Dire Bear

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821 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 1 alias.



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All of it. Total conversion with full control over every single system that would otherwise be autonomic. I want my electric heart to beat at the pace I set it to. I want to enter R.E.M. according to a tight schedule. I want to be able to play with synesthesia when I get bored.


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Garretmander wrote:

I do like the idea of taking the more unique ideas from this class and making an archetype though.

Starfinder archetypes tend to be somewhere between niche and terrible, turning this into an archetype that anyone can take sounds like the sort of thing that might be taken, unlike most of them.

I'm gonna take this as a compliment because I need a win, dammit. ;)


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Consider using Kindle Direct Publishing via Amazon. Unless you have to have hardcover, they can handle most options you might be looking for.


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Philosophical minds have been trying to define evil for thousands of years with only limited success. You might be asking for too much, here.


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Rory wrote:
wraithstrike wrote:
It is saying if you use X you get Y, but if you use A you get B. It never says you can't use X and A to be B and Y.

It says "when worn, the shield gives Y bonus or B bonus".

It never says you can get Y bonus and B bonus at the same time. You can get Y bonus or B bonus, but you just can't get them at the same time.

Actually, you're both wrong. It says "if you have A ability you get B, if you have X ability you get Y." But the person in question has both A and X, making them capable of getting both B and Y, which isn't mentioned by the ability because normally A and X are mutually exclusive.

Quite frankly, if you spent the time and effort to possess what are normally mutually exclusive abilities, I don't have a problem as DM with allowing you to make use of them.

I DO think that it would technically be the same source (same ability giving both bonuses) and so would not work by RAW.


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Matt Gwinn wrote:
.

+1 to pretty much everything Matt said.

Not only are we not required to make a character who is good at combat, we're not required to make a character who is even interested in it. There used to be a Vow of Pacifism available for strictly non-combat characters, this sort of thing isn't new. I'm currently playing a venerable half-elf caster who explicitly refuses to risk his health for any reason. (He's "getting too old for this s%#+!")

I would venture a guess that if you only had four party members the player would make more of an effort to be useful during conflict but... it sounds like what the player is doing is fun to him. And he probably very much appreciates efficient optimizers like you enabling him to play in the fashion he likes. Does he ever rant and rave at you for not running away with him to play dice in an alley? Just leave him be and assume he's a non-combatant.

If you absolutely MUST make an issue of it, I'd confront him in character. That way you can vent your frustrations, maybe even be abusive for the sake of catharsis, without making it personal.


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ProfessorCirno wrote:


I love this logic because of how openly honest it is of how edition wars work.

Namely, it isn't an edition war until the 4e fans gets tired of being bashed.

Except that, in my admittedly quick skim of the 108 posts since I last visited this thread, I haven't seen anyone "bash" 4th ed. players. Bashing of 4th ed. isn't the same thing as bashing its players. And I've seen quite a bit of "bashing those who bash 4th ed" which is a good deal less mature than the bashing of 4th ed, imo. And now the word bash has lost all meaning for me. Bash.

Frankly, the only reason I mentioned 4th in my own earlier post was because someone said not to and after double-checking it turned out they were not the boss of me.

And I made a phone call a little while ago and heard that most of the gamers I knew in my last city refer to Pathfinder as Pathfinder. But they didn't stop playing 3.5 for a couple of years after Paizo started publishing.


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I've been pretty vocal about hating the Monk for quite some time, and about the fact that a fighter can be a superior (if unsatisfying due to the light damage their strikes inflict) unarmed combatant because of their sheer number of feats. Having stopped by the boards last night I found a lot of discussion about the new Gish class (sorry guys, I'm not going to call it a Magus) and it reminded me that there have been all sorts of new classes put out. This is NOT a problem in my mind. Those who don't like adding new core classes are welcome to their opinions but for those of us who crave variety having more options sanctioned by the creators of the game is simply fantastic. My only issue is that it seems like magic always gets more love than martial classes. SO. Since I'm tired of waiting for someone else to "fix" the Monk. (And I hear tell that some people actually want the whole "mystic" flavor attached to it) I decided to make my own core class - one which is about kicking the snot out of people instead of falling really far.

The problem I've run into is one of imagination. I have a couple of unique class features that I really like: Stances, Styles, Techniques, and Combination Attacks. I need help with variety though, my imagination is a bit tapped out so suggestions for new things to add to those sections would be welcome. Also, I'm uncertain about power level because I've never homebrewed something to this extent, and certainly not for PF. So a lot of the numerical effects were drawn directly out of BS, although I tried to keep things tame.

Anyway, what follows is my (currently incomplete, give me a hand) Martial Artist class. This is, in my mind, a replacement for monk although the two are vastly different and could probably both exist in the same campaign with a minimum of fuss. (Essentially the Martial Artist is Bruce Lee, while the existing Monk would be... some asian guy who gets knocked around a lot by fighters, I guess.)

Feel free to offer suggestions. Please try to be constructive. I'll do my best to be thick-skinned if you'll do your best to be kind.

***

Martial Artist
Flavor text goes here.

Alignment
Any.

Hit Die
d10.

Starting Wealth
Don’t care.

Class Skills
The Martial Artist's class skills are Acrobatics (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Diplomacy (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (local) (Int), Knowledge (nature) (Int), Perception (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Stealth (Dex), Survival (Wis), and Swim (Str).

Skill Ranks Per Level
4 + Int modifier.

Table: Martial Artist
Level BAB Special

1st +1 Unarmed Strike, Armor Restriction, Combination Attack, AC Bonus, Unarmed 1d6, Unarmed Combat, Style

2nd +2 Technique

3rd +3 Combination Attack

4th +4 Stance, Unarmed 1d8

5th +5 Combination Attack

6th +6/+1 Kata

7th +7/+2 Combination Attack

8th +8/+3 Stance, Technique, Unarmed 1d10

9th +9/+4 Combination Attack

10th +10/+5 Mastery

11th +11/+6/+1 Combination Attack

12th +12/+7/+2 Stance, Improved Kata, Unarmed 2d6

13th +13/+8/+3 Combination Attack

14th +14/+9/+4 Technique

15th +15/+10/+5 Combination Attack

16th +16/+11/+6/+1 Stance, Unarmed 2d8

17th +17/+12/+7/+2 Combination Attack

18th +18/+13/+8/+3 Superior Kata

19th +19/+14/+9/+4 Combination Attack

20th +20/+15/+10/+5 Stance, Technique, Grandmastery, Unarmed 2d10

Class Features
The following are class features of the Martial Artist.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency
A Martial Artist is proficient with all simple weapons and gains no armor proficiencies.

Saves
All Martial Artists have two good saves, determined by their style.

AC Bonus (Ex)
A Martial Artist trains without armor, relying on his skill to protect him from harm. Martial Artists gain a bonus to AC equal to ¼ their class level (rounded down) plus the dominant ability modifier of their chosen style. This bonus cannot be less than 0, even if the Martial Artist has a low ability score. This AC Bonus is lost if the Martial Artist wears any armor or wields a weapon.

Unarmed Strike
At 1st level, a Martial Artist gains Unarmed Strike, as per the Monk class ability. Unlike the Monk class ability, this ability also allows the Martial Artist to replace their strength bonus to unarmed damage with that of their style's dominant ability score.

Stances (Ex)
At 1st level, 4th level and every four levels thereafter (1st, 4th , 8th , 12th , etc.), a Martial Artist gains a new stance picked from those available to him, with additional stances added to this list as the Martial Artist advances in level. Stances typically provide both a bonus and a penalty. Martial Artists may benefit from only one stance at a time. Entering or leaving a stances is a free action but a Martial Artist may only benefit from one stance per round.

Unarmed Combat
A Martial Artist may qualify for feats that are restricted by Fighter class levels (i.e., Weapon Specialization, Greater Weapon Focus) at the same level that Fighters would be eligible, but may only select these feats for his unarmed strikes. (Credit for this idea goes to Philetus and his Unarmed Specialist)

Armor Restriction
A Martial Artist loses the ability to use Martial Artist class abilities, including AC bonus, while wearing armor; even if he is proficient with the use of that armor.

Style (Ex)
Every Martial Artist has a core fighting style that helps to determine their available Techniques, Stances, and Combination Attacks. This style is chosen at first level and cannot be changed afterward.

Combination Attack (Ex)
At every odd-numbered level (1st, 3rd, etc.) a Martial Artist may choose to learn a new combination attack from those available to him. These combination attacks may be used in place of any standard attack with two limitations - A particular combination attack can only be used once per round unless otherwise noted in the attack’s description. Combination attacks can be mixed freely with normal armed or unarmed attacks, but only during a full attack: combination attacks cannot be used as a standard action. Some combination attacks are marked as “finishers” these especially powerful combination attacks may only be used as the last attack in a full attack action and only if they were preceded exclusively by other combination attacks. Martial Artists may choose to replace a known combination attack with another that they qualify for any time they gain a new combination attack, however they may only retrain one attack at any given level.

Techniques (Ex)
Techniques are powerful and unique abilities that Martial Artists perfect via rigorous training. A Martial Artist may activate a technique as a swift action and may use only one technique at a time, even if they are somehow able to use more than one swift action in a single round. Martial Artists gain techniques at 2nd level and every six levels thereafter. (8th, 14th, 20th).

Kata (Ex)
At 6th level, if a Martial Artist makes a full attack action using only combination attacks he may make one additional attack at his highest base attack bonus. This attack must also be a combination attack.

Mastery (Ex)
At 10th level, a Martial Artist may choose one stance in which he has trained. All beneficial numerical effects of this stance are doubled while penalties remain the same.

Improved Kata (Ex)
At 12th level, if a Martial Artist makes a full attack action using only combination attacks (as per the Kata ability) he may another additional strike when using his Kata ability. This extra attack is made with a -5 penalty and must be a combination attack.

Superior Kata (Ex)
At 18th level, if a Martial Artist makes a full attack action using only combination attacks (as per the Kata ability) he may add a third additional strike when using his Kata ability. This extra attack is made at a -10 penalty and must be a combination attack.

Grandmastery (Ex)
At 20th level a Martial Artist may choose to benefit from the effects of any two stances at the same time, their bonuses stack. In addition, the Martial Artist no longer suffers the penalties associated with any stance he knows.

---

Style List

Blinding Speed: A Martial Artist who utilizes Blinding Speed is an agile combatant who employs their amazing dexterity in order to avoid attacks and place precision counterstrikes. +1 competence bonus to AC and +10 feet of movement. Good saves: Ref & Will. (Dex)

Mighty Blows: Able to destroy castle walls with a single strike, Martial Artists of this style favor offense over defense and can choose some of the most vicious combination attacks. +1 competence bonus to hit with Unarmed strikes and may reroll 1s on Unarmed Strike damage. The Martial Artist may only reroll any given damage die once, even if the second roll results in a 1. Good saves: Fort & Will. (Str)

Wise Warrior: Specializing in spotting weak points in an enemy’s defense, the Wise Warrior achieves victory through keen senses and absolute timing. May ignore DR of equal or less than ¼ of their Martial Artist level (rounded down), minimum 1. Good saves: Ref & Will. (Wis)

Kung Fu Genius: Brilliant tacticians and natural combatants, the Kung Fu Genius can formulate a plan of attack in the time it takes most men to blink, earning them the respect of their peers. +1 initiative and +4 to all social interactions (Bluff, Diplomacy, etc.) with martial classes. (ie: d10 HD) Good saves: Fort & Ref. (Int)

Undying Champion: Having trained in esoteric methods of weathering pain and mitigating damage, the Undying Champion can resist the mightiest of blows. Gain DR equal to ¼ class level (rounded down), minimum 1. Good saves: Fort & Ref. (Con)

____: Some kind of Charisma based style? No good ideas...

---

Stance List

Patient Scorpion Stance: access to precise combos, techniques
Hunting Hawk Stance: access to aerial/high ground combos/techs
Agile Lemur Stance: access to evasive combos/techs
Endless Assault Stance: access to rapid-fire combos/techs?

---

Combination Attack List

Jab: bonus to hit, penalty to damage
Spinning Strike: power attackish, penalty to ac
Peircing Strike: bypass ac/dr?
Hurricane Attack: attack several adjacent enemies
Punishing Blow: attack bonus on weapon that hit you

---

Technique List

Iron Shirt: dr or ac?
Godhand: huge damage
Adamantine Fist: ignore hardness/construct DR, extra damage to them
Keen Senses: Improved Uncanny Dodge?
Power Kiai: stun/nauseate short range
Light Body: Run up walls, across fluids, etc.
Faceless Opponent: become unidentifiable
Snatch Weapon: free disarms
Silent Fist: d6 sneak, multiple times, stacks


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I've been pretty vocal about hating the Monk for quite some time, and about the fact that a fighter can be a superior (if unsatisfying due to the light damage their strikes inflict) unarmed combatant because of their sheer number of feats. Having stopped by the boards last night I found a lot of discussion about the new Gish class (sorry guys, I'm not going to call it a Magus) and it reminded me that there have been all sorts of new classes put out. This is NOT a problem in my mind. Those who don't like adding new core classes are welcome to their opinions but for those of us who crave variety having more options sanctioned by the creators of the game is simply fantastic. My only issue is that it seems like magic always gets more love than martial classes. SO. Since I'm tired of waiting for someone else to "fix" the Monk. (And I hear tell that some people actually want the whole "mystic" flavor attached to it) I decided to make my own core class - one which is about kicking the snot out of people instead of falling really far.

The problem I've run into is one of imagination. I have a couple of unique class features that I really like: Stances, Styles, Techniques, and Combination Attacks. I need help with variety though, my imagination is a bit tapped out so suggestions for new things to add to those sections would be welcome. Also, I'm uncertain about power level because I've never homebrewed something to this extent, and certainly not for PF. So a lot of the numerical effects were drawn directly out of BS, although I tried to keep things tame.

Anyway, what follows is my (currently incomplete, give me a hand) Martial Artist class. This is, in my mind, a replacement for monk although the two are vastly different and could probably both exist in the same campaign with a minimum of fuss. (Essentially the Martial Artist is Bruce Lee, while the existing Monk would be... some asian guy who gets knocked around a lot by fighters, I guess.)

Feel free to offer suggestions. Please try to be constructive. I'll do my best to be thick-skinned if you'll do your best to be kind.

***

Martial Artist
Flavor text goes here.

Alignment
Any.

Hit Die
d10.

Starting Wealth
Don’t care.

Class Skills
The Martial Artist's class skills are Acrobatics (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Diplomacy (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (local) (Int), Knowledge (nature) (Int), Perception (Wis), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Stealth (Dex), Survival (Wis), and Swim (Str).

Skill Ranks Per Level
4 + Int modifier.

Table: Martial Artist
Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1st +1 +2 +2 +0 Unarmed Strike, Armor Restriction, Combination Attack, AC Bonus, Unarmed 1d6, Unarmed Combat, Style

2nd +2 +3 +3 +0 Technique

3rd +3 +3 +3 +1 Combination Attack

4th +4 +4 +4 +1 Stance, Unarmed 1d8

5th +5 +4 +4 +1 Combination Attack

6th +6/+1 +5 +5 +2 Kata

7th +7/+2 +5 +5 +2 Combination Attack

8th +8/+3 +6 +6 +2 Stance, Technique, Unarmed 1d10

9th +9/+4 +6 +6 +3 Combination Attack

10th +10/+5 +7 +7 +3 Mastery

11th +11/+6/+1 +7 +7 +3 Combination Attack

12th +12/+7/+2 +8 +8 +4 Stance, Improved Kata, Unarmed 2d6

13th +13/+8/+3 +8 +8 +4 Combination Attack

14th +14/+9/+4 +9 +9 +4 Technique

15th +15/+10/+5 +9 +9 +5 Combination Attack

16th +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +10 +5 Stance, Unarmed 2d8

17th +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +10 +5 Combination Attack

18th +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +11 +6 Superior Kata

19th +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +11 +6 Combination Attack

20th +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +12 +6 Stance, Technique, Grandmastery, Unarmed 2d10

Class Features
The following are class features of the Martial Artist.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency
A Martial Artist is proficient with all simple weapons and gains no armor proficiencies.

AC Bonus (Ex)
A Martial Artist trains without armor, relying on his skill to protect him from harm. Martial Artists gain a bonus to AC equal to ¼ their class level (rounded down) plus the dominant ability modifier of their chosen style. This bonus cannot be less than 0, even if the Martial Artist has a low ability score. This AC Bonus is lost if the Martial Artist wears any armor or wields a weapon.

Unarmed Strike
At 1st level, an unarmed specialist gains Unarmed Strike, as per the Monk class ability. Unlike the Monk class ability, this ability also allows the Martial Artist to replace their strength bonus to unarmed damage with that of their style's dominant ability score.

Stances (Ex)
At 1st level, 4th level and every four levels thereafter (1st, 4th , 8th , 12th , etc.), a Martial Artist gains a new stance picked from those available to him, with additional stances added to this list as the Martial Artist advances in level. Stances typically provide both a bonus and a penalty. Martial Artists may benefit from only one stance at a time. Entering or leaving a stances is a free action but a Martial Artist may only activate one stance per round.

Unarmed Combat
A Martial Artist may qualify for feats that are restricted by Fighter class levels (i.e., Weapon Specialization, Greater Weapon Focus) at the same level that Fighters would be eligible, but may only select these feats for his unarmed strikes. (Credit for this idea goes to Philetus and his Unarmed Specialist)

Armor Restriction
An unarmed specialist loses the ability to use Martial Artist class abilities, including AC bonus, while wearing armor; even if he is proficient with the use of that armor.

Style (Ex)
Every Martial Artist has a core fighting style that helps to determine their available Techniques, Stances, and Combination Attacks. This style is chosen at first level and cannot be changed afterward.

Combination Attack (Ex)
At every odd-numbered level (1st, 3rd, etc.) a Martial Artist may choose to learn a new combination attack from those available to him. These combination attacks may be used in place of any standard attack with two limitations - A particular combination attack can only be used once per round unless otherwise noted in the attack’s description. Combination attacks can be mixed freely with normal armed or unarmed attacks, but only during a full attack: combination attacks cannot be used as a standard action. Some combination attacks are marked as “finishers” these especially powerful combination attacks may only be used as the last attack in a full attack action and only if they were preceded exclusively by other combination attacks. Martial Artists may choose to replace a known combination attack with another that they qualify for any time they gain a new combination attack, however they may only retrain one attack at any given level.

Techniques (Ex)
Techniques are powerful and unique abilities that Martial Artists perfect via rigorous training. A Martial Artist may activate a technique as a swift action and may use only one technique at a time, even if they are somehow able to use more than one swift action in a single round. Martial Artists gain techniques at 2nd level and every six levels thereafter. (8th, 14th, 20th).

Kata (Ex)
At 6th level, if a Martial Artist makes a full attack action using only combination attacks he may make one additional attack at his highest base attack bonus. This attack must also be a combination attack.

Mastery (Ex)
At 10th level, a Martial Artist may choose one stance in which he has trained. All beneficial numerical effects of this stance are doubled while penalties remain the same.

Improved Kata (Ex)
At 12th level, if a Martial Artist makes a full attack action using only combination attacks (as per the Kata ability) he may add two additional strikes instead of the one provided by Kata. These extra attacks are made at the Martial Artist’s highest base attack bonus and must be combination attacks.

Superior Kata (Ex)
At 18th level, if a Martial Artist makes a full attack action using only combination attacks (as per the Kata ability) he may add three additional strikes instead of the one provided by Kata. These extra attacks are made at the Martial Artist’s highest base attack bonus and must be combination attacks.

Grandmastery (Ex)
At 20th level a Martial Artist may choose to benefit from the effects of any two stances at the same time, their bonuses stack. In addition, the Martial Artist no longer suffers the penalties associated with any stance he knows.

Style List
Blinding Speed: A Martial Artist who utilizes Blinding Speed is an agile combatant who employs their amazing dexterity in order to avoid attacks and place precision counterstrikes. +1 competence bonus to AC and +10 feet of movement. (Dex)

Mighty Blows: Able to destroy castle walls with a single strike, Martial Artists of this style favor offense over defense and can choose some of the most vicious combination attacks. +1 competence bonus to hit with Unarmed strikes and may reroll 1s on Unarmed Strike damage. The Martial Artist may only reroll any given damage die once, even if the second roll results in a 1. (Str)

Wise Warrior: Specializing in spotting weak points in an enemy’s defense, the Wise Warrior achieves victory through keen senses and absolute timing. May ignore DR of equal or less than ¼ of their Martial Artist level (rounded down), minimum 1. (Wis)

Kung Fu Genius: Brilliant tacticians and natural combatants, the Kung Fu Genius can formulate a plan of attack in the time it takes most men to blink, earning them the respect of their peers. +1 initiative and +4 to all social interactions (Bluff, Diplomacy, etc.) with martial classes. (ie: d10 HD) (Int)

Undying Champion: Having trained in esoteric methods of weathering pain and mitigating damage, the Undying Champion can resist the mightiest of blows. Gain DR equal to ¼ class level (rounded down), minimum 1. (Con)

Stance List
Patient Scorpion Stance: access to precise combos, techniques
Hunting Hawk Stance: access to aerial/high ground combos/techs
Agile Lemur Stance: access to evasive combos/techs
Endless Assault Stance: access to rapid-fire combos/techs?

Combination Attack List
Jab: bonus to hit, penalty to damage
Spinning Strike: power attackish, penalty to ac
Peircing Strike: bypass ac/dr?
Hurricane Attack: attack several adjacent enemies
Punishing Blow: attack bonus on weapon that hit you

Technique List
Iron Shirt: dr or ac?
Godhand: huge damage
Adamantine Fist: ignore hardness/construct DR, extra damage to them
Keen Senses: Improved Uncanny Dodge?
Power Kiai: stun/nauseate short range
Light Body: Run up walls, across fluids, etc.
Faceless Opponent: become unidentifiable
Snatch Weapon: free disarms
Silent Fist: d6 sneak, multiple times, stacks


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james maissen wrote:
Pathos wrote:

I would follow with the 50% miss-chance here. Displacement does state that you can target the opponent...

"Unlike actual total concealment, displacement does not prevent enemies from targeting the creature normally."

Which seems to me, that a Rogue would be able to stake out the sweet spot he wants to hit.

You're confusing things here.

A creature with *total* concealment cannot be the subject of 'targetted' spells nor AOOs.

That is what the line in the spell is referencing.

It still grants concealment, which prevents precision damage.

-James

Actually that line could easily read as meaning you DON'T have concealment. "Unlike actual total concealment"

That line wouldn't be written that way if they intended you actually treat it like real concealment. Instead, you're to treat it like concealment only for effects expressly mentioned in the description, like miss chance. Miss chance is not automatically the same as concealment and they were clear about the two being separate in that spell.

If you were supposed to treat it like actual concealment the spell description would be much shorter: "This grants the recipient x% concealment." or something like that.

EDIT

Just to reiterate, because it's important, this spell does NOT grant concealment. It grants miss chance. (I checked the SRD to make sure I wasn't misremembering)


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seekerofshadowlight wrote:


His god is dead, his god does not grant his power yet he says it does. so yeah he is a liar even if it is to himself.

A delusion is an erroneous belief. Meaning that while he might be wrong, he's not a liar because he believes what he's saying. Lots of roleplay potential.


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seekerofshadowlight wrote:
Krome wrote:


Just out of curiosity, why can't you serve a dead god? It is fantasy...

And since you can serve ideals, why can't you serve the ideals of a dead god? As far as lying to himself, it is simpler to say "I am a Paladin of Aroden," than to say "I am a Paladin to the ideals of the dead god Aroden." If the character understands the difference how is it lying?

It is like calling the sky blue... the sky is not blue, it is cyan, there is in fact a distinct difference, yet no one complains about lying when someone says the sky is blue.

That being said, I would not allow it in my game, only because I have already made some plans concerning Aroden.

I'll tell you why, his faith comes from Aroden, his power comes from his faith. His power is a lie, he is diluted and based off false hope, off a lie of his own making.

He can say he is a paladin of the teaching of fallen aroden but saying e is a paladin of aroden is a lie. He lies by showing "power" of something that is not there.

So to me I would never allow it.

Switch to decaf. He may be "deluded" but that doesn't make him a liar. In fact, belief is necessary for delusion, which pretty much precludes him from lying. In a zone of truth spell for example, he'd be fine saying "I'm a paladin of Aroden" because he believes it to be true. Anyway, in MY games worshipers directly correlate to life for gods. You kill off their faith base, you kill off the god and that's the preferred method of warfare between gods; letting their churches blow each other up. Which is why in my games and in those of most DMs I know, you get enough belief going on and you either resurrect a god or make a new one. There's plenty of backing for that in fluff, too. Some of the relatively new Dragonlance books specifically involve a god made due to the lack of old gods. (That Mina chick.) Lots of Forgotten Realms stuff backs this too. During the Time of Troubles gods fought directly and sucked the life out of their peons to do it; which ultimately weakened the gods in question. Sure, you can argue that there are greater gods who are divorced from the belief-dependence, but for the most part it's the worshipers that make everything go.

[Edit]
Also, point of order, if an Ur-Priest can nab bits of divine power without worshiping anything; surely a cleric can do it unintentionally during the process of revering a departed patron. And without being evil, which was always a lame and judgmental requirement for Ur-Priests... =P


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So I've been geeking out a little bit on the threads where people have brought up martial arts, and I'm curious. Has anyone tried representing martial arts in d20 via feats? I know that the monk class is supposed to be the HtH fighting master, but that's sort of a joke; so I find myself wondering about other avenues.

I know it's pretty simple to use feats to simulate a lot of martial arts stuff and I'm wondering if you could take it a step farther with dedicated feat style trees. There was a little bit of this going on in Star Wars d20 of all places, so I thought I'd ask if anyone has pioneered this at all. I'll see if I can find and adapt some of the feats I've seen; maybe post some new ones. I'd like to see whether any of you have input in the same vein.