Frightful presence

[Ecaterina Ducaird]

Sooo..... first time GMing pathfinder 2e, and I have a question on if I'm missing something.

Frightful Presence: Cliff notes version... Will save or be Frightened 4 / 2 / 1 / 0. Immune for 1 minute regardless of save outcome.

Frightened: Cliff notes version... Penalties on stuff. Reduces by 1 each round unless otherwise noted.

Frightful presence isn't one of those 'noted' as far as I could see.

...

Sooo... Ummm... Look, I'm just going to say it... is Frightful presence a once a minute jump scare? Is that basically how it's working here or is there some errata / rule / subtext I missed? Do you actually get over things completely and utterly over 60 seconds and then suddenly remember you are in fact talking to a Dragon and have a 'moment' again?

[shroudb]

A different way to see it is that you are able to steel yourself against the frightful presence of a dragon for a very short period of time, but they are so frightful that after just a minute after the initial shock, it still comes back.

[Tridus]

That's pretty much how it works, yeah. Mechanically, Frightened 2 is a major debuff and Frightened 4 is basically crippling to a PC's ability to fight, so if that was just permanently on it would really hinder someone's ability to be in the encounter at all.

[Claxon]

Yeah, it may be hard to narratively make sense of it, but mechanically you make a save (are possibly frightened depending on the result) and are the immune to the presence for 1 minute. After a minute you'll need to make a save again.

You could add a bonus to saves against frightful presence for "reoccurring " instances (assuming it even came up, most fights are probably over) to represent becoming more used to it.

[QuidEst]

Narratively, I would describe it as slow waves of fear washing out from the dragon. Let's suppose we have a well-hidden invisible halfling sneaking around near a dragon. Every so often, despite their best efforts, they will feel dread creep over them and horrible images of being devoured will shake them. It passes after a few moments, but it isn't long before it's back.

[Quentin Coldwater]

I don't think a dragon (or any creature with Frightful Presence) is actively giving off waves of fear, it's just that their reputation precedes them. You've heard tales of dragons absolutely wrecking settlements and devouring dozens of people that just the very thought of one sends you spiraling, let alone being close to one.

In First Edition, they could turn that ability off, implying it's more of an active choice (like more of a creature employing their natural charisma), but I can't find that in Second Edition.

[Errenor]

I'd say that Frightened means such strong fear that it's actually physically felt and so it affects all your performance and represented by a status in the game mechanics. When it ends you aren't suddenly unafraid, you are just more in control. Or maybe you are relatively unafraid, depends on a character. But the thing is, the effect still exists and the mental pressure builds up until it's almost unbearable again.
Another thing is, it's all mostly abstract game mechanics and at some point we need just to accept it as it is.

Even if Frightful Presence is not explicitly magic it's very close at least most of the time.

[Finoan]

Frightful Presence (and most Creature Abilities) are intended for combat.

If you are talking to a Dragon for more than a minute, then as the GM, feel free to fudge the rules of these combat abilities a bit to make them make more narrative sense.

The Aura Creature Ability rules mentions that it can be ruled to not affect allies. It even uses Frightful Presence as the example.

So extrapolating from that, I could rule that during a social encounter, even if not considered an ally, the Frightful Presence is not causing fear to the point of game mechanical impact. It doesn't require a save and doesn't cause the Frightened condition. It just causes a narrative 'sense of unease and awe' that can be role-played as the players see fit.