the rules more strictly by constantly arguing about them, and so on.

My goals before the next session (in two weeks):
-Learn the rules better, particularly those that I'm expecting to come up next session
-Use a more standardized form of turn order outside of combat
-Be more forceful about not interrupting other players

Big thanks to everyone who replied in this thread. Hopefully this straightens things out.

I like to have fun with metagamers...I'll use different creatures stat blocks to attack them with well known monsters.Have them display never before seen abilities.

I've got to admit, this is pretty good. The bunny thing was cool :) Might have to start trying this.

Then, confront him at the table about his behavior and hope the rest of the table backs you up. It's easier to remove/deal with a problem player like this if the rest of the players openly back you up.

The thing is, I JUST did that with this the last session. My other players backed me up, but the problem player didn't want to change his ways. He was pretty polite about it, but he's a stubborn guy (as am I) so we got nowhere. I almost got him to fix these problems once, I talked to him and the next session it was about half as much rules-lawyering and spotlight hogging. Then it gradually went back up to the normal level.

Personally, stealing my treasure is a sure fire way to make me mad.

Maybe there are actual problems he has with how you GM, have you talked with him about why he's acting this way?

I have talked to him about it. Most of his complaints center around "I don't like how the DM makes rulings on the spot; he should be more prepared and follow the rules more." I've tried to explain that I make mistakes and some of the rules are very complex so I don't use them (the group already knew this), but he seems to be pretty irritated. He obsessively reads the rules as written even during session, I can't even keep up.

However looking back on the way he plays, I think I have found a potential source of his misbehavior.

I think, for whatever reason, he doesn't feel safe as a character in the game world. Every night (in game time), he sets up a ludicrous amount of defenses (~5 spells, bear traps, caltrops, turns into a bat for blindsight) casts a bunch of buffs, and so on. Now that I recall our earlier argument, I think he was also upset that his character had ever been hoodwinked and that the fey had got past his plant growth/spike stones - he was simply in disbelief and was convinced that I had cheated the party by ignorant DMing.

The bizarre part is, there are hardly any ambushes at night - the party only faces 1-2 encounters per session. None of his characters have ever died to my knowledge, either. Maybe he is taking some of his paranoia/insecurity out by hogging/rules lawyering? I just can't figure out where it's from. Next time I will certainly try to be more blunt with these issues and see if I can talk to him in private.

Another interesting note: apparently, some of my other players have actually been emailing the problem player (without my knowledge) asking him to stop being a distraction. I've no idea what was said but it's...eyebrow raising. I hope they weren't too abrasive, it would make things worse.

By the way, thanks all for your responses. Very quick reply time on these forums.

EDIT: By the way, if the problem player is reading this, you know who you are. I apologize if you are offended by this thread but I am only trying to help keep our group together and playing smoothly. We'll talk soon :)

Okay, so I have a player who is running a level 9 thundercaller bard. His favorite technique is using the thundercall performance to deal lots of damage and stun multiple times in a round. Basically what he does is start a thundercall performance, end it, then start another to deal 6d8 points of damage and 2 stun rolls. The problem is that many of the other players are feeling overshadowed by this damage output, especially the stun (I've had direct comments). We are a new fairly low-power group, this is my second time DMing and I'm not really familiar how to adjudicate the thundercaller. To make it worse, I already had him switch from a soundstriker, so he's been fairly tolerant with me. It's a little awkward to consider rule changes at this point, though they may be necessary.

For reference:

I have some questions regarding the use of this, as well as the use of this and two bard spells (exquisite accompaniment and virtuoso performance).

1. Is using two of the thundercall in a round legal? Does the bard simply produce a single performance effect while maintaining per round, or can he start/stop to use the thundercall effect multiple times in a round (so at 11th when he can start a performance as a swift action, 3 times a round)? What I'm really asking is how does the bard's performance work with thundercall - immediately when the performance starts, or at the beginning of a round while he is maintaining?

2. What is the benefit of using exquisite accompaniment? A bard can already maintain a performance as a free action, so how does this spell help?

3. With virtuoso performance, eh can start a second bardic performance. I have some concerns here: can he use this to do thundercall even more times in a round? If thundercall is indeed "maintained" and has an effect only once per round, this isn't too bad- he'll get two thundercall blasts per round, one from him, one from the performance spell. Otherwise, this could give him six in a round using his current strategy (three from start/stop on his own, 3 from the accompaniment).

Thanks for the help!