Welcome to the discussion thread for group 1! Now is the time for you to get your aliases taken care of, while I get the first gameplay post ready to go.
I'd also like to get an idea of everyone's time zones, so I know roughly when to expect posts from you guys. It helps me maintain realistic expectations on pacing.
Thank you for selecting me, GM Phntm888. I’m looking forward to perpetrating dastardly deeds with all of you.
I’m on the east coast. I’m sometimes able to post at random times, but generally post between 12:30am and 1:30am.
One question I have is about villain points. You mentioned they would work like Hero Points. Can we assume whatever you can do with hero points can be done with Villain Points?
I’m going to try to read through everyone’s backstories while we wait for the opening gameplay post.
Yay! Really appreciate the selection, GM, looking forward to this.
I'll get the alias finalized asap.
My time zone is UK (GMT).
Think this is going to be fun! :-)
EST time zone GM. Outside of board issues i post all the time :-)
Looking forward to being in one of your games once mor!
Will have the alias reorganized by tomorrow.
Thanks for the invite. I'm operating on GMT like Rigel. I'll be busy much of the weekend but will still be able to post a few times before Monday.
*high pitched squealing noise of unholy joy*
... sorry. Never been picked first before, not here, anyhow.
I'm East Coast US, so EST, though my posting times tend to be late - midnight and afterwards.
I do have the outlines for an alternate background for Hel, if you're interested ...
Let me know if you'd like the change.
Hey Hel, I noticed in the future thoughts section of your profile that you were concerned about ammo. You might consider (eventually) looking into Durable Arrows. It's an extra gold per arrow, but they'll last forever, assuming they don't get lost. Might save you some gold in the long run. They're especially nice if you make adamantine arrows durable.
Oh, I wasn't really worried about not being able to recover them after a fight; hopefully I won't have to learn alchemy in order to create those, but I will if I have to, and just start making one a day.
I'm thinking (for the distant future) about dealing with running out during a fight. By, say, 6th level, Hel is emptying a 20-arrow quiver in six rounds, with two arrows left over; at 11th, she empties it completely in four, and a standard 60-arrow efficient quiver in twelve - and I expect we'll have long battles at some point. Even with being able to resupply at an ammo wagon, that could become ... annoying for her. Having the ability to fill the air with arrows is great, but you need to be able to have lots of arrows with which to fill it. So an efficient quiver filled with special arrows and an endless ammunition bow to take care of the mundanes ... ;)
In other thoughts, I was throwing everyone into Hero Lab, because it's what I enjoy doing when I'm part of a new group, and since we have no gear, this was particularly easy. HL prodded me into noticing a few things on a few people ...
Something I only just recently noticed was the Skill Unlocks. I presume that as per standard those are 'feat unlocked' for anyone but a rogue?
Also - changed 'Iraen' to 'Old Talirean'; the dead language seemed to be more appropriate for her (real) scholastic parents.
If you can find someone willing to make the arrows durable for you, you wouldn't need to be able to make them. Alternately, you could always force someone to make them for you.
If GM Phntm888 decides I need to switch a trait out, I can certainly do that. Both seemed thematically appropriate for my character, though, so I would prefer to keep them as is, if possible.
@Hel Blackfist - you're right, but since we don't start with anything (including familiars) I didn't see a point in statting it up.
I have to admit not having looked into the familiar archetypes, and I'd actually forgotten about them (it's been a long time since I played a familiar-having character). Thanks for the reminder. I like the Emissary archetype a lot, it fits with Rigel's personality; but Rigel's going to be undead at some point so the Emissary's extra protection against mind-affecting effects is less attractive.
Also, the Sage could be useful as we don't have a lot of knowledge skills.
OK, so we have:
Antipaladin (Tyrant)
Cleric
Fighter
Monk (zen archer)
Unchained Rogue (scout/thug)
Wizard (exploiter)
A good mix! Should be fun.
Wesh (I keep wanting to type 'Welsh'!!), you're absolutely right on the crafting stuff - but if there's ever long periods of camp downtime, I don't see why a 'good arrow a day' mightn't be possible. ;) But yeah, both of those traits definitely seemed appropriate for him; had been eyeing 'Bloody-Minded' myself.
Hel's familiar (at 3rd level, via wizard VMC) is going to be a Sage archetype at the very least; I'm hoping to get Emissary-Sage, and drop the at-will Guidance which replaces Alertness, because Sage replaces it as well; this would be because Emissary replaces some of the things I have NO use for, not otherwise being a spellcaster.
You 'get' the viper immediately, and while I can see it not being immediately handy, e.g. with us in the cell, considering its nature I'd think it might be around somewhere ... ;)
And definitely a good mix!! And almost all human or human-appearing, so we'll be able to infiltrate all those rat fsking bastards and ... *coughs*
... no, I am NOT sorry.
Hm, I forgot you get a familiar as well thanks to the VMC! If you're going Sage then I don't need to :-)
I'm pretty sure (90%+) that we start with nothing, including familiars - DM gets the final ruling on this, of course, and if I do get to start with it then I'll stat it up.
I'm thinking that Protector might be a useful archetype - Rigel has low Con, and it gets worse before it gets better.
Here I am.
I seem to have one feat more than I should because unchained rogue gets weapon finesse for free and since that is no longer a feat thanks to the feat tax rules we are using the GM gave me weapon focus instead.
My timezone is AEST or GMT +10. Australian east coast.
Wesh (I keep wanting to type 'Welsh'!!), you're absolutely right on the crafting stuff - but if there's ever long periods of camp downtime, I don't see why a 'good arrow a day' mightn't be possible. ;) But yeah, both of those traits definitely seemed appropriate for him; had been eyeing 'Bloody-Minded' myself.
Lol. Please don't. Though I've changed everything except his name, race, and gender, I had someone in the last game he was in repeatedly write his name as Welsh. It nearly drove me crazy. I trust Hel will be more sensitive to such things. ; )
@Rigel: Hopefully the GM will be generous and let you have your familiar back if/when we escape. I don't know anything about the AP, though, so I suppose that could be a while. Maybe he'll slither in a window of the jail cell or something.
The group's composition does look quite good. Having read everyone's backstories, I think we should have some interesting connections once we get to know each other.
Along those same lines, Wesh is happy to kill any Mitran priests you think need killing.
I seem to have one feat more than I should because unchained rogue gets weapon finesse for free and since that is no longer a feat thanks to the feat tax rules we are using the GM gave me weapon focus instead.
Cool, I'll throw in the bonus. (I call it 'feat tax refund', 'cause all the feats are the tax, and we get them for free. ;) )
Wesh (I keep wanting to type 'Welsh'!!)...Lol. Please don't. Though I've changed everything except his name, race, and gender, I had someone in the last game he was in repeatedly write his name as Welsh. It nearly drove me crazy. I trust Hel will be more sensitive to such things. ; )
Oh, absolutely - one of the (few) things I pride myself on is writing well, and getting things like names correct is a part of that. As long as I'm thinking and not reacting, 'Wesh' will come out from my fingertips just fine. ;)
Rigel and I discussed her familiar in the recruitment - it’s coming, but not right away.
Also, who thought you guys had windows in your cell? Talingarde doesn’t care enough about the well-being of Forsaken to give them windows.
I feel like when I looked at Wesh’s Traits, one showed up as not combat. Oh, well. I am going to ask you to choose one of the two. You could replace the other with Indomitable Faith - I think that would fit Wesh very well
Hel, if you prefer the noble backstory, go ahead. I’m okay with either.
Anyway, some quick bookkeeping things:
1. Animate dead - This is a great campaign for it, and there are times it will be super useful! However, there are also times it will be inconvenient to have around, and could make things more difficult for you. Also, all the actions of the horde would take a long time. Please keep that in mind.
2. Summoned creatures - Try not to summon too many at once, as it can slow things down, but are otherwise great.
3. Leadership - Totally allowed! In fact, there are several NPCs who will make excellent cohorts - and a special subsystem that allows followers to be more relevant!
Also, who thought you guys had windows in your cell? Talingarde doesn’t care enough about the well-being of Forsaken to give them windows.
My bad. I suppose we wouldn't get any of the comforts of... anything.
I feel like when I looked at Wesh’s Traits, one showed up as not combat. Oh, well. I am going to ask you to choose one of the two. You could replace the other with Indomitable Faith - I think that would fit Wesh very well.
Alright, no worries. I took your advice and swapped out Armor Expert for Indomitable Faith. Wesh will need all the help he can get on will saves anyway.
3. Leadership - Totally allowed! In fact, there are several NPCs who will make excellent cohorts - and a special subsystem that allows followers to be more relevant!
This should be fun once we get to the level we can take it. Look forward to seeing all the villains, er, misunderstood people we get to work with.
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To clarify, will Villain Points work exactly the same as Hero Points or will there be some variation?
Oh, yes. Missed that one. Yes, Villain Points will work exactly as Hero Points, and do all the things Hero Points do.
Cool beans. We can do retraining of skills and abilities (much) later on, yes/no? Also ... while the Sage is a definite for Hel's familiar when she gets it at L3 (btw - compsognathus or greensting scorpion, or are you going to make me wait? ;) ), I was wondering / hoping to blend Emissary with it as well.
... oh wow. I just realized that they don't overlap. Cool!!
OK, stat line up. I'll leave the Profile as is unless you have an objection to the layout DM.
Oh, yes. Missed that one. Yes, Villain Points will work exactly as Hero Points, and do all the things Hero Points do.
Alright. I've never used Hero/Villain Points before. Should be interesting.
They don't regenerate, so spend them wisely.
Yep. I was looking over the Hero Points section of the PRD. There are some neat things you can do with them. We'll have to see how generous our GM is with handing them out.
In other thoughts, I was throwing everyone into Hero Lab, because it's what I enjoy doing when I'm part of a new group, and since we have no gear, this was particularly easy. HL prodded me into noticing a few things on a few people ...
Sir Gallen Baran, purportedly of the House of Darius, receives a language from his 12 Int and still has 2 adventuring skill points left to spend.
He's got 4 Adventuring Skills and two background skills so I don't see where he'd be getting more from though you are right on the languages.
2 Class + 1 Int + 1 Racial + 2 GM = 6/lvl, + 2/lvl background skills. I saw Focused Study, which replaces the bonus feat, but nothing replaces the bonus from Int, you haven't replaced the one from Racial, and the GM has given us two extra, so ... :)
You have two more skills.
I get 15 skills and it still doesn't feel like enough sometimes haha
Found myself watching 'The Terminal' tonight, and I realized that the bad guy of the movie, Stanley Tucci as Frank Dixon, was Lawful Evil. Very focused on the rules, claims he's paying attention to people's stories, but he's pretty much just focused on things working the way he wants them to work, and doing the things he wants them to do.
A very good model for all of us, I think. :D
Do not mind me. Just dotting so I can follow it by lurking about. After all, just because I did not make the cut does not mean I am not interested in seeing how this goes. It does include some of my favorite players after all (the GM ain't too shabby either). ;-)
@Hel - think that's a film that passed me by, but good to know it has inspired your character. So, is this where we start thinking about party role?
Rigel is LE, but affable with it. She has a folksy charm and will be an excellent party face (her Diplomacy and Bluff are through the roof, and they scale up with her level), particularly against anyone who's attracted to her. She's not a melee tank, but once she goes full vamp she'll be formidable in combat. Right now she's a bit fragile (low Con). She's also a full caster so will be able to contribute however needed.
Unusually for a cleric, she's got excellent perception, although no trapfinding or disable device, so she won't be treading on anyone's toes (unless that's your thing, honey, in which case I'm not here to judge ^_^).
She doesn't have Intimidate, so if someone else wants to fill that niche, go ahead!
Wesh can help out with Intimidate. He's not the best at it for now, but I plan for him to take intimidating prowess eventually, so he should get to be quite good at it.
He'll also be good with climbing and swimming. Later on, he can help with crafting weapons should the need arise.
He tends to be more into smashing things really, really hard. In addition to being a heavy hitter, I also see him taking on the role of the primary tank for the party. With his 18 constitution and Barbarian VMC, he should be quite beefy before too long. Assuming we can find some armor relatively soon, he won't be too easy to hit either. He'll eventually have DR 14/- so he'll be able to take quite a few blows for the team.
He's not nearly as charming as Rigel and tends to be a bit anti-social. That said, I like to think that's mainly due to him not having many things in common with most of the people he's had to interact with. Now that he'll have some like-minded folks, he should open up a bit.
Anyone going in the Vampire direction? I plan on becoming a Lich as the character evolves.
Rigel and Demlin both have the Bitten feat, so they will both become vampires. I had several options in that regard :).
Gameplay post coming tomorrow. Had a very busy day, but productive.
I'm gonna be a vampire. What were the different options?
There were five character applications who had been Bitten - Raevenis Dwin'Alir, Demlin, Aeron Carden, Cole Hale, and Rigel. I find it interesting that the other group has three oddballs (changeling, ratfolk, tiefling) where the 'strangest' thing we've got is a half-elf. (Well, and me ... but I'm practically human!! ;) )
Hel is the ranged assassin sort. Like most Monks, she'll be a Perception and Sense Motive fiend, and with Enforcer she'll be intimidating a lot right out of the gate - free roll with a nonlethal strike - and with 10+ points a level, I'll be picking up a lot of skills, at least at a point or two - disable device, heal, UMD, pretty much anything that isn't Charisma-based. As she gets her familiar, it'll be a KS-focused thing.
For the most part, though, she's a ranged striker - ki to kick the bow damage up to her HTH damage, good mobility that goes to really good at 8th level, with the ability to renew her ki by slaughtering mooks when she hits 10th. I'm going with the Damnation feats too, which will let her conceal her alignment. The only thing I'll need to figure out how to handle are incorporeal sorts; if/when I get a ki focus bow, I'll be able to work against a lot of things with DR that we'll run into.
That said, she's not generally going to want to take the credit; while I wouldn't call her a lackey, and while I intend for her to have a certain amount of tactical acumen, the only sort of leader she'd ever be would be a combat leader. When it comes to social situations, while she might have suggestions, I have NO problem backing up whatever play our social mavins come up with.
Good to know we have some ranged firepower! It's not a strong point of the Cleric class... Although I can summon monsters at a reasonable distance.
Feat choice is going to be tricky, I can tell already. There's almost half a dozen feats in the vampire chain, and I wouldn't mind grabbing Leadership, and possibly Sacred Summons as well. Oh well. In the immortal words of Mikkael Jeggare, the philosopher-bard, "you can't always get what you want."
Concealing her alignment is another problem: Rigel starts the game with an aura and when she goes undead things just get worse.
Gallen is pretty tanky and leans towards melee but if someone in the group clearly has a more effective ability to handle a problem he will let them do their thing. He's patient and willing to work as a member of a team.
@GM Phntm888 Something occurred to me. Do our VMC levels count as levels of the secondary class to some degree? Mainly I am thinking of the http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/r-z/sash- of-the-war-champion/ being useful. Weird question I know but it also worth considering with regard to advanced armor/weapon training feats. Advanced weapon training requires you to have advanced weapon training class feature (which he will have at level 11) and be a fifth level fighter which you might argue he is the equivelant of at that stage... I will work with whatever way you go with it but wanted to check, the idea of him getting armed bravery would be just delightful against will saves. But as an Antipaladin I have enough ideas for feats regardless.
Gameplay is up! You will have Edit capabilities for the map, but at this time I'm going to ask you not to move your tokens - you guys are chained to the wall, after all.
Most of the entries were human - the other group just had a couple other potential RP opportunities I couldn't pass up with the oddballs (2 of those oddballs have a Witch VMC - plus there's an actual witch...)
As for alignment concealment - well, I'm sure you'll think of something >:).
@Sir Gallen: I will look into that, and come to a decision. It is definitely a worthwhile question to consider.
Based on our Backgrounds, I assumed Amalrus would have at least heard of Rigel and her (now deceased) friends.
That works for me - we are the nation's most notorious villains, after all ^_^
I am going to hold back rather than having every second response be Gallen.
I think I'm going to go with the noblewoman background - gotta revamp what's on the sheet - but I have a question. Is there a good upper-level Inquisitor in the campaign for me to have shot? Someone besides Sir Balin of Karfeld, by preference.
Check your PMs.
Thanks. I had another question, but my brain is not working at top efficiency at the moment, so I really can't think of what it might've been.
Edit: Oh, that was it. Request permission to have my ankles bar-manacled together, as well as cuffed to the chain? I'm thinking she kicked someone fairly seriously when she got branded.
So I did it anyhow. Also, background has been updated - Baroness Janleyn, at your service. Not a good party girl, 'alas', and in Daveryn, so it's unlikely that she and Rigel moved in the same social circles.
Sure, the bar manacle is fine. One more lock to escape :).
@Hel: not that it matters, but for the record only Rigel is the bumpkin; Lu and Jo were sophisticated, urban Matharynites :-)
Anyway, time to see what our DM has in store!
OK, at this dramatic juncture I have to sign off for the night. I look forward to seeing what plots you have conjured up once I log in tomorrow!
I have refigured what feats I will take. It slipped my mind when thinking of feats that 5 of them would be for vampire. Oops.
Does anyone have a good idea of good rogue talents? The list is sooooo long. I haven't properly played a rogue before.
Fast Stealth is generally useful, as is Combat Trick. When I play a rogue, I usually focus on talents that don't have limited uses, with the exception of minor magic and major magic, since you can get sneak attack if you choose the right spells for those. The talents that modify your sneak attack can be useful, especially bleeding attack.
OK, some of this is just going to be easier planned OOC.
Looking at the map, we have to get through our shackles, the door to our cell, and then another door (plus the door to whatever is in the cell that Rigel heard) before we can get to the guards - which gives them a lot of time to spot us and raise the alarm.
Actually, DM, I just want to check something - looks like the 'wall' to our cell is barred and therefore see-through; what about the wall with the guards on the other side? Is that bars or solid? If it's bars, the guards are almost bound to see us coming.
@Demlin: if you're going for a combat-based rogue, Combat Trick is good as it gives you another feat. Weapon Training can be handy too, as it makes up for your 3/4 BAB. Out of combat, Fast Stealth is nice.