I could go over the logs, but it sure sounded to me like Fin knew some stuff that we hadn't told anyone outside the group, for fear of it getting back to the people behind Arthugh's research. Since they clearly know all about us, I don't think there's much left for us to do here. We should head back to Rydwyrna and hope that the arcane order doesn't try to have us murdered (or, since we're playing a game that involves combat, hope that they don't try hard enough to actually succeed) on the way there. Telling the senator what Fin has told us is about all we can do. Getting a look at Galador's ledger won't really tell us anything new, though STEALING it would probably give us proof of allegations that may or may not otherwise be hard to believe (See the eventual answer to Psalm's question to the DM about political backstabbing and whether it is common knowledge).
There's also the question of whether we want to rescue Grugiz. Again. We've already saved him once, and he somehow managed to beat us back to Galador's to get recaptured. I don't think we owe him anything, and my estimation of how dangerous the attempt would be keeps going up.
Unless, of course, the Goblin we saved previously was not Grugiz, or this one isn't.
Given that the GM's description was "looks identical", even if he turned out not to be the same goblin, I doubt there's any way we'd find that out without first rescuing him.
The Darkest of Heresy! But eh, life happens.
Ummm ... what happened to Lindaer now? He posted that he was back, but, nothing now since that back on 9/11, and no game post at all either?
He's been posting (not terribly frequently) in the other game we're in together since then. I already posted once there to remind him about this game (which is what lead to the above post), but since he hasn't posted anything else, I think we need to assume that he is dropping this one.
Since the mayor doesn't seem pro or anti shopkeep, what do we wanna do? Reveal everything or take the money and run?
Whichever the group chooses, Jun will go along with your decision.
Let's roll, and split the funds amongst us so we can garner what we need.
I agree with 'Hack'. Divvy up, shop.
Luna does think that the Mayor seems 'in a hurry' to send us on our merry way, but, doesn't seem like there's much we can do about it, unless we want to insist on hanging around annoying him enough ... NOT a good idea.
Where do we want to go?
Everybody, I wanted to pop in and apologize for not getting a map up, and to let you know that it might not be up until Thursday or Friday. I was off on Friday, and unfortunately came back to a LOT more work than I had anticipated. I will most likely be busy at work, with work, until late Thursday morning, or maybe even Friday. Sorry for the delay on that. Speaking of Boddynuck and Lindaer, since it does look like we're losing Lindaer as well. This current situation seems like a most opportune time to "lose" them, due to moral conflict with the current path. So, when I do post the map, I will also be narrating their hasty and unstoppable exit. :) See you all later this week, and I apologize again for me being the delay here.
No apologies needed...looking forward to the streamlined group.
Yes, no apologies needed as Hack said. RL, she can be a b@%*@! And it typically tends to get in the way of what we WANT to do!
Cause sure, I 'want' to go spend 8 hrs a day, 5 days a week, sitting at a desk that is just like a gazillion other desks and talk to customers (who tend to be IDIOTS!) and be bored out of my mind!
Well, then again, getting the paycheck last Friday was nice! (First paycheck in 3 months due to being out of work for those who didn't know.) Knowing I have the money to pay for my rent and also being able to afford to go grocery shopping and buy things I WANT besides things I need! I haven't been able to do that in about 3 months, so that is nice. Of course I bought way too much stuff I wanted rather than needed! Ice cream, candy, snacks, food I WANT, not just the cheapest thing available ... so, okay, maybe I do want to spend 8 hrs a day doing the other boring, stupid stuff ... just gotta keep it in perspective! :-D
Speaking of which, we should probably buy whatever we want to buy before we try to break Grugiz out. We may not be welcome in the shops after...
I have no money for what I need...breast plate.
So, we have 500gp to split 6 ways, leaving 83 and 1/3 gold for each of us, or (since a gold piece split into thirds, while still somewhat valuable, probably ceases to be legal tender) 83 each with a remainder of 2. Should our party's rogue contrive to pocket the remainder so that the rest divides evenly?
We can always just start a party fund as well.
Hack, if you sell your current armor, how much more do you need for a Breastplate?
Nikeisha is fine for items, and won't care much about two GP.
Breastplate is 400gp.
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Nikeisha is fine for items, and won't care much about two GP.
Quint needs a 45gp armor upgrade (minus whatever he can get for his current armor) and a 50gp set of tinker's tools. He should also buy some new clothes (mostly for flavor purposes) and some other little things, and he needs 10gp for the material components to cast FInd Familiar.
After playing pathfinder, it feels really weird to be scrounging for the cost of mundane items at level 3...
We can always just start a party fund as well.
Having a party fund might have allowed the group to hold on to the funds that characters took with them when they dropped out of the game. On the other hand, most of what we need are a few (relatively expensive, in 5e) items that only (directly) benefit one character. Would the group pay for something like Hack's breastplate or Quint's tinker's tools? The more people you have in the group, the harder it can be to agree how to spend the funds if you don't divvy them up.
Btw, in another PBP I'm running, the group got bogged down for months, ended up losing one player, and almost didn't recover at all when the group decided to keep all of their gold in a party fund, and it took them that long to come to a mutual agreement about what they wanted to buy on a trip to the local magic mart.
So, Mended, should we just narrate our own interactions with merchants other than Galador, or do you want to have some back-and-forth? Any names (of the shops and/or their proprietors) or other details about the shops that we should have in mind, or should we just build them as we go (those of us that are even interested in roleplaying our purchases, anyway)?
I am all for dividing up the loot immediately, then each player can apply it how they see fit. This way, Expensive items just take longer to acquire...sort of like real life. Lol
I say yes to any leftover gold going to a party fund. There will always be the wand of XXX that benefits the whole party. In regards to that idea that Quint mentioned of a party putting "all of their gold in a party fund"?!?! ABSOLUTELY NOT!!! I would probably be the player leaving if it came to that.
Making any purchases before the heist does sound like a very good idea though.
Any suggestions for a Monk? I have not played a monk since 3.5 and I am VERY definitely out of touch with items in 5E. I can't think of anything a Monk would need that could be afforded at this level, so far.
And don't get me wrong. I am a player that VERY MUCH believes in spending every single copper he can to improve his character.
In my tabletop game, we have a player that doesn't really bother to research and see what he can buy to improve. We are 20th lev and every now and then we get loot in the amounts of 100,000 GP EACH! For 5-6 players! Believe me, when your Sorcerer can get a Headband of Mental Superiority it can make a HUGE difference in the game!
I've been at tables that also lost players due to "how do we decide what to do with the treasure" discussions, which, really, I mean really really, is sad... It's a game. The imaginary wealth of an imaginary character should NEVER interfere with real human relationships. Since that is the case, I've actually found that it is the very rare and selfless group that can pool their money. So, if you were looking for my advice, I'd say, split it up evenly, maybe with the two left over going to the rogue because... shady characters. :P As to the VAST CHASM of difference between the way 5e handles character wealth and the way Pathfinder (which you can't blame Paizo for because they adopted the 3.5 rules) handles them... Yes, there is designed to be a vast difference.
Chapter 7, Treasure>Magic Items: Excerpt
Unless you decide your campaign works otherwise, most magic items are so rare that they aren't available for purchase. Common items, such as a potion of healing, can be procured from an alchemist, herbalist, or spellcaster. Doing so is rarely as simple as walking into a shop and selecting an item from a shelf. The seller might ask for a service, rather than coin. In a large city with an academy of magic or a major temple, buying and selling magic items might be possible, at your discretion. If your world includes a large number of adventurers engaged in retrieving ancient magic items, trade in these items might be more common. Even so, it's likely to remain similar to the market for fine art in the real world, with invitation-only auctions and a tendency to attract thieves. Selling magic items is difficult in most D&D worlds primarily because of the challenge of finding a buyer.
Plenty of people might like to have a magic sword, but few of them can afford it. Those who can afford such an item usually have more practical things to spend on. See chapter 6, "Between Adventures," for one way to handle selling magic items.
Chapter 6, Between Adventures>Downtime Activities: Excerpt
Few people can afford to buy a magic item, and fewer still know how to find one. Adventurers are exceptional in this regard due to the nature of their profession. A character who comes into possession of a common, uncommon, rare, or very rare magic item that he or she wants to sell can spend downtime searching for a buyer. This downtime activity can be performed only in a city or another location where one can find wealthy individuals interested in buying magic items. Legendary magic items and priceless artifacts can't be sold during downtime. Finding someone to buy such an item can be the substance of an adventure or quest.
So, it if takes a readjustment of thinking to come to grips with the distribution of wealth in 5e, then now is a good time to start that cognitive recalibration.
On narrating the purchasing and selling of mundane goods... I have zero problem with it. I would just remind everyone of the few "named" places that have been part of the story already. Galador's Goods, Vadela's Vestments (this is actually the weapon/armor smith that is directly adjacent to Galador's via the alley), Burga's Buthcery (provisions), Coastal Coster Trading Company (dock warehouse), Temple of Light (religious services), the Prancing Stag Inn and Tavern, and The Bloody Dagger. Please, by all means, feel free to invent a few other shops if you so desire, just do me a favor and either bold the names of any NPCs or places you create, so I can find them quickly and add them to my ever-growing database. :)
There is a VERY SLIM chance that I will have time this afternoon to create a map of Blueblossom Haven and the smaller "adventure site" map of the particular streets and alleys in question. More likely though, judging by the amount of work I have left to perform this week, it won't be until Friday afternoon.
Have fun!
Psalm will likely sell his leather and buy hide armor +5 - 10 if we are going by standard values. After which any of his split can go to a party fund.
As for how treasure is handled in general. I think in character and out of character are 2 separate things.
OOC we are adultish so we understand fairness not just of even distribution of gold but in distribution of overall help to the group. For this reason most groups (not all) adopt an item goes to the most useful character to have it. From there they split what is found in gold and jewels. I have been in groups that have party members take their treasure out of the group tally but 5e doesn't really have a hefty magic item trade.
IC we are people of differing motives and values. Even with the expectaion of the above remembering fairness out of character there is room for shennanigans and that those shennanigans would be limited and the reponse to them be flavorful and used to cause the right amount of fun playful tension in the group.
I tend to find the best way to deal with da lootz is to just split it up, and then people can pitch in if they want to help out others (which I am offering to do Hack, btw; it's why I asked about how much you needed).
If I could offer a suggestion, btw, I'd actually recommend just getting a shield and a longsword instead of a Breastplate, and going unarmored. your AC will be 16 wearing a breastplate, or 17 with just a shield (Barbarians can use a shield with their unarmored defense, unlike Monks).
It would be alot more cost effective, and would allow you to purchase a potion of healing, which I would recommend that each of the inflitration team seriously consider purchasing. It's 2d4+2 healing, which is not terrible. Eventually I think everyone who can't heal should pick one up.
To answer Luna's question, I'd recommend making sure that you have a ranged weapon - which it looks like you have. Picking up a silvered weapon isn't a bad idea if you have the coin for it (it costs 100 gp) cause it lets you bypass some DRs.
Vials of Acid are pretty good - they do 2d6 acid damage if thrown or splashed on something with a ranged attack.
On narrating the purchasing and selling of mundane goods... I have zero problem with it. I would just remind everyone of the few "named" places that have been part of the story already. Galador's Goods, Vadela's Vestments (this is actually the weapon/armor smith that is directly adjacent to Galador's via the alley), Burga's Buthcery (provisions), Coastal Coster Trading Company (dock warehouse), Temple of Light (religious services), the Prancing Stag Inn and Tavern, and The Bloody Dagger. Please, by all means, feel free to invent a few other shops if you so desire, just do me a favor and either bold the names of any NPCs or places you create, so I can find them quickly and add them to my ever-growing database. :)
You can add "Reginald's Raiments" to the list. Reginald is a surname, and the owner's daughter (who I imagine to be a little older than Quint, so maybe 18-19) is named Lira. They sell, alter, and repair all types of clothing (including shoes).
I guess Quint's next stop will be Vadela's Vestments. He's looking for new armor (I assume that's the right place to buy studded leather, not just metal armor?). I'm imagining he will, again, have trouble finding something made for someone his size, but this time he'll get involved in the alterations, and end up purchasing some of tools necessary for those types of alterations before he leaves (tinker's tools wouldn't allow you to CREATE armor, but they include the types of things you would need to make alterations and repairs).
Also, although the book lists a single price for the toolset, I figure a tinker's tools aren't something you would purchase in a neat box wrapped in string, but an odd assortment of tools you would acquire over time. So what I'm thinking is that I'll pay the price of it now and have the tools for mechanical purposes, but for RP purposes, (whle the stuff he gets from Vadela might make up the bulk of the toolset) he'll actually be spending a bit here and there for a while adding other tools to his collection (like getting Lira to sell him a few needles and some thread when he goes back to pick up his new clothes).
I'm also thinking that might be a place where he could get information about the chronometer. Not that an armorer would know how to make such a thing, but he (or is Vadela a "she"? First name or last name?) would be likely to know who could make something like that. Any other details for me to work with in roleplaying that scene? Do you want any back-and-forth when it comes to asking about the chronometer?
I've been at tables that also lost players due to "how do we decide what to do with the treasure" discussions, which, really, I mean really really, is sad... It's a game.
Btw, it wasn't that we lost a player because things got heated. On the contrary, the problem was that everybody seemed to be waiting for someone else to assert a course of action, and whenever someone posted a suggestion, nobody else seemed to care enough one way or the other to post their approval/disapproval, so posts got really scarce, and people started losing interest (this was also during the summer months when all of the games I'm in (this one included) took a dip in posting. It took me a while to get people posting again, and one player never came back (didn't even post to say he was dropping the game, just kept posting in others, but ignoring ours).
Thanks Jun, but no shield for Hack. He needs to swing the greataxe! That is just his build...what do we get each as the final split from the Mayor?
lots of stuff...
Quint, that's all golden, wonderful, stuff. Great roleplay elements, and a keen eye for the fine details. Love it, love it, love it. Vadela is female, and a half-orc to boot! :) She's not the only armorer in town, though, even though I haven't devised another location, I'm certain there would be more than one in Blueblossom, because it is a jumping off point for adventure in the northern and eastern parts of the Byrthelm. But, I'm figuring Quint is going to want to scope out Vadela's anyway, because of it's proximity to Galador's, right? Regardless. I trust your instincts as far as any back and forth, so if you want to post both parts of any conversations between Lira and Quint, and Vadela and Quint, I'm completely fine with that. One note on that end though. The Republic has enough small sized citizens that finding a suitable suit of leather-based armor would not be a problem. That doesn't mean, though, that Quint wouldn't want to still make a few adjustments to a suit to suit his needs. :)
To all! I finally have a few spare minutes this morning, and I'm planning on getting to work on maps and a decently lengthy narrative post to get rid of Boddynuck and Lindaer. Should be up before morning's end. :) Thank you all for your patience. :)
Question:
Can we keep Boddy around because of his proficiencies with handling vehicles? Its cool if not I guess Psalm will try driving the wagon if Boddy needs to leave.
I find myself having to ask... What wagon...? Cause, a wagon is 35gp, and one draft horse is 50gp... And there's nobody in Blueblossom Haven that's going to rent a horse and wagon. That's 85gp of your earnings to try and pull off a goblin rescue mission... Is everybody on board with that?
Edit: And the answer is no, Boddynuck and Lindaer will be gone, very shortly. :)
A wagon may not be necessary, considering Hack could easily carry a goblin.
A wagon may not be necessary, considering Hack could easily carry a goblin.
True, but while climbing down 3 stories? Doubtful.
And Mended? Who said anything about renting a horse and wagon? Surely such an 'intrepid' group could manage to 'borrow' (Yes, read that as steal) one?
And Jun, thanks for the suggestions! Thinking on them ...
I could throw it over my shoulder and climb down just fine, especially with the aid of a rope we could put in place once we get to the top. The DC with rope becomes very manageable, even with a goblin in tow.
What is the split on the reward for each party member remaining after incorporating the shares of the departed?
I could throw it over my shoulder and climb down just fine, especially with the aid of a rope we could put in place once we get to the top. The DC with rope becomes very manageable, even with a goblin in tow.
What is the split on the reward for each party member remaining after incorporating the shares of the departed?
My figure above of 83gp each was assuming that neither of them took a cut.
Great, thanks Quint!I will purchase a potion of healing for 50gp, and I will pocket the rest of my share.
lots of stuff...Quint, that's all golden, wonderful, stuff. Great roleplay elements, and a keen eye for the fine details. Love it, love it, love it. Vadela is female, and a half-orc to boot! :) She's not the only armorer in town, though, even though I haven't devised another location, I'm certain there would be more than one in Blueblossom, because it is a jumping off point for adventure in the northern and eastern parts of the Byrthelm. But, I'm figuring Quint is going to want to scope out Vadela's anyway, because of it's proximity to Galador's, right? Regardless. I trust your instincts as far as any back and forth, so if you want to post both parts of any conversations between Lira and Quint, and Vadela and Quint, I'm completely fine with that. One note on that end though. The Republic has enough small sized citizens that finding a suitable suit of leather-based armor would not be a problem. That doesn't mean, though, that Quint wouldn't want to still make a few adjustments to a suit to suit his needs. :)
To all! I finally have a few spare minutes this morning, and I'm planning on getting to work on maps and a decently lengthy narrative post to get rid of Boddynuck and Lindaer. Should be up before morning's end. :) Thank you all for your patience. :)
Any details he can learn about the chronometer that I should work into the next piece, or should I pause for some back-and-forth when I get to that point?
Any details he can learn about the chronometer that I should work into the next piece, or should I pause for some back-and-forth when I get to that point?
Hmmmm, good question. Let me see.
If you mention to Lira that you found the initials "A A" inscribed into the inner workings of the chronometer, she'll have a vague recollection that there is a fancy-schmansy artisan in Rydwyrna who might have those initials, though she can't really remember for sure. A gnome, she thinks, but, again, isn't sure. If it's the one she's thinking of, she's heard rumors that he's a complete recluse and that his items aren't even sold in shops, but are sold at high-end auctions, where you have to pay hundreds of gold pieces just to be allowed into the venue to bid.
I find myself having to ask... What wagon...? Cause, a wagon is 35gp, and one draft horse is 50gp... And there's nobody in Blueblossom Haven that's going to rent a horse and wagon. That's 85gp of your earnings to try and pull off a goblin rescue mission... Is everybody on board with that?
Edit: And the answer is no, Boddynuck and Lindaer will be gone, very shortly. :)
I totally get Boddy is gone. Just trying to squeeze what resources we had. As for what wagon that was part of the plan all along. I mean in game we have spent a few minutes chatting out a plan before getting some shopping done. But for a week we have had the fool hearty plan of renting a wagon and making the attempt.
It sounds like Jun said he was off trying to get the wagon is going to learn how hard it might be to get one. If it proves particularly problematic. We could go back out to the farm were we met some of the farm hands and they let us use a wagon as part of our fighting a worm. Perhaps they will let us borrow the wagon again with a horse or two?
If they idea of a fast getaway makes no sense then the plan would be obviously even more ridiculously ill-advised and not in keeping with smart characters.
If we can't get away fast, we'll need to hide instead and get out the next day.
Wait, are we trying to get Grugiz out to expose Galador, or just to sneak him away to safety?
I went off to see about either purchasing or renting a wagon a while back.
I don't think that rescuing Grugiz alone, would be enough to 'expose' Galador. I suspect some sort of hard evidence would be needed, and then again - what is it we are exposing about him? Doing his job of delivering goods to a customer in a rare/remote location? And/or 'kidnapping' a creature who is probably considered to have no rights under the law, and so there has been no law broken in doing the kidnapping/holding prisoner?
I have thought the idea of rescuing Grugiz is a foolhardy plan from the start, and have said so many times. I still think it is foolish, and especially so with no wagon full of something to break our fall. No wagon? Luna is staying on the ground IF the group still insists on going through with this plan.
The heist thing still sounds fun to me (and I've been secretly hoping that it would net us enough XP to trigger the old "ding"), but I agree that if we're just trying to save Grugiz from himself, it's not worth it, and he doesn't deserve it. I also think it will turn out to be a trap. Call me paranoid, but just because you're paranoid doesn't mean everyone's not out to get you.
Do we need to have an actual vote? So far, it's Luna and Quint against.
Is Hack the only one who is gung-ho for a rescue mission? Quint wouldn't want anyone trying to pull off a heist without him, but he's also not going to go along just because the barbarian wants to do it. We've all been going along with the idea of breaking in in broad daylight and trusting that Galador won't make a move against us publicly, but I still think that if we DO go for it, a covert plan would be better, especially if a horse and cart are as hard to come by as Mended says they are.
The heist thing still sounds fun to me (and I've been secretly hoping that it would net us enough XP to trigger the old "ding"), but I agree that if we're just trying to save Grugiz from himself, it's not worth it, and he doesn't deserve it. I also think it will turn out to be a trap. Call me paranoid, but just because you're paranoid doesn't mean everyone's not out to get you.
I agree with all of this section! It does sound potentially fun! But ... not worth it. And as far as the XP, I believe Mended is giving XP on 'overcoming' situations as well, without getting into combat, so I'm still hoping for that 'ding!' as well! He has 'hinted' at it!
I went off to see about either purchasing or renting a wagon a while back.
I either missed that, or completely blanked on it afterwards. Blueblossom Haven is big enough to have a horse trader, and a wainwright, so purchasing a horse or two, and a wagon is easily doable. Renting, though, is not something anyone in all of the Republic would do, as a business. The environment is too dangerous to rent a horse or wagon that you might never see again. That's different, though, than hiring a coach or cab to take you from place to place. That is a service offered in all towns of a certain population, and carriages from one city in the Republic to another are also available, albeit pre-booked, and with half payment in advance, but that's not what you're talking about. At this point I do believe a vote for or against attempting to rescue the goblin assumed to be Grugiz is in order.
So far we have 2 of 6 against. Two more "nay" votes would carry it to a no. Does leaving a helpless victim in captivity have some moral ramifications? Yes, but that is something that makes the world very real. Moral grey areas exist in many people's lives now and again. In a world that is this dangerous and corrupt, certainly moral conundrums will happen quite often. Perhaps leaving a goblin in captivity is something that will weigh on some party member's conscious and drive their motivations moving forward, perhaps not, perhaps the differences between those two ethical egos will make for some excellent intra-party role play discussion...? :D
I'll move things forward whenever you all decide. In the short term, Jun, you can easily notify the group that you found a place to purchase a wagon and another to purchase a horse or two, if that is really what everyone wants to do.
OH! Also, I was reminded by one of our intelligent party members that you can rotate images in Google Drawings... I'm an idiot. I have since rotated the map on the Battle Grid so that East is right and West is left, as it should be. :P That was a most stinky brain fart, that was... My apologies.
Psalm is not FOR rescuing Grugiz. Rather if we are foolish enough to try. The plan he suggested was his pro-posed safest option. Which sounds like its not possible at least as originally intended.
He doesn't think that the Mayor wants Galador exposed. If he is reading the mayor and Fin correctly. The mayor referred to Fin as a good man who wants to do good by the people wants this to go away because he doesn't want the Arcane Order and their rivals tearing crap up in his city or he doesn't want to loose political support if the Order is upset.
Now on the flip side. Galador has caught this goblin twice. So there must be a reason and it is possible that even if the Mayor doesn't want to push the issue that Galdor doesn't want to risk exposure. In other words while the crime is hidden Galador gets what he wants and the Order's issues aren't exposed and John Q Public is unaware. If crap hits the fan and a few town guard or the people learn things the Mayor couldn't keep it quiet and who knows what would happen. But Psalm is hoping that possible public exposure would slow Galador's forces down.
If we can't rent a wagon. It stands to reason our farm hand friends who helped us before wouldn't let us borrow one and if I remember correctly they are not terribly close.
We could try to break in steal the goblin and then try to just get away that just sounds harder without a vehicle. The point of the wagon was:
1- Jump from the window safely thus negating the slow careful climb.
2- Get away fast enough that by the time people check the room where Grugiz was they at most see a relatively normal street below. While Grugiz is safely burried in hay.
If we can't afford to outright buy a wagon. It sounds like we would have known from the start (at least those from the Republic) that renting a wagon would be impossible.
If Jun wants to attempt to steal one on his own. That is really up to him.