Yup. Not ideal, but would allow me to take the worship of his creator to the next level ;^) But I'm not dead-set on this, just open to take up the healer role if Shari doesn't want it.
The book Races of Eberron has a couple of pages on warforged and religion and talks about warforged clerics and paladins.
@Shari: the book Dragonmarked deals almost exclusively with the dragonmarked PCs.
It has a 5-6 page overview of each of the houses and tons of info.
It's a long read but you may want to peruse those sections that you are considering.
I don't need to be healer because I've played quite a few in the past. So you can have at 'er, Kirsdrake :)
I will try to read over some stuff this weekend. Still learning towards arcane magic user of some sort...maybe a pyromaniac who has channeled her love of fire into magic so it's not frowned upon.
Work is about to blow up for me next week but I'll really try to stay on top of things. Sucks when people quit and you get their work as well as yours. Good thing is that it won't be forever...I hope.
Actually thinking Alchemist, of some sort.
Decent combat abilities, discoveries work well for "altered form". 6th can get Promethean Alchemist, which grants Craft Construct.
Bombs suggest he was 'artillery', but Alchemists are decent in a fight (especially with Mutagens).
I will pick up Craft Alchemy and Craft Armour and (if I can get the trait to be a int based doctor) Heal - flavoured as "Craft Flesh".
If necessary Alchemists can get some discoveries that make them healers as well. Not a great answer if Kirsdrake is interested in a Cleric.
Tempted by Artificer, but it's a very close mechanical effect as far as I can tell, in a converted version of a class I don't really understand.
Actually thinking Alchemist, of some sort.
Decent combat abilities, discoveries work well for "altered form". 6th can get Promethean Alchemist, which grants Craft Construct.
Bombs suggest he was 'artillery', but Alchemists are decent in a fight (especially with Mutagens).
I will pick up Craft Alchemy and Craft Armour and (if I can get the trait to be a int based doctor) Heal - flavoured as "Craft Flesh".
If necessary Alchemists can get some discoveries that make them healers as well. Not a great answer if Kirsdrake is interested in a Cleric.
Tempted by Artificer, but it's a very close mechanical effect as far as I can tell, in a converted version of a class I don't really understand.
There was no alchemist class in Eberron but we can that work *refluff a lot of stuff for warforged".
I've sent you a few pages on a prestige class called alchemist savant that may help with your fluff.
I'm thinking of a social rogue, a real con artist. She'll have several very fleshed-out aliases, and delight in the long con and the art of making people believe her lies. Superficially at least, her main goal is to get rich.
What kind of fluff are you wanting? The traditional background/appearance/personality, or the newer 10 min background?
I'm thinking of a social rogue, a real con artist. She'll have several very fleshed-out aliases, and delight in the long con and the art of making people believe her lies. Superficially at least, her main goal is to get rich.
What kind of fluff are you wanting? The traditional background/appearance/personality, or the newer 10 min background?
Both... (maybe?)
Actually I like the traditional but I now sometimes start out with a 10-min background, I specifically like 1st and 5th steps.
Step 1: Write at least 5 concept elements that you feel are important to your image of the character. These can be a concept overview, a list of important life events, a physical description, a personality profile...whatever you need to get an image in your mind.
Step 5: Describe at least 3 mannerisms, or quirks that your character has. They don't have to be elaborate, but they should provide some context and flavor.
What's our beginning gold going to look like? What kind of magic items can we start off with?
What's our beginning gold going to look like? What kind of magic items can we start off with?
2nd level PC or 1,000 gp. I'm Ok with whatever 1,000 gp buys you.
We need to work on starting connections.
Do we want to get a patron that you all work for? I know it's cliche but...
I'm almost ready to start...
2nd level PC or 1,000 gp. I'm Ok with whatever 1,000 gp buys you.
But Daaaaddddd....I want a bag of hooollllldiiinnnggggg....
Patron works for me. My girl will have her fingers in a lot of different pies...
Oh, the site you posted a link to had an entry for Alchemist.
I think it works well :)
Oh, the site you posted a link to had an entry for Alchemist.
I think it works well :)
It does? Where?
@Shari: the book Dragonmarked deals almost exclusively with the dragonmarked PCs.
It has a 5-6 page overview of each of the houses and tons of info.
It's a long read but you may want to peruse those sections that you are considering.
Do you have a link to where I can find a pdf file of the book you speak of?
Also, I don't have access to the Core Eberron Book. Again, any suggestions as to where I can find it? I've played D&D 3.5 but not Eberron.
Forgot you told me that.
Just as regards the new spells. Alchemist
Actually, given the martial training, maybe the Grenadier archetype works better.
Ugh, finding an avatar even remotely appropriate for a changeling is impossible. I don't imagine it'll be easier for the 'forged. There's no way to upload your own image, is there?
Does a travellers any-tool count as thieves tools too? Or is that a separate kit?
How are we doing character build? 15 point buy?
My fluff is getting pretty close to done.
From what I've been reading about the houses, The House of Making makes the most sense for the character that I have in mind. Would this work for what you have in mind for the campaign?
Does a travellers any-tool count as thieves tools too? Or is that a separate kit?
How are we doing character build? 15 point buy?
My fluff is getting pretty close to done.
Traveler any tool is not thieves tool.
Your avatar is fine but I was going to suggest that you use one of your favorite 'forms' and change it as you change forms. That is unless you'e going to change forms constantly at which point it becomes a pain.
I'll read your fluff later and give you some comments.
How's everyone else doing?
I'm still trying to figure out how to get you guys together but I need more info from you to do that.
Option a)
I'd like to have someone hire you but you need to be somewhat known for that to occur. I mean why are they going to hire you?
Do you want to be some sort of team and have a little reputation?
Option b)
You are all looking for work. You all respond to an 'add' for work but it turns out to be a gang recruiting new members. Disgusted the four of you leave together. And I take over from there.
Thoughts?
From what I've been reading about the houses, The House of Making makes the most sense for the character that I have in mind. Would this work for what you have in mind for the campaign?
er... sort of because House Cannith is a major player in this campaign.
You're still doing a wizard-type PC, right?
Have you considered House Lyrandar or House Orien?
From what I've been reading about the houses, The House of Making makes the most sense for the character that I have in mind. Would this work for what you have in mind for the campaign?er... sort of because House Cannith is a major player in this campaign.
You're still doing a wizard-type PC, right?
Have you considered House Lyrandar or House Orien?
Yes I considered both. I was drawn to Orien initially so I can go back and visit that again. I was also liking the idea of playing a half-elf so I'll take a closer look at Lyrandar. I'm always open to suggestions :)
Yes still considering wizard-type
Your avatar is fine but I was going to suggest that you use one of your favorite 'forms' and change it as you change forms. That is unless you'e going to change forms constantly at which point it becomes a pain.
I plan on her changing often, so we'll see if I feel up to changing the avatar. This current one is her "family" look, though she's not actually in it very often. Only for family meals once a week.
Option a)
I'd like to have someone hire you but you need to be somewhat known for that to occur. I mean why are they going to hire you?
Do you want to be some sort of team and have a little reputation?Option b)
You are all looking for work. You all respond to an 'add' for work but it turns out to be a gang recruiting new members. Disgusted the four of you leave together. And I take over from there.
I'm not against option a), though it will require a bit of background tweaking to make that work. But I could create another alias/persona that would be a team player.
For option b), the ad would have had to promise something quite good, as Vi already has a few jobs - you'll see in her fluff. But it's also workable.
I ask again - crunch rules?
From what I've been reading about the houses, The House of Making makes the most sense for the character that I have in mind. Would this work for what you have in mind for the campaign?er... sort of because House Cannith is a major player in this campaign.
You're still doing a wizard-type PC, right?
Have you considered House Lyrandar or House Orien?
Yes I considered both. I was drawn to Orien initially so I can go back and visit that again. I was also liking the idea of playing a half-elf so I'll take a closer look at Lyrandar. I'm always open to suggestions :)
Yes still considering wizard-type
I was asking because it looks like we will NOT have a fighter type because both warforged aren't 'it' (one is alchemist and the other is healer). And the changeling is a rogue.
If you decide to do a fighter-type then I would really look into the Deneith House, who have the market cornered.
And don't forget that being a member of the House does NOT necessarily mean that you have dragonmark.
I'm not against option a), though it will require a bit of background tweaking to make that work. But I could create another alias/persona that would be a team player.
For option b), the ad would have had to promise something quite good, as Vi already has a few jobs - you'll see in her fluff. But it's also workable.
I ask again - crunch rules?
Sorry. Crunch is the usual: 20-point buy, two traits, max hp for 1st level then 1/2+1 for other levels.
I'm also open to suggestions about getting the team together.
All I need is for you four to be going to some place and be somewhere in Sharn.
Thoughts?
Makes sense then. Alchemist and wizard are very close in spectrum. I'm totally fine going fighter-type. I had initially looked at Deneith House as well but had discarded it because I wasn't thinking fighter at the time even though the dragonmark abilities were interesting. Since we don't have a fighter-type, I'll go that route. I'll just have to work out what fighter-type to be.
If anyone else has changed their mind, let me know so I don't go down this rabbit hole...speak now or forever hold your peace :)
Vi is a lover, not a fighter. Well, some of the time at least. :)
If anybody is being tourist in Sharn, or looking for work or anything, Vi could totally have a guide-type alias.
Hang on,
Alchemist is a martial + fighter class.
My plan was to go heavy on bombs and stabbing.
Hang on,
Alchemist is a martial + fighter class.
My plan was to go heavy on bombs and stabbing.
The alchemist can indeed be a good melee fighter but there isn't a 'fighter' per se.
We don't need them all the time but there's usually one in every group. Especially if you guys want to be veterans of the war.
Still looking for ideas on getting the party together so let's hear your thoughts.
Reading up on Warforged, they often stayed in units post war.
That seems like an easy link for us.
Suggests there might have been others that have fallen.
Was Vi in the war? The avatar looks young.
Hmm - or I could see a unit of warforged interacting with society getting taken advantage of, and only realising too late. Treating this as a war problem: this is 'terrain'. The terrain is dangerous. We need a scout. A scout is an expert in terrain. Let us hire a changeling.
If Shari is a dragonmarked, and therefore noble... okay, spitballing an idea here.
House X noble is in charge of a unit of Warforged. Unit is heavily damaged in a very big fight (possibly the one that created the Mournlands? Or a city siege?) and as he dies out gasps out "look after my daughter".
Survivors of the unit takes this as an order, goes to look after the daughter. When the Warforged are freed, they still have a purpose as their order was not the war.
Potentially could have been a fair bit before the war, possibly even leading to the warforged becoming childminders.
Also, I have an Avatar.
Reading up on Warforged, they often stayed in units post war.
That seems like an easy link for us.
Suggests there might have been others that have fallen.Was Vi in the war? The avatar looks young.
Hmm - or I could see a unit of warforged interacting with society getting taken advantage of, and only realising too late. Treating this as a war problem: this is 'terrain'. The terrain is dangerous. We need a scout. A scout is an expert in terrain. Let us hire a changeling.If Shari is a dragonmarked, and therefore noble... okay, spitballing an idea here.
House X noble is in charge of a unit of Warforged. Unit is heavily damaged in a very big fight (possibly the one that created the Mournlands? Or a city siege?) and as he dies out gasps out "look after my daughter".
Survivors of the unit takes this as an order, goes to look after the daughter. When the Warforged are freed, they still have a purpose as their order was not the war.
Potentially could have been a fair bit before the war, possibly even leading to the warforged becoming childminders.Also, I have an Avatar.
This could work as House Deneith is heavily tied to the war. They are the ones that trained and supplied mercenaries and also were in charge of training troops so House Deneith could have easily trained the warforged unit that Squeak belonged to.
We'll need confirmation from Jussi that his warforged-healer also belonged to the same unit.
Working in Angie is easier and more difficult at the same time. If she stayed in persona then yes, she could be a scout but what happens when you find out she's a changeling? Do you know she's a changeling? Did you know and perhaps hired her because she's a changeling?
Fun questions.
Sorry, scout as an analogy.
Warforged get conned. Then conned again.
Realising they don't understand this new situation they classiy it as war.
This is a new "terrain" (social)
When you have a terrain you do not understand, you need a scout who understands the terrain.
In this case that means a scout who understands conning and how not to be conned (and con others).
Changelings are born con-artists.
Therefore a Changeling would be a good "scout" for navigating peacetime social interactions.
Now find a Changeling.
Now recruit said changeling.
"We know as a changeling you are untrustworthy and deceitful. Therefore we would like to hire you."
Sort of imagining a changeling might be intrigued by a group that so readily believes the stereotypes and not only doesn't care but sees them as an advantage.
Just spitballing though.
So you're saying:
Squeak and other warforged were/are part of the same unit.
This unit had ties with a Deneith Heir (Shari) and was told to 'protect' her.
The forged realize that protecting the heir won't be that easy so they 'hire' a changeling scout (Angie).
So the dynamics of this party would be that either the heir calls the shots, 'challenged' by the scout, and the forged follow along.
This could work. Let's hear others chime in on it.
Hang on,
Alchemist is a martial + fighter class.
My plan was to go heavy on bombs and stabbing.The alchemist can indeed be a good melee fighter but there isn't a 'fighter' per se.
We don't need them all the time but there's usually one in every group. Especially if you guys want to be veterans of the war.
If it's the fighter class itself that you're talking about, I'm happy to take a level of fighter (probably makes sense, actually) so Shari can stay wizard.
I'm not sure I'm understanding the point though.Unrelated question: how much did Warforged cost during the war? How much is a warforged body worth now? Thinking of carrying a corpse.
Hang on,
Alchemist is a martial + fighter class.
My plan was to go heavy on bombs and stabbing.The alchemist can indeed be a good melee fighter but there isn't a 'fighter' per se.
We don't need them all the time but there's usually one in every group. Especially if you guys want to be veterans of the war.
If it's the fighter class itself that you're talking about, I'm happy to take a level of fighter (probably makes sense, actually) so Shari can stay wizard.
I'm not sure I'm understanding the point though.Unrelated question: how much did Warforged cost during the war? How much is a warforged body worth now? Thinking of carrying a corpse.
I'm saying that squeak is an alchemist (3/4 BAB, d8 hit point, etc.) which is less martial oriented than a fighter (full BAB, d10 or more hit point, etc.).
------------A warforged sold for between 5,000 and 6,000 gp. So let's say that 1/2 of that is manufacturing cost, 1/4 is raw materials, and 1/4 is profit.
So raw materials for one warforged is 1,500 gp.
Vi was not involved in the war at all. She was busing trying to ignore it, and live life to the fullest in Sharn.
If you want to hire her as a changeling, that can be arranged, but it will be out of her comfort zone. Most people don't know she's a changeling (I'll try and get my fluff posted tonight). However her PI boss does, and he dabbles in all sorts of things, so there's a way there to connect them. She does have good local knowledge, and lots of contacts, so she would be a good guide around the city.
I love the idea of the Warforged being so blunt with her about hiring a changeling. It will probably shock her to her core.
@Fabian - as per my many aliases - it's unlikely that most of them will surface during play - it was more for history than for RPing.
Vi was not involved in the war at all. She was busing trying to ignore it, and live life to the fullest in Sharn.
If you want to hire her as a changeling, that can be arranged, but it will be out of her comfort zone. Most people don't know she's a changeling (I'll try and get my fluff posted tonight). However her PI boss does, and he dabbles in all sorts of things, so there's a way there to connect them. She does have good local knowledge, and lots of contacts, so she would be a good guide around the city.
I love the idea of the Warforged being so blunt with her about hiring a changeling. It will probably shock her to her core.
@Fabian - as per my many aliases - it's unlikely that most of them will surface during play - it was more for history than for RPing.
It may make more sense for the warforged to hire Vi as a half-elf guide and then later learn (sometime after the adventure starts) that she's actually a changeling....
It may make more sense for the warforged to hire Vi as a half-elf guide and then later learn (sometime after the adventure starts) that she's actually a changeling....
That works for me too. Or once Kirsdrake weighs in, there may be hidden option #3.
background skills?
I think I'll dip one level into Fighter for armor/weapon proficiency (besides, makes sense for a 'forged), then go all-in to Cleric (or possibly Oracle...) I need to figure out a decent archetype since the vanilla Cleric doesn't interest me. Forgemaster would fit very well, but it's racial one.
Also, what do you think of the Variant Channeling rules? Forge variant would be highly useful for this group, helping with healing our two warforged.
As for god... I think the character will worship his creator, but we could just steal the mechanics from Onatar - if the god ARE real, in the first place, he could just worship the Sovereign of Fire and Forge without knowing. And if the gods of Eberron are pure fantasy, well, then it's all up to the person doing the believing in the first place ;^)
So you're saying:
Squeak and other warforged were/are part of the same unit.
This unit had ties with a Deneith Heir (Shari) and was told to 'protect' her.
The forged realize that protecting the heir won't be that easy so they 'hire' a changeling scout (Angie).So the dynamics of this party would be that either the heir calls the shots, 'challenged' by the scout, and the forged follow along.
This could work. Let's hear others chime in on it.
Suits me, love the cold (and possibly slightly detached from actual reality) logic of the thought process behind this.
And it would get around the part of not having any leader and us spending a week pondering our every move. I remember well how much you love that kind of turns ;^)
It may make more sense for the warforged to hire Vi as a half-elf guide and then later learn (sometime after the adventure starts) that she's actually a changeling....
Would prefer this, as it'd leave the moment of revelation forthcoming. Could make for a very interesting post. And half-elves are known socialites, so hiring one as a guide to civilization makes sense.
Would there be a fighter archetype that would more sense for House Deneith or should I just go vanilla fighter? I took a quick look through the archetypes but nothing jumped out at me. I had also briefly considered the Urban Barbarian archetype but wasn't sure if that would be allowed or appropriate.
Ok, so I have:
2 warforged that are tasked with protecting a Deneith heir hire a half-elf city guide.
- Squeak (alchemist 2);
- other warforged (fighter 1/cleric 1)
- half-elf guide (changeling rogue 2)
- Deneith heir (???)
All we need is Shari's Ok with the initial plot line.
@Shari: you do not have to be a fighter-type but you do need to be associated with the 'war/mercenary' effort so you could certainly be a 'battle-wizard' if you still want to go that route.
Thoughts?
I think I'll dip one level into Fighter for armor/weapon proficiency (besides, makes sense for a 'forged), then go all-in to Cleric (or possibly Oracle...) I need to figure out a decent archetype since the vanilla Cleric doesn't interest me. Forgemaster would fit very well, but it's racial one.
Also, what do you think of the Variant Channeling rules? Forge variant would be highly useful for this group, helping with healing our two warforged.
As for god... I think the character will worship his creator, but we could just steal the mechanics from Onatar - if the god ARE real, in the first place, he could just worship the Sovereign of Fire and Forge without knowing. And if the gods of Eberron are pure fantasy, well, then it's all up to the person doing the believing in the first place ;^)
Forgemaster seems suitable so take it if it interests you.
There was no variant channeling in Eberron so I'm going to say no. Part of the flavor is that warforged heal 1/2 with 'healing spells' but can be repaired.
Yes to background skills.
Would there be a fighter archetype that would more sense for House Deneith or should I just go vanilla fighter? I took a quick look through the archetypes but nothing jumped out at me. I had also briefly considered the Urban Barbarian archetype but wasn't sure if that would be allowed or appropriate.
It depends on what your role was/is in House Deneith.
If you're some sort of commander, I would look into drill sergeant or tactician.
But you could be involved in recruitment or boosting morale or other associated activities with mercenaries.
Gives us some of your fluff to get a better feel for this PC.
Ok, so I have:
2 warforged that are tasked with protecting a Deneith heir hire a half-elf city guide.
- Squeak (alchemist 2);
- other warforged (fighter 1/cleric 1)
- half-elf guide (changeling rogue 2)
- Deneith heir (???)All we need is Shari's Ok with the initial plot line.
@Shari: you do not have to be a fighter-type but you do need to be associated with the 'war/mercenary' effort so you could certainly be a 'battle-wizard' if you still want to go that route.
Thoughts?
Sorry I'm taking so long...deciding on my class will help solidify the fluff for me. Is there somewhere to look at crunch for a battle-wizard? Otherwise could go the Tactician route...
Sorry I'm taking so long...deciding on my class will help solidify the fluff for me. Is there somewhere to look at crunch for a battle-wizard? Otherwise could go the Tactician route...Ok, so I have:
2 warforged that are tasked with protecting a Deneith heir hire a half-elf city guide.
- Squeak (alchemist 2);
- other warforged (fighter 1/cleric 1)
- half-elf guide (changeling rogue 2)
- Deneith heir (???)All we need is Shari's Ok with the initial plot line.
@Shari: you do not have to be a fighter-type but you do need to be associated with the 'war/mercenary' effort so you could certainly be a 'battle-wizard' if you still want to go that route.
Thoughts?
I don't think Paizo has a battle wizard archetype (there was one in 3.5).
Didn't you say that you wanted a wizard to burn everything or was that Angie.
If I was going to build a battle wizard, I would look into making them specialize in an elemental school (fire or air) or the evocation school.
Does that appeal to you?
That was me that wanted to burn everything :) But that wouldn't solve the issue of not having a full martial character. So maybe I'll go the route of fighter and look into the Tactician archetype.
Hopefully I'll have the 10min background up later today...
That was me that wanted to burn everything :) But that wouldn't solve the issue of not having a full martial character. So maybe I'll go the route of fighter and look into the Tactician archetype.
Hopefully I'll have the 10min background up later today...
But Eirik's warforged will dip into fighter so that sort of takes care of that.
If you want a wizard that burns everything and is tied to House Deneith, go for it.
That fire supremacy ability is awesome for fluff and RPing...
You gain resistance 5 to fire. At 10th level, this resistance increases to 10. At 20th level, you gain immunity to fire damage. In addition, whenever you are within 5 feet of a source of flame at least as large as a campfire, you can draw the fire around you for 1 round as a swift action. Anyone striking you with a melee weapon or unarmed strike takes an amount of fire damage equal to 1/2 your wizard level (minimum 1). Weapons with reach avoid this damage.
You get fire jet and an extra fire spell per level. (fireball at level 5)
I built one a while ago and loved it. Only caveat is that you need to have another trick for those enemies resistant to fire.