This will be the discussion thread for the game.
Very cool GMMichael, again thanks for running the game.
Looks like a good mix of characters and races, should be a good time. I haven't decided on Rory's fighting style or archetype, leaning toward "pack master" cause wolves run in packs and will definitly take 'weapons finesse' in the first round. Not sure if the rest of the feats will lean two weapon melee or ranged.
GMM do you mind if we discuss plans, like what types of attacks and what type of skills, so we can synergize or would you rather we build our characters without knowledge of what the others are doing?
Not at all
Thank you.
I Know Rory's background skills will be crafting leather, this may end up being 'armor' so he can make something useful, but will work in leather/hide/scale for him and the wolves. Then a knowledge check tied to town, if allowed possibly "Lore" on the wars fought here in the "hold of Belkzen." Both background skills will tie in to his backstory.
Hunter class skills are pretty much the same as rangers, so not a lot of help there. Knowledge skills are limited to dungeoneering, geography and nature;
As for fighting style, I'm leaning toward the archetype packmaster: start with a wolf to ride, then add another wolf for a flanking buddy. Both Ovirl and Imara have the option to go ranged or melee, I know rorek55 mentioned he may prefer ranged instead of two weapon fighting.
Looking forward to seeing everyone's ideas :)
Thanks for the chance to play this guy.
With rydell I'm debating between several options.
The first option is a TWFer using a longsword and dagger. That said, that's only for theatrics, as I'm not a fan of TWF in general in pathfinder and I know how deadly some encounters are to melee and I don't have easy ways to mitigate that.
The option I'm leaning towards at the moment is a switch hitter of sorts, focused mostly on archery. He would primarily be a ranged combatant, move to melee only at early levels and when nessecary. This build would likely make use of an animal companion that I could use as a mount. Hopefully one that can fly. As such, I'm looking at sky sentinel as a potential archetype or just picking up the monstrous mount feats later on.
The final option is, I'm considering trying out the drake companion archetype. Though, I'd need to discuss it with you a bit more, as raw the drake companion is... well terrible but I've always liked the idea of it.
I also look forward to seeing Rydell come to his own decision regarding hopeknives and what happens from there.
Thank you for having me, Michael. It's a pleasure to meet you all.
I've yet to truly flesh out Ovril's build and I'll come back to you all once I got a better idea of what I want and how to realize it. It seems that investing into ranged feats is a bit of a waste as a cartomancer, so that's something I'll have to read into.
If needed, he can flex into the Healing Hex at 1 and provide support through that. I got no clue whether undead will be a thing, but past 3 he could even make ranged touch attacks against them using the cure light and later cure moderate spell provided through the hex. I think.
Of course, I could always go 'pure' Witch and drop the Cartomancer and lean into Profession Fortune-Teller instead ... but that would be boring and a betrayal of my original idea =P
@Rydell: a switch-hitter using a shield paired with throwing weapons and a dedicated melee word is also quite alright. You can always phase-out of it as you gain levels and gear, but javelins and throwing axes are super solid weapons.
Thanks for sharing Rydell, When I play a ranger their always what I would call a switch hitter.
The Switch hitter idea from Treantmonks guide to Rangers made a lot of sense to me.
The Switch Hitter isn't quite the Archer that the Archer Ranger is, but he's close. Furthermore, the switch hitter is a melee character, ready to wade into melee whenever the chance presents itself. You know those video games where you can switch between archery and melee fighting and be good at both? That's the Switch hitter in a nutshell. A fighter can pull this off too, but wouldn't you rather have all the skills, all the spells, the animal companion, the class abilities, excellence in archery, and excellence in melee? Sound too good to be true? It's not, and I'll prove it.
Tactics: At first level you are just a melee fighter. Grab a greatsword or a longsword and shield if you prefer and bash away. You'll find that high strength melee builds are always optimal at first level, and the switch hitter is no exception.
When you can afford a mighty composite longbow, get one. You should have quick draw early on, so you'll be firing a bow at range, and when the range drops, you drop the bow and draw your melee weapon. At this point don't be using a shield, you just don't have time to get it on. Therefore, your melee weapon at this point should be two handed, beyond that, whatever you like.
When you get to 6th level you will notice that your arrows are really quite deadly. With Deadly Aim, Manyshot, and Rapid shot, you can fire 4 arrows in one round for pretty nice damage potential. Then when you drop your bow and enter melee, you should be having a to hit and damage that rivals pure melee builds. This is in addition to all the skills and the spells you are starting to receive. The animal companion is just gravy in the mix.
By upper levels your arrows will continue to rival a dedicated archer's, and your melee ability should rival a dedicated meleer. The pure fighter will outshine you in melee eventually, and the Paladin will outshine you vs. evil, unless you are fighting a favored enemy, which will tilt the scale in your favor, but you will always be competitive, with the archery ability as a pure bonus.
Combat Style: The combat style of the Switch Hitter is Archery. The Switch Hitter doesn't use TWF, he uses a two handed weapon instead. His skill in archery is gained through the combat style class feature, while his skill in melee is gained through his regular feat selection.
Ability Scores:
Strength is the primary stat for the switch hitter. The Switch hitter doesn't need a high Dex to qualify for Archery Feats because combat style allows you to bypass stat requirements. Strength however will determine the strength of the mighty composite longbow (damage), and determine to hit and damage for a 2 handed weapon (utilizing a 1 and 1/2 bonus to damage on the weapon). Dexterity will affect your to hit with archery, as well as affect your AC. It's not as important as Str, because you've got a great BAB already, so those arrows will have a pretty good to hit anyways. That said, jump on Dex stat bonus items when they become available. Wisdom affects your ability to cast spells, as well as the duration on one of your potential abilities, so a bit is needed, Con affects your HP, which are nice to have, but you have a good base already. Int affects your skill points, which is nice, but you have a decent amount of skills already, so not too important. Cha is your only true "dump stat".
Race:
Remember the Archer Ranger? Remove Elf, and put the +2 stat into Strength for the others. That's it.
Combat Style Feats to choose:
2nd: Rapid Shot
6th: Manyshot (for a Ranger, this is just better than Rapid Shot)
10th: Improved Precise Shot
14th: Your Choice
18th: Your Choice
Why no precise shot? If you think about it, precise shot is worthless to the switch hitter, because when melee breaks out, he's in it, and you don't need it to qualify for Improved Precise Shot, because you are a Ranger...yay! Why no Point Blank Shot? Because he doesn't need it. Ranger's can avoid prerequisite feats for their combat style bonus feats. The only other archery feat you'll be taking is deadly aim, and Point Blank Shot isn't required for that either.
Regular Feat Selection:
Level 5: At level 5 you will select Deadly Aim. Its the one archery feat you will select with your regular feats, and it's absolutely a necessity, so just do it.
Quickdraw ****: In order to make the switch from Bow to Two Handed Weapon, this is a must. Level 3 at the latest.
Power Attack ****: An excellent deal with two handed weapons, grants +3 damage for -1 to hit. As a Ranger you have a great chance to hit, so this is a great deal
Cleave ***: This has become a nice skirmish feat. Move into position where you threaten two enemies, attack one, and if you hit, make an attack on the other. Nice.
Great Cleave **: Harder to set up than Cleave, but if you can, it's almost like pounce, except you don't need to charge.
Step Up **: A good way to hound archers and spellcasters who use the "5 foot step back and cast or fire arrows" tactic. Force them to give you an attack of opportunity instead.
Improved Sunder **: I like this feat for a two-handed weapon strength build. You have a really nice chance of destroying the weapon.
Lunge **: A handy feat for someone who is a skirmish meleer. Also works nicely with Cleave (to improve the reach for threatening foes).
Dodge **: Nice to have, just for the AC boost.
Vital Strike***: A nice feat for skirmishing, because it adds damage to standard action attacks. Also, this feat is adding to both your ranged and melee attacks. If you have two potential targets in Melee, Cleave is better, but if you are fighting a single target, then Vital Strike is just extra damage.
Heavy Armor Proficiency ***: A good expenditure of a feat so you can wear Mithril Full Plate
Improved Critical (Falchion) ***: Here's where you start to specialize in a specific weapon. The Falchion works very nicely with Improved Critical
Critical Focus (Falchion) **: Obviously just one in the chain...
Blinding Critical (Falchion) ****: Take advantage of the Falchion's nice crit range to blind foes. Rangers have full BAB, and mesh well with the critical feats.
So how does this turn out? Lets take an example build. Say a 10th level Switch Hitter Ranger, how good is he?
Human 15 point stat buy
Str (+2 racial): 18 (10)
Dex: 13 (3)
Con: 13 (3)
Wis: 13 (3)
Int: 10
Cha: 7 (-4)
Raise the Dex at level 4, the Con at level 8, the Wis at level 12, and Str at levels 16 and 20.
Level 1: Feats: Power attack/Cleave: At this level the character is a Greatsword Wielder. With a Breastplate he has a 17 AC, and 12 HP (for first level not too bad). His to hit with his Greatsword is +4, and damage is 2d6+9 (pretty good)
Level 6: Add feats: Quick Draw, Deadly Aim, Manyshot, Rapid Shot Dex has been increased to 14 at level 4: Equipment: Now the character is using a Greatsword and a Mighty Composite Longbow (+4 str). When enemies are at range, the ranger can take his normal move and fire 2 arrows, each at +7 to hit (1 attack roll, both hit or miss), or take a 5 foot step and attack 3 times, each at +5 to hit. Damage with each is 1d8+8. This is without any magical bonuses. Not bad eh?
The enemies close, he drops his bow, quick draws a greatsword, and in Melee he is now doing 2d6+12 on two attacks, or even on three with a move action if he plans it well. Welcome to the switch hitter.
Keep those feats concentrating on melee, archery will take care of itself now. Rapid shot and Many Shot will ensure you get all kinds of arrows in the air, and Deadly Aim will ensure they hit with a deadly punch. When melee comes, drop the longbow, and switch to a two handed weapon. Eventually a Falchion may be your best bet to take the best advantage of critical feats.
The Switch Hitter and Multiclassing:
Really, the Switch Hitter is a single class character build. A single dip into Rogue is always a decent option for Ranger, but not required. Fighter dips are also possible, but in the long run, you aren't going to see the payoff for what you give up.
Your best Switch Hitter plans on 20 levels of Ranger.
The Switch Hitter and Prestige Classes:
Again, not really the way to go with a switch hitter. Keep him Ranger all the way, use the bonus feats to keep his archery top notch, and his regular feats to ensure his melee ability remains great.
The weaknesses of the build: There is only one that I can see, and only at lower levels. It is the Armor Class. The Switch Hitter needs to concentrate on Strength, which means his AC, considering he wears only a breastplate, will mean a moderately lower AC than a fighter two handed weapon build. Heavy Armor Proficiency plus Mithril Full Plate should eliminate this weakness entirely at higher levels. Otherwise you have a ranged capacity far better than a focused melee build, but aren't facing much disadvantage in melee, you have spells, skills, an animal companion, class special abilities galore, favored enemies, favored terrain...can't complain!
Hey Soicitor! I've never played a Witch, looking forward to seeing you in action :)
so first let me say welcome to the Game all. I hope to make this enjoyable and challenging.
So to answer Rorek/Rydells question in the recruitment thread.
I see no reason not to make the three feats he suggested making standard- Power/attack/deadly aim/combat expertise (as long as you have the prerequisites) You can add them as a free feat on your sheet if so.
Id also like to make scribe scroll standard for any full caster. part time casters ike the ranger and the hunter have to take the feat....along those lines full time casters can use 'read magic' as a free orison/cantrip that doesnt count against their total.
when youre building Id like to keep dump stats from going below 8 as I think its too difficult to 'play' that properly in a roll playing game.
any questions to these additions to the character build pointers?
For those with characters partially made, make sure they adhere to this games guidelines.
I truly look forward to GM'ing for you guys.
I will be using roll20 for maps, and I cant say Im that well versed in it, but I am a quick study ;) initially there may be some growing pains though.
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Idk, I had a blast playing a 7 Int barbarian several years back haha. But I normally do not like dump stats below 8 as well, I actually prefer 10+ if I can swing it. The only exceptions being said barbarian and a very gruff and blunt dwarf at 6 cha.
GM. Would you be willing to consider some changes to the drake companions? As they are, they are weaker than a normal animal companion until ~level 15+, and only marginally surpass later. If you aren't comfortable with it that's fine and I'll just stick with my original intent for animal companion, this also is something we have a little time to think on, since I won't be getting an animal companion until level 2 at best.
what are you thinking to change?
Hey Solicitor/Ovril...what is the name of your sister and how old would she be? You and Rydell share that in common. both are looking out for younger siblings.
Ive been looking over backgrounds and looking at links to each other...
thats an obvious one.
just a reminder on whose who.
1.Rydell Derrick Ellindorr (rorek55) Male Half-Elf 1st Ranger *Trunau Native*
2.Ovril Necul Havayselvay (Solicitor) Male Human 1st Witch *Orphaned by Giants*
3.Shel (crisischild) Female Half-Orc 1st Shaman *Artifact Hunter*
4.Imara Novoron (Eshan) Female Elf 1st Rogue *Artifact Hunter*
5.Rory Cornelius (Robert Henry) Male Halfling 1st Hunter *Trunau Native*
soooo
Imara works with the guard and practices at the Commons, sometimes she bartends for extra cash at the Killing Ground....She will reside at The Boarding House. No Family in town. Mom and Dad both Elven Rangers...perhaps theres a link there for Rydell's Father who was an Elven Ranger, maybe cousins? or friends?
Rory is a Tanner/hunter Im going to give him a shop. and he will live out of it. Friends with Agrit. No Family in town. Hes a Halfling.
Shel is a Half-Orc Shaman who guides merchants and caravans resides at Ramble House. maybe Rory and Rydell know her from meeting when outside the town. Also Shel and Rydell both live at Ramble House.
Ovril is a Varisian Fortune Teller with a sister. she lives in The Boarding House. Maybe has met Imara. Maybe his sister and Rydell's sister Amelia know each other and they ahve met because of that.
Rydell lives at Ramble House, he practices a lot at The Coommons and maybe has met Imara there, and the Elven ranger tie....
Providing Conections is my job ;)
Rory is a Tanner/hunter Im going to give him a shop. and he will live out of it. Friends with Agrit. No Family in town. Hes a Halfling
If we do that I will need to change his backstory. They got rid of the shop when his grandfather died, and moved to the hobbit hole his father owned out of town. He now works with the guard and as a scout/outrider for caravans. If it would be ok when he's in town He could stay at the barracks in the longhouse with the other unmarried warriors who are part of the guard.
He would know anyone who works with the guard. Happy to still know Agrit and he would also know Jagrin Grath, unless you want me to change the 'Oath ceremony' and his backstory.
No need. Both Rory and Rydell provide skins to Sara Morninghawk when they need leather. If you want to say he does a little work there we can. Otherwise we can just have him work for the guard and then theres a second link to Rydell and Imara.
No need. Both Rory and Rydell provide skins to Sara Morninghawk when they need leather. If you want to say he does a little work there we can. Otherwise we can just have him work for the guard and then theres a second link to Rydell and Imara.
cool, in the backstory I said his father earned money as a guard for caravans, going on raids and selling hides. I inferred Rory would do the same things, just didn't spell it out.
I assumed he would know Rydell because of the similarities and then anyone else with a direct connection to the watch. His big focus right now is proving himself to the guard and coming out from under his fathers shadow.
My current background has it that Ovril's sister left Trunau together with his parents while Ovril stayed because of a crush that did not pan out.
Of course, she might've stayed (or returned).
It's late here, so I'll be going to bed anytime soon, but I'll definitely come back to you tomorrow and give you something you can work with!
just fyi...Ive added the full force of npc's for this and some . just go to the character tab and peruse to get an idea. I think it will have more effect posting as the npc's ;)
I'll look over it and make small list on my thoughts. Won't be able too until a bit later today.
As for connections-
Rydell makes ends meet doing a few things-
1. He hunts, and while he is decent at tanning, found it was better off to sell the hides and let others do the real time consuming work. So he may sell hides every now and then to Rory.
2. He technically joined the militia, but has proven quite a problem due to his strong headed nature and his desire to do things his (his father's) way. You know how teens/young adults are hahaha.
3. He often helps whenever he needs something done. To help pay for it. Such as, if he needs patchwork done on his gear, he would offer to help Sara free of charge in exchange. He also provides a portion of any meat he gets to Cham.
@Robert, perhaps you could look to Rydell as a potential partner to open a new tanning shop? Rydell wouldn't think to do it, and may be against it at first. But it's something interesting that could come up. Perhaps we've been out hunting together. Though Rydell normally prefers solitude.
Imara and Rydells parents would likely at minimum know of each other. I doubt elven rangers are plentiful enough that those operating in generally close areas would be unknown. If you want, I've seen Rydells father (Teriel) as a bit of a rebellious sort. Likely having caused a bit of a.. problem is too strong a word. But something along those lines when he left the elven forest near last wall.
I could see Rydell having a distrust of Shel and her "savage magic". At least at first.
Rydells sister (Amelia) is ~13 at present time. For Ovril if he is interested in that.
And anyone that has been in Trunau for at least 6 years likely knows how Rydell lost his mother and father.
something to note- with only 780 townsfolks, its highly likely all of you know everyone.
@Robert, perhaps you could look to Rydell as a potential partner to open a new tanning shop? Rydell wouldn't think to do it, and may be against it at first. But it's something interesting that could come up. Perhaps we've been out hunting together. Though Rydell normally prefers solitude.
Yeah, sadly Rory isn't interested in opening a shop at all. He grew up on stories of warrior Hobbit's Halflings and wants to earn his place beside them.
So he's looking for adventure. His style is a little unorthodox since he hunts with a wolf and uses a staff sling to hunt with. But he could have hunted with Rydell on big game. Also he would work as a guard for Caravans, we could work as partners doing guard work.
After looking back over the ranger archetype, I've decided against trying to fidget with the drake companion stuff, as their drake never gets bigger than medium size. If I decide on something unorthodox I'll just use the monstrous mount feat(s) with your permission.
Also, to any interested, I did some digging and found a decent picture for Rydell- Here
Also, I'm considering using the "rich parents" trait, but only really using the money on a blade and a bow, and perhaps a couple potions to represent him having found his fathers blade and longbow while searching for him. If you are OK with that.
Also, sorry for the flurry of posts, but are we making use of background skills? Or do I need to throw a few skill points from levels into professions if I want them?
Yes to background skills and hero points.
All traits that are from paizo are usable.
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I am out of work and ready to get going! I'm going to post separately for mechanics and RP as it's easier for me if I split them up and focus on them separately.
My overall thoughts for her are that she is very creative with the use of items (both magical and non-magical) to make up for her lack of casting abilities. Beyond that, I want her to have strong social skills and be able to sneak in and infiltrate as a typical rogue would.
As far as mechanics go, I'm definitely thinking of Imara as melee. I'm considering doing a crit focused build, but I haven't looked into the details yet. Any long-term plans are somewhat flexible anyway as they are subject to change based on how the story plans out. I am not overly familiar with the archetypes, so I still need to look through them, but I'm likely to just go straight up rogue.
I haven't thought about background skills yet. I'll look into that tonight.
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just fyi...Ive added the full force of npc's for this and some . just go to the character tab and peruse to get an idea. I think it will have more effect posting as the npc's ;)
I love this idea!
I agree that any Trunaun natives probably know everyone in town. Imara grew up there and is now a young adult. I am thinking her mom died when she was pretty young and she was largely raised by her father (until he disappeared). The boarding house is perfect for her, I was thinking along those lines as well.
Rydell, maybe their fathers were friends and patrolled together? I wouldn't say cousins as I picture them arriving just before Imara was born and not being local to the area. I see Rydell lost his parents as well. How old is he? If they are around the same age, I'm thinking they might be close - they have a lot in common.
If Rory is friends with Agrit, she probably knows him that way as she also spent a lot of time with Agrit.
I'm sure she's at least seen Ovril around the boarding house from time to time. She may not know Shel.
I'm picturing Rydell around the 20-22 age range. Starting to better understand the world and figure out his beliefs, while still being able to cling on to some of that edgy angst. And yes, so it seems. After all, who leaves a loving perfect family home to go adventuring? haha.
I could picture Him getting close to someone else, someone "to actually talk to" And yeah, I hinted that Rydell's dad my be alive out there doing something (up to GM really) so maybe they left together? Elves can do that sort of thing. They go "well... guess this chapter of my life has ended.... welp, things to do!"
on a different note, you know, a lot of people complain about how bad using dex to hit, and strength for damage with melee, but then you get all these people talking about how amazing archery is... which normally used dex to hit, and strength to damage.
As you get characters finished. please complete your stat block for me. This will help us move through combats quickly and efficiently. The reason for the expendable abilities included here. I find that during combats in PBP its easy to forget whats been used. The list will include spells done as such 1st-2/2 always the after the slash will be the remaining. questions?
the reason I want the traits is it helps me know the character.
Character Combat Stat block
Rydell AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Ranger {Infilitrator} M Half-Elf Defenses: Immune Sleep Magic, +2 Enchantment ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Ovril AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Witch Class {Specialty} M Human Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Familiar {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Shel AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Shaman {Specialty} F Half Orc Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Imara AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Rogue -Unchained- {Specialty} F Elf Defenses: Immune to Sleep Magic +2 Enchantments ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Rory AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Hunter {Specialty} M Halfling Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Companion {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Character Traits (DM List)
Rydell- 1.*Trunau Native* 2.Rich Parents
Ovril- 1.*Orphaned by Giants* 2.
Shel-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.
Imara-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.
Rory-1.*Trunau Native*2.
Just so you know...what the traits mean in for the DM is how the world sees the character. Obviously as players you can play the character how you want...
Rydell choosing Trunau Native means the community views Rydell as one of them! By Taking Rich parents. The Community views him as 'he thinks hes entitled. He thinks hes special.
Rory is looked at as one with the community
Ovril- by choosing Orphaned by giants, the town feels some pity and sympathy for the character.
Shel/Imara by taking artifact hunter, the community sees you as treasure seekers. temporary members of the community
it helps me create well rounded views by the npcs for the characters.
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So mechanically there a couple options for Shel. The Unsworn archetype has a ridiculous amount of flexibility, but it loses the Spirit Magic class feature, so no channel energy for Shel if going that way. But it’s an option.
Probably go with the Restoration spirit at level one since it gets channel energy at level one and a pretty cool hex. It’s 1 + Cha mod /day, but otherwise scales the same as a cleric. The Lore spirit taken as a wandering spirit has a hex that gives shaman access to the wizard/sorcerer spell list, combined with the human FCB to learn cleric spells, Shel could access pretty much all of the best spells in the game. She could go into crafting feats if time allows. The only issue with the Lore spirit and crafting is that it requires a decent int so Shel would be looking at something like a 10, 10, 10, 14, 18, 14 stat spread, which I’m fine with but would leave her with almost no way to contribute in combat besides buff spells until she gets access to level two spells.
For skills, since some of the shaman class features are keyed off Cha she has a decent diplomacy and the usual good wisdom keyed skills. Nature, Arcane, Spellcraft, UMD.
What are yall’s thoughts?
I’ll get more into the story part tomorrow I hope. Kinda a disaster at work right now.
Ok, I've got everything done on Rory's crunch except for the second trait and his wolf. Still trying to decide if I will use a separate Icon for the wolf or not.
Crisischild, I don't know a lot about the Shaman class, picking up channel energy sounds like a good idea. Rory has very limited druid spells, he will focus on battle field control.
Good to hear we have someone with diplomacy. Rory's skills are very much like a rangers, so class knowledge will be nature.
GMM is the 'background skill' Lore (wars of Belkzen)or should it be Lore: (Hold of Belkzen).
How about lore Belkzen. Make it a catch all
If you want the wolf to have a personality. Give it it's own avatar. If you don't...don't
I want to stay away from build suggestions and let the party do that
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Having channel around for emergencies (someone is down) could be nice, outside of that, we have plenty of people that can use wands of CLW.
Outside of that, shaman is one of the few classes I have never liked enough to even make a build from (the others being skald and shifter) so I have really no idea what would be good.
Looking at our group, if our resident witch brings the Debuffs, having you provide some good buffs and utility would be pretty good. I wouldn't focus too heavily on channel energy either, as the only way I've seen it be a viable thing is on a cleric mixing the blossoming light/angelfire apostle archetypes. Mostly due to absurd uses per day and being able to use channels for powerful healing spells.
certain types of spells I think would do our group well, based on what we have and past experience. if you want any input (please, if you had a certain theme in mind, don't let me sway you away from it)
early on- some magic damage or a way to give the martial members magic damage would be good. Along with something like enlarge person to help control the battle field.
spells like haste and slow, to give our group extra attacks, or to keep our (fairly squishy) frontline from being on the receiving end of full round action attacks.
glitterdust is a favorite of mine personally.
we technically have more divine casting that arcane, however my casting won't really be worth much until about level 9 onwards. Speaking of, I may actually change my trait to magical knack from rich parents. I wouldn't be as strong starting off, but eh, I'd just focus more on melee.
Shamans are great flex casters. From buffs, to healing, to summons, they can pretty much always support the party in one way or another without having to rely on a high casting DC. Unlike the cleric, they're not god-bound and get one floating 'domain', so they can flex into a spirit for specific powers and or spells.
Oddly enough, they do not get a good fort save and aren't proficient with shields (?!), but they do get 4 skills a level and a familiar. The biggest downside to the shaman is the amount of rules that are attached to the class, but you only need to get over that hill o' reading once :P
Right now, I got Ovril down to a Witch (Cartomancer) with a 14/16/12/10/16/8 stat line with pb shot and precise shot. I'll need to dive into what spells the witch gets, so I can plot out his spell progression. And yes, the focus on throwing darts (and at 2+, cards) might change. The cards are mostly for buffing companions and turning touch attacks into ranged ones :) but the idea of throwing magical masterwork cards for 1D4+4 damage makes me feel warm and fuzzy.
And hrm, I hope the forum doesn't eat this post. The servers have been unstable and uncooperative for me all day.
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Just checking in to say I am still here. My husband is quarantined right now which effectively makes me a single mom and it is really limiting my free time! So, I will probably be posting less than normal for the next few days, at least.
I think I will be going with an archetype after all - scout rogue. It gives me some advantages to being a bit more mobile and replaces uncanny dodge and improved uncanny dodge. Trait will probably be ambush trained or anatomist.
I will try to get a more detailed post up tonight.
Oof, stay safe, Esha! And I hope he recovers soon.
Yes, Esha take care of things in RL, were not going anywhere..
This might be the oddest caster I've played in a while, but I think it looks good. At 2 he picks up Deadly Dealer and at 3 he can use ranged (touch) attacks to deliver touch spells. Feel free to give me feedback, recommendations & suggestions, or even daring changes.
NAME Ovril
CLASS Witch (Cartomancer)
RACE Human (Varisian)
Alignment Chaotic Neutral (with good tendencies)
STR 14 INT 16
DEX 16 WIS 10
CON 12 CHA 8
BAB +0
HP 8
F +1 R +3 W +2
Javelin +3 to hit, 1D6+2 damage, +1 to hit and damage within 30ft
Bladed Scarf +2 to hit, 1D6+3 damage
FEATS
H Point-Blank Shot
1 Precise Shot
SKILLS
1 Heal
2 Spellcraft
H Perception
I Knowledge Arcana
I Knowledge Nature
I Knowledge History
BG Craft Calligraphy
BG Profession Fortune-Teller
TRAITS
1 Orphaned By Giants
2 Varisian Tattoo (+1 on saves versus charms & compulsions, proficient with Bladed Scarves and Starknives)
SPELLS
Known
0 - ALL
1 - (6) Cure Light Wounds, Enlarge Person, Sleep, Mage Armor, Touch of Combustion, Frostbite
Prepared
0 - Light, Guidance, Daze
1 - Sleep, Enlarge Person
Per Day
0 - 3
1 - 1+1
SPECIAL
Patron: Strength: Divine Favor (2), Bull’s Strength (4), Greater Magic Weapon (6), Divine Power (8), Righteous Might (10), Bull’s Strength Mass (12)
Hex: Evil Eye:Standard action. The target takes a –2 penalty on one of the following (witch’s choice): AC, ability checks, attack rolls, saving throws, or skill checks. This hex lasts for a number of rounds equal to 3 + the witch’s Intelligence modifier. A Will save reduces this to just 1 round. This is a mind-affecting effect.
Gear (10) (37.5 lbs)
Harrow Deck (familiar, contains spells), Fortune-Teller’s Deck (common quality), Bladed Scarf, Scroll Case (Cure Light Wounds x2), Hopeknife (fate cuts both ways), Witch’s Kit (backpack, bedroll, belt pouch, candles x10, chalk x10, flint & steel, ink, inkpen, iron pot, mess kit, soap, torches x10, trail rations x5, waterskin, spellcomponent pouch), Javelin Bag (Javelin x5), Alchemist Fire x1, Alchemist Acid x1, Money Pouch (contains a total of 10 gold in various coinage)
edit: I used his 'scribe scroll' feat, as bestowed upon us by our generous DM, to scribe the two scrolls of CLW.
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Character Combat Stat block
Rydell AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Ranger {Infilitrator} M Half-Elf Defenses: Immune Sleep Magic, +2 Enchantment ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Ovril AC:13(FF:10/T:13) HP:8/8 Saves-FO:+1 RE:+3 WL:+2
1st Witch Class {Cartomancer} M Human Defenses: +1 vs Charms and Compulsions
limited abilities: Spells-1st:2/2
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Familiar {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Shel AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Shaman {Specialty} F Half Orc Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Imara AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Rogue -Unchained- {Specialty} F Elf Defenses: Immune to Sleep Magic +2 Enchantments ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Rory AC:20(FF:15/T:16) HP:11/11 Saves-FO:+5 RE:+7 WL:+4
1st Hunter {Packmaster} M Halfling Defenses: +2 vs Fear
limited abilities: Spells-1st:3/3 Animal Focus-1/1
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Companion {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Character Traits (DM List)
Rydell- 1.*Trunau Native* 2.Rich Parents
Ovril- 1.*Orphaned by Giants* 2.??
Shel-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.??
Imara-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.??
Rory-1.*Trunau Native*2.??
Ovril AC:13 (FF:10/T:13) HP:8/8 Saves-FO:+1 RE:+3 WL:+2
1st Witch Class {Cartomancer} M Human Defenses: (none)(CMD 15)
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
trait 2: 'Varisian Tattoo' (+1 to saves vs charms & compulsion effects, grants proficiency with Bladed Scarf and Starknife)
He has no limited abilities other than two first level spells. I'll try to work out his fluff tomorrow. Believe it or not, working out his crunch was harder than figuring out his backstory and personality.
I'm rather unfamiliar with the witch spell list and how it progresses, but I think Ovril will 'work' like this, even if his build is a little out of the ordinary :)
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Character Combat Stat block
Rydell AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Ranger {Infilitrator} M Half-Elf Defenses: Immune Sleep Magic, +2 Enchantment ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Ovril AC:13(FF:10/T:13) HP:8/8 Saves-FO:+1 RE:+3 WL:+2
1st Witch Class {Cartomancer} M Human Defenses: +1 vs Charms and Compulsions
limited abilities: Spells-1st:2/2
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Familiar {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Shel AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Shaman {Specialty} F Half Orc Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Spirit Animal {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Imara AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Rogue -Unchained- {Specialty} F Elf Defenses: Immune to Sleep Magic +2 Enchantments ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Rory AC:20(FF:15/T:16) HP:11/11 Saves-FO:+5 RE:+7 WL:+4
1st Hunter {Packmaster} M Halfling Defenses: +2 vs Fear
limited abilities: Spells-1st:3/3 Animal Focus-1/1
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Companion {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Character Traits (DM List)
Rydell- 1.*Trunau Native* 2.Rich Parents
Ovril- 1.*Orphaned by Giants* 2. Varisian Tattoo
Shel-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.??
Imara-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.??
Rory-1.*Trunau Native*2.??
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Character Combat Stat block
Rydell AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Ranger {Infilitrator} M Half-Elf Defenses: Immune Sleep Magic, +2 Enchantment ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Ovril AC:13(FF:10/T:13) HP:8/8 Saves-FO:+1 RE:+3 WL:+2
1st Witch Class {Cartomancer} M Human Defenses: +1 vs Charms and Compulsions
limited abilities: Spells-1st:2/2
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Familiar {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Shel AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Shaman {Specialty} F Half Orc Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Spirit Animal {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Imara AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
1st Rogue -Unchained- {Specialty} F Elf Defenses: Immune to Sleep Magic +2 Enchantments ?? ??
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Rory AC:20(FF:15/T:16) HP:11/11 Saves-FO:+5 RE:+7 WL:+4
1st Hunter {Packmaster} M Halfling Defenses: +2 vs Fear
limited abilities: Spells-1st:3/3 Animal Focus-1/1
Name AC:??(FF:??/T:??) HP:??/?? Saves-FO:?? RE:?? WL:??
Companion {Specialty} Sex Race Defenses: ?????????
limited abilities: Ability-??/?? Ability-??/?? Ability-??/??
Character Traits (DM List)
Rydell- 1.*Trunau Native* 2.Rich Parents
Ovril- 1.*Orphaned by Giants* 2. Varisian Tattoo
Shel-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.??
Imara-1.*Artifact Hunter*2.??
Rory-1.*Trunau Native*2.??
Here's a tentative build. I think I have enough system mastery to handle a shaman's complexity, though I must admit I generally don't play 9th level spellcasters so I'm open to advice.
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I would like y'alls input on my animal companion selection. I've got 3 ideas atm, due to the limited selection of ranger Animal companions.
st- Generic wolf companion, pick up boon companion at level 5, ride as mount after level 7. A good body guard as well in a pinch.
Pros- easy, effective, lowest feat investment, decent melee combatant.
cons- can' fly, cannot climb cliff faces (requires carry companion wand/spell in some places)
2nd- Take Sky stalker archetype for a hippogriff
pros- Gain companion at level 2, can eventually fly (huge boon for staying out of melee), decent combatant in a pinch
cons- not as strong melee as wolf, eats a style feat
3rd- Take boon companion AND monstrous mount as normal feats to get a griffon
pros- Strongest combatant of the three, flight.
Cons- slower flight than hippogriff, usually combat power wasted due to being a mount, requires 3 feats to use properly.
What are y'alls thoughts? I'm leaning a bit towards the 2nd option.
The other option is to take a level of druid to grab something like a Roc. But that would be it's own kettle of fish.
@ ROREK55, sorry I'm not going to be a lot of help here, I've only played an animal companion one other time and it was a bear. And I've never played a mount-dependent character before. So the wolf is going to my second attempt at one and first attempt at the other.
My advice, play what fits the character. Would a rich kid from Trunau have the animal in question? Is it an animal that is trained in the town, or available in the wilderness nearby? How does the animal fit in your backstory or how can you work it in you backstory?
For instance Sable Company Marine (Sky Stalker) is a very specific military unit in the city of Korvosa. How would a rich boy from Trunau learn those skills and acquire the animal. Maybe you work a retired "Marine" into the backstory?
On a side note, Rory will be flanking a lot with hit and run tactics, but he's not a 'frontline' fighter. As we're working on builds we need to decide if we're going to have a front-liner, who keeps enemies off of the squishy people, or not. If everyone has armor and can stand on their own, we may get away with everyone else focusing on ranged attack.