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This thread probably should be moved to the "Lost Omens Campaign Setting General Discussion"; I've flagged for a mod to do so.
I think as far as the Tian groups go, my impression is that elves, dwarves, and orcs are just not at all common in Tian Xia; it'd be like a samsaran being in the Inner Sea region. Possible, but rare enough that they're more likely to be a lone individual or handful of individuals embedded in a larger community rather than having their own substantially sized ancestry-based subculture in the region. Ysoki and hobgoblins do have a significant presence in Tian Xia though.
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I think as far as the Tian groups go, my impression is that elves, dwarves, and orcs are just not at all common in Tian Xia; it'd be like a samsaran being in the Inner Sea region.
As a quick correction to this, elves do have a nation in Tian Xia (Jinin), as noted in the Lost Omens book about the continent. They’re also as far as I recall listed as a group that lives in Tian Xia in the character guide book in the section called ‘Peoples’. They are stated as being an unusual sight outside of Jinin at the present moment though. (A quick search says that they’re noted as living in Goka, Jinin, Kaoling, and Linvarre. Linvarre is specifically because of bordering Jinin though. Songbai also mentions elf residents but doesn’t list them on the ‘peoples’ section for the nation, make of that what you will.)
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Oh, neat! TIL.
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I was definitely a little sad to not see any sort of names/terms for the regional Kholo in the Impossible Lands book.
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I was definitely a little sad to not see any sort of names/terms for the regional Kholo in the Impossible Lands book.
I would imagine that the regional terms are all tribal, as in they refer to themselves based on their tribe first and foremost.
That said I do agree with you and hope that a Golden Road book will have plenty of details on the Kholo.
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To be honest, I really wish we had gotten less ancestries, but added depth on the existing ones.
And I can still kind of keep that same hope in the sense of, don't add more ancestries, but do add more depth to the existing ones.
With ancestry options that help to differentiate these cultures/ethnicities from one another.
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To be honest, I really wish we had gotten less ancestries, but added depth on the existing ones.
And I can still kind of keep that same hope in the sense of, don't add more ancestries, but do add more depth to the existing ones.
With ancestry options that help to differentiate these cultures/ethnicities from one another.
This.
Within a year or two I'd lost interest in Starfinder's zoo of options and would dislike seeing that dilution creep into PF2. It makes the exotic the norm, hence boring. Sometimes in PFS (or SFS for that matter when two players didn't know they were playing the same obscure race) I've had to point out to the players how crazy the party's composition was; i.e. one party that was mostly a mix of Nephilim with obvious indicators so NPCs would literally see a party of angels & demons, while each player had thought themself the only stand out (while the one mortal was the true exception). Once pointed out, they embraced it, even formed a rivalry to outdo the other half of the team, but most mixes won't be so thematic. I'd like all Ancestries to have themes and backstories, flavor beyond the shuffling of stats & feats.
I kind of wish the alternate ancestry boosts were the default rule, reducing the "mechanical need" for a race to fit the attribute requirements of certain ideas/builds.
Don't get me wrong, I like the menagerie of things players can encounter, but not necessarily as player options. And I just generally want those things to be more detailed and interesting.
More substance and depth than a zoo of options.
Not to say either is right or wrong, just a personal preference.
Golarion as a setting already resembles the 'zoo' folks are complaining about, though. It's never really been a low-fantasy "humans and one dwarf" kinda world, especially now that Orcs and Leshies are Common.
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Golarion as a setting already resembles the 'zoo' folks are complaining about, though. It's never really been a low-fantasy "humans and one dwarf" kinda world, especially now that Orcs and Leshies are Common.
True, and something I don't like about the setting, but in general I like the setting.
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Golarion as a setting already resembles the 'zoo' folks are complaining about, though. It's never really been a low-fantasy "humans and one dwarf" kinda world, especially now that Orcs and Leshies are Common.
I think what Castiliano means is that Starfinder 1E just threw tons of races at you with each Bestiary, each with very little personality outside of its assigned gimmick. I personally would prefer more depth for each ancestry in SF2E.
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Golarion as a setting already resembles the 'zoo' folks are complaining about, though. It's never really been a low-fantasy "humans and one dwarf" kinda world, especially now that Orcs and Leshies are Common.
And for Orcs and Leshies to actually feel common, they need to exist all over the place and have histories and cultures that are carried and diverse. Leshies, I feel like have gotten this attention effectively enough in the life cycle of PF2, but Orcs have really only gotten about half of what it would take thus far. Humans, just in the inverse’s region have many different heritages and being Taldane is different enough from being Chelish that most Ancestries recognize these differences. Dwarves, Elves and even halflings have pretty much gotten over this way as well (I think Leshies magical physiognomy and sociology gets them over too with just including plant diversity), but Orcs have essentially 2 vibrant, well developed cultural back grounds and could use at least a couple more. Same with Gnomes and Iruxi. Goblins are maybe ok as is, being so disposed around the globe that just a couple of very physically obvious variants are enough, and they can just keep popping up in relative isolation around Golarion, but a bunch of other ancestries kinda end up the same boat, where their heritages mostly just end up covering physical difference that doesn’t seem to connect to any deep cultural differences, and then the vast majority of the ancestry exists as a group that is confined to a very small geographic region, sometimes even just a single settlement or island.
The reason I think this is unfortunate is because such ancestries rarely get enough options to make for much variety, especially in how they will be played when only a handful of the heritages provide benefits players tend to look for and some have maybe 2 feats for some of the higher ancestry features levels. It just makes some ancestries incredibly flat, difficult to justify playing in certain campaigns, and sometimes feel very gimmicky.
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I'll introduce some.
Here is my first one:
The Hinnish of the Fair Country
Nestled in the green, gentle lands between the Fog Peaks and the Verduran Forest lies a region the locals simply call the Fair Country. Neither a kingdom nor a state in the traditional sense, this patchwork of meadows, orchards, and well-tended hills is home to a distinct halfling folk known as the Hinnish.
A Simple Life in a Gentle Land
The Hinnish are halflings who have long turned away from the great cities and turbulent politics of Avistan. Life in the Fair Country is rooted in rhythm—of seasons, of harvests, of community. Each valley holds a few burrow-villages, where families live in turf-roofed homes carved into the sides of hills or nestled into the roots of old trees.
The land is fertile, the people are generous, and while outsiders are welcomed with curiosity and a shared pint, few ever stay. It’s said the hills don’t sing to all folk—only those born with hinnish hearts.
Governance and Law
There is no formal ruler of the Fair Country. Instead, the Hinnish organize themselves around extended family lines—clans—each led by a matriarch or patriarch known as a Grandkin. These elders meet during seasonal fairs and harvest feasts to resolve disputes, plan shared work (like bridge-mending or forest-clearing), and swap tales and recipes.
Justice is local and communal. Crimes are rare, but when they happen, the worst sentence is exile. To be exiled is to be declared Unhinnish, effectively erased from the community. Former friends turn away, names are struck from family trees, and the exiled are forbidden from partaking in the sacred meals or setting foot in a village again. In a society so deeply bound to kin and hearth, this is a fate worse than death.
Faith and the Land
The Hinnish are deeply spiritual, though they lack temples, robes, or formal clergy. Their gods are known as Mother Field and Father Forest, who are in truth the halfling faces of Jaidi and Erastil, respectively. These gods are not distant forces, but living presences in the wind through the wheat and the hush of the glade.
Worship takes the form of shared meals—big, boisterous affairs that mark the changing of the seasons, births, marriages, and good harvests. To eat alone on a holy day is considered a sorrowful omen, and every village leaves a space open at the table for wandering kin or friendly strangers.
The Pellars
The closest the Hinnish come to arcane or divine practitioners are the Pellars—wise folk, usually older women (though not exclusively), who keep alive the old ways of herbal lore, folk magic, and stories half-remembered from the Age of Darkness.
Pellars speak to the trees, know the names of forgotten spirits, and guide births, plantings, and even deaths with quiet ceremony. Some outsiders mistake them for witches, and perhaps some are—though they work no dark magics and serve no infernal patrons. Their tools are bundles of herbs, weather-charms, whispered chants, and the trust of their kin.
Culture and Traditions
Food and Ale: Hinnish culture revolves around the table. Every household brews its own ale or cider, and inter-family disputes are often settled through cook-offs or brew-battles. Recipes are heirlooms, passed down like treasure.
Folklore: The Fair Country is thick with tales—of hollow men in the forest, of apple spirits who bless good orchards, and of whisper hedges that hide burrows from intruders. Every child is taught never to mock the wind or whistle after dark.
Naming Conventions: Hinnish names are long and lyrical, but every halfling also has a kinname—a kind of affectionate nickname used within their village. Examples: Tulley Appleburr (Tul), Hespera Lintwhistle (Hesp), or Gramble Rootkin (Gramb).
Clothing and Craft: Homespun clothes with fine embroidery are the norm. Spinning, dyeing, and carving are highly respected crafts. Simple tools and farm implements often feature beautiful decorative work.
Festivals: Each village hosts four major feasts:
Greengrow (Spring planting)
Highsun (Summer games and courtships)
Threshcall (Autumn harvest and storytelling)
Deepnight (Winter mid-festival, honouring ancestors and the Pellars' wisdom)
The Longstride
Among the Hinnish, there comes a time in most young halflings’ lives when the hills no longer feel quite so wide, and the hearth’s warmth begins to itch at their heels. This is known as the Longstride—a long-standing tradition where young folk leave the Fair Country to see the world beyond.
Some take up seasonal work on distant farms, others apprentice in foreign towns or walk the roads with caravans. A few even join adventuring companies, their hearts stirred by songs of heroes and forgotten places.
The Longstride is not exile—it is expected. Families say farewell with teary eyes, but always with the understanding that the door remains open. Most return after a few years, bringing back strange customs, new recipes, and the occasional spouse or tall tale.
Note: Mix in the Shire with elements of Cornish folklore and Amish traditions and you have the Hinnish.
Not terribly original or interesting I know, but it was fun to write.
Anyway, I have others that I shall add later.
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The Lirenei
Elves of the Court Under the Hill
When the starstone fell and the world cracked beneath it, most of Golarion’s elves fled through the aiudara to Sovyrian. But not all. Deep beneath ancient hills and woven groves, a hidden people remained—those who would become known in whispers and stories as the Court Under the Hill.
These elves are the remnants of an older kind—stranger, more fey-touched, and far more secretive than their kin in Kyonin. Shunning the high towers and rigid hierarchies of other elven cultures, the Court wrapped itself in enchantment, seasonal rites, and glamoured mist. Their home is not marked on any map, but songs speak of silver trees, black roses, and moonlit halls beneath the roots of the world.
A People of Riddle and Ritual
The elves of the Court Under the Hill rarely show themselves to outsiders, and when they do, it is often in masks, riddles, and dances that blur the edge of dreams. They speak in lilting tongues and never say anything plainly that could be said poetically.
To them, time is a river that bends. A night of dancing in the moon-ring might cost a mortal a week, a year, or more. They do not lie—but they will lead you astray if your wits are dull or your manners lacking.
Queen Diana, the Gleaming Lady
The Court is ruled by the Gleaming Lady, Queen Diana-of-the-Silver-Horns, a figure of immense beauty and uncanny power. Some say she is part goddess, others that she drank the essence of the First World itself. She is both sovereign and symbol—eternal yet ever-changing, with a different face for every season. She is kindness and cruelty in equal measure.
Her word is law, though it is rarely spoken outright. Her favour is intoxicating. Her displeasure can twist a soul into shadow.
Traditions and Beliefs
The Dance of Hours: The Court’s most sacred rite. To dance beneath Queen Diana’s moonlight is to step outside the world’s time. Some return changed. Some do not return at all.
The Pact of Manners: The elves of the Court abide by strict customs of hospitality and form. To eat their food or accept a gift is to bind yourself, unless you know the proper phrases to refuse or repay.
The Gloamwatch: A silent order among them who ensure the boundaries between the Court and the mortal world remain unbroken. They bear masks and names forgotten to themselves, and walk unseen.
Naming: Each elf has a given name, a shadow name, and a true name—the last never spoken but known only to Queen Diana.
Note: Elves of folklore and fairy tales. These guys could easily allies or enemies - possibly even a replacement for the drow in terms of antagonists.
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The Autumn Court – The Red Hunt of the Wild Paths
Also known among scholars as the Ashamein, the Autumn Court elves are nomads, hunters, and fierce guardians of the wild places. Where other elves build cities in canopies or retreat to shadowed glades, the Ashamein follow the old trails—over misted moors, through wind-cut valleys, and across the thinning forests of northern Avistan.
Hair like flame, hearts like steel, these elves are known for their vivid red and russet hair, golden eyes, and striking warpaints in ochre and ash. Their lives follow the turning of the seasons, and autumn is sacred to them—it is the season of blood, fire, and the hunt.
The Wild Hunt and the King of Horns
The Autumn Court is ruled—loosely—by King Thalion Cernai, also called the Lord of Falling Leaves or the King of Wolves. Said to be the son of the god Cernunnos, Thalion appears only in the harvest months, when the scent of rot and ripened fruit fills the air.
When the sky reddens and the wind cries, he rides at the head of the Wild Hunt, a mounted storm of elves, wolves, and spectral beasts that pursues monsters, demonspawn, and evil gods through the wilds of Golarion. Towns that see his riders pass bolt their doors and light no fires. To be caught in the Hunt is to vanish—or to return changed.
Only the bravest warriors of the Autumn Court ride in the Hunt. It is a rite of honor and terror, whispered of in the same breath as glory and madness.
Traditions of the Ashamein
Wolf-Bonding: Many Ashamein form lifelong bonds with wolves. Some even claim descent from wolf spirits. These companions are family, never pets.
Season Tattoos: Ashamein mark each passing season with a new tattoo—each year is written in blood and ink across their skin.
Fire Rites: Fire is sacred. Major rites—births, deaths, oaths, and feasts—are marked by blazing pyres and flame-dances.
The Oath of the Thorn: Warriors swear to defend the balance of nature and take no permanent home. They consider stone walls and plowed fields signs of weakness and decay.
Relations with Other Elves
To the elves of Kyonin and Iadara, the Ashamein are wild, romantic, and dangerously close to the First World. The Autumn Court shares an uneasy respect with the Court Under the Hill, though they rarely meet save on solstices and storms.
They despise the undead, demonspawn, and any who twist nature for personal power. More than one necromancer has vanished without a trace after passing too close to Ashamein territory.
Note: Big inspiration from the Wood Elves of Warhammer here. Thalion is probably super miffed after what happened to his dad.
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Golarion as a setting already resembles the 'zoo' folks are complaining about, though. It's never really been a low-fantasy "humans and one dwarf" kinda world, especially now that Orcs and Leshies are Common.I think what Castiliano means is that Starfinder 1E just threw tons of races at you with each Bestiary, each with very little personality outside of its assigned gimmick. I personally would prefer more depth for each ancestry in SF2E.
Yeah, I don't like rubber forehead aliens.*
For those unfamiliar, it's a trope and doesn't necessarily mean aliens only. It's a complaint of having a lot "exotic" races that look different from humans, but the difference is superficial (think some makeup on your forehead) and the culture doesn't have much depth.
I'd rather have 5 races with a lot of depth, than 40 shallow ones.
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Golarion as a setting already resembles the 'zoo' folks are complaining about, though. It's never really been a low-fantasy "humans and one dwarf" kinda world, especially now that Orcs and Leshies are Common.I think what Castiliano means is that Starfinder 1E just threw tons of races at you with each Bestiary, each with very little personality outside of its assigned gimmick. I personally would prefer more depth for each ancestry in SF2E.Yeah, I don't like rubber forehead aliens.*
For those unfamiliar, it's a trope and doesn't necessarily mean aliens only. It's a complaint of having a lot "exotic" races that look different from humans, but the difference is superficial (think some makeup on your forehead) and the culture doesn't have much depth.
I'd rather have 5 races with a lot of depth, than 40 shallow ones.
An old complaint about race design for both fantasy and sci-fi was the notion that so many different cultures were all about *one trait* dialed up to 11. This is the race that's all about logic. This one's all about honor and conflict. This one's all about commerce, greed and capitalism.
Not just a human with pointy ears or bumpy ridges on their forehead, but an entire culture based around a single trait. Which can be dull, when multiple people's are designed with this sort of broad brush.
The same is also weird for environments. This entire world is a desert. This one's all ice. This one's a big swamp. Gosh, somehow, on Earth, we have *all three of those things!* :)
Similarly, many races in sci-fi and fantasy have a single culture, a single god (or pantheon of gods), a single language, a single government, etc. Kinda limiting. I like how the elves and dwarves of Golarion have several distinct groups, very different in governance, religion, etc. A Pahmet and M'Beke dwarf might come across as very alien to one from the Five Kings Mountains. Same with elves fresh off the boat from Castrovel, living in Kyonin, discovering how the Alijae or Snowcaster elven societies have greatly branched off since their long separation.
That's cool to me!
And with the radical differences between the Matanje orcs and those of Belkzen, or the Kholo of the Expanse, or the Lamashtu-worshippers of Katapesh, there's some neat differentiation there among traditionally monocultural 'generic bad guys' folk.
The Strix, which I just learned the other day is playable in PFS now, came off this way to me. At first I was excited until I read their entry and their feats. Even if I wanted a flying PC, I doubt I'd make a Strix, and that's their singular standout aspect other than resentment.