Clarifications on a Few Domain Powers


Rules Questions


Hi guys,

Just a couple of questions about the following cleric domain powers:

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Madness domain 1st level:

Vision of Madness (Sp): You can give a creature a vision of madness as a melee touch attack. Choose one of the following: attack rolls, saving throws, or skill checks. The target receives a bonus to the chosen rolls equal to ½ your cleric level (minimum +1) and a penalty to the other two types of rolls equal to ½ your cleric level (minimum –1). This effect fades after 3 rounds. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.

This doesn't have any explicit descriptors like mind-affecting, but I suspect it isn't supposed to work on things normally immune to mind-affecting spells (undead, constructs, ect)?

Also, is it possible to use Dweomer's essence to buff the this ability, even though it isn't a spell? (can it use spell components?)

People always talk about this ability like it's incredible at high levels, but it seems like it fails miserably against anything reasonably threatening (immunities, high SR, basically everything you would want to hit with this).
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Demon domain 1st level:

Fury of the Abyss (Su): As a swift action, you can give yourself an enhancement bonus equal to 1/2 your cleric level (minimum +1) on melee attacks, melee damage rolls, and combat maneuver checks. This bonus lasts for 1 round. During this round, you take a –2 penalty to AC. You can use this ability for a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.

Am I correct to assume this doesn't stack with weapon enhancements? If it doesn't then does it have any effect on your ability to ignore DR? It would be a bit strange for it to act like a weapon enhancement in terms of not stacking with weapon enhancements but then also not act like a weapon enhancement in that it can't beat DR. Basically, is there any point to taking this ability?
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I'm trying to make a variation of a reach cleric which focuses on madness domain debuffing (using a conductive longspear) rather than the usual summoning/buffing. Not sure if I can make it work out effectively since trying to debuff requires me to invest heavily in wisdom (detracting from strength) and beating SR. I'm also quite concerned about becoming useless any time something immune to mind-affectings shows up since I won't have any investment in summoning and my melee ability will be worse than most reach clerics.


Madness Domain:

It doesn't look like it calls out mind-affecting or anything like that so you should be good. Expect table variation though, since the flavour does seem to be of the mind-affecting variety.

Also I don't think you can use Dweomer's Essence with Spell-Like Abilities.

Demon Domain:

I think you are correct, it doesn't stack with weapon enhancements. However it does scale approximately twice as fast as weapon enhancements, and from level 12 onward it's giving you bonuses you wouldn't normally get. I'm not sure if it will bypass DR, but my instinct is to say "YES" since it calls itself an enhancement bonus.

I think a Conductive weapon is a good idea with the Demon/Madness domains. You'll be slightly worse-off than you normally would against most enemies, but 3+WIS/day you can buff yourself to overtake them. The Madness Domain is a nice debuff alternative when dealing damage is someone else's job. Remember you can also Channel your Channel-Energy through a Conductive weapon, so that's another option as well.


MrCharisma wrote:
I think you are correct, it doesn't stack with weapon enhancements. However it does scale approximately twice as fast as weapon enhancements, and from level 12 onward it's giving you bonuses you wouldn't normally get.

Fair enough. However, I'm not sure it's worth spending a domain in that case. I could just as easily separatist into growth domain (you don't lose much from it) and have toggleable 20 ft reach and a comparable damage buff (1d8 -> 2d6 and 16 -> 18 str) starting from level 1 for the same AC loss. Also means I wouldn't have to be evil.

Ignoring DR is interesting though. Not sure how to compare that to other things.

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