Just curious, why would Mos have misgivings about a halfling wizard?
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Well to be truthful, I was confused when s/he first introduced himself and made a point of saying he was a halfling
"Greetings my dear. I am Zeebo Softfeather, an acquaintance of Master Geldzauberer... and despite appearances am not a gnome! Perish the thought I say! Gno, I am, merely a well-fed, well-read halfling of... mature, yes mature years... Like a cheese I have got better with age!"
That was my first clue...lol
Ah, OK. I thought there was something about them being a halfling, or a wizard, or a halfling wizard, that was bugging you. Carry on!
Yeah I'm a little in the same boat - I could see Mos being suspicious if Zeebo claimed some connection to the Guild of Larcenous Acquisitions but right now you'll likely just think Zeebo's a old flakey magic user?
Now as the journey commences it might be that Mos' questions/interactions with Zeebo start to raise flags... and that might organically come, but as of right now not so sure? Unless its the old double bluff... Smallbarrow is a suspicious wee fella whose trying not to be suspicious, Softfeather isn't suspicious of the rogue, which is in itself suspicious... ;S
Agree as/when/if Mos does realise the old cheeser is actually a gnome, keeping that to yourself for purposes to be determined makes sense. Secrets are a currency as much as coin.
Yeah let's run with that variant Encumbrance :)
Worn & Capacity Items
Items that are designed to carry and redistribute the weight and bulk of other items are called Capacity Items. Capacity Items can carry a number of items equal to their Capacity. Furthermore, a Capacity Item cannot carry any item whose EV is equal to or greater than it’s Capacity rating. So a Backpack, with a Capacity of 8, can carry up to 8 items whose EVs are 7 or less. Items that are carried in a Capacity item do not have their EV included in the character’s Encumbrance Total. Instead, the character only notes the EV of the Capacity item. So the character wearing an EV 2 Backpack that has a Bedroll (EV 3), hammer (EV 2), 50 nails (EV 1), and one torch (EV 1) has five items in the Backpack (and thus has space for three more items). The character’s Encumbrance Rating is only increased by 2 when they carry the Backpack, ignoring the EVs of the items inside of it.
Coins
There is no way to determine exact weights and encumbrance of coin. Use the following for a baseline. Each coin in C&C is roughly 1 ounce. This would make gold coins, as the metal is heavier, smaller than silver coins, whose metal is lighter. Every 16 coins is equal to a pound. However coins have almost no bulk to them, but may have weight. A single coin, or a pound of coins, has no appreciable EV. Ten pounds, or 160 coins, is equal to 1 EV.
In other news can't believe the boards don't have a Mule or Donkey icon... p1ss poor says I.
Suggested Secondary Skills
This skill notes that the character is proficient with manners, social mores on their particular level of social class, and how to act among those superior or inferior to them. Public speaking is also part of this, as are the many methods society uses to segment itself (such as heraldry, regalia, etc.).
The skills of performing arts comprise any method of artistic expression that entertains an audience by physical activity. This can encompass acting, singing, juggling, etc.
Both of these tie into his "educated savage" with the voice as rich as mead?
The scribe’s skill is that of penmanship, writing, and ink and paper preparations. Simple illumination is possible, as well as other writing abilities.
A character with this skill is well versed in determining the general worth of non- magical items as well as the discrete techniques for haggling without giving offense. The successful use of this skill allows a modification of 10% of an item’s cost per bonus point of charisma the skilled appraiser has.
Figure with her background she'd be familiar with falsifying docs and already mentioned she'd helped Gordrenn with valuations etc?
More to follow...
Well to be truthful, I was confused when s/he first introduced himself and made a point of saying he was a halfling
"Greetings my dear. I am Zeebo Softfeather, an acquaintance of Master Geldzauberer... and despite appearances am not a gnome! Perish the thought I say! Gno, I am, merely a well-fed, well-read halfling of... mature, yes mature years... Like a cheese I have got better with age!"That was my first clue...lol
Yeah this was me leaning (probably a little too much) into Salsa's OOC intro of the alter-ego. Thought it would be a funny trope for an old halfling who looks like a gnome (and actually is one) to keep mentioning they are a halfling not a gnome (or even a small dwarf!)
Regarding Hûnidark's background and secondary skills, I imagine he’s always existed on the fringes of society so his skills would be ‘subsistence’ tasks to keep food on the table or find shelter. Perhaps, Mariner (Con) and/or Forester (Con) make sense?
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Spiro just stopped to buy a Medium Wooden Shield he's had his eye on for some time, and will be ready to head out at first light.
@Spiro: Sounds good.
@Hûnidark: Makes sense - both fit nicely. Mariner I see as more an emphasis on fishing than seamanship.
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Mariner I see as more an emphasis on fishing than seamanship.
That was my take on it as well. He'd likely have some small boat skills (knots, setting an anchor against a current, etc.) but nothing that would make him a legitimate sailor on a ship.
Of the two, do you have a preference which I should take?
Don't be afraid to say "both". ;P
@Hûnidark: Haha. Both is fine :)
@Mos: There's a rationale to losing Zeebo's trail, not just hand-waiving/fudgery by me :)
Excellent! Character sheet updated!
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Sorry gang - week got away from me, been prepping some encounter maps so will get forging ahead o'er the weekend.
Sounds good, chief!
Hi all - managed to get floored by the flu over the weekend, so little progress made. I've reluctantly trimmed off my WFRP game also so here's hoping I get this one up to pace once my energy levels are restored.
Appreciate the patience in the meantime.
Hey BD, just make sure you take the time to rest and recover fully, and no stress about the game. If you ever feel like getting back to it, I for one will be around!
Hi. Crazy week of business associates in town and trade show, so I'll be able to post (Probably) but it will be later at night... so feel free to BOT as necessary.
Yup, take care of yourself!
Gives me time to actually finish my character profile....and make a post.
Busy....busy....
Right ye are folks. Am on the mend courtesy of some codeine tincture to suppress this annoying cough I've developed post flu (wasn't covid but felt exactly like it...)
Anyhoo, will get some more background stuff done today - updating the campaign calendar and tweaking some info on the various pantheons, before getting some game posts up.
Could everyone ensure they have at least one Background skill selected for the PC, also please not somewhere about your religious believes - be you a skeptic, believer, follower of Diety X or Cleric etc. The gods do listen to their followers (sometimes) so would be good to know should party meet a pickle of a situation lol.
Appreciate the patience shown :)
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Done!
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Hey all, wanted to let you know that I'm planning on catching up with the game soonish. I've got to get my own games up and running again and I didn't get as much done as I wanted to over the past few weeks. Unfortunately, that means I don't have a timeline at the moment, but I will be joining in as soon as I can.
Thank you for your patience. I'll keep y'all posted on when it looks like I'll be caught up.
- Adam
Posts delayed, the flu/cough thing rallied and had a truly sh1te day & night of it yesterday. Will try and get things rolling this week folks workload and aliment allowing.
Again sorry for the delay :(
- Adam: Good to see you back in the trenches mate, plenty of time for you to get caught up before our first encounter...
Sorry to hear you're unwell, BD. Hope they prescribe you something to kick that flu/cold's butt.
That sucks BD... Just forget about the delays and the game for now.
Sometimes when we try to rush recovery, we just make it worse. The body needs the time it needs, so you have to be patient. Rest and recover, for as long as it is necessary.
Team FYI, I will be traveling from early tomorrow until Monday, so my posting will be sparse.
Evening gang - good news is I'm finally feeling like I'm getting the better of this virus/flu/thing... been doing a wee bit more prep in the background, so have a decent run (I hope) of encounters and posts primed when we get going...
Still not 100% though, and with work on Monday I'm giving myself a midweek mental target to gauge how I'm feeling and if I can get back to regular posting.
Confident we'll commence sometime this week - just can't say when! Til then bear with please - your collective patience is very much appreciated :)
No problem, chief. Real life has a way of interfering with our virtual interests. Glad to hear you are on the mend!
No worries BD - good to hear you are on the mend! That's what is important.
Back at it folks - illness is mostly gone (tis but a sniffle now) - appreciate the patience :)
Post up!
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Tis but a flesh wound!
Have rejigged the Campaign Tab with rules content at the foot - setting in the middle and new Dramatis Personae section to start tracking the campaign folk of note.
Heyo, I've gotten back in the groove with running my two games, so I'll be catching up with this one. Sorry for the longer than expected absence.
Indeed....much the same for me. Will try to catch up as well!
Good to have you both back in the saddle :) Adam - hopefully haven't ruined Zeebo in your absence :)
Have also invited the GM from one of the PBPs I'm in so his PC may show up later on the journey (or in Haranshire) - still debating on what he'll play - with Wizard, Druid and Ranger all potentials.
Good to have you both back in the saddle :) Adam - hopefully haven't ruined Zeebo in your absence :)
Not at all, I think you did a wonderful job. And it's good to be back. :)
Have also invited the GM from one of the PBPs I'm in so his PC may show up later on the journey (or in Haranshire) - still debating on what he'll play - with Wizard, Druid and Ranger all potentials.
Sounds fun! I'm looking forward to seeing who joins up with this merry, if rather eclectic, band.
Greetings all. Many thanks for Black Dow for the invitation - right excited to enjoy a campaign from the other side of the screen for the first time it quite a while..and an older-school one, at that.
I don't have much experience with AD&D but from what I've gleaned from the C&C handbook so far this iteration seems roughly in tune with early 3rd edition which is where I got my start in 2000 so I think I'll manage without much issue.
I've narrowed characters down to either a human wizard with a heightened fascination for the aberrant or a dwarven ranger operating as a subterranean scout and wayfinder. I think I'll write up both and see what I'm feeling more when I flesh out the backstory and personality of each, but if anyone has any input I'm glad to take a listen as well.
Reckon I'll throw out some stat rolls and get crackin'
= 16
= 17
= 11
= 12
= 9
= 14
Looks good to me!
Looking forward to playing with you all.
Oh, nice! I'm kinda torn. I think either would be great. I can see the wizard giving Zeebo some side-eye when we start flinging spells. The ranger would definitely be welcome for the sustained firepower, and depending on personality, I can see some fun interactions between the dwarf and the old, flakey, cheesy wizard.
Also, I forgot about the secondary skills. BD, do I pick one or take both? I can see them both working for Ping/Zeebo.
Hi Woodsmoke, and welcome aboard!
I have no particular preference for your character, so I will take the easiest solution - since we we already have a Dwarf (me :D), my suggestion would be a SomethingElse Ranger or a Wizard.
Welcome Woodsmoke - glad to have our join our merry band.
As discussed in PM no preference as I can see both fitting into the group and campaign pretty seamlessly.
Happy enough to have 2 dwarves in the party if everyone is - especially given as we have 2 halflings ;)
@Zeebo: you can pick 2 background skills :)
Yes. Welcome Woodsmoke. I would think that another combatant would be good, so I'd lean towards Ranger. I don't believe the party has a rogue if that interests you at all?
Quick straw poll for everyone - as mentioned in the game thread C&C doesn't have proficiencies per say - some classes have skills etc and both races and classes grant bonuses to certain types of checks.
Secondary Skills (as they stand) also attempt to bridge this gap... however I digress. I was dredging over old campaign notes when I ran Night Below with my TTPRG group back in the day. We started in 2E AD&D and transitioned to 3E when it came out. I used the handy dandy conversion rules to see out the epic game.
Some of the notes regards Non Weapon Proficiencies and Kits got me thinking back - kits were essentially broad archetypes as we know them from PF. Non-Weapon Proficiencies were skills not linked to a specific class. Was something all my players had and deliberated on their selections.
Curious to know what everyone thinks - is it liberating not having Skills represented in the game or limiting? As i touched on I'm torn as I keep defaulting to PF/3E style checks in my head, then have to hold off hoping you will examine the horse or tree or gravestone etc.
Thinking NWPs at least give me a something to hang my hat on to allow for checks etc... Dunno curious to see what you lot are thinking about it.
Non-Weapon Proficiencies - could be a possible house rule or we can continue to ignore? (I would cut this list down excluding all the psion based stuff etc - just showing it as an example)
Edit: This is just me spitballing - not pitching anything hard and fast.
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I personally don't think they necessary... we just have to get used to not having them again.
2nd Edition was my least favorite edition (Until 4e), and I quickly tired of 3.0/3.5.
I think as we get used to playing our characters things will naturally develop. For instance Spiro has the farming background so he should be able to deal with the injured horse... perhaps a bonus for a charisma check. He also has enhanced senses so while a WIS check would normally be a higher DC perhaps his bonus lowers the roll. I like the skilled/unskilled DC's of Castles & Crusades.
BTW: C&C Reforged is scheduled to release next month. If you sign up you get a free pdf. I think it's pretty much the same just diverging the game from the OSR license.
I think you may want to check out the Dungeoncraft YouTube channel. He has a lot of videos on running old school, homebrewed D&D games. He has a couple of videos on skills that I haven't watched, but might be of interest to you.
If I were to make a change to how C&C handles checks, I'd have the Castle Keeper ask themselves, "Would it make sense for this character to know how to do this given their background," and use that answer to set the base DC. If it's yes, the base DC is 12. If it's no, the base DC is 18. If it's unclear, then ask the player clarifying questions.
But that's just me, and I realize that it'd slow down PBP play.
Taking a look at the table you linked to, I think that maybe we could simplify it to just a background.
Ping/Zeebo's background would be Charlatan/Con Artist. She would probably know how to do various things like lie, pickpocket, forge documents, and wheedle information out of people. That said, she grew up with her father as her only source of information and he wasn't interested in having someone capable of acting on their own, so he did his best to make her dependent on him. She likely wouldn't be very knowledgeable outside of what she knows about magic and conning people. Maybe include a drawback like sheltered and paranoid?
Hunidark could have a background of brawler with a distrustful/wary drawback.
Didn't see a backstory for Eireachdail ap Leòmhann, though his entrance certainly gave me itinerate troubadour vibes. Can't really come up with anything for Rannock except blacksmith based on the secondary skill you gave him.
Spiro doesn't have a backstory in his profile either, so I'm going with squire or guard for his background based on what I've seen so far.
The background (and drawback) would mainly be for figuring out if we should have some proficiency with a task. Ping/Zeebo would know how to forge documents and convince someone that a worthless trinket is actually some mystic artifact, but wouldn't have much common knowledge or be able to tell when someone is trying to help her.
Kinda spitballing myself, so forgive the rambly post.
I have recently been lucky enough to find an RPG game and group to play face to face. And we are playing AD&D2e. This was the edition I ever played the most in my life, so it is an interesting experiment coming back to it after all these years.
One of the things I am now convinced about is that Nonweapon Proficiencies do not work - there are simple just too many subjects/crafts/areas of expertise for the amount of NWP the players ever gain, and I think the table you linked shows exactly that. So in spite of its size, I find it limiting in play.
I like the Background approach, and the ideas highlighted by Spiro and Zeebo: "Would it make sense for this character to know how to do this given their background?". I understand it takes some more adjudicating from the DM side, but it is my preferred method at the moment.
And on a side note, I don't feel the need to roll all the dice all the time (except during combat, then I prefer to do my rolls) - as an example, I have grown to dislike 'preemptive' dice rolls, and would much rather you roll for me if you find it necessary. Also perfectly fine if for example I am trying to bargain at a shop, and you ask me to roll, stuff like that. Or if I am trying to craft an item. But for situations like Perception, Sense Motive or similar, and such, please feel free to roll for me and adjudicate. Heck, you can even stat our skills in PF1e and use that system if you prefer, without us knowing ;)
That being said, I am a BIG fan of Smugzoid's Youtube channel, and I think he has very interesting insights regarding how skills can be adjudicated when you are playing with a system without any skills. I really recommend checking out Dungeons Dragons 5th Edition Vs 1d6 OSR Skills White Box D&D. Why have skill checks?
, though there are many other interesting videos on his Youtube channel.
Cool - some interesting takes from old heads lol.
Agree let's run with the concepts and flavour as they stand and really lean into character backgrounds (et al. Secondary Skills etc).
@Spiro: Yup signed up - looking forward to seeing what comes out of it :)
In the case of noticing something... with his elven senses Spiro might get a bonus... so if the target number as an untrained stat is (18) he might get a +2 for his Enhanced Senses.
If calming the horse is a Target number, he might get a +2 for his farming background, or perhaps a +2 for his Empathy. or maybe a combination of the two.
Easy to add bonuses to lower the difficulty of rolls using backgrounds, but still keeps the lower target numbers based around the core abilities.
C&C is much like old AD&D where the 'agency' largely resided with the DM to create the story, much like in a book. So, the DM decides when you are ambushed and how surprised each character is by it. Your only chance to adjust that result was by the specificity of your actions: "I'm looking for hidden baddies hiding in the trees" or "I'm looking for the baddies hiding beneath a camouflaged tarp in the field".
Modern games, in an attempt to make things more fair (and possibly disrupt some s@@+ty DM behaviors from back in the day) have transferred that 'agency' to players via skills.
I'm OK with giving that agency back to the GM to tell his tale and playtest C&C as written. The other obvious option (which I'm also fine with) is to lean into the simplified C&C mechanic for 'everyman' skills.
So, let's take 'Awareness' of an ambush here as an example. BD decides that the folks moving toward the horse have a chance to spot the hidden Bloblins. He decides spotting these buggers is a INT (or whatever) check and assigns the CC (difficulty rating). Then we roll. Now, if we have any special specific abilities -- Huni's 'detect by smell' or whatever, that either becomes a modifier or supersedes the roll.
The one change to C&C as written that I think makes a lot of sense, is wiggling the numbers to lose that base difficulty 12 or 18 thing.
I saw a video from one C&C group that simplified that. Instead of having multiple difficulty ratings, they went with a bonus to characters with the corresponding Primary skill.
So, from the GM side, EVERY challenge had a base difficulty of 18. "12" is gone.
Each player gets a +6 bonus (the difference between 12 and 18) to rolls on their Primary stats.
So, if the team is exposed to poison, the GM just says CON save vs CC:22 (18 + poison modifier). Characters without CON as their Primary make their base roll. Characters with CON as a Primary make their base roll +6.
The one change to C&C as written that I think makes a lot of sense, is wiggling the numbers to lose that base difficulty 12 or 18 thing.
I saw a video from one C&C group that simplified that. Instead of having multiple difficulty ratings, they went with a bonus to characters with the corresponding Primary skill.
So, from the GM side, EVERY challenge had a base difficulty of 18. "12" is gone.
Each player gets a +6 bonus (the difference between 12 and 18) to rolls on their Primary stats.
So, if the team is exposed to poison, the GM just says CON save vs CC:22 (18 + poison modifier). Characters without CON as their Primary make their base roll. Characters with CON as a Primary make their base roll +6.
Mmm. Interesting...
In the case of noticing something... with his elven senses Spiro might get a bonus... so if the target number as an untrained stat is (18) he might get a +2 for his Enhanced Senses.
If calming the horse is a Target number, he might get a +2 for his farming background, or perhaps a +2 for his Empathy. or maybe a combination of the two.
Easy to add bonuses to lower the difficulty of rolls using backgrounds, but still keeps the lower target numbers based around the core abilities.
Good point and reminds me of something. Can you all put your Primary abilities (and their respective bonuses) into your PC headers please. Means I don't have to dig for them :)