GM Granta's AP Planning

Game Master Granta

As this is non PFS, has our all powerful GM thought about background points for helping low skill characters?

I've found them helpful in APs before.

Everyone will definitely get a rank for profession or craft, and I may allow a second background skill as will.

GM Granta, with only two more days until release (and hopefully the player's guide), do you want to lay out your character building rules, house rules, optional systems you'll be using, etc?

I actually want to wait until I've had a chance to look at the materials before finalizing those things, just in case something doesn't fit well. Or I might get new ideas, too.

Book one just arrived in the mail, and I will hopefully have the first read through completed in a week or so.

Regarding the player's guide: link.

The Crimson Nuthatch is built best (especially without archetypes) as a bard or rogue. The total number of skills required to represent a cat burglar's skill set requires a class with plenty of base ranks. One of his other character tricks requires arcane mark, which would require the rogue talent, Minor Magic.

Bluff is required to fast talk his way out of situations when he's caught. Diplomacy is desirable, but necessarily not a major focus.

Skills requiring maximum ranks:

Bluff
Disable Device
Perception
Stealth

Other skills required:

Acrobatics
Climb
Diplomacy
Disguise
Escape Artist
Knowledge (Local)
Knowledge (Nobility)
Sense Motive
Sleight of Hand

Other skills desired:

Appraise
Knowledge (Engineering)
Perform
Swim

Thanks for the link Granta, looks like tomorrow is hopefully the day!

In my unsolicited opinion, The Cromson Nuthatch (is there a story behind the name?) sounds like a rogue with charisma.

Any rogue can have charisma. The nuthatch has flair.

It was a play on the Scarlet Pimpernel.

I didn't know that Nuthatch was a type of bird until I looked it up. Now I understand the relationship to Scarlet Pimpernel.

Here is the first draft of the GM Feedback Form. Please complete it, based upon your previous play with me. If you have any feedback on the form itself, please offer that here, i.e. how well does it explain what each question is about.

And please, do not be afraid to give bad ratings. If something needs improvement, then I need an honest answer in order to get better. Though if you do give me a bunch of very poor ratings, I will be curious why you are still willing to play in my games :-p

Responses can be viewed Here. My basic plan is to add your responses together, such that each question gets a score between 5-25. I will start with the aspect of my GMing that gets the lowest score, and work on improving each aspect one at a time.

Character building questions:
Are rangers a purposeful omission?
May we opt for average HP on level up?
Is there a general rule to use that will help in determining what is a hardcover book when using online sources?
Are archetypes from Ultimate Intrigue ok?
Would you be able to post what the two skills for each profession are?

More AP specific (not sure how much of this you can answer):
Are there any options you strongly suggest we don't pursue (for example, paladins in skull and shackles)?

I'm thinking gnomish paladin (eventually becoming an Oradin). That should give a reason to bump cha which I'm guessing will be handy in this, and a reasonable front liner. Not so good on stealth though.

Second choice, depending on whether we have a lot of others hitting the front line / healer niche would be a sorcerer (still cha) possibly an enchanter. I could even swing to a wizard (maybe focus on item creation).

It sounds like the stealth option is already well represented.

I was initially thinking that a vigilante type character might work well in this AP, but noticed intrigue was off limits.

Are rangers a purposeful omission? Yes, and druids. They were replaced with bloodragers and oracles, respectively. Bonus points to whoever figures out the reasoning behind the list.

May we opt for average HP on level up? No, but we will be using the retraining rules, which includes an option for increasing hit points.

Is there a general rule to use that will help in determining what is a hardcover book when using online sources? The product listing usually says, but the price and page count should be good indicators, too.

Are archetypes from Ultimate Intrigue ok? Ultimate Intrigue and Campaign are still under review. I need to do some more reading/research first, but they will be included in some fashion. That was actually in the first draft of the character creation post, and looks like I accidentally deleted it. Good catch.

Would you be able to post what the two skills for each profession are? I will have to create the list, so remind me in a few days if I forget.

Are there any options you strongly suggest we don't pursue (for example, paladins in skull and shackles)? I don't feel confident answering that question without having read most/all of the six books.

Do we have a player's guide to know what the campaign traits are yet?

For HP per level, do we throw out rolled 1s?

Can we take the Rich Parents trait?

If we can afford it, can we start with magic items?

I was initially thinking that a vigilante type character might work well in this AP, but noticed intrigue was off limits.

We will probably be using content from the book, but at first glance the vigilante actually does not look like a good fit for this adventure. I can't quite pin it down, but my gut feeling is that it's too late now for vigilantes. Vigilantism feels like something that happens while the pressure is building in a society, but this AP occurs after the pressure has exploded.

Do we have a player's guide to know what the campaign traits are yet? Nope, and no estimated arrival date either. Yay, Paizo!

For HP per level, do we throw out rolled 1s? Only if you have a Constitution of 12 or higher. Hit points are going to be scarce in this campaign, at least until they are retrained.

Can we take the Rich Parents trait? Yes, but any time that you are going to intentionally de-optimize your character like that, I hope it is an important part of the character's background and/or personality.

If we can afford it, can we start with magic items? Yes, and you can even craft mundane or magical items during character creation if you meet the requirements.

Softcover permissions:
Armor masters handbook
Weapon masters handbook

Both specifically for the advanced armor/weapon training options/feats for a fighter

Softcover books and Occult Adventures are a hard no. I might make an exception for Taldor specific softcover books, but even that is unlikely.

Are rangers a purposeful omission? Yes, and druids. They were replaced with bloodragers and oracles, respectively. Bonus points to whoever figures out the reasoning behind the list.

"Oooo, oohh, pick me... Is it because we are in an urban setting? Is it? ooohh.."

Although the Dandy is kinda nice, and there are urban druids

I have thoughts for a bloodrager or an inquisitor, but, again, I'd be willing to play anything besides the dedicated face.

You could include the Taldor soft cover... there are NO character options in it!

Granta wrote:

Are rangers a purposeful omission? Yes, and druids. They were replaced with bloodragers and oracles, respectively. Bonus points to whoever figures out the reasoning behind the list.

"Oooo, oohh, pick me... Is it because we are in an urban setting? Is it? ooohh.."

That is part of it, but far from the whole reason.

For funsies, I whipped up a light outline for an Inquisitor of Abadar. Nothing set in stone, just figured I'd throw my build ideas into the thread so they are all in one place. With 3/4 BAB, the need for a buff, and a d8 HD would probably put him as a secondary frontliner. I'm pretty sure with the exception of a trait (from Ultimate Campaign that I think because of the source needs permission), it is all from the CRB, Ultimate Magic/Combat, and the APG.

I'll eventually make a more dedicated frontliner and post it here too.

Oh, and that reminds me--who is looking at what roles?

• Full Progression Arcane Caster
  
• Full Progression Divine Caster
  
• Full BAB Frontliner
  
• Skill Monkey

Also, traits from Ultimate Campaign are legal. I totally forgot to include that. Adding to Gameplay now . . .

I'm looking at Skill Monkey.

I was looking at (almost) full progression front liner in terms of the Oradin. He'll drop one BAB with four oracle levels, but after that should be able to keep everyones hp nice and high.

I was looking at (almost) full progression front liner in terms of the Oradin. He'll drop one BAB with four oracle levels, but after that should be able to keep everyones hp nice and high.

I would prefer to see a character like that in the fifth role, rather than as the full BAB frontliner. IMO, martial classes with non-martial levels are the hardest multi-classing to make work. And if the primary frontliner falls, others are likely to come down, too.

I can take the full BAB frontline role and scratch the inquisitor! It'll likely be a fighter or a bloodrager, but I'm leaning more to the bloodrager with most of the fighter goodies being in more recent/softcover books.

If someone else would prefer the full BAB frontliner role, I am willing to pursue either of the Arcane or Divine caster role.

I was looking into the Oracle. Is that a full progression divine caster?

Yes, oracle is a spontaneous, full progression divine caster.

If nobody else really wants to be a front liner, I could go with a standard paladin without the oracle levels. How many of us are there?

5 players

I can take the Arcane Caster role, as both Gummy Bear and Aerondor first preference seems to be something melee-ish.

One of my original thoughts was an arcane trickster, but that is not full progression. It was partly thought to balance the party by not having quite so much power as a full wizard.

I have some other concepts but I have to check the allowed rule set to see how they will fit. Also, the campaign traits might give more ideas.

If we have...

Blake's Tiger bringing the skills
Aerondor bringing the HP battery ;)
MindXing bringing the full divine
Melda bringing the full arcane

Then I'll whip up a bloodrager for the full BAB!

Sound good to everyone? Not that we can't switch with each other, just so we all have a starting point.

Sounds good to me. I'll start working up the Oracle. We need to wait for the player's guide to get the campaign traits, right?

A Bloodrager! Thinking rage and power attack will bring the damage well enough. Rest of the feats bring up my defenses or increase reliability. I'll probably pour a good amount of money into upping my saves after an initial investment in my weapon.

Thoughts? I know it is pretty basic, but welcome to the frontline, AMIRIGHT?!

@MindXing: Correct. Book one includes the names of the traits, but zero details about them.

@Gummy Bear: Mathematically, Improved Critical and keen are not very effective. IMO, Blind Fight is the most powerful feat in the entire game, IF you have someone to cast cloud spells, AND IF everyone in the party can function in a cloud.

@All: If you are interested in the Blind Fight strategy, MindXing should look into the waves mystery.

IMNSHO Improved crit is good if you are doing crit fishing with a high crit weapon and especially two weapon crit fishing. But then you need lots of feats to get all those juicy extra effects. Good for fighters but not much else.

I am amenable to a Blind Fighting strategy, if the team wants to go that way, and--a tentative consideration--if Granta will allow the feats that allow Sneak Attack against targets with concealment (or if not, it will definitely push me more towards Bard than Rogue).

@Blake: Link to the feats, please?

Still need one more person to fill out the feedback form, only four responses so far.

Shadow Strike, APG

Turns out it was one feat. I conflated it with a feat chain that applies to creatures with low-light vision and darkvision, granting them certain benefits when in concealment.

Shadow Strike looks good, go for it.

We are going to be using story feats from Ultimate Campaign, and each PC gets one for free at character creation.

Here's the results:

• Game Speed & Posting Consistency - 23/25
  
• Clarity - 23/25
  
• Challenging Encounters - 16/20
  
• Narration & Storytelling - 20/25
  
• PC Agency & Effectiveness - 21/25
  
• Rules Knowledge & Application - 24/25
  
• Conflict Resolution & Communication - 16/20

Percentage-wise, Challenging Encounters, Narration & Storytelling, and Conflict Resolution & Communication tied for the lowest score, but two of them had an N/A vote and comments about being difficult to rate due to the limitations of PFS scenarios. So . . . Narration & Storytelling is going to be the first thing I work on.

So, let's brainstorm. What can be/needs to be improved? Are there any GMs you think excel at narration and storytelling, that I could learn from?

While I think your narration is in my Top 5 PbP GMs, two GMs who have a knack for improvisational storytelling, even within the confines of OP Scenarios, are GM Hmm and GM Ladile.

Hmm, in particular, seeks out background information on her players' characters and makes a point to weave what she can into the scenario. One factor that assists her with this that I am aware of is that she keeps her game total relatively low.

@Gummy Bear: Mathematically, Improved Critical and keen are not very effective. IMO, Blind Fight is the most powerful feat in the entire game, IF you have someone to cast cloud spells, AND IF everyone in the party can function in a cloud.

I've heard the opposite on keen/improved critical. I'll be using a falchion and would be looking at a 15-20 crit range, double damage 30% of the time sounds pretty sweet to me. I've never run the numbers though and I think most of the conversations I've read on it are mostly anecdotal. I'll see if I can find someone who has run the numbers on the forums. Do you have suggestions for feats to replace it?

I have no problem with a Blind Fight team strategy! I took the feat as filler tbh, there have been times where miss chance just screws you over so I thought I'd take it since I had space and hitting things is my job.

On GMing: I think Hmm does a great job as well. I'm in a game with Ladile right now, so can report back afterwards :) One thing worth considering about GM Hmm though is that I get the impression that she has quite a bit of free time. Assuming this is true, it would help explain why she is able to be so awesome at PbP: she has the time to invest in intensive storytelling methods! I think she is absolutely worth looking at and there would be a lot to learn, but if you don't have ability to invest your time in the same way, I don't think it would be fair to yourself to strive for the exact same standards. Again, this is all assuming her time constraints are more lax than average. I could very well be wrong!

EDIT: I might have to dive into one of those DPR Olympics threads for if Improved Critical is worth it. All the other threads say it is awesome and everyone agrees, but nobody does any math to actually support their assertions... It's awesome, because it is! That's good logic, right? ;)

REDIT: This is what I found as far as doing the math:

The damage formula is h(d+s)+tchd

h = Chance to hit, expressed as a percentage
d = Damage per hit. Average damage is assumed.
s = Precision damage per hit (or other damage that isn't multiplied on a crit). Average damage is again assumed.
t = Chance to roll a critical threat, expressed as a percentage.
c = Critical hit bonus damage. x2 = 1, x3 = 2, x4 = 3.

I'll crunch some numbers when I get back from class.

You have found someone who has run the numbers. RealDave and I made a spreadsheet once when he was bragging about his crit-build. We tried out a wide range of variables, and under the parameters which were most favorable to his build, my way was still 0.1% better. Under a less extreme range of parameters, my way was 3-10% better.

That formula is only half of the equation. You then need to calculate the opportunity cost, i.e. what would your average damage be if you put the same amount of feats and resources into a greatsword. If you don't feel like doing a lot of math though, here is the short answer--would you rather develop an ability that can be used 30% of the time or 95% of the time?

As to a replacement? I don't see Weapon Focus on your list yet.